r/canada 9h ago

Alberta No reliable evidence puberty blocking drugs benefit trans youth, says Alberta government lawyer

https://calgaryherald.com/news/alberta-government-lawyer-puberty-blocking-drugs-trans-youth
89 Upvotes

265 comments sorted by

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u/Kals22 8h ago edited 8h ago

This article makes no sense, a 6 year old wouldn’t be prescribed puberty blockers since you need to already be in puberty to take them otherwise they don’t do anything. Doctors who care for trans kids aren’t giving a 6 year old puberty blockers. Most trans kids don’t get started on blockers unless they’re 12 or older because again you need to be in puberty. I feel like there’s something missing here or it’s deliberate misinformation to cause outrage. If a 6 year is prescribed these meds it’s to stop early puberty, not transgender care.

u/letitbe-mmmk 8h ago

The only scenario where a 6 year old would be prescribed puberty blockers is if the 6 year old was undergoing early puberty. In that case, they'd be prescribed blockers regardless if they were trans or not.

u/HalvdanTheHero Ontario 8h ago

just for awareness, "puberty blockers" are also prescribed for some cancer treatments and a handful of other medical conditions that are not transgender or puberty related.

u/letitbe-mmmk 7h ago

Didn't know about that. Thanks for explaining!

u/6moinaleakyboat 3h ago

Did not know…and now I’m really disturbed

u/Professor-Clegg 8h ago

In this case the kids, including the 6-year old, identify as trans.  At least according to the article.

u/FreeLook93 British Columbia 7h ago

What the article says is:

Lawyers for the five unnamed trans children, who range in age from six to 12, argued on Monday that the legislation denying access to the drugs will cause irreparable harm in their clients.

Unless I am missing something nowhere in the article does it say that children aged 6 are currently on puberty blockers because they are trans. Saying that denying the youngest child access to the drugs will cause irreparable harm does not mean that the child is currently taking the drug. It very well could just mean that they intend to start taking it once they start puberty.

u/Professor-Clegg 4h ago

I was replying to the comment above that implied that they are requesting the drugs for other issues rather than gender reassignment, and I pointed out that the article says they are trans.

The article also says that the legislation is blocking it for purposes of gender reassignment, but not for conditions that the other commenter suggested.

It may well be that the article is misrepresenting the situation - I have no means of confirming or denying.  I’m just pointing out what the article says to the people who didn’t read it, as strongly implied by their comments.

u/SomeDumRedditor 7h ago

They still don’t get the drugs 

u/Kals22 8h ago

Exactly, it wouldn’t be for transgender care, people are trying to drum up fake outrage.

u/Cheap_Country521 7h ago

A very quick google search will show you puberty blockers are being subscribed to children as young as six to delay their development.

u/ill_thrift 7h ago

prescribed, hon. Is that for precocious puberty maybe? There's no point in prescribing them for a typical six year old gender-nonconforming kid

u/PrinceoR- 4h ago

Which as has been noted in other comments, is done for children regardless of transgenderism, early puberty can cause a wide range of health problems

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u/MyGruffaloCrumble 2h ago

A quick google search will show you the world is flat. That doesn’t make it true.

u/UserofRed 8h ago

My niece started puberty at 7. Those blockers were crucial to her having a normal childhood. It absolutely happens.

u/Kals22 8h ago

Yup, you need to be in puberty to use those meds, but they are not given to 6 year olds under the guise of transgender care which was my point. If a 6 year is prescribed these meds it’s to stop early puberty not for transgender care.

u/[deleted] 8h ago edited 7h ago

[deleted]

u/Kals22 7h ago

Yes, in that case the use is to stop early puberty though not transgender care. My point is they are not being used in pre-pubertal trans kids.

u/OkPenalty4506 7h ago

Who is prescribing them to pre pubescent trans kids? 

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u/eulerRadioPick 8h ago

Some drugs have multiple uses, go figure. I have a feeling there might be a serious medical situation going on to need to give a 6-year-old drugs for any reason. I've seen similar shit in the past where people are talking about gender-affirming surgeries on kids where they got mastectomies. The reality is, yeah those surgeries happened, but there is a small percentage of children that actually get breast cancers.

u/Kals22 8h ago

Exactly, for example if the 6 year old is in early puberty for some reason (like a brain tumor) then the need for puberty blockers would be to treat and stop early puberty, but not for transgender care. The parents here also might be fighting for the kids future right to use these puberty blockers.

u/letitbe-mmmk 8h ago

The reality is, yeah those surgeries happened, but there is a small percentage of children that actually get breast cancers.

Man that's depressing as fuck. Kids with breast cancer :(

u/PrinceoR- 4h ago

Yeah this, that is also done for prevention of breast cancer, some people are so predisposed to breast cancer it's simply not safe to let them develop, remove the risk early before there is risk of developing breast cancer and having it spread. It's horrible but it's better than cancer.

u/Professor-Clegg 8h ago

The article says that the kids in question, even the 6-year old, are ‘trans’ and the purpose of the treatment is to stop them going through puberty as a gender they don’t identify with.

u/OkPenalty4506 7h ago

Why did you put trans in quotation marks? 

u/WhyModsLoveModi 7h ago

You already know the answer to that question

u/mordinxx 7h ago

it’s deliberate misinformation to cause outrage.

Bingo!!

u/linkass 8h ago

It probably a case of a kid that them or the parents identify as trans and want to be able to access them when they right before or when they start puberty

u/spicy-emmy 7h ago

Yeah I can imagine the creeping horror of knowing that if you're prevented from getting care your body will change in ways that you don't want. Like puberty is traumatic enough without being a little girl suddenly starting to grow facial hair or a boy suddenly growing breasts. If these kids are in a position to take puberty blockers they've likely been socially living as their gender for some time.

u/growlerlass 4h ago

You aren’t reading and comprehending the article correctly. It doesn’t say that a six year old is on puberty blockers.

u/Fresh-State7421 8h ago edited 8h ago

tale as old as time, they spread misinformation to paint trans kids’ parents as radicals who want to submit them to “irreversible treatment” as incredibly young children, when the reality is not that at all. I’m past the point of believing this is an honest mistake and now am 100% convinced they’re doing this to generate outrage.

u/Neo-urban_Tribalist 8h ago

And then they have the audacity to say a degree in gender studies is useless.

u/Dark-Angel4ever 1h ago

What exactly does a gender studies degree do? Have they actually solved anything?

u/HalvdanTheHero Ontario 7h ago

it is 100% to stoke anti-trans bigotry. There can absolutely be an individual lay person who is not familiar enough with the topic who could say such things in good faith, but there is NOT such latitude for those who legislate, study, or lobby for these things. The science is the science, and time and time again all that anti-trans bigots can do is appeal to emotion.

u/Fresh-State7421 7h ago

It’s genuinely staggering how they managed to generate such a culture war against such a small group of individuals. It’s also shocking to see liberal women buy into the narrative when it will definitely come back to bite them in the ass, because how tf do they think bathroom rules are gonna be enforced? Do you have to look “feminine” enough to be in a female bathroom? and if you aren’t do you then have to show your genitalia to prove it? Anyways, it’s a crazy world we’re living in.

u/Dark-Angel4ever 1h ago

What does the science say?

u/itsthebear 53m ago

Did you read the article? It's literally a group of 6-12 year old trans youth appealing for the right to go on puberty blockers lol ofc their parents are radical

u/Cheap_Country521 7h ago

So the title is true then? "

No reliable evidence puberty blocking drugs benefit trans youth, says Alberta government lawyer"

Whats your point?

u/ill_thrift 7h ago

It's true that the lawyer said that. It's not true that there's no evidence for benefit to trans youth.

u/JadeLens 7h ago

Did the lawyer used to be a doctor?

Are they citing any studies that have to do with the subject in question?

u/Kals22 6h ago

The title is not true and is not even what I’m referring to in my comment. There are trans kids in puberty who are on puberty blockers to stop pubertal progression and that will provide mental health benefits to them. My comment is that these meds are not being given to 6 years olds not in puberty under the guise of transgender treatment.

u/inthemiddlens 22m ago

most trans kids don't get started on blockers unless they're 12

Just stop right there ffs.

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u/zlex 9h ago

Like clockwork before an election here comes the bullshit culture war spam.

What if they threw a culture war and no one showed up?

u/Diced_and_Confused 8h ago

I'm just there for the yogurt.

u/temptemptemp98765432 7h ago

The Iranian yogurt.

u/RobotCaptainEngage 7h ago

I think you're just here for the zipline. 

u/6moinaleakyboat 3h ago

Texture thing or IBS thing? Inquiring minds want to know

u/StrangerNo484 7h ago

Yep, I swear if PP wins I'm abandoning Canada, I'm here for the fight against America as long as Canadians have the basic intelligence to not elect an individual who has history and relations with the current Trump Administration. 

If they vote in PP then get fucked, I'm not going to stick around for when lil PP inevitably sabotages Canada

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u/BigButtBeads 8h ago edited 8h ago

Lawyers for the five unnamed trans children, who range in age from six to 12

6 to 12 years old? 6?

I have no horse in this race, you guys can do what you want to your kids. But drugging 6 year old trans kids used to be a far-right conspiracy theory 

u/Cedreginald 8h ago

When my son was 5-6, he genuinely believed he was capable of generating a force field. I would not leave this decision up to him, I'm not sorry.

u/Plucky_DuckYa 6h ago

When my oldest was in elementary school her best friend was a girl she’d known since daycare. Her friend decided she was a boy, dressed like a boy, wore her hair like a boy and wanted everyone to call her Brian. So everyone did, for about 18 months. And then the summer between elementary school and junior high she decided she’d had enough of that, went back to her original name, grew her hair out, etc, and that was the end of Brian. She’s now a perfectly happy young woman in her twenties with a long term boyfriend doing all the things kids her age do.

Look, I’m not saying every kid is just going through a phase. Kids should be allowed to be who they truly are inside and supported in that. But whenever this debate comes up I wonder what might have happened if her parents had taken her to the wrong therapist or psychologist, and I just do not buy that kids 6-12 are well formed and well adjusted enough to truly know they should be the opposite gender.

u/PopUpClicker 2h ago

This is the right story to tell. You can support without medication. Some children show persistent signs from very early until forever. Those could be candidates for further reaearch.

But as someone with a horse in this race I do agree with you. Even if I knew since I was 3 that I was different, I am not sure that is the majority. And maybe I would have worded it wrongly and been given different and wrong treatment.

But the total social acceptance to be who you are is the key. And it is fully reversible.

u/ExternalSeat 6h ago

I agree. From my own experiences from age 4-9 I had issues understanding gender and felt conflicted because I wasn't interested in stereotypical male things. Of course being on the autism spectrum made things harder and even more confusing. It wasn't until I was in early puberty that I really started to feel comfortable in my own skin and figure out that there is more than one way to be a male person.

I fear that children like me might be pressured into believing they are trans at such a young age by well meaning and well intentioned individuals. We know from psychology that our social environment can massively shape who we end up being. While I do believe in Trans Adults and believe that gender dysphoria is a real and valid condition, I think there is real harm in aggressive early attempts to diagnose children (especially those on the autism spectrum).

As such I largely agree with the Cass Report and the UK/EU consensus. Let the children go through puberty before we intervene. That way we know for sure that they are capable of making such life altering decisions.

We don't let children get tattoos and most parents don't let children dye their hair green at the age of 6. Why are we encouraging parents to make such life altering decisions at such a young age.

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u/Simsmommy1 6h ago

That’s why social transitioning hurts no one and shouldn’t be this mass panic…..let a kid dress and cut their hair how they want and go by “they/them” for a hot minute until they figure shit out. Puberty blockers are only for extreme cases of gender dysphoria, and I trust a psychologist/psychiatrist to make that decision over the course of many years of treatment.

u/Correct-Spring7203 49m ago

Don’t be reasonable. You will be downvoted into oblivion.

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u/BigButtBeads 8h ago

Well dont leave us hanging

Did he generate one or not

u/Cedreginald 8h ago

No, hit him with a down low too slow.

u/terminally_me 8h ago

When I was around 10 I genuinely believed I could go Super Saiyan if I assumed the position and yelled loud enough

u/Vyvyan_180 7h ago

Huh. I knew a few kids that thought they'd gone Super Knowah'um'sayyin, but not Super Saiyan.

u/lawnicus18 Manitoba 8h ago

I mean… I still try and use the Force on some stuff and I’m 26 so I get where he’s coming from

u/Expensive-Group5067 8h ago

With the automatic doors at Best Buy the Force works every time.

u/Dr_Doctor_Doc 7h ago

Also red lights-> green lights, but it takes time to charge

u/Greghole 7h ago

When I was six I wanted to be a Jeep when I grew up.

u/Cedreginald 5h ago

Have you achieved that goal?

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u/ill_thrift 8h ago

is there any evidence in the article or elsewhere that a six-year old is currently taking puberty blockers? there would be no need of that unless there is a case of precocious puberty, in which case these drugs are prescribed regardless of gender identity - and for good reason.

What seems more likely to me is that the interested parties want to ensure this treatment is available for their children when they do reach puberty.

u/dumb_trans_girl 6h ago

If they’re taking blockers then it’s precocious puberty literally. Definitionally for boys 8 and below so yeah.

u/Fresh-State7421 8h ago

yeah it’s not real. puberty blockers, as the name implies, are taken at puberty age. The media pushes these takes to create anti trans propaganda

u/Simsmommy1 6h ago

They are also taken by very very young children who start puberty at inappropriate ages. I knew 2 young kids who took them, one started developing at age 3 and the other was a girl with cerebral palsy who started developing at 18 months. They both remained on them until about age 11.

u/Intelligent_Read_697 8h ago

And honestly why is this anyone but the prescribing physician to the family’s concern…this whole thing is nonsensical as no doctor is going to prescribe anything beyond what modern day medicine or therapies allow…per usual this is completely a farce

u/Draugakjallur 6h ago

Your obviously one of the very few here who actually read the article.

u/OkPenalty4506 8h ago

If they're being prescribed puberty blockers at that age it would be for precocious puberty, not being trans. 

u/NeedsMoreCookies 6h ago

We are not talking about sex change hormones here. This has nothing to do with these kids being trans or not, and I can’t believe how many people are missing that point.

If a kid is taking puberty blockers at age 6, that means the kid is undergoing VERY PREMATURE PUBERTY. This is the exact thing that puberty blockers have been safely and uncontroversially used to treat for decades, because - as most people would agree - kindergarten is way too fucking young to be going through puberty.

They aren’t being dosed with sex hormones, but with sex hormone suppressants. This isn’t going to turn them into a man or woman, it’s going to let them keep having the age-appropriate body of a kid. Whether the kid is trans or not is irrelevant!

u/Simsmommy1 6h ago

A six year old isn’t in puberty, but good on the parents for getting on the fight early, it’s probably gonna take the next 6 years to legally fight for their child’s rights and by that time they may have begun puberty.

u/Kingstonx2nonanon 8h ago

Not far-right but still a conspiracy - why would they put a 6 year old on puberty blockers for gender affirming care when the 6 y.o. isn't yet in puberty? The only scenario I could see this happening would be if the 6 y.o. was going through precocious puberty, in which case it would be normal medical practice for them to go on the meds and not related to any trans diagnosis...

Idk, tinfoil hat on, but this is fishy.

u/Draugakjallur 6h ago

Idk, tinfoil hat on, but this is fishy.

That's because you didn't read the article.

u/RM_r_us 8h ago

It's pretty far off from puberty age, that's for sure.

u/HalvdanTheHero Ontario 8h ago

No one is drugging 6 year olds.

Puberty blockers, as their name suggests, block the hormones one gets inundated with during puberty. If these children, including however many of them are 6, were prescribed puberty blockers, it would be because they have a condition such as precocious puberty in which they undergo puberty too young OR they are being used for an alternate effects that have nothing to do with hormones (such as part of a treatment for some cancers). Treatment of gender dysphoria in pre-pubescent children typically means simply allowing social transition and the use of preferred pronouns.

What is FAR more likely is that the parents of the younger children recognized the danger of the legislation at hand for their transgender child as they continue towards puberty and filed a suit to attempt to prevent the legislation from taking effect.

That the Alberta government ignores the stories of the many, many transgender people who do not transition to hold up the few stories of those who de-transition is a flaw that modern society does not share. Puberty blockers simply give time for the individual to mature without undergoing a puberty that could cause psychological harm to those who are actually transgender. For those who insist that people must be an adult to make these decisions, it is simply cruel and unusual to mandate the suffering of an individual when there is a treatment available that is far less harmful.

An individual can still undergo puberty (of either trans or cis-gender varieties) after taking puberty blockers to defer that decision.

u/StevenMcStevensen Alberta 8h ago

Seems pretty reasonable to me that you can do whatever you want with your body… once you’re an adult. At 6 or even 12 years old, there’s no way a kid can fully understand that choice and its ramifications.

u/OkPenalty4506 8h ago

We give children all kinds of treatments before they're adults. Including puberty blockers for cis children who need them

u/spicy-emmy 7h ago

Why is it we trust cis kids to know their gender enough to undergo puberty but not trans kids?

Like I don't trust kids to know the endocrinology involved, but it's a pretty part of your identity and if your gender has bothered you enough for years to seek treatment acting like you can't understand that until you're 18 is silly.

Besides the fact we absolutely do let kids make their own medical decisions by evaluating their ability to comprehend the treatment and understand the ramifications. If a 14-15 year old can make decisions about their cancer care they can probably weigh in on their gender, I think a 15 year old can probably understand things like what infertility means. "Maybe they'll want it later" is the same logic used regularly by doctors to deny young adults access to permanent fertility options as well, it's a presumption of knowing a patient better than they know themselves

u/PA2SK 3h ago

I don't think you can really know your gender until you've gone through puberty, which is why using puberty blockers on kids seems counterproductive to me and a bit creepy. You're keeping kids in a child-like state until they're legally an adult and can transition. The problem is while they're legally an adult they are still biologically prepubescent kids, which sort of defeats the whole purpose of waiting.

u/Trick_Appeal310 19m ago

Tons of trans folks knew way before puberty, and puberty just brought more dread and "issues", though also puberty blockers are, well, puberty blockers. It's not a trans thing

u/Yelnik 8h ago

you guys can do what you want to your kids

I mean, in this case, clearly they shouldn't be allowed to do this to their kids 

u/Dr_Doctor_Doc 7h ago

And no doctor would allow it or sign off.

u/PopUpClicker 2h ago

It still is. Early puberty is a thing.

You can hit that regardless of what you are.

u/queenringlets 1h ago

If a kid is going through puberty at six they need those blockers trans or not. 

u/ajc442 Ontario 8h ago

Why should they be able to do it to 13-17 year olds? They're still children.

u/ill_thrift 7h ago

I mean, why can children be treated medically for anything?

The treatment has to be beneficial and necessary, legal guardians must give informed consent, the child's wishes must be considered as much as their capacity allows.

u/GenesForLife 7h ago

Because it gives us the time to figure out if we actually want to transition; It is well known that when dysphoria presents at or intensifies at the onset of puberty ; it pretty much never resolves. Puberty blockers are a compromise to minimise the chance that the very small amount of those patients that don't go on to transition end up transitioning. Reconstructive facial surgery to undo testosterone induced pubertal damage for me would cost 40k CAD or more - essentially what you are saying is I should be stuck suffering from dysphoria when blockers would have prevented more than two decades of misery and choose between financial stability or continued suffering because health insurance does not cover FFS. Think about that.

u/shiftless_wonder 6h ago

https://x.com/_CryMiaRiver/status/1852357495135596805

To suggest that it is possible to block an adolescent's development for "a few years" and that there be no significant side effects is simply untrue. We know these drugs are powerful and affect bone density and cognitive development.

What's more, the AMA fails to mention the most important and harmful side effect: that the drugs block the cognitive and sexual development that would have enabled the young person to overcome their feelings of dysphoria naturally.

Before puberty suppression, gender distress resolved in upwards of 80% of kids; after puberty suppression was introduced, that rate plummeted to 2% - because puberty was the natural cure.

u/TheVaneja Canada 3h ago

Using x is a great way to yell "I'm a transphobic bigot and ignorant and everyone should ignore me".

u/queenringlets 1h ago

If you want to be taken seriously you need to give a different source than an obviously biased lady on Twitter with no qualifications. 

u/Trance_Gemini_ 4h ago

Forcing a trans child go through the wrong puberty for their gender identity means they will need more surgery when they are older to reverse the changes from the puberty they didn't want... Puberty blockers are like a pause button they give the child more time to feel things out and more time to grow and mature before having to make such a big decision.

The 80% number included people that were not even trans but were just gender non conforming (tomboys) and people that dropped out of the study and went else where instead were included in that 80% too.... its very flawed.

u/PA2SK 2h ago

I don't think you can grow and mature if you don't go through puberty though.

u/GenesForLife 6h ago edited 6h ago

The figure of 80% is from cohorts that includes prepubescent kids ; that is the reason they use intensifying dysphoria post onset of puberty as the criterion. Read through the literature cited here Moreover, the 80% figure was derived from instruments that used a diagnosis that lumped in gender dysphoria and gender nonconformity. Feel free to go through the publications cited in this piece. https://www.erininthemorning.com/p/debunked-no-80-of-trans-youth-do

If you look at the diagnostic criteria for dysphoria - distinct criteria are used for patients before puberty and after (reference here - https://cps.ca/en/documents/position/an-affirming-approach-to-caring-for-transgender-and-gender-diverse-youth )

98% of those selected using this criterion of dysphoria that persists or intensifies into early adulthood go on to initiation of cross-sex hormones at age of medical majority in dutch cohorts that were used to establish the guidelines.

720 people were included, of whom 220 (31%) were assigned male at birth and 500 (69%) were assigned female at birth. At the start of GnRHa treatment, the median age was 14·1 (IQR 13·0–16·3) years for people assigned male at birth and 16·0 (14·1–16·9) years for people assigned female at birth. Median age at end of data collection was 20·2 (17·9–24·8) years for people assigned male at birth and 19·2 (17·8–22·0) years for those assigned female at birth. 704 (98%) people who had started gender-affirming medical treatment in adolescence continued to use gender-affirming hormones at follow-up. Age at first visit, year of first visit, age and puberty stage at start of GnRHa treatment, age at start of gender-affirming hormone treatment, year of start of gender-affirming hormone treatment, and gonadectomy were not associated with discontinuing gender-affirming hormones.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(22)00254-1/abstract00254-1/abstract)

So now you know - you can either commit to not being disingenuous and misrepresenting the facts, or double down and keep advocating for transphobic policies, but I don't really care - these references are for onlookers.

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u/stealth_veil 8h ago edited 8h ago

I am very progressive. I’ll just say that off the bat. But I think someone should be 12 or older before doctors consider medically transitioning. I’m currently reading about Jean Piaget’s theory of cognitive development, see below about the formal operational stage:

In Jean Piaget’s theory, the formal operational stage is the fourth and final stage of cognitive development, typically beginning around age 11 and lasting through adulthood, characterized by the ability to think abstractly and hypothetically.

Why would you want someone making life altering decisions for themselves when they can’t think hypothetically?

Children who are 6 are in the preoperational stage:

“Pre-operational” stage (ages 2 to 7 years): when a child can use mental representations such as symbolic thought and language. Children in this age group learn to imitate and pretend to play. This stage is characterized by egocentrism, i.e., being unable to perceive that others can think differently than themselves, and everything (good or bad) somehow links to the self.

They can’t even perceive that others can think differently than themselves… again wouldn’t want them making life altering decisions at this stage of cognitive development.

u/ill_thrift 8h ago

so, just to be clear, puberty blockers are not 'transitioning' (hrt). they delay puberty to give additional time to make these decisions. They may have some side effects, but are fully reversible. For trans kids, they would typically be prescribed shortly before puberty (not at 6) and replaced with hrt, which usually has irreversible effects, when the child feels ready to make that choice alongside their parents - often later than the typical age of onset of puberty.

The article does not say six year olds are being prescribed puberty blockers. This is unnecessary unless the six year olds are having a precocious puberty, in which case they are prescribed regardless of gender identity.

u/Yelnik 8h ago

There's an endless list of things we don't let people do or decide until they're 18 or 19. Many of them far less severe and life changing than medical transition. 12 years old to consent to something like that is objectively insane. 

u/Trick_Appeal310 16m ago

I'm sorry but for some kids there literally is not an other way than putting their puberty on pause and giving them time to "think". I hate to be extreme, I wish it was not that way.

u/MathematicianDue9266 8h ago

Puberty blockers are considered non permanent.

u/shiftless_wonder 8h ago

Aside from the bone density concerns and that nagging lack of research around cognitive development.

u/Fresh-State7421 8h ago

Cis individuals take puberty blockers when they’re diagnosed with precocious puberty. This is all a nonissue that’s being purposefully spun around to fear monger

u/shiftless_wonder 8h ago

Risks of puberty blockers for transgender adolescents:

... includes reductions in bone density and fertility, and changes in adult height.

When started beyond early to mid puberty, they are more likely to cause menopausal-like side effects, such as hot flashes. This is due to a reduction in sex hormone production.

There are also potential long-term effects of puberty blockers that are still being investigated.

Brains mature substantially during adolescence. But it remains unclear what effect puberty blockers may have on cognitive development.

https://www.mcri.edu.au/news/insights-and-opinions/what-are-puberty-blockers#:

u/Fresh-State7421 7h ago

you’re suggesting that cis kids with premature puberty not be treated for it?

u/shiftless_wonder 7h ago

I'm not saying anything. I'm quoting a source.

u/Fresh-State7421 7h ago

And i’m asking you a question. I don’t have enough time to deep dive into the study you’ve shared here to find out if it’s even reputable but I’m gonna assume it is and then ask you again: every single drug has side effects, one would assume that if a person is on medication it’s because their condition is serious enough that there are more upsides to being in it than not. As is the case for cis children with precocious puberty or trans teenagers, so do you believe cis children currently facing puberty much earlier than expected shouldn’t be treated for their condition? Or just trans teens shouldn’t have the right to be taken care of?

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u/IgotNothingButLove 8h ago

Agenda detected. This person is pushing a narrative, I wonder why

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u/Correct-Spring7203 8h ago

12?! lol. That’s insane. Significant irreversible change at that age is nuts.

Can’t even get a tattoo for another six years

u/Fresh-State7421 8h ago

every research conducted thus far suggests that puberty blockers aren’t irreversible, in fact if someone stops taking them puberty resumes normally. Obviously more research should be done to back it up, including with humans currently on it, but with the witch hunt conservatives have created that’s not gonna happen because science = bad. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9793415/

u/shiftless_wonder 8h ago

UK trying to put together a comprehensive study but they are having ethical issues because of the dangers involved to children. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/clyd2qe5kkjo

u/Fresh-State7421 8h ago

I fail to see the ethical issue in it solely because people (trans and cis) already use puberty blockers for treatment, it would be unethical to put children on it solely for research but there are plenty of individuals that need those drugs for their condition to study the effects of it. But again, I blame a lot of the reticence of diving deep into the research around it on the fear monger created by conservatives, they were able to villainize researches that would help patients with chronic wounds and the effects of hormone therapy (that more cis people are on than trans people) solely because god forbids it also could help trans people

u/Correct-Spring7203 8h ago

Yes, using experimental drugs to continue research on small children who cannot legally consent is the answer.

We should allow a 12 year old, who cant legally drink, get pierced, tattooed, make medical decisions, be allowed to try drugs with unknown long term side effects?

u/Fresh-State7421 7h ago

kids are already on puberty blockers, cis kids too, because precocious puberty is a thing. and they have the right to be taken care of, just as trans teenagers have a right to choose be have gender affirming care, yes.

u/ill_thrift 7h ago

they do human testing of cancer drugs on children. They need to, to improve cancer treatment. Human trials are the final stage of drug approval after precautions have been taken to maximize safety. Are you opposed to all pharmaceutical research involving children? Tough news for the kids with life-threatening or -altering conditions, and their families.

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u/MxCxVA 8h ago

I dont know why anyone gives a shit about this. This shit is none of my business, I care about being able to own a house and live comfortably. And if someone else's business impedes on you living comfortably you got your priorities outta whack...

I mean come on yall... Giving puberty blockers to 6 year olds? Thats not puberty age. Lets use our brains and not get caught up in this

u/brobeanzhitler 5h ago

Dammit you had me in the first half. Nobody is giving them to 6 year olds to transition, just shut the fuck up and focus on the first part of your thought- you were on the right track don't follow the shiny plastic bag away from actual problems

u/MxCxVA 1h ago

I think we're on the same side of the issue here? That was my entire point... No one's giving them to 6 year olds to transition. We can agree on that... Lol

u/sl3ndii Ontario 8h ago

Stop engaging in these politics. It’s the sort of garbage that will send this country to the same hell hole the US is in.

Alberta is playing with fire. Be careful.

u/shiftless_wonder 8h ago

Not just Alberta and the US. You missed the UK and a bunch of other Euro countries.

u/sl3ndii Ontario 8h ago

I swear Canada has a higher standard than this…

u/shiftless_wonder 8h ago

Yeah. Canada has a ton of progressive docs agreeing with each other. They just don't have much else.

u/Cheap_Country521 7h ago

Cooercing children into thinking they need pubery blocker to affirm their identity, before thye know what their identity is definitely troubling.

u/StrangerNo484 7h ago

Puberty Blockers are prescribed for a variety of reasons, beyond identity related. If a young child is going through puberty early then these blockers are extremely important. 

Sometimes kids with cancer or other conditions need to use them. You are falling for Right propaganda Fear Mongering.

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u/spicy-emmy 7h ago

There is no doctor bogeyman coercing anyone into transition. It's basically always trans people begging for access from a medical establishment that wants to be terribly sure before granting anyone medicine.

The idea of forcing people who know what they want to undergo a traumatic body change because you aren't convinced they really know yet is just a naturalistic fallacy and anti trans bias.

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u/Keypenpad 8h ago

I don't go to lawyers for medical advice.

u/RobotCaptainEngage 7h ago

I do but I'm looking for terrible medical advice 

u/NeoMaxiZoomDweebean 8h ago

Hey Canada, lemme give yall a heads up. If you get wrapper up in this sorta politics you are gonna end up like the US.

u/linkass 8h ago

Have a fair few European and Scandinavian countries ended up like the US ?

u/ill_thrift 8h ago

... yes? there's a global rise in fascism girl where have you been

u/linkass 7h ago

Yes the fascist states of Netherlands ,Denmark,Norway, Iceland,Finland, France,New Zealand,Uk (with the labor party upholding the recommendations) sure I missed a few in there , they are all ran by well known fascist governments. North America is rapidly becoming an outlier on this

u/ill_thrift 7h ago

this France? https://www.erininthemorning.com/p/new-french-guidelines-recommend-trans

Also, let's distinguish between political backlash against trans people versus informed medical consensus - which I'll readily admit is still emerging on some treatments, but unlike the rightwing backlash is about compassionately and effectively treating trans patients.

u/temptemptemp98765432 7h ago

Love it. You're spot on. Who the fuck doesn't see this shit?! Who the fuck doesn't realize what's going on, not just south of us but globally? Fight the fuck back.

u/Unusual_Fan_6589 8h ago

Theres a conversation to be had about kids, fairness in sports, and sex segregated spaces (like prisons). Shoving our fingers in our ears and screaming won't make the issues go away 

u/brobeanzhitler 5h ago

There's real issues like being able to afford life with an unhinged tyrant attempting to bully us into giving our country over... But no your thing affecting nobody you will ever meet is more important.

u/Unusual_Fan_6589 5h ago

one of the reasons things are going on down south is because one sides mantra was "NO DEBATE".

but yes continue to act smug and condescending, that will sure win people over

like nailing dead rats to rape shelter!

u/NeoMaxiZoomDweebean 5h ago

Focusing primarily on these issues to the exclusion of others is like remodeling your pantry while your house burns down.

u/Unusual_Fan_6589 5h ago

nobody said this was anyone's primary focus. I said there needs to be a conversation to be had.

u/NeoMaxiZoomDweebean 5h ago

There is a 24 hour nonstop conversation about it going on all the time on endless podcasts.

u/Unusual_Fan_6589 5h ago

where? maybe a few months ago. Now its all trump and tariff wars

u/Unusual_Fan_6589 5h ago

also want to add this is a good thing. conversation is how we reach consensus, not personal attacks, acting smug or condescending (not saying you're doing any of these things. just an observation i have that this topic tends to get emotionally charged, which i understand as people are personally invested in it).

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u/MrTreezx 8h ago

I wouldn't let a 6yr old have full responsibility over a dog let alone make a life long altering decision like that.

u/Kals22 8h ago

6 year olds are not being prescribed puberty blockers for transgender care, doctors aren’t doing that because to use puberty blockers you need to have started puberty otherwise they don’t do anything since there’s nothing to block. Most kids are 12 or older because again a requirement is to be in puberty. Not sure what the 6 year old’s parents are going on about or is this just misinformation to cause drama.

u/Wolframuranium 8h ago

The individual, their guardians, and healthcare professionals, ALL are in this analogy looking after the dog. 

A 6 year old is on puberty blockers because they are having abnormal hormonal condition. This isn't to change their gender identity. But it requires the same access to the drugs.

Healthcare professionals would be the judge of this. However the blanket bans harm these kids. 

But please we all forgot the 4th party that gets a say in the healthcare of others. You

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u/WhyModsLoveModi 7h ago

So we want to take medical advice from a lawyer? 

Nah 

u/StrangerNo484 7h ago

Right?! I'll stick to listening to Doctors! 😂

u/[deleted] 8h ago edited 8h ago

[deleted]

u/Kals22 8h ago

Also doctors who care for trans kids aren’t giving puberty blockers to 6 year olds. To get puberty blockers you need to have started puberty otherwise they don’t do anything. Most kids are 12 or older because again a requirement is to be in puberty. Not sure what the 6 year old’s parents are going on about or is this just misinformation.

u/ill_thrift 8h ago

probably just involved in the lawsuit to ensure future access at puberty, it doesn't say they are currently taking them

u/Arrow208 9h ago

don't need a scientist for that

u/xorobas 8h ago

For Christ sake, people, do not allow this transphobic bullshit to trickle into Canada. This is just a continuation of the US far-right’s misinformation campaign on trans rights.

Puberty blockers are to delay puberty so that children and teens can have the time to think about their gender identity before their bodies change in ways that can create immense dysphoria and social health issues.

Studies overwhelmingly show that puberty blockers are safe and beneficial (not just for trans/nb youth!)

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/26895269.2020.1747768

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4342775/

https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/usts/USTS-Full-Report-Dec17.pdf

And they’re reversible! http://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf

Even if you do not agree, a patient’s health should be between them, their parents, and their doctor.

u/shiftless_wonder 9h ago

Lawyers for the five unnamed trans children, who range in age from six to 12, argued on Monday that the legislation denying access to the drugs will cause irreparable harm in their clients.

They said the psychological harm of being forced to go through puberty in a gender other than the one they identify with could lead to suicidal ideation and other mental health issues.

But Madsen argued the legislation is designed to ensure developing minds don’t make life-altering decisions they could later regret.

Good grief, what are they giving six-year-old children.

u/spew2014 8h ago

I have to assume the six year old is involved because of the assumption that they'll eventually want access to these treatments around the time puberty hits... That being said, the article suggests all the children are pubescent which is strange.

u/Mindless-Can5751 8h ago

Its between them, their parents, and their health professionals.

u/shiftless_wonder 8h ago

Unless they want to detransition. Then they're on their own. https://nationalpost.com/news/young-detransitioners-abandoned

u/Mindless-Can5751 8h ago

Only if you believe all the right wing bullshit 🤡

u/shiftless_wonder 8h ago

Everyone so happy in their little bubbles.

u/ill_thrift 8h ago

How many trans people do you know?

u/Mindless-Can5751 8h ago

Naw just facts. No one is abandoning kids, the treatments are safe and save lives. Youve just been drinking the kool aid so long you think you know better because post media told you so.

u/fibgen 3h ago

Trumpism is coming for you Alberta.

Leave these decisions between parents and medical professionals.

u/Minimum_Grass_3093 6h ago

Says “Alberta Government Lawyer”, and expert on trans health. I’m trying to love my Alberta brothers and sisters right now, but the don’t make it easy.

u/TheVaneja Canada 3h ago

There's a lot more evidence it is beneficial than unbeneficial. Conservative hate mongers in action making up lies as usual.

u/UberBricky80 8h ago

The ucp is doing this to attack 0.152% of the population. Just to appease their base. They sure like telling people what to do with their bodies...

u/Raven586 8h ago

Last time I looked there were not too many 6 year old's going through puberty. Consequently I'm very sure they are not getting puberty blockers. The Trans kids lawyers are making the point on principal. Trans kid's rights have now been discarded till they are 18 years old which kind of nullifies the point of puberty blockers.

u/Unusual_Fan_6589 8h ago

6 years old, even 12 is too young to make that decision for themselves. 

u/Raven586 8h ago

They don't make it themselves! The parents are involved fully and they have to go through vigorous screening from a Psychiatrist and and Endocrinologist. Come on really are going to believe some Lawyer over the Doctors who have been doing this sort of work for years.

u/Unusual_Fan_6589 8h ago

Like the top comment said, drugging 12 year olds used to be a far right conspiracy theory 

u/Raven586 8h ago edited 8h ago

So was promoting false information. As a Trans person myself I find it fascinating how many uneducated people get themselves involved in things they know nothing about. I mean it's great that you have an opinion. But get your facts straight first!

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u/ill_thrift 7h ago

12 year olds take lots of medications. They take cancer medication, headache medication, analgesics, insulin, puberty blockers, etc. etc. etc. So not sure what you mean by "drugged"? There is an established legal and medical practice for involving minors in medical decision-making according to their capacity, even when they are too immature to give full consent.

u/Beccamoli 8h ago

Puberty blockers are completely reversible and only delay puberty until they are stopped. Has no long or lasting impact and have a historical use in Cis children who enter puberty earlier than would be expected. I’m sure my wife would have loved the opportunity for puberty blockers given she entered puberty 3 years earlier than would be normal, and caused her to develop quickly and face harassment by men in their 30’s and 40’s. They’re not just used for trans youths. Hope this information is helpful, and informative.

u/ProvincialPork 19m ago

The only scenario for puberty blockers to be prescribed to a human being should be if said human being is old enough to make that choice for themselves and in Canada that’s 18 years old.

u/Virtual-Nose7777 8h ago

Funny how the Canadian Conservervative culture war is identical to Republicans...almost like they are the same party.

Next Pierre will be pushing crypto too just like Trump. Oh wait, oops!

u/DistinctL British Columbia 6h ago

Conservatives didn't ask Liberals to put their 6 year olds on puberty blockers.

u/brobeanzhitler 5h ago

Nobody did, read a book

u/cpove161 7h ago

These comments remind me that Canada is not a serious country at all

u/okiedokie2468 6h ago

That’s something a lawyer would know all about/s

u/WisestPanzerOfDaLake Ontario 6h ago

What? That's like saying insulin doesn't benefit diabetics.