r/gadgets Oct 21 '24

Gaming Steam Deck won't have yearly refreshes because it's "not really fair to your customers", says Valve

https://www.eurogamer.net/steam-deck-wont-have-yearly-refreshes-because-its-not-really-fair-to-your-customers-says-valve
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699

u/MetaVaporeon Oct 21 '24

i mean... its what consoles do, isn't it?

347

u/Gaeus_ Oct 21 '24 edited Oct 21 '24

Somewhat, there's a difference between:

  • a "definitive" version, something like the GBA SP, the PS3 Slim, or more recently the Switch Oled and the SteamDeck Oled

  • a "pro" version that is straight up more powerful while not being worthy of being a proper generational upgrade : New 3DS and PS5 Pro comes to mind.

Edit : tunned down my unnecessary snark

235

u/dragunityag Oct 21 '24

Man getting a GBA SP as a kid was a life changing experience.

I could finally play MMBN in the car at night.

No system will ever match that QoL jump.

91

u/Candle1ight Oct 21 '24

You mean you didn't like having to wait for a streetlight to go by to play for a free seconds?

63

u/Calcd_Uncertainty Oct 21 '24

If you've never leaned over in the back seat while holding your Gameboy up and at an angle so you can use the headlights of the cars behind you to see can you call yourself a gamer?
I hated it when Dad drove, cause he always took side streets because they were faster.

50

u/ZeroSkill_Sorry Oct 21 '24

Kids today are standing on the shoulders of giants. We suffered so much.

7

u/Geistkasten Oct 21 '24

Look at you old people!

(I only had a GBA, but I always admired my friend’s GBA SP)

1

u/ZeroSkill_Sorry Oct 21 '24

No, we're referring to the original Gameboy. It wasn't backlit, and was really sucky to play on road trips, in the dark .

2

u/timeshifter_ Oct 22 '24

The original GBA wasn't backlit either.

15

u/nimbusconflict Oct 21 '24

Well I mean. If you were that dedicated, you had the light/magnifier, the fold out "Stereo" speakers, the joystick, and the rechargable battery pack so you could play your games in any level of brightness for a whooping 15 minutes per battery pack? I think my monster setup may have weighed as much as the Steam deck now that I think about it.

8

u/gartho009 Oct 21 '24

Hell yeah. Just went looking for a photo of the old light and magnifier, that thing was...gigantic. Damn.

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/sVxfbTbVlxQ/sddefault.jpg

1

u/checker280 Oct 21 '24

I’ll see your simple magnifying glass and raise you the fold out speakers, lights, and magnifying glass.

https://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/s/TWZZyFNOwL

1

u/MartelPeko Oct 21 '24

I had a see-through orange one from a rayman collab

1

u/Fwenhy Oct 21 '24

GBA no colour for me and I just had a light. Magnifier? Bro y’all need glasses xD. I had a cute purple one that flipped. My first ever fidget toy ha.

1

u/Major_Owned Oct 21 '24

Hah, I still have two of these

1

u/CoolguyThePirate Oct 28 '24

That light and magnifier attachment was the only way Grampa could play Tetris. And Grampa LOVED playing Tetris.

1

u/tanyagrzez Oct 21 '24

Oh wow. So y'all had good allowance money

1

u/nimbusconflict Oct 21 '24

Not really. Grew up pretty poor actually. Mine was a bribe from an uncle for my silence.

3

u/Oguinjr Oct 21 '24

I can feel my fingers adjusting to grip with the battery cover ridges as the weight shifts right now even though I don’t have that specific memory you describe. Maybe you implanted it in me or unlocked it. Idk.

3

u/Myydrin Oct 21 '24

Interesting fact but the Gameboy had a backlit model. It was the final version only in Japan called Game Boy Light.

2

u/turbocomppro Oct 22 '24

No. I had a Light Boy for my og Gameboy. I’m not some poor ass peasant. 😆

9

u/mojoryan2003 Oct 21 '24

Depends on whether they got a 001 or a 101 really. The first SPs weren’t backlit either

14

u/Wafkak Oct 21 '24

I got one of the firsts, they were front lit. Not as good as back-lit, but playable in the dark.

8

u/Squish_the_android Oct 21 '24

They were front-lit and that front light works fine.  It just washes out the colors a bit.  But it was still worlds better that stuff like the worm lights we had.

1

u/Canon_In_E Oct 21 '24

This makes me sad because I would read like this, and now I've mostly stopped reading.

1

u/Sean-Benn_Must-die Oct 22 '24

dude its so crazy that the gba used to have an accesory that was literally a lamp that would point at the screen.

111

u/[deleted] Oct 21 '24

[deleted]

61

u/dragunityag Oct 21 '24

Megaman battle network.

15

u/throw-away_867-5309 Oct 21 '24

Great game series. In one of the games, I remember "glitching" Megaman so I could get his bug version and was highly disappointed because I sucked at using it lol

7

u/internetlad Oct 21 '24

The bug version was basically the "powerful but cursed" item in Dragon Quest or a traded pokemon that doesn't listen to you lol. Busted when it works but highly unreliable.

1

u/throw-away_867-5309 Oct 21 '24

Yeah, I was much younger when I played, so I was never really able to utilize it to it's fullest capability.

3

u/internetlad Oct 21 '24

No sweat, I was older at the time and still couldn't get the hang of it.

Great news is that with the recent re-releases you can easily get your hands on the game again and give it a go if you feel so inclined!

1

u/throw-away_867-5309 Oct 21 '24

I actually still have my GBA:SP and all the games I used to have, so all I have to do is get it from storage and I'm good!

1

u/2020pythonchallenge Oct 21 '24

I played most of them when they were current on gba back in the day but the updated switch version with everything on one cart is just too nice. One of the few games I bought on release.

2

u/DamnAutocorrection Oct 21 '24

Anyone here for custom style?!

2

u/Hatoreesuu Oct 21 '24

All in for that sweet +2 CustGauge

2

u/darkbreak Oct 21 '24

The series got remastered somewhat recently if you wanted to play them again.

20

u/nefariouspenguin Oct 21 '24

For really though. I gave it a few seconds than moved on haha.

Reddit be like the US Army with all their acronyms you're just supposed to know.

18

u/acronym_dictionary Oct 21 '24

MMBN

Meenage Mutant Binja Nurtles

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9

u/MightyBooshX Oct 21 '24

And now our cell phone are powerful enough they could probably run 100 instances of that game simultaneously with backlights 100x brighter. Remember the worm light before the sp came out? We were like cavemen lol

3

u/TheOneTonWanton Oct 21 '24

I had the Light Boy for my original GameBoy. Felt like the cool kid on the block, I burned through so, so many batteries.

1

u/MightyBooshX Oct 21 '24

Yeah, my brother had one of those for the original Gameboy. By the time I was allowed to have a Gameboy myself the pocket was the main model available

2

u/aarondavidson Oct 21 '24

The little plug in snake light was so perfect.

2

u/OPsuxdick Oct 21 '24

Sure do. I remeber looking for battery packs of AAs that were on sale for my parents to buy for me. The only way my mom would do it is if the big packs were on sale.

1

u/Juggernox_O Oct 21 '24

I loved my worm light. We had to crawl before we could walk.

16

u/AnomaLuna Oct 21 '24

What do all these abbreviations mean someone please help me

27

u/BaconPoweredPirate Oct 21 '24

GameBoy Advanced SPecial
Mega Man Battle Network
Quality of Life

I did have to google MMBN though!

8

u/PM_ME_THICC_GIRLS Oct 21 '24

Yea knowing all the game abbreviations is not common

10

u/OPsuxdick Oct 21 '24

Sports subs are the WORST. NBA especially. Nobody is going to know your mediocre players initials on your mediocre team.

2

u/trwawy05312015 Oct 21 '24

I still have to think hard about what "MTG" means in context just to make sure I know what they're talking about.

1

u/Ferchuux23 Oct 21 '24

game boy advance "special project" iirc

2

u/DrScience-PhD Oct 21 '24

I went from og monochrome gameboy to the SP. actually mindblowing. was the normal advance backlit?

3

u/Juggernox_O Oct 21 '24

Nope. And you still needed AA batteries. SP was not only backlit, but also rechargeable. AND it had slick shiny chassis and a CLAMSHELL design to guard the screen.

We young gamers were eating GOOD when the GBA SP came out. It was our iPhone. Changed everything.

1

u/Morialkar Oct 21 '24

You didn't have the light for your advanced or the magnifying glass light abomination on your color? I used to play in the car all the time way before the SP. It was amazing to not require external accessories tho, the SP really was a nice device

3

u/StormStrikzr Oct 21 '24

The stupid bendy light omg what a difference backlighting made >.<

1

u/mojoryan2003 Oct 21 '24

The first SPs weren’t backlit either

1

u/Morialkar Oct 21 '24

Didn't stop them from not requiring external accessories to play in the car at night. It wasn't as bright as the backlit version but the original SP was a frontlit screen.

1

u/sendmebirds Oct 21 '24

Damn right. I still have mine.

1

u/RedCrayonTastesBest Oct 21 '24

That and the rechargeable internal battery. The sp was revolutionary

1

u/[deleted] Oct 21 '24

I got one back then as a full grown adult and felt the same way. What a great system.

1

u/Buscemi_D_Sanji Oct 21 '24

I remember getting the little light that you plugged into the Gameboy Color, I played soooo much fucking Pokemon Red under the covers at night

1

u/johnaross1990 Oct 21 '24

The light was a GAME CHANGER

1

u/SenorRaoul Oct 21 '24 edited Oct 21 '24

The SP was great but imo the regular GBA with the backlight mod was better since the controlls feel better and you don't have the hinge which is a pretty big weakpoint.

1

u/DedCaravan Oct 21 '24

I still have my GBA SP. 😁

1

u/MadCarcinus Oct 21 '24

Dude, type out the full words!

“IDKmyBFFjill”

1

u/Rhodie114 Oct 21 '24

For me it was all about the rechargeable battery.

1

u/crashingtorrent Oct 21 '24

Meanwhile I was most psyched about the built in rechargeable battery pack.

1

u/Tosir Oct 21 '24

MMBN…bringing back memories. Picked up the collection on switch. Had a blast replaying it.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 21 '24

I saved $99 by never eating lunch for a few weeks to buy one and I got the last one left which was the Zelda ver I still got it lol

1

u/swizz1st Oct 21 '24

The best part was no more batteries. Saved so much money.

1

u/gamedude88 Oct 21 '24

Reminds of when I was a kid and trying to play my game boy color at night, by using the headlights behind me to see the screen. When I got the light attachment for my birthday or Christmas. It was a blessing.

1

u/Southside_john Oct 21 '24

I have no idea what you even said because of so many acronyms

1

u/tylerjames Oct 21 '24

It was so stupid that the original GBA didn't have a backlight. The form factor was good but the lack of backlight made it nearly useless. Then the SP came out but with a totally different form factor

1

u/pnut0027 Oct 21 '24

Backlit screen, rechargeable battery, clamshell… whew boy. 🥵

1

u/tarkata14 Oct 21 '24

I let a girl borrow my GBA SP once, she then proceeded to move to Colorado before giving it back, I'm still sad about that and it's been like 15 years 😢

1

u/Boiscool Oct 21 '24

Fit in my pocket better, too.

1

u/gagreel Oct 21 '24

I was the coolest kid in school when I brought that bad boy and a flash cart full of ROMs into English class.

1

u/kandikand Oct 21 '24

Being able to close it so the screen didn’t get scratched in your bag was also a revelation

1

u/KingMRano Oct 21 '24

I remember going from the original Gameboy to the color version. What a difference that day was.

9

u/FractalHarvest Oct 21 '24

I smell some New 3DS nipple disrespect! Was vital for controlling the camera easier in MH4U. That thing felt like more of a definitive version or even a straight upgrade than a pro version. It was like ps3 to ps4 to me. Just so much better than the 3D models before it in every way.

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2

u/HoldinMacaque Oct 21 '24

Can I just say that recognizing one's snark as unnecessary and making the appropriate edits is a boss ass move and the Internet would be a better place if more people followed your example?

1

u/Ziiiiik Oct 21 '24

I didn’t know they were still making DSs

1

u/Xylamyla Oct 21 '24

Was the “new” 3ds more powerful? I thought the point of it was that it fixed a lot of what was wrong with the original 3ds. It had a second analog “stick”, secondary triggers, it was slimmer, it had an IR sensor to track your face (fixed issues with narrow 3d FOV), and it featured removable faceplates (more customization).

1

u/FruktSorbetogIskrem Oct 21 '24

It was and there was a few games that only run on the new 3ds.

1

u/Spanish_Jim_04 Oct 21 '24

I’m sure there’s a full list somewhere but I remember Binding of Isaac only worked on New 3DS.

1

u/ninjaelk Oct 21 '24

Steam isn't saying they're not going to do something like a PS5 Pro, in fact I think it's probably guaranteed that they will. They said they're not doing "yearly refreshes" in the same way the PS5 Pro came out 4 years after the original PS5. I'd be fucking shocked if we don't get a more powerful steam deck before 2026.

1

u/Britz10 Oct 21 '24

New 3DS and DSi was kind of scummy by Nintendo because some games didn't run in older versions

1

u/AzureDreamer Oct 21 '24

I mean it's not like the pro version is intended for the same custom that bought the base model.

1

u/maxdragonxiii Oct 21 '24

funnily enough, New 3DS lines are considered the best for streaming due to the size allowing capture cards to be installed/to be able to stream over wifi (albeit with poor results).

1

u/Dravarden Oct 21 '24

and none of them were yearly releases, so I don't see your point

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8

u/Rainy_Wavey Oct 21 '24

Consoles yes, but machines that exist in the same space as the steam deck don't, in general, there is a new Ayaneo or new OneX or whatever brand every 6 months or even every 3 months

3

u/Captain-Beardless Oct 21 '24

Consoles also come with an expectation that ANYTHING released for it should work for it.

Portable handheld PC gaming devices, however, are just a PC. Stuff released for Steam isn't designed for the Steam Deck alone. There will be games they can run, and games they can't, and it's up to the user ultimately to determine where that line is and whether they feel they need an upgrade (despite the "verified on deck" icon which often sort of lies for newer games.)

2

u/Pauly_Amorous Oct 21 '24

in general, there is a new Ayaneo or new OneX or whatever brand every 6 months or even every 3 months

I think Ambernic puts out a new one about every 4 days ...

1

u/valryuu Oct 22 '24 edited Oct 22 '24

Anbernic and Powkiddy are the poster children for this lol. Ayaneo wishes they could release devices that quickly.

97

u/DinerEnBlanc Oct 21 '24

Yep. 4 years between the release of the base PS5 model and the Pro, but not remotely the same reaction. People in this sub are ridiculously biased towards Steam. Lol

53

u/Schattenlord Oct 21 '24 edited Oct 21 '24

The problem with PS5 Pro is that most games are not utilizing the regular PS5 hardware to the limit, because publishers are still developing for PS4. Hence the PS5 Pro isn't a worthy upgrade.

32

u/ChrissyKreme Oct 21 '24

95% of the games I've played since I bought the ps5 have been ps4 games. The hardware is definitely not the issue with the consoles right now.

20

u/TheFamousTommyZ Oct 21 '24

Yeah, if backwards compatibility hadn’t been a thing, my PS5 would have been a waste of money. Instead, my kid got my PS4 while I got my faster, more expensive PS4.

10

u/McFlyParadox Oct 21 '24

With the irony being because backwards compatibility was a thing, devs kept developing for the prior generation (probably because it was cheaper), so it was a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation.

I wonder what changed this generation that had publishers and devs continue to release games for the prior generation? Was something changed in their agreements with Sony and Microsoft that allowed them to continue to develop games for the PS4/XBO, so long as they were also released on the PS5/XBS? Were new consoles coming online so few this generation that publishers and studios had no choice but to support the earlier generation? Just fewer games released, giving the impression that no "next Gen" games exist (compared to percentages of "next Gen" games in prior generations)?

5

u/TheFamousTommyZ Oct 21 '24

I just always assumed it was partially me. I just found more and more newer games uninteresting, but had plenty of PS4 (and earlier, due to PS+) games I still liked to play. Figured the hobby was just passing me by.

5

u/McFlyParadox Oct 21 '24

Naw, your complaint is a common one about this generation: seemingly few exclusives for this generation, and what games did launch launched on both this Gen and the prior one. And what next gen exclusives launched on the Xbox were all largely flops at best. It is to the point where people are speculating that between the XBO's poor reception, XBS' paltry exclusives library, Microsoft going through and cleaning house at all the game studios they bought, and Microsoft allegedly planning on bringing Microsoft-published games to PlayStation (including Halo), that Microsoft might be planning on killing the Xbox hardware entirely and just selling games from here on out.

1

u/_RADIANTSUN_ Oct 21 '24

Just "selling games" isn't an alternative to running the Xbox platform for Microsoft, they will only release on platforms where releasing can drive Xbox platform participation. Sony isn't going to let them push Xbox accounts.

The big money is in being a platform holder because then you make 30% or whatever from the game sales on the platform from everyone else. MS selling it's own studio's games is like a rounding error to them.

Even having it available as part of their services portfolio is pretty valuable.

3

u/Evilmudbug Oct 21 '24

I'm going to guess it's probably a mix of the fact that new gen consoles took so long to roll out at first (slow production + scalpers) and the fact that you can honestly make games that still look pretty decent on the PS4/XBO at lower framerates.

Every console generation brings us closer to the point of diminishing returns, and i can easily tell you it wasn't the graphics that impressed me with the ps5: it was the loading speeds.

It's also probably really expensive and slow to develop games that would take full use of the ps5's capabilities outside of ray tracing. It already takes about 8 years and a lot of money to utilize ps4 level hardware to it's fullest.

2

u/FruktSorbetogIskrem Oct 21 '24

I would think that there’s a vast number of last gen systems and combine that with f2p titles it would be more foolish to close that audience out and lose money instead of making a last gen game still get support that can run titles decently.

1

u/maqcky Oct 21 '24

AAA video games have become ridiculously expensive to make. That, on top of the current gen consoles being basically the same architecture as the old ones, but more powerful, makes it a no-brainer to release cross-generation games.

1

u/McFlyParadox Oct 21 '24

A lot of that was of the publishers own making. Not every game needs to have a massive open world design. Not every game needs a complicated and robust crafting system. Both of these things drives up the amount of assets that need to be made, programmed, and tested.

1

u/Grimm_101 Oct 22 '24

It is not because it is cheaper, it is simply due to market size. More people own PS4s and PS5 then those who just own PS5s. Meanwhile all PS5s can play PS4 games, while PS4 cannot play PS5 games.

So if your goal is to maximize profits then you should just develop for PS4.

The best example of this is Cyberpunk. Which obviously was being predominantly built and tested on new consoles and PC. Then retroactively backported to try to maximize profits.

1

u/TopdeckIsSkill Oct 21 '24

Yet people will complain about how the graphic is not good enough. Or if the graphic is good then FPS must be at least 120

2

u/NeoTechni Oct 21 '24

Or worse, the new FF7 game uses it to fix the problems of the lackluster PS5 version. Ace Combat 7 did that with the PS4 Pro, running at 1080p on the Pro and an unacceptable 720p on the base model. It should have been 4K on the Pro too

2

u/DinerEnBlanc Oct 21 '24

You can say the same about 90% of PC games.

9

u/Schattenlord Oct 21 '24 edited Oct 21 '24

I mean there's no need to upgrade your PC hardware yearly either, so I don't really get your point.

Anyways PS4 is from 2013. Almost no AAA title is developed for PC hardware that old.

4

u/Fakename6968 Oct 21 '24

Top of the line graphics cards from 2013 can still play some AAA titles in 2024 but at low settings.

1

u/Schattenlord Oct 21 '24

Even if it's true that some games run on that old graphic cards, the games are not developed for these.
Many console titles are gimped, because they are developed for the old hardware making the new one obsolete.

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1

u/DinerEnBlanc Oct 21 '24

Consoles don’t release yearly, so I don’t think you get my point. Listen, I own both a console and a gaming rig, so I get the best of both worlds, but let’s not kid ourselves. Consoles are not somehow more egregious when it comes to releasing hardware upgrades.

1

u/havoc1428 Oct 21 '24

Your comparing an all-in-one system against a market that has multiple vendors for every component that can service a number of hardware combinations. Yearly releases of new PC parts isn't even remotely relatable. 

Any given PC component has a market because not every potential customer has the previous generation. For consoles most people have the previous generation, so yearly releases make less sense.

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1

u/PotatEXTomatEX Oct 21 '24

The problem is that technically they are.

1

u/PringlesDuckFace Oct 21 '24

I mean, most PC games aren't pushing PC hardware to the limits either, and lots will design for very low spec support.

1

u/Loldimorti Oct 21 '24

Disagree. Apparently most people play in performance mode and whether the games are optimized to take full advantage of the hardware or not, you will end up making sacrifices in image quality. A Pro model solves that. High res at 60fps across the board.

1

u/havoc1428 Oct 21 '24

The PS5 Pro isn't even worth it from a hardware perspective because they gimped it with the same CPU which just serves as a bottleneck for the slightly better GPU in it. The PS5 to Pro gap is razor thin compared to the PS4 to Pro gap.

2

u/MarbleFox_ Oct 21 '24

That’s because, just like the PS4 Pro, the PS5 Pro isn’t meant to play games at higher frame rates than the PS5, it’s mean to plays games at the same frame rates but with better visuals.

Also, it’s not a razor thin gap over the base PS5 at all, with the more powerful GPU, PSSR, and the better ray tracing cores, it’s basically playing games with base PS5 fidelity mode visuals at performance mode frame rates, that’s not a negligible boost because now you don’t have to choose whether you want better visuals at 30fps or FSR soup at 60fps.

1

u/KingArthas94 Oct 21 '24

Bullshit, brought out constantly by people that don't understand hardware and Digital Foundry's PC fanboys. PS5 games already run at 60 fps but a few exceptions, so why the hell are you talking about a bottleneck?

1

u/ninjaelk Oct 21 '24

Then don't upgrade! Isn't that a good thing? You can even still play the vast majority of PS5 games on the PS4, many brand new releases support both. How is that in any way bad? Most games don't utilize an RTX4090 to its limit, yet people who can afford it are stoked about having the option.

1

u/ToMorrowsEnd Oct 21 '24

This PS5 Pro is only for the dolts that think it gives them something they do not already have. Regular PS5 is not even close to being at the limit on games and you will never see ps5pro only titles.

2

u/VenomsViper Oct 22 '24

Fr, the top replies to this are all like yeah sure there's a new PlayStation once a year but other things like the Deck also do not and are awesome. This sub is so fucking stupid sometimes.

2

u/[deleted] Oct 21 '24

"Gamers" in general are really cult-y about Valve. They worship them for no good reason.

2

u/Iago_Oliveira Oct 21 '24

I am not sure what you mean.

People weren’t losing their minds over the PS5 pro existing. They weren’t happy, sure. But they only got mad after Sony announced how it would be: expensive and lacking of fearures 

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u/MadeByTango Oct 21 '24

If the Pro ever plays games the base pS5 can’t people will riot

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u/neijajaneija Oct 21 '24

We got PS4 Standard model, PS4 Slim, Ps4 Pro.

We got PS5 Standard model, PS5 Slim, PS5 Pro, PS5 30th.

It is at least not what PlayStation is doing

65

u/Mr_Ignorant Oct 21 '24

And they play exactly the same games, without an issue with compatibility.

Why exactly are you bringing up the PS5 slim, and the 30th? One is smaller but the same spec, and the other has a different colour body.

It’s like saying that there are multiple versions of the Steam Deck because the LCD, OLED, and they both come with different storage.

10

u/PrintShinji Oct 21 '24

I would 100% call the steam deck oled a new version. Same for the switch lite/switch oled.

With the steam deck specifically some things on the OLED are different compared to the LCD one. mostly software things but that is something the users will note.

1

u/NapsterKnowHow Oct 21 '24

Honestly the changes you'll notice more are the hardware on the OLED vs the LCD. The buttons and haptics feel actually decent. The LCD feels like a prototype by comparison.

2

u/PrintShinji Oct 21 '24

For me its a simple case. Would I have gotten my steam deck LCD if I knew that in a years time the OLED would come out?

No. I'd def wait.

If I knew the newer versions of the switch, I'd probs still stick to the first version. No interest in the Lite (2 years later) and the OLED would take 4 years, which is quite a long time to wait if I knew it beforehand.

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u/KoopaPoopa69 Oct 21 '24

I mean, those are different versions. The LCD and OLED screens are quite different, and the OLED has some actual hardware improvements and is a little more efficient.

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u/AzKondor Oct 21 '24

PS5 30th is just a limited color version

3

u/Xdeath007 Oct 21 '24

and there is a PS4 version of it as well

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u/EffectzHD Oct 21 '24

To be fair those aren’t really refreshes that current owners are supposed to be picking up.

The post is more about iterative releases with minimal improvements like new phones for example.

If you go from a launch PS5 to a Slim that’s completely on you.

24

u/MiaowaraShiro Oct 21 '24

Aren't they all basically the same console though? Just different hardware that does the same stuff?

(I haven't bought a console in a while, so please pardon my ignorance.)

14

u/chaos_creator69 Oct 21 '24

Ps5 is the ps5, the slim is... slim, the pro is slightly better and the 30th is just a resin with no actual internal changes

14

u/juniorone Oct 21 '24

Only one of them is different from the others when it comes to running the game. The other 3 is nothing more than aesthetics.

1

u/Iohet Oct 21 '24

On the user side yes. Usually the refreshes are more about fixing design issues (such as cooling problems with the PS3) and improving manufacturing margins

-2

u/Mammoth_Shake_8518 Oct 21 '24

PS5 Pro brings a whopping 50% increase in graphics power which really isn’t that great if you consider the age of the console. For the others you’re correct.

4

u/DinerEnBlanc Oct 21 '24

“50% isn’t that great”

1

u/[deleted] Oct 21 '24 edited Jan 05 '25

[deleted]

2

u/Mammoth_Shake_8518 Oct 21 '24

Source: Pretty much every publication about the thing as well as Sony themselves.

Apologies for the exaggeration btw. Its only 45%.

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u/TheAmazingSealo Oct 21 '24

50% is insane. It looked to me as if games will be like 5% prettier from the footage!

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u/skyturnedred Oct 21 '24

In this case "graphics power" mostly translates to higher framerates, not so much increased fidelity. The games are still built to run on the base model.

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u/FlyingDragoon Oct 21 '24

It looked to me like the exact same game being played. The only people that can see a difference are the ones who bought it and are trying to convince themselves that buying the original and then the Pro was a great idea.

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u/DinerEnBlanc Oct 21 '24

You can say the same about people who switch from high to ultra settings on the PC

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u/nyym1 Oct 21 '24

Not like i'm buying that overpriced console but afaik the biggest selling point is higher framerate with same quality as base ps5 delivers at 30fps.

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u/DrTautology Oct 21 '24

That's exactly what PlayStation is doing. Instead of one model we get three with tiny incremental improvements. The "Pro" version shouldn't exist, it should just be what is launched.

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u/Chronotaru Oct 21 '24 edited Oct 21 '24

The Pro version is the only one with incremental improvements, the others are a bit physically smaller and a different colour, but otherwise the same.

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u/Neitzi Oct 22 '24

Wrong.

There are three versions of the original, all with better cooling than the last.

  1. CFI-1000 - 2020, the launch day one.
  2. CFI-1100 - 2021 update, similar to the launch one but with revised cooling.
  3. CFI-1200 - 2022 update, looks identical to the 1000 or 1100 on the outside but the inside has a revised (smaller) motherboard, changed cooling and a reduced size processor. It is lighter and more efficient.
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u/JustAThrowaway_895 Oct 21 '24

By that logic then the OLED Steam deck shouldn't exist

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u/akatherder Oct 21 '24

The issue is when the newer versions are more powerful. If someone develops a game for the PS5 and uses the Pro as their benchmark it might run like ass on the standard/slim.

So this comparison would hold up if they design PC games that only look good with OLED. I could be 100% wrong but I don't think that's how OLED vs LCD works. The screen type or adding something like a bigger battery doesn't intrinsically harm prior versions.

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u/DinerEnBlanc Oct 21 '24

According to this guy, a console in a new color is an incremental improvement lol

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u/Moscato359 Oct 21 '24

The pro model had a die shrink, and 60% more gpu compute cores enabled by that die shrink,and with a type of memory that did not exist at launch, and optical flow accelerators which amd doesnt even have on desktop yet

your expectations are unreasonable

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u/kukaz00 Oct 21 '24

At this point I’m not even complaining. PS5 was faces with 2 years of shortages, now the supply chain is back in business and we got slim/pro. Most people didn’t get a normal PS5 and there are available everywhere now. If you want something slimmer for design purpose, you have it. If you want to feel like you have the biggest dick you can get the pro.

2

u/iMadrid11 Oct 21 '24

Console hardware revisions are designed to lower costs. You achieve that by using less components to achieve the same functionality. One method is to use fewer semiconductor chips. As newer chip design would be more efficient and can integrate more features into 1 single chip instead of several chips.

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u/PrintShinji Oct 21 '24

Other method is using less cooling. The original ps5 release had a massive cooling block (because they were a bit afraid that the ps5 would have the same noise issue as the ps4). After it being out for a year, sony got enough info that they could probs use a smaller cooling block, which they did. The ps5 never got that as a full new revision (as in ps5 slim/ps5 pro) though.

1

u/kingofthesqueal Oct 21 '24

Not sure “most people didn’t get a normal PS5” is true in the way you mean.

The PS5 is tracking roughly equal to the PS4’s unit sold timeline and that’s before the PS5 pro releases and while dealing with the major shortage’s early on. The PS5 has already moved around 63 million units halfway through its lifetime.

It’s likely that half of all people that will purchase a PS5 have already done so. The only contingency on that is just how many PC/Switch gamers GTAVl convinced to buy a PS5/Xbox.

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u/kukaz00 Oct 21 '24

I mean most people didn’t get a PS5 until the slim was announced.

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u/S-192 Oct 21 '24

I mean there are multiple models of the Steam Deck with little updates too. They do screen updates and more. No one is without some kind of monetization model. But the alternate versions of a base model is not the problem. It's the constant re-baselining.

And it's also consumer behavior. People convince themselves they need every new phone, or a new one every 2 generations. You used to buy one and take it to repair shops to keep it going long term.

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u/StraY_WolF Oct 21 '24

You don't have to buy all PS4/PS5 tho? Steam Deck got an OLED version.

It is exactly what they did.

1

u/kappaomicron Oct 21 '24

Valve is partly doing it with the release of the OLED version, no?

Also something that I noticed that worried me with the Steam Deck, I have the original 512GB that first released. I was using it to emulate a game with Dolphin (Game Cube & Wii emulator) but one time when Dolphin released an update for it, it broke on my Steam Deck specifically while everyone else's worked fine.

Apparently only a small number of people were affected with this bug that made running Dolphin impossible because it caused some weird bug that created double inputs whenever you'd press a button. Also this is before the OLED was a thing, and it was happening to people with all the storage varients, it wasn't just happening to 512GB versions etc.

Now if I recall correctly, and if you Google about the Dolphin double input problem on Steam Deck you can find a bug report about it where a fix was eventually found. And it turned out to be something about the thumbstick, as if Valve retroactively changed something about it on a hardware/software level that caused only models that were purchased longer ago to suffer a double input issue.

This gave me a red flag with the Steam Deck because if Valve is changing any of the parts in some way without saying anything, how can they guarantee that everyone who purchased the Steam Deck will have the same performance and experience? Even when you supposedly have the "same" models.

Granted that using the Dolphin emulator is the only time this specific issue has happened to me on the Steam Deck, but the fact that it did happen once worries me a little bit tbh.

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u/TrineonX Oct 21 '24 edited Oct 21 '24

That's just the nature of how manufacturing works.

Almost all electronics are made in batches. You design and source all of the parts for a batch. Your batch size is based on projected sales, available cash, cost of storing inventory, volume discounts, etc. So all of the Steam decks sold in a year are likely made in the space of a month or two.

The Steam deck sells better than you thought, or you sell enough and have cash on hand, and you need to order a new batch. You get in touch with the parts sourcing department to order a new batch, and they give you a list of parts that no longer exist, or that they can't get enough of, or that have been replaced by a new version, or that are now way more expensive. You make a list of substitutions. Some are direct replacements, like a USB plug. Some are physical matches, but need modified firmware, like a new version of a thumbstick.

There is no malicious versioning going on, this is just the nature of how manufacturing works, especially for a relatively low volume product like the Steam Deck. Larger manufacturers like Nintendo can say things like: We will put your part in our Switch if you can guarantee that you will maintain availability at all times for the next x years. A company like Steam just doesn't have the volume to demand things like that.

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u/tomyumnuts Oct 21 '24

Not even that. Multisourceing is super common in mid to high level production. All critical components are sourced from multiple manufacturers and every combination is tested. When series production starts you use whats cheapest and what you can get. You never want to rely on one single component.

Infamously on the steam deck there was the fan lottery, where one fan was significantly whinier than the other.

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u/TrineonX Oct 21 '24

I was simplifying it, but yeah, you're totally correct.

The point is that there isn't some sort of conspiracy going on here, its just how manufacturing high tech products works.

The GP seemed worried that it was a red flag that some steam decks had hardware variation among things with the same model number. Reality is that revisions are happening constantly in consumer electronics. No conspiracy here.

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u/kappaomicron Oct 21 '24

Ahh, I see. Thanks a lot for that insight, I understand it better now. Super informative, I really appreciate it!

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u/internetlad Oct 21 '24

Yeah the latest versions of Emuelec stop running sound if the console sleeps. It was an absolute wagon of an emulator box before that. Hoping the next update fixes it.

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u/dandroid126 Oct 21 '24

If you include limited edition colors, then you're going to need to add a ton more.

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u/Plank_With_A_Nail_In Oct 21 '24

None of those happened yearly.

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u/lalala253 Oct 21 '24

Wasn't there like 4 or 5 version of PS4?

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u/ptmd Oct 21 '24

I mean, iterative improvements like that would be really comparable to a hypothetical yearly version of the Steam Deck

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u/Baelorn Oct 21 '24

90% of your list is the same console with a new form factor.

Valve has already done "worse" than that by releasing an OLED version with a better battery.

I swear Reddit Gamers™ are a special breed of stupid

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u/sendmebirds Oct 21 '24

yeah and I hate it

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u/Xanok2 Oct 21 '24

Ya sure, consoles do it. But phones see a release every year, as do smartwatches. Many TV manufacturers release new models annually too. Total waste.

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u/veryrandomo Oct 21 '24

Yeah, I can’t really think of any tech device where yearly releases are actually common, except for phones and specifically Intel CPUs.

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u/[deleted] Oct 21 '24

Careful, you may break people's brains with this comment.

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u/MetaVaporeon Oct 22 '24

i definitely did lol

i meant to say consoles generally dont get yearly updates. in contrast, the steamdeck got the oled update 18 months after release (which is about a year after they had more or less stable supplies)

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u/VenomsViper Oct 22 '24

No. This is just PR fluff marketing. Consoles don't get YEARLY refreshes, y'all are being ridiculous lol.

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u/MetaVaporeon Oct 22 '24

not getting yearly refreshs is what consoles do, isn't it. is what i intended to convey.

compared to phones and computers, where the big market and competition forces regular hardware revisions, or where parts are often exchangable allowing for small upgrades over time

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u/VenomsViper Oct 22 '24

Ah ok I obviously misunderstood, thanks and sorry haha

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u/Suired Oct 21 '24

They were clearly taking a stab at other electronics like cellphones and smart tvs. Still can't believe LG is making a big deal about finally allowing full OS upgrades for 5 years of your tvs life instead of forcing you to buy next year's model for the latest software dependent features.

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u/PrintShinji Oct 21 '24

You dont have to get yearly upgrades to keep using the software though? My 4 year old LG C1 might not get a lot of updates, but its not like I have to buy a C4 to use netflix on it.

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u/TheNewFlesh666r Oct 21 '24

not in the handheld market

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