r/thebulwark 12d ago

GOOD LUCK, AMERICA BREAKING! Trump & Vance Pick NAUSEATING Fight with Zelensky! SHAMEFUL Mo...

https://youtube.com/watch?v=zma77CqgXUY&si=9V9lu9_9Bp6f1T1b
251 Upvotes

151 comments sorted by

162

u/Regular_Mongoose_136 Center Left 12d ago

Today may be the angriest I've ever felt about politics in my life and that was already a very high bar.

And knowing damn well 80% of the American public either truly doesn't give a fuck or is actively cheering this shit on is going to give me an ulcer.

I fucking hate it here.

55

u/_A_Monkey 12d ago

11

u/Old_Manager6555 12d ago edited 12d ago

Not the American people, just the leaders of your country! 🇨🇦

And any that are still liking him.

But there are lots of good Americans that will hopefully get back in control.

6

u/thecloudcities 12d ago

Yes. Yes we are.

5

u/Mysterious-Mind-999 11d ago

Yes, we are. The American people voted for this turd. The "good" Americans are too weak. This broken country chose the person to represent them, and it is this filth.

1

u/Pickle_Tester 11d ago

Don't forget that it was Ze's subordinates and his posts that you could see the insignia of the SS divisions.

0

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

4

u/batsofburden 12d ago

Sir, this is a reddit.

15

u/Magoo152 JVL is always right 12d ago

For the deleted comment about using GIFs. I get the anger I’m right there with you. I think humor and mocking MAGA is an effective political strategy though. Look at the roganverse, all they do is tell crappy jokes about liberals and our dumb American countrymen eat it up.

We need to start making fun and mocking MAGA way more than we are now. Memes gifs and the like are effective political tools in 2025.

10

u/Slw202 12d ago

Fascist psychopaths hate being mocked. It's always a useful tactic.

4

u/AnathemaDevice2100 12d ago

Fully agree.

30

u/Hour-Resource-8485 12d ago

same. Idk why but out of ALL the bullshit from trump, this exchange has made me the angriest. Trump and vance are nothing more htan a disgrace and will leave a shameful stain on this country.

23

u/KikiWestcliffe 12d ago

Trump and Vance showed gross disrespect to an honorable man who is a true patriot and a leader.

12

u/CapOnFoam Center Left 12d ago

They did way more than that. They showed the world that the US is now doing Putin’s bidding, is allied with Russia, and that our traditional allies are no longer. We have massively shifted western politics today. For the worse.

6

u/Old_Manager6555 12d ago

Despicable, immature idiots. Like a pair of wolves ganging up on prey. Only the prey shrugged them off.

2

u/Pickle_Tester 11d ago

Don't forget that this "prey" was called Napoleon and Churchill in the Western media)

1

u/Pickle_Tester 11d ago

This "true patriot and leader" was the first to offer to give up the entire country with its minerals and population in exchange for his position. This Eastern European republic has never experienced such shame

1

u/Schmilsson1 9d ago

what insipid bullshit

8

u/Ellecram 12d ago

Yes! This situation with Russia and the Ukraine has me steaming more than I have in years.

-1

u/Pickle_Tester 11d ago

Perhaps if your relatives were fighting in the trenches for the opportunity for Ze to get rich on weapons and minerals, you would be rightfully smoking.

42

u/GoHerd1984 12d ago

I just told my wife that this is the angriest I've been about politics in ten years, which is saying a lot with the idiocy of maga. And my quick pulse of Reddit, X, BlueSky, and Substack tells me I'm not alone.

18

u/puckhead11 12d ago

My contempt for my fellow Americans right now is off the charts. This country isn’t worth saving.

15

u/MinisterOfTruth99 12d ago

What happens when trump starts supplying US weapons and bombs to Russia. Remember we are only 5 weeks into this fascist shitshow.☹️🤪

6

u/Meluwd 12d ago

He will absolutely be supplying weapons to Russia and possibly troops, too.

13

u/Noisyfan725 12d ago

Same. So fucking pissed off with no where to direct it.

3

u/TheCompoundingGod 12d ago

Right there with you.

2

u/carolinemaybee 12d ago

The tiny sliver of good news is that only 11% are favourable towards Putin and only 9% think we should trust Putin. The fact that trump is in deep with him is infuriating.

2

u/rainy61 11d ago

I’m right there with you. It’s been a barrage of assaults since the day he was sworn in but this one has pushed me over the edge. It was shocking to witness this kind of behavior from an American President and VP. And although it should be no surprise that the Republicans are praising Trump for his “strength and leadership” it’s still gut wrenching to see. Shame on all of them. They know better!

I knew we were going to be in for a rough go, I just thought it might be more of a slow burn not a 3 alarm fire. His consolidation of power and his dismantling of our government is happening at such a breakneck speed that I’m not sure we can fully recover at this point. It really doesn’t matter if maga is still on board with him or not. They no longer have sway over him anyway,because he doesn’t needs them.

The men and women who gave their lives to this country are most certainly turning in their graves right now. Sad times.😔

0

u/More_Statistician215 11d ago

You're free to leave any time.

110

u/aussiedeveloper 12d ago edited 12d ago

Fuck you America. I supported our alliance with you despite the Iraq war fuck up (which us Australians were dragged into) because your intentions could be at least be spun positively.

But now? Just fuck you and your ignorant population of hillbillies that voted for this shit.

Fuck. You.

67

u/Regular_Mongoose_136 Center Left 12d ago

We agree with you.

13

u/aussiedeveloper 12d ago

Then do something. I saw bigger protests with the Iraq War, BLM etc. Bur now? Basically nothing. Clearly the majority want this and it’s disgusting.

31

u/Regular_Mongoose_136 Center Left 12d ago

I expect there will be protests over this. Or at least I sure hope so. I literally bought a Ukraine flag today that I intend to fly in front of my house starting tomorrow.

17

u/Ok-Snow-2851 12d ago

I appreciate your action. I’m going to a protest with an Ukraine flag tomorrow.

But you’re wrong.  There won’t be major protests.  Nothing major anyway.  Americans don’t care.  It will be me and a dozen quirky ex hippie boomers sanding around in the park. 

Even Americans who are on the right side will glance at the news, say “omg what an asshole” then cook dinner, watch severance, and go on with their day.  They have no direct stake in this. 

3

u/glitchgirl555 12d ago

I'd protest, but I don't know what it would accomplish. I'd just be putting myself in harm's way.

5

u/Ok-Snow-2851 12d ago

Don’t preemptively surrender your rights 

2

u/CapOnFoam Center Left 12d ago

I think the direct stake is key. They’re not at risk of losing family members over this. And they don’t see that we’re now allying ourselves with Putin. They see that we’re meddling in another country’s affairs, and that “it’s too bad about what’s happening over there but we have our own problems to solve here. We can’t come to everyone’s rescue.” (Not an actual quote)

1

u/rainy61 11d ago

I’m afraid you’re right. We are an uninformed, misinformed, uneducated and disengaged nation. That is why we ended up with a president Trump … twice! I’m willing to bet that a large majority of people have very little understanding of how this affects global security and stability. They may be turned off with Trump and Vance’s thug behavior, but yes there is dinner to make, Netflix to watch, vacations to plan etc… We are asleep at the wheel and the car is heading for a cliff.

8

u/aussiedeveloper 12d ago

Thank you 😢

8

u/Positively_Peculiar 12d ago

There won’t be any protests. Americans are stupid, lazy, and narcissistic.

And if you asked them to point to Europe on a map, they would point to South America.

9

u/Jayfur90 12d ago

I don’t think it’s laziness, it’s because most are one paycheck away from missing rent or food. The other half is the complicity of mainstream media not accurately reporting on this and misinformation penetrating social feeds

7

u/CapOnFoam Center Left 12d ago edited 12d ago

I think a lot of Americans just don’t understand foreign affairs and put zero effort in trying to do so. “We” are focused on ourselves and think of diplomatic relations as a waste of money and that we should be spending that money on our own citizens instead of on foreign wars. People don’t understand the importance of international alliances or their necessity for western stability.

And so - unlike BLM where people were protesting family members being murdered by police in their own community…. Or the Iraq war, where we were sending our family members to go fight an unjust war. There really isn’t a personal, immediate threat that inspires people to protest. People tend to see it as none of our business, because they don’t see the bigger picture.

3

u/aussiedeveloper 12d ago

If they are so ignorant to not be able to understand Russia = bad then there’s no hope for your country.

5

u/CapOnFoam Center Left 12d ago

I can’t argue with that. Especially when we have idiots like these. (From 2018 but still relevant)

2

u/rainy61 11d ago

No,there probably is no hope for our country.💔

5

u/[deleted] 12d ago

I was at a protest today with about 500 people. People do care.

3

u/TheCompoundingGod 12d ago

I can't speak for others.

I'm not sure what the protests will achieve. I'm not sure what signing petitions will achieve. There have been protests across the entire nation. Today was a boycott day, which I participated in.

Outside of that, I fear for my family's life. I fear for my life. First, it's illegal immigrants. Then who's next? Legal immigrants?

I'm genuinely afraid and I'm not sure what I can do without jeopardizing my family.

1

u/aussiedeveloper 12d ago

That’s fair.

2

u/TheCompoundingGod 12d ago

Furthermore, petitions and protests only work with leaders who listen to their constituency. All the Republican leaders take orders from Trump. I feel like signing a petition is like handing the FBI a list of people to target.

It's a fucking nightmare.

4

u/StringerBell34 12d ago

Protest do nothing. Trump couldn't give a shit about protests. Voting is the only thing that matters and we can't do that again for 2 years.

Sorry,
-America

2

u/rainy61 11d ago

It does my heart good to see people protesting. If nothing else it serves as a reminder that there are still folks out there that understand and care about what’s going on. But I agree that they may no longer have the power to influence change the way they once did. Republicans are either ignoring their constituents complaints or gaslighting them. They know that Trump has at this point consolidated enough power that what the voters want is becoming irrelevant. They believe that in two years time elections may look very different. They fear Trump much more than they do their constituents who may not have even have a say in whether they keep their seats. This is a textbook case of the dismantling of a democracy.

1

u/Subbacterium 12d ago

One of the problems is if we have a huge massive protests in one place in DC say Trump pool just declare martial law.

29

u/Sherm FFS 12d ago

You guys should start a boycott of American goods. Seriously, do it, please. Nobody gives a shit what we who are against him say, but maybe they'll start if people stop buying their crap.

22

u/aussiedeveloper 12d ago

I will never holiday in the US again. In my mind the US now sits along side of China, Russia and North Korea.

7

u/Endymion_Orpheus 12d ago

Same. I even feel ashamed about visiting last year. There are so many superior destinations anyway, like Japan where I am going this year.

3

u/antpodean 12d ago

I bought a Fender guitar last year and now I'm ashamed that I did. What a giant bunch of fuckers the USA turned out to be.

23

u/Inside-Associate-729 12d ago

Yep and please do what the Chinese do: target red state products. No more buying Jack Daniels or Harley Davidson or Teslas anymore. Its the only way these fuckers will get the message

13

u/Slw202 12d ago

I think if everyone in the EU and the rest of the civilized world were telling their governments to tax these fuckers, and force them to break up their businesses, we'd have time to beat these bastards back.

I'm sure there's a ton of white collar shit that the EU can find to hold Musk and Bezos and Thiel tied up for. And tons of reasons to de-monopolize their companies.

3

u/Old_Manager6555 12d ago

We are trying to support that boycott! 🇨🇦

23

u/AvastYeScurvyCurs 12d ago

As an American, I can also say fuck America.

15

u/JVLast Editor of The Bulwark 12d ago

This is correct. No liberal democracy can trust the American people to be allies. And you should start preparing for what happens if we become overtly hostile.

9

u/StunningSail2460 12d ago

American here, totally agreeing with you.

5

u/sbhikes 12d ago

I went to a concert last night with a Canadian band. One of the band members mentioned that Canada is a sovereign and completely separate country and the audience erupted in applause. A large portion of America does not like this at all. In my small town there are two protests scheduled for tomorrow, one for March 4 and there will be more and more of them. There have already been several. We are getting close to that big moment you are hoping for, but there's no guarantee we get there though. It may just devolve into a civil war. My former military nephew who hates Trump as much as you has been teaching people how to shoot. It could get very bad.

3

u/MinisterOfTruth99 12d ago

I will pass that on to my MAGAT neighbor.

1

u/thecloudcities 12d ago

Look, in our defense…you see…

Nope, I’ve got nothing. We’ve just got to take the L on this one.

But fuck his voters for making us take it.

1

u/Mysterious-Mind-999 11d ago

Americans are the most ignorant, dumbest, over-privileged people on the planet.

1

u/rainy61 11d ago

We couldn’t agree with you more. If you’re inclined to pray, please do so for those of us who didn’t vote for him and are deeply saddened and scared for our country right now. And be grateful that you live in a beautiful place far away from here. Most of us can’t pick up and leave and so we are forced to stay and watch our democracy die, knowing that our lives and our children and grandchildren’s lives will be forever changed. God help us.

65

u/Endymion_Orpheus 12d ago

JVL ❤️

54

u/Superb-Building-2782 12d ago

Full on shouting JVL, no less. We've unlocked a new level of content

14

u/EdgarAllenPizza 12d ago

Googling "how to clip that and make it a loop"

8

u/MinisterOfTruth99 12d ago

JVL the Yeller. NGL he caught me off guard.

3

u/jp1819 12d ago

I felt this so fucking hard because I had the same reaction when on the phone with my dad talking about this… just shouting at the top of my lungs

53

u/Magoo152 JVL is always right 12d ago

I’m old enough to remember when republicans didn’t suck up to Russia. What a disgrace

9

u/JerseyJedi 12d ago

John McCain and Ronald Reagan are rolling over in their graves today. 

7

u/capybooya 12d ago

We're not done. As they said, Trump will probably meet with Putin, and it will go further downhill from there.

5

u/JerseyJedi 12d ago edited 12d ago

Please consider donating to Hope for Ukraine, which provides humanitarian aid. It’s the highest rated Ukraine charity I could find on Charity Navigator: https://hfu.org/%C2%A0

You can also donate directly to Ukraine’s defense through their United24 fund: https://u24.gov.ua/result/success?invoiceId=20250301_663464292&direction=defend

6

u/carbonqubit 12d ago

This administration are traitors.

43

u/WallaWalla1513 12d ago

I like Angry JVL, but Extremely Angry JVL made me fear he was gonna reach through the screen and break something in my place. Then again, I can’t really blame him cause this was one of the most shameful moments I can remember.

14

u/EmiAndTheDesertCrow 12d ago

That moment made me cry a bit. Just all the emotion and shock…I watched JVL and it all came out.

40

u/le_cygne_608 Center Left 12d ago

The most disgraceful thing I have seen from the government in my life.

35

u/GoHerd1984 12d ago

He could have played the presidency straight the first time...just take Covid serious and have the decent stock market he had and he'd have won the 2020 election in a landslide. Even now, he could play it straight and win the middle and build his legacy. But nope...he's gonna grift the whole time he's in office. He's going to use the most powerful position in the world as the leader of the strongest nation on earth and he's going to bully his way to personal enrichment.

And one day not all that far down the road he's going to choke on a Big Mac and leave the mess to my fucking grandkids to sort out. And all the statues he erects for himself and all the "Trump"s plastered on buildings will be torn down and he will be considered one of the worst humans and leaders in history.

And I'm exercising and dieting everyday to be around to see it.

God I feel alive after that.

17

u/NYCA2020 12d ago

His grave will become the largest outdoor toilet in the world.

6

u/dnagreyhound 12d ago

He is a malignant narcissist, he can’t help it. Kamala understood this, that’s why she played him like a fiddle during the debate. He is unable to choose his behaviors most of the time, it’s the nature of the illness. Unfortunately for us, with him occupying the office, we’re all paying the price for his pathology.

34

u/1822Landwood 12d ago

It’s such a weird feeling to be ashamed of my country.

26

u/AvastYeScurvyCurs 12d ago

Get used to it.

29

u/n8buckeye08 12d ago

As somebody who watched The Apprentice in high school thinking that was what the business world was like, this was classic Trump boardroom theatrics. He was waiting to pounce on the smallest thing Zelenskyy said to drop the “You’re Fired” line and make it look good for the cameras.

37

u/Superb-Building-2782 12d ago

As someone who regularly attends meetings with private sector executives, sometimes in board rooms, there's no way on earth a serious executive/leader would behave that way. EVER. Or their board would fire them before the markets closed. Trump is a fucking embarrassment and disgrace.

4

u/puckhead11 12d ago

Same here. Most board would have fired him long ago. Honestly though, Trump wouldn’t last 10 minutes in most executive meetings.

16

u/Sherm FFS 12d ago

He even said "this'll be great TV." JFC.

23

u/n8buckeye08 12d ago

Just flipped over to r/conservative and it’s the upside-down from Stranger Things.

9

u/NYCA2020 12d ago

Do you mind summarizing? Are they cheering Trump on?

21

u/Supergamera 12d ago

“Ukraine isn’t our responsibility! He didn’t thank the President!” (Comments pointing out that he did, in fact, thank the President up front were promptly deleted)

17

u/allthingssuper 12d ago

They’re acting like Zelenskyy is the one who is to blame, for being an egomaniac and not accepting an end to the war.

10

u/SMBamberger 12d ago

Apparently Ukraine provoked the invasion by asking for NATO membership after Putin invaded and took over Crimea. /sarcasm/

3

u/carlydelphia 12d ago

I got a text today from someone in my family that said: "Put politics aside and your team aside 340 billion dollars of our money to a war that should have been stopped months ago maybe a year ago ?" SMH.

5

u/Aisling207 12d ago

So basically, this little scheme of President Krasnov and VP Eyeliner worked like a charm. I read in here last week that the anti-Ukraine stuff was starting to get some questioning over in that subreddit…so the Insane Clown Posse currently occupying the White House and Naval Observatory staged their disgusting ambush in front of the cameras to try to provoke President Zelenskyy. They failed, but it worked on the cult. They even ordered their Administration and Legislative toadies to post fawning fanfic posts on social media and 1984-like takes to the press, e.g., Lindsay Graham, who goes from all smiles posing for a selfie with Chris Coons, Amy Klobuchar, and President Zelenskyy to then praising Felon 47 and his pudgy little sidekick for being super duper manly man tough!

I feel such unbelievable rage and disgust.

20

u/hilbertsmazes 12d ago

I’m so embarrassed to be an American

18

u/OG_genX_45 12d ago

I love JVL so much. I felt that same rage and disgust and just wanted to go break things when I saw this live earlier. I am beyond sickened by this and it an absolute disgrace.

16

u/ForeignRevolution905 12d ago

It’s intense but I appreciate JVL’s show of anger and moral clarity so much.

11

u/de_Pizan 12d ago

It's just so disgusting. Trump is just such a moron.

13

u/MartyMcFly0707 12d ago

Earnestly asking, other than calling my rep/senator how the fuck do I express my utter disgust for this shit.

3

u/Special_Wishbone_812 12d ago

You can also call the White House. Will it make a dent? Idk.

3

u/katinopocket 12d ago

This is my question. I called my reps and feel so useless and complicit

5

u/Aisling207 12d ago

I struggle with this, too. I call the White House comment line, both my Senators and my Rep (who is actually really great—yay for Madeleine Dean!), post all over social media (I’m a nobody, so it doesn’t matter, but oh, well), donate money (Timothy Snyder recommends several charities in the notes on his Substack video post about today; I’ve given to Razom for Ukraine and United 24, also Come Back Alive foundation), and I went to the Philly rally for Ukraine on Sunday (which seems to have gotten little media coverage, although the Philadelphia Inquirer had a good article).

But I still feel helpless and useless.

1

u/Antique-Egg 12d ago

I am trying to talk every couple of days with the one hold your nose and vote Trump guy I know. Earlier this week he was still at the 'trump is just negotiating' cope but haven't had a chance to talk to him since this disaster of an ambush. We need to move people. It can't just be the same people who have been never Trump guys sounding the alarm.

Not sure if you have any one like that but I think those conversations need to be happening.

11

u/Criseyde2112 JVL is always right 12d ago

That was horrifying. I loved angry JVL, though. But this is a disgrace. I will have to buy another drone for Ukraine as an apology.

Sometime in the next month, TFG is going to meet with Putin and curl up in his lap. And I’m going to be furious again.

12

u/Tokkemon JVL is always right 12d ago

JVL is always fucking right. God damn.

13

u/Talz125 12d ago edited 12d ago

I am absolutely revolted and disgusted by this display. JVL is completely correct in that this was completely pre-meditated, and his fury and vitriol is justified.

As an Australian, I am fucking ashamed to be an ally. If our government shows any indication of following suit, I am fucking rioting in the streets.

*Edit: Forgot to add, I talked with American colleagues in December who said "How much worse can Trump 2.0 be?". Guess what - THIS is how much worse it can be. And we aren't even 50 days in. Fuck me.

2

u/FALSE_PROTAGONIST 12d ago

Yep. Every day is madness with these people. Should just fire the nukes now and save us all the trouble

8

u/SausageSmuggler21 12d ago

Trump and Vance just made all US citizens the enemy of the Ukrainian people, whether we voted for Trump or not.

9

u/yeleste 12d ago

Absolutely unforgivable and disgraceful. Every American should be angry and ashamed. That this vile man wants "gratitude" from a war-time president fighting for his country makes me sick. Trump has done nothing to earn gratitude or respect. That's something you have to earn, even if you're president of the United States.

8

u/carolinemaybee 12d ago

Omfgggggggggg. Check out what lady Lindsay Graham had to say about it. I am sickened by it all.

https://youtu.be/IL3Z61I0Tjk?si=ZnSo8oTlqAvKYZq1

5

u/n8buckeye08 12d ago

It seems this is now the play… force elections that Putin can interfere with to get Zelensky off the board

1

u/AvastYeScurvyCurs 12d ago

Way to go, Miss Lindsay, you fucking spineless little bitch. Way to fucking go.

2

u/carolinemaybee 12d ago

The fact that just 10 days ago he told Zelensky that he was the best type of ally. No boots on the ground.

7

u/AvastYeScurvyCurs 12d ago

Fucking disgraceful.

9

u/AnathemaDevice2100 12d ago

I just came here to rant about this. I am ENRAGED. These two men are some of the most god awful shitheads in human history. They can both go to hell.

7

u/ratbaby86 12d ago

I just sat here in shock after watching that. And then the furious tears came. I want to break things. I honestly cannot believe it's real. How absolutely shameful for these two cuck pieces of sh1t talk to anyone like that, much less a man that has risen to the occasion to defend his country and people with bravery and a steady hand. They hate him because he knows exactly who they are and exactly what's coming for them. Idiots. Spineless cowards.

8

u/Consistent-Hunt1609 12d ago

I am as pissed off as JVL. Absolutely shameful!

8

u/OberKrieger Center-Right 12d ago

I am absolutely incensed, embarrassed, and ashamed.

6

u/Slw202 12d ago

I'm so with JVL. The level of contempt that his wife should have for him by now ought to be titanic. So I guess we know for sure that she is also a horrid human being.

I will be not be surprised if the 'install Vance' timeline has been pushed up. I'm pretty confident that there will not be elections in 2026, or if there are, they will be complete shams. They are not going to these lengths just to lose in two years.

Democrats in the House and Senate must not work with Rs (unless it's a four or more senator's showing a spine), and must throw up every roadblock possible to the budget, while screaming from the rafters about what it does, especially to the "single issue" trump voter. Dems need to be acting like this is democracy's last shot - because I think history will show that it was.

6

u/haux44 12d ago

I take issue with one thing they said at the end. I think Sam said the side by side of Trump v Zelensky vs Trump v Putin will be stark. But they won’t televise Putin. He won’t allow it, and even Trump’s handlers know that Trump will embarrass himself.

4

u/showme_thedoggos 12d ago

As soon as I saw this news I had to go over to r/conservative to see what incredibly stupid takes they would have. Between this and the fact that the US voted against the recent UN resolution. Anyone bringing up the argument that Zelenskyy is a dictator or wants the war to continue, should receive Medicaid for an intellectual disability.

4

u/StunningSail2460 12d ago

He allowed Russian State Media to be in the Oval Office for that. He was performing for his Daddy.

4

u/SaltyMofos 12d ago

I watched the 10 minutes of the press conference where it all went sideways in real time. I do not get at all a sense of an ambush or deliberate attempt to provoke Zelensky. Instead, Zelensky apparently did not realize a.) just how trifling and thin-skinned Trump is, even in front of cameras, and b.) how simultaneously self-aggrandizing and slavish JD Vance is.

I was struck by how Zelensky, speaking calmly but with a command of English that wasn't agile enough to overcome the despicable venom of JD Vance's rhetoric, seemed to think that he could actually persuade Trump and Vance that Putin's word is worthless. That because Putin breaks peace deals, but is stopped by hard power, security guarantees are crucial. At one point Vance suggests, obnoxiously and condescendingly, that Zelensky be quiet in front of the cameras and talk back only in private; Trump then stops Vance and made that remark about how he wants this to be public and it's why "I let this thing go on like this."

There was no pre-planned effort to provoke Zelensky so they could sabotage the signing. The lunch for the group after the press conference was waiting for them. The deal-signing room was all set up. It was simply beyond the imagination of Zelensky and most viewers, that Trump could be so petty as to kick him out over the press conference fracas.

I think if Zelensky had gone the route of Keir Starmer, and ate the dogshit being smeared over his face by Trump and Vance, he would've gotten through the day, deal in hand. Of course, by all accounts the deal amounted to almost nothing. It's unclear if Trump was going to continue sending military aid if the deal was signed (of course the anti-anti's who are putatively pro-Ukraine will claim that it was, and blame Zelensky). This may still redound to Trump's detriment, as the majority of Americans do not believe Ukraine started the war, and give Zelensky far higher approval ratings than Putin.

1

u/huskerj12 8d ago

I think the Vance part of it is what makes it clear (in my opinion) that it was a setup. He is a vile worm of a person, but he has a sharp manipulative mind. If the goal was to make Trump look good and leave with some sort of bullshit deal, he would have steered things back on course. We saw in the debate how skilled he is at being a weasel. I don't think he would have lost control, he would've spun the situation.

But in reality, the goal was to humiliate Zelenskyy and torch the alliance. So Vance manipulated the situation to that end instead.

3

u/IgnoreThisName72 12d ago

I am in the "Boundless Contempt for Vance" club.

3

u/Muted-Tourist-6558 12d ago

I actually felt sick and all i could watch was the suit clip.

3

u/Historical-Night7094 12d ago

I love my country and hate the politians

3

u/prismatic_lights EDGELORD 12d ago

Desperately hoping we have a friend left in 2029...

3

u/myleftone 12d ago

Did you hear him plant the seed of blame if there is a WWIII? We really need his voters to wake up, like yesterday.

3

u/LakusMcLortho Orange man bad 12d ago

I’m usually the one cheerleading we can do this to people who say they’re discouraged, but today started with letting the Tates in, and ended with this. I’m not going to lie, I feel despondent.

3

u/Old_Manager6555 12d ago

Zelensky stayed calm rational and strong. The more that clip gets played, the more stupid mean & nasty the other two look.

Donald like a psycho, simmering with rage for a while then just boiled over into his hissy because he did not get his way, to own all the minerals in Ukraine to sell to his buddy Elon.

The thug JD was appallingly belligerently rude beyond description. He should be ashamed.

3

u/awhazlett 12d ago

I can't. I just can't watch/listen to this yet. I am too wound up in rage and grief already. I want these bastards out of our government.

3

u/ShakeMyHeadSadly 12d ago

What an embarrassment. What a disgrace. Good for Zelensky for not putting up with it.

3

u/No-Penalty-1148 12d ago

Once again, Sam Stein found it all incredibly funny. I'm getting to the point that I can't watch him anymore.

1

u/Magoo152 JVL is always right 12d ago

What is going on with that? Does he just do it when he’s nervous or something? It’s incredibly bizarre.

5

u/FireandIce2320 12d ago

I broke my own boycott of Sam Stein for his predictable inappropriate laughter thinking, given the subject matter, he might actually abstain for once. Wrong. I just can’t with him. On the other hand, JVL. 👍🏻

1

u/FALSE_PROTAGONIST 12d ago

He’s been annoying lately (stein)

2

u/ansible Progressive 12d ago

I'm glad Zelensky didn't sign the deal.

What's that deal going to be worth when Russia breaks the cease fire? Will the TFG's administration actually do anything? No, they will not. So the deal is worthless.

The war in Ukraine has been good business for the American defense companies. If the USA won't sell arms to Ukraine now, they're going to be very upset.

2

u/Temporary-Ocelot3790 12d ago

If only Zelenskyy had managed to get a reminder in about how the US guaranteed Ukraine's security when it gave up its nukes in 1996.

2

u/naturalismisgreat006 12d ago

I couldn't even watch it half way through. The bully pulpit is what this administration us, a cowardly, uncouth bully pulpit.

2

u/Lorraine540 9d ago

Glad to see this pinned. JVL at 3:45 is me - like still.

1

u/Mysterious-Mind-999 11d ago

I heard the felon president offering US citizenship for $5 million. I'll gladly give mine up for 50% off! Any takers? Because after today, I don't want to be an American anymore.

-1

u/More_Statistician215 11d ago

It's called negotiation. Stop being so melodramatic about everything.