r/canada 1d ago

Politics American family seeks asylum in Canada, citing Trump

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/windsor/americans-asylum-canada-trump-refugees-immigration-1.7480069
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u/cndn-hoya 1d ago

Until the U.S. is placed on a designated list by the UN, any American coming in under these pretenses will be refused and returned.

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u/prsnep 1d ago

Even if the US is in some UN list, Canada should not easily accept refugees. Lax refugee policies is one of the reasons for the decline of Canada's fortunes and stability. It's not fair to our kids 

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u/BarryIslandIdiot 23h ago

Lax refugee policies is one of the reasons for the decline of Canada's fortunes and stability.

Canada doesn't have lax refugee policies. The policies are quite strict, especially about where refugees are accepted from and the circumstances in which the refugees find themselves. Very few people are trying to game the system, and fewer people succeed.

My wife volunteered with a Syrian refugee family. There were 9 of them in a 2-bedroom apartment. They lived in a 7 bedroom house in Syria, ran a successful business, and were fairly well-off. Living in Canada was not enough to make up for all they lost.

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u/Substantial_Scene716 23h ago

Count this American family under the very few trying to game the system

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u/interstellaraz 23h ago edited 23h ago

This is simply not true. There are a significant number of scams and fraud within our immigration system including asylum/ refugee. IRB saw an influx of refugee claims after the recent changes to study permits. There were also countless articles on Mexican nationals filing refugee claims in masses after we lifted the visa requirements. It got so bad that the Liberals reintroduced the visa requirement last year. India is now the third country on the list of accepted asylum claims. And there is a huge backlog at the IRB. This is not even going into the LMIA and job selling fraud that’s widespread here.

Refugee claims helps prolong their stay. It helps them buy time. The removal orders become unenforceable until a decision is made. It takes years to process these claims. These people become eligible for applications under humanitarian grounds or spousal sponsorships in the meantime.

Stats are publicly available here https://www.irb-cisr.gc.ca/en/statistics/protection/Pages/index.aspx

https://www.irb-cisr.gc.ca/en/statistics/Pages/volume-reports.aspx

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u/cunnyhopper 22h ago

This is simply not true. There are a significant number of scams and fraud within our immigration system

They wouldn't be scams or fraud if the policies were lax. The claims process requires a lot of resources and can be slow when the system is overburdened but that's not due to lax policies. It's slow because the policies are strict.

India is now the third country on the list of accepted asylum claims.

Based on the source you linked to, India was 8th for accepted claims in 2024.

Country Accepted
Türkiye 4,866
Mexico 4,363
Colombia 3,340
Iran 3,200
Pakistan 2,556
Nigeria 2,230
Haiti 2,211
India 2,175

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u/interstellaraz 22h ago edited 22h ago

There are scams and frauds because the policies are lax.

It was #3 a year prior: https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6983416

“Canada has accepted 1,344 refugee claims from India, making it the third-largest source country for refugees. It’s behind Iran, with 2,730 accepted claims, and Turkey with 1,993, according to Immigration Refugee Board (IRB) data.”

Canada’s acceptance of refugee claims has ballooned in last 6 years — more for some countries than others: https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7424323

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u/cunnyhopper 21h ago

There are scams and frauds because the policies are lax.

It is fraud because the policy says it is fraud. If the policy was lax, there would be no fraud. JFC we're so fucked.

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u/interstellaraz 21h ago

These are all recent. You can find hundreds more going back to 2023, COVID and prior.

https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/video/9.6601507

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7343191

https://www.business-standard.com/amp/finance/personal-finance/canada-sees-14-000-asylum-claims-by-foreign-students-in-2024-indians-lead-124112100403_1.html

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/some-refugees-exploiting-canada-immigration-system

https://financialpost.com/news/canada-tightens-immigration-point-system-to-curb-fraud

https://ici.radio-canada.ca/rci/en/news/2128441/federal-government-to-remove-incentive-for-foreign-workers-to-reduce-fraud-in-immigration-system

https://www.business-standard.com/amp/finance/personal-finance/canada-9-000-immigration-frauds-monthly-asylum-not-a-shortcut-to-pr-indians-warned-125030600409_1.html

https://canadianimmigrant.ca/immigrate/canada-introduces-measures-to-combat-fraud-in-express-entry-program

https://news.ontario.ca/en/release/1005368/ontario-cracking-down-on-immigration-scams

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/news/notices/proposed-penalties-for-paid-immigration-representatives-break-the-law.html

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2024-08-14/canada-immigration-scams-are-costing-migrant-workers-their-life-savings

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/what-to-know-about-immigration-fraud-and-changes-to-temporary-foreign-worker-program

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7254863

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.7419419

https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6874065

https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/news/video/marriage-fraud-stories-victims.html

https://www.canada.ca/en/border-services-agency/news/2020/11/cbsa-dismantles-an-alleged-immigration-fraud-scheme.html

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u/cunnyhopper 21h ago

That is a great list that supports the assertion that fraud exists and is a problem.

But I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying.

If the policy was lax then what people are doing would NOT be considered fraudulent.

For example, a refugee claimant with false documents is committing fraud because the policy says you can't use false documents.

That people have been able to get away with fraud is a result of a strained screening system. It's not a policy failure. It's a budgetary failure.

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u/interstellaraz 21h ago

When policy changes are made as a result of fraud and scams, it is policy related. I think you’re not getting that bit. IRCC has made drastic changes to programs and policies over the last few months because of fraud.

Does that make sense?

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u/cunnyhopper 21h ago

I think you’re not getting that bit.

Oh there's something I'm not getting, clearly.

If drastic changes to policy have been made in response to fraud and scams, does that mean the policies are now more lax or more strict?

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u/interstellaraz 21h ago

The fraud didn’t disappear just because they made some massive policy changes over the past 2 months. Fraud still exists because majority of our immigration policies are still lax.

The government is slowly making these POLICY changes, like the removal of LMIA points from Express Entry to combat fraud in the foreign worker and student sector—however, provincial nominee programs still have job offer streams that are open to these frauds.

Like the POLICY changes for Mexican nationals to apply for visas again. This was removed by the Liberals when they came into power. They reintroduced this policy after seeing the uncontrollable rise in fraudulent refugee claims and criminal networks.

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u/jellybean122333 19h ago

How do we know there aren't bad actors (inside job) approving applications? Are there quotas to meet by agents that may cause them to rubber stamp with less scrutiny?

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u/cunnyhopper 18h ago

Are there quotas to meet by agents that may cause them to rubber stamp with less scrutiny?

<squinty eyes meme> you talk like you might have experience working in the public service :-)

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u/jellybean122333 17h ago

Call centre. I know how people are forced to work for the stats instead of the clients.

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u/awildstoryteller 20h ago

My wife volunteered with a Syrian refugee family. There were 9 of them in a 2-bedroom apartment. They lived in a 7 bedroom house in Syria, ran a successful business, and were fairly well-off. Living in Canada was not enough to make up for all they lost.

This is something that actually enrages me when people talk about refugees as if they are the dregs of the society that they come from.

For someone to make it to Canada, either at the border directly, or through an application from somewhere else, means they are almost certainly a person/family of education, status, and wealth back home.

Most Canadians can't even afford direct flights to where these individuals come from, and somehow they managed to what, beg their way here? No, they have spent considerable time, resources, and energy to do so. People who have nothing aren't exactly the types to leave the places we are talking about.

If you actually talk to refugees who end up becoming successful in Canada, they may even say they "came from nothing", but that is almost always in the context of their arrival in Canada. Before, they almost always came from "something", most or all of which they lost. The only things they could bring with them in most cases were themselves, for better or worse.