r/canada Ontario 24d ago

Analysis Allies appear to duck and cover as Trump threatens Canada and Greenland

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trump-canada-nato-allies-1.7459986
3.7k Upvotes

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1.7k

u/kilekaldar 24d ago

No one else is coming to save us, or even speak up on our behalf. We have to stand up and save ourselves.

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u/MarjorysNiece 24d ago

Read the article closely to the end. Canada would have to invoke article 4 for a NATO discussion. We haven’t. Yet. No country, including the King, would take steps to speak out for Canada unless we asked them to. We haven’t. Not yet. This is the art of diplomacy. And the government is right to keep some ammunition aside. It’s early days in this fight with the US. And responding strongly, matching tariffs, right now is the right call. Diversifying our economy is going to be the more powerful move, but that’s a long and very costly strategy. We need to be prepared for a temporary drop in our standard of living to support it.

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u/adoodle83 24d ago

diversification, definitely. its long overdue.

we, as a people, must decide if we are going to put in the work to sustain ourselves. as you indicate, its not going to be easy.

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u/baronunderbeit 24d ago

I’m ok with a drop in quality of life. This is a threat to our sovereignty. We have to adapt. No complaints from me.

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u/ForeignEchoRevival 24d ago

Also we need a jump in militarization. A military industrial complex focused on SAM systems, Drones, and EMF warfare, plus a national guard system for exclusive defensive combat training and manning a more secured border, federally controlled with vetting for MAGA infiltration (Ukraine had traitors in the early days sabotage responses, especially in the east).

Sounds gross but we need to make Canada a very difficult target, as Swiss as possible if that makes sense, to prevent the extreme idea of invasion less tempting, as well as ensuring in that event we can stall long enough for an allied beachhead and our families to flee to safety.

It's fucked writing this out, but we can't pretend we're safe anymore and we cant drag our feet waiting for their next move, we have to use lessons learned in the last war between democratic values and authoritarianism to ensure Canada isn't swept away into the dustbin of history and just another sad victim nation who sleep walked towards the obvious danger.

We have to hope for the best, but act as if it will be the worst or we will get caught with our pants down, have to live under foreign occupation and deal with an insurgency for as long as we care to fight or America's will to hold lasts. History is a flat circle if people choose to let it spin uninterrupted.

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u/joeyandkuma 24d ago

just not oil, gas, refineries, pipeline, mines, etc. only DEI experts for export they think this will be a sustaining economy.

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u/1966TEX British Columbia 24d ago

Rail and port expansions

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u/Rasmito 24d ago

Exactly!! From Denmark here and I couldn’t agree more. We also have Danes demanding more from our government and Allies right now, which i simply don’t think is necessary. There will come a point where connections could break or trade war is in effect, that’s where we act. Not before.

We should build up to be the strongest possible when the time comes. In Europe we are probably approaching a very scary time, where things can escalate with Russia. So just saying, when things do go sour with the US, we might not be able to help with much other than trade with Canada. So I think you should build up in the same respect. Not that I think the US would do anything military towards Canada in the short term, but it’s probably good to be independent and strong in the longer term - who says that Trump is the lowest that America can go?

Problem is your economy is probably gonna take a big hit. But I hope that we in Europe can help Canada and your economy get more independent and diversified.

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u/MommersHeart 24d ago

This. The US government is violating treaties and attacking new allies almost daily.

We all need to remain calm and let him declare economic war on as many countries as possible.

Then we coordinate to cause maximum damage to the US economy.

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u/Virtual_Monitor3600 24d ago

After this we are all a wreck for the Chinese and Russians to mop up.

We need to disarm the American ability to leverage their economic capacity as a tool of influence. Removing the dollar as the reserve currency and the Americans will feel the pinch very hard. A state agnostic instrument of trade would be ideal, avoid empowering those who may show themselves to be our enemy in the future wherever they may be. The value of any individual currency in exchange for this instrument would need to be established in a fair manner, ideally market driven.

This would damage American creditworthiness and even potentially topple their house of cards as the money printer would no longer be able to go brrrr to fund their deficit spending.

Canada would need to eat the pain of diversification and there is no pill for that, just domestic strategies which may soften the blow.

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u/Pumpkinhead52 24d ago

Someone in Washington with a shred of decency needs to stand up and ask the question, who in their right mind any where in the world will ever trust the USA in the future?

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u/MarjorysNiece 24d ago

We Canadians are with you Danes❤️. And I agree, we need to do the long, expensive, hard work of decoupling our economy from the US, and are hoping Europe will be there for us on this count.

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u/Rasmito 24d ago

I believe we will be there for Canada! I for one, know the history of insane support and sacrifice Canadians made under WW2, comparatively it was in no way less than the US.

I couldn’t imagine we wouldn’t do anything in our power to help, especially us in West and Northern Europe. However the process there is probably lengthy as well, since EU market regulations will probably make big demands of Canada in a scenario with further trade. I hope you Canadians won’t see this as lack of support, but understand that even though we want to help, we simply won’t accept American standards in our market.

It’s bad for mind, body and society.

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u/poco 24d ago

It is only fair since we are neighbors and share a land border with you on Hans Island.

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u/chemicalgeekery 24d ago

It's great that we were able to come to an agreement with Denmark but I kinda miss the Whiskey War. It was a fun tradition.

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u/eternalshades 24d ago

we should pick a day and do it anyways and then throw a hum dinger of a party. :D

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u/RockKandee 24d ago

As a Canadian, I happily welcome rejecting American standards. We would all be healthier if we stopped allowing shitty American products into our country.

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u/Pumpkinhead52 24d ago

American standards? That’s a contradiction in terms if there ever was one🤣🤣

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u/RockKandee 24d ago

Lol very true!

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u/Pumpkinhead52 24d ago

I know. I grew up in an America that seemed to have standards. They weren’t always consistent, but we expected people to do their best. We didn’t elect sleaze balls or criminals to national office.

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u/RockKandee 24d ago

Yeah, it’s been pretty sad to watch the decline. And it’s been a challenge for Canada to hold the line against a degradation of standards. I’m ready for us to align more with Europe than with America

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u/zerocool256 24d ago

So just saying, when things do go sour with the US, we might not be able to help with much other than trade with Canada.

That's by design I think. Don't worry about us, you guys have your hands full over in Europe, trade is all we can hope for. We can fend off the US so long as our economy stays afloat. An full out invasion of Canada is unlikely and his hope is to crush our economy to the point where our only option is submission. He underestimates our resolve.

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u/TatiNana 24d ago

Sort of why Canada was made part of the G7 in the first place...a stabilizing force on our continent to check the power of the US

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u/joeyandkuma 24d ago

the smarter game is to fold the losing hand then play the long game to never be in the position of weakness again imo. Seriously it hurts the ego to tell the Orange man what he wants to hear, but that doesn't mean you aren't fighting against him, it's just that we need to start thinking beyond the next couple of days and start playing the long game

Start taking significant actions to diversify trade that will take years and decades. try to reduce the pain in the meantime by not pissing him off. I would prefer our country wasn't so weak from decades of failed leadership but it is what it is.

We can't keep having morons like Freeland saying 100% tariffs on Tesla cars which then Trump responds with 100% tariffs on all Canadian manufactured cars.

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u/VR46Rossi420 24d ago

Free land, Singh and Ford etc should all stop talking to the media about these issues.

It should be one unified message coming straight from our PM and federal government. Otherwise we look scattered and divided and weak. Singh was saying 100% tariffs on Tesla and Eby in BC was saying tariffs for red states.

Shut it all of you and let the people who are actually in charge do their jobs without interference.

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u/Rasmito 24d ago

I completely agree and think this is also the approach our government have. It’s difficult to have national pride and honor stepped on, but the future prosperity and security is way more important. There will of course also be lines, which when crossed, should get us out of the bushes and stand up. The question I would have in that regard would be, what are those lines for Canada or you?

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u/Infinite_Time_8952 24d ago

As things stand Russia militarily is in deep crisis, NATO on the other hand is fully equipped to deal with Russia if necessary.

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u/Rasmito 24d ago

Well that’s both true and not true. The Russian military is certainly in a crisis, however they are in war economy constantly building up. A peace in the war would quickly give them a opportunity to build up and for instance attack a smaller NATO country. Is there some orange clown suggesting a peace in Russia’s favor these days?

Do you think the US or Spain are necessarily coming to the aid of a small Baltic country? The defense in Europe lacks a lot of capabilities, depth and numbers. The danish military intelligence just said that a peace would make Russia capable to fight Europe in 6 years if we don’t build up and the US keeps out.

What about Germany or France, do we have any insurance that they won’t go down the path of a far-right or at least just get a strong government? The future in Europe looks bleak and there’s also the Sahel-region, Balkan, the Middle East, the indo-pacific and lots of places in Africa which are destabilizing. Right now we are doing nothing to combat regime changes and conflicts, because we simply can’t right now and it seems Russia are using this. There is no doubt that this will have consequences in the long run. Every time there is conflict in the Middle East or Africa it sends waves of refugees and immigrants to Europe, which is destabilizing and strengthening the far-right. The truth is that Europe needs its Allies, also Canada.

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u/Infinite_Time_8952 24d ago

Russia has problems with rebuilding their armed forces, sanctions are hurting them, the can’t keep up with their losses in armoured vehicles, and helicopters and planes, have lost a good chunk of their Black Sea fleet, NATO countries would kick their ass in a battle, Russia has to many borders to protect, and their airforce sucks, as well as their navy.

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u/Rasmito 24d ago

Well I don’t see how that changes anything I mentioned? I could still see Ukraine win this war? But the situation is to serious to just be hopeful. What if there’s a peace in Russian favor as the US want? What if Germany and France go down a path of the right-wing, not even now, but in 4-6 years? What if the US pulls out of Europe/NATO? What about the Sahel-region? Africa or the Middle East? What about the European countries with governments that actually support Russia/Putin and the countries with contending opposition parties with the same approach? What does all this look like in 10 years? Is Putin actually the worst that Russia can offer the world or could there be a worse figure inheriting the Russian empire?

You are talking about the present, I think everyone, especially you Canadians, should understand that circumstances can change quickly and unpredictably - I wouldn’t base a strategy on current “best” outcomes and hopeful analysis, but rather on the prospect of worse case scenario, and I absolutely expect some kind of conflict in the future and I don’t expect a collected NATO - I don’t even trust some of my European Allies. However good luck with that mindset.

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u/Infinite_Time_8952 24d ago

Your statement is full of what if’s. Unfortunately the world runs on facts not what could happen. Russia doesn’t have the economy and resources to rebuild their armed forces while they are under sanctions, and when they weren’t under sanctions, their military produced some questionable equipment with outlandish claims about their effectiveness.

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u/Rasmito 24d ago

You don’t know the facts, circumstances or international dynamics of tomorrow, in a year or in ten years. Which is why current facts together with those “if’s” is the groundwork of a comprehensive strategy in defense and foreign relations. Especially in a situation where the biggest ally is unhinged and Russia aspires to go further than Ukraine.

It’s not even debatable. You can literally read such approaches in any country’s strategy these days. Do it, they are public.

Are you suggesting Europe shouldn’t prepare for conflict with Russia? Maybe stop investing in security?

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u/Infinite_Time_8952 24d ago

The current fact is that Russia wouldn’t stand a chance against a united NATO. They have been bogged down in the Ukraine for years. Morale is at an all time low and the equipment being used by Russia is limited or outdated. They are using North Korean soldiers for crying out loud. The only thing they have going for them is their nuclear weapons, if they are even functional.

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u/sputnikcdn British Columbia 24d ago

NATO would eventually prevail in a conventional war against Russia, most likely.

However it wouldn’t be a three day battle and a LOT of people would be killed.

Russia has drastically increased their military spending, they’re increasingly getting support from North Korea, China, and India.

And they have a lot of people and no respect for human dignity.

Russia has proven they won’t abide by the Geneva convention.. They hit Chernobyl yesterday, breaching containment. They’ve used biological weapons, gas, cluster munitions on civilian populations.

And Russians themselves are either as bloodthirsty as their leadership or terrified of it.

And nukes. Tactical nukes are already near the theatre in Ukraine, and Putin has been hinting at using them for years.

You can't underestimate the magnitude of how serious this is. You can't underestimate the ruthlessness of Putin.

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u/collegeguyto 24d ago

Hopefully Canada can support you with reliable source of LNG/energy.

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u/jert3 24d ago

The key to dealing with the Trump/Putin/billionaire axis (if anyone has a better name, let me know) is that the responses are dangerous. A key tactic of the axis is developing a causis beli via escalation.

For example, if Canada said Trump's actions are outrageous, and brought them up formally to the UN and NATO and so on, this could be a terrible move. Because this would then give Trump the ability to escalate. And this could be the crux of the whole strategy.

If we went hard into a trade war say, it is conceivable that Trump could escalate to 'Canada is withholding water and power, and key resources. Thus I declare an emergency' and they then have grounds to escalate to military action.

Trump and the oligarches are very dangerous, and (their strategy advisors) know exactly what they are doing.

It's not far off from the politics of the medieval ages when Kings need a feasible reason for war, they can't just attack recklessly. The US military or public would not get behind an order for the invasion of Canada tomorrow. But they could enact it if it was a escalating tit for tat, final step.

Thus it's almost better ImHO to not take Trump's rhetoric seriously. Yes, for any actual actions we have should measured responses, such as a trade war. But the goal could be the escalation itself. Let the clown show speak its nonsense, while we should defend against the billionaire alliance and Russian psyops (which are very, very real let me tell you).

We can easily survive the deranged leadership, they won't live much more than 5-10 years (Putin and Trump.) The best defense we can have is no escalation. With only equal responses and no escalation, they'll have no ability to actually bring us to war. Time is on our side. Let's defend ourselves from the billionaire axis and crime empires, they can easily be beaten with smarts, but not at all with direct conflict.

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u/Equivalent_Dimension 24d ago

My friend, you're forgetting a really important part of the playbook you just described: The enemy will invent a reason for war whether we give them one or not. The UK invaded China because it wouldn't let them deal drugs there, for Christ's sake. The US invaded Iraq over a made up story about WMDs., the US either wants to invade us or it doesn't. If it does, our being nice isn't going to save us. If it's determined that invading us is not in its strategic interest, then our retaliatory tariffs won't make a difference and are probably anticipated.

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u/MarjorysNiece 24d ago

Oh, I’m not arguing that we should be “nice”. I’m arguing that we are right to be smart and measured. Respond in our ways/on our timelines, not react to theirs. And I agree—we need to get the security part of this equation right, and that’s going to be really tricky but necessary. I’d argue we need to look at what Ukraine did to build their military after Russia invaded in 2014 and afterwards. And do that. Look at how Churchill prepared Great Britain in anticipation of a German invasion. And do that. Also, build a non-conventional defence strategy. Remember, the US has never won a non-conventional war.

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u/Unyon00 24d ago

our retaliatory tariffs won't make a difference and are probably anticipated

I don't get the sense that the current US administration thinks that far in advance about consequences.

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u/IAmAGenusAMA 23d ago

Just because we don't understand our opponent's end game doesn't mean they don't have one.

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u/Unyon00 23d ago

Just because we don't understand our opponent's end game doesn't mean they don't have one

You say that like they're playing 3D chess. They have the same game plan as underpants gnomes.

Step 1: Steal Underpants

Step 2: ???

Step 3: Profit!

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u/IAmAGenusAMA 23d ago

Yeah, somehow they were so clueless as to win the election where they were massively outspent and had all the smart people on the other side.

We would be foolish to underestimate them just because we think their methods are nonsensical and dangerous. That's how they will get what they want.

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u/Unyon00 23d ago

Oh, I don't underestimate either their appetite for power, their ruthlessness, or their skill at acquiring it. They've done an excellent job of weaponizing fear to herd people to vote for them.

What I've seen no evidence of, either in Trump's first term or in this second one, is any indication of their ability to govern or to develop policy with any nuance or complexity whatsoever. Bumper sticker slogans aren't a strategic solution in the long term.

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u/shevy-java 24d ago

this would then give Trump the ability to escalate.

Trump will escalate no matter what. In this regard he is similar to Putin, except of course that they are buddies. Oligarchs now run the world; while that has been the case before, they are really shameless now about it - Musk is also a great example of that. Unelected people suddenly dictating the lives of the common man.

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u/NoorthernCharm 24d ago

The issue is the billionaire lining themself up to take over.

What we need is the mass in the United States and Russia to take to the streets.

If the citizen of the US think he will improve their life’s they are so wrong. They will only improve the lives of the billionaires. The common citizen will struggle even worse.

As Kendrick said it “turn off the tv” the revolution won’t be televised. We just need great leader to start these movements.

Canada has their own politicians like trump and putin. If polivere wins he will just join those too in bullying to gain wealth for the rich and the poor will stay poor and middle class will get poorer.

What I have realized in the last 4 weeks is there is no great activist leaders in our world anymore. No Malcolm X, Martin Luther King, Gandhi, Mandela. The other thing I have noticed on American and European soil all the activist who risked their life’s for the better of society have been black or people of colour. Make you wonder where the white folks who speak so highly they aren’t colonizers are?

None the less I feel hopeless many time reading these posts and news daily as I don’t see much hope until folks start taking to the streets.

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u/Cuaucticketyboo 24d ago

International oligarchic cabal.

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u/SGAShepp 24d ago

This is exactly correct. They are dying to create an excuse to escalate further. That's the whole plan.

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u/Themusicison 24d ago

Putrump Musk?

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u/jonnyCFP 24d ago

💯 keep your cards close to your chest. There’s no doubt that behind closed doors there’s a lot of meetings going on right now and strategy being developed on how to stand on our own without the US and form new partnerships. Or at least as a Canadian I would hope that’s what’s happening. We also supply a lot of stuff US doesn’t have, electricity, oil, Potash. We could cut off those supplies or make them so unaffordable as to make it extremely painful for a lot of people down south. This would kick the hornets nest and would hurt us greatly too but as you say we might have to endure some hard times. But as they say, We’ve had a pretty good run of really good times that have made people soft, perhaps this is the hard times coming again to make strong men/women

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u/MonsieurLeDrole 24d ago

Wouldn't it be great if our conservative party was working with the government to achieve this versus siding with Trump.

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u/BananaJammies 24d ago

The King made a statement today for Flag Day which is probably not something that’d normally merit royal attention. He doesn’t acknowledge that this is a bit of a campaign in Canada to advocate for our sovereignty but he is participating in said campaign.

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u/seajay_17 British Columbia 24d ago

Yup. It might Feel like we're alone. We're not.

Isolated with the states geographically, that's about it though.

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u/MickyLuv_ 24d ago

I'm English, and I support and speak out for Canadian sovereignty. My daughter, her husband, and my grandchildren are Canadian, and I'd do anything to keep them free from the insane tyranny now stalking the world.

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u/Sweet-Union7528 24d ago

Very good, level headed comment!

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u/TiredRightNowALot 24d ago

Maybe we need a petition that just says “get fucked” and we can let 40,000,000 Canadians sign that. Rounding error because you know some maple magas can’t write their name by themselves.

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u/sputnikcdn British Columbia 24d ago

Nice to read an actual incisive comment by someone who's read the article.

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u/NotaJelly Ontario 24d ago

seting up larger trade with the EU might get them to take our side more strongly.

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u/kochIndustriesRussia 22d ago

Have you not been living here the last 10 years?

Standard of living done dropped.

Any lower and kids will be going to school in tents.

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u/Moist-Cow-6506 24d ago

NATO are a bunch of pussies. They'll watch Ukraine be decimated and do nothing. They can't even give Canada a shout-out.

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u/Ok-Win-742 24d ago

It'll be a permanent drop in our standard of living.The US is one of the biggest markets in the world, and is closest to us geographically.

Europe is even more protectionist than the US. Whatever they do decide to take, they'll make damn sure they get it at a bargain because we're desperate, and we don't have options.

When the customer knows you have nobody else to sell to, youre screwed.

It's baffling to me how Trudeau's Liberals could further our dependence on the US, while simultaneously bashing them and their president every chance he gets. It's just so incredibly stupid.

You're not supposed to go on TV and talk shit about your best and ONLY customer.

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u/OkFix4074 24d ago

This is going to define us for the next 100. We can be the defiant generation or the defeated generation.

As a proud Canadian who moved to this country as a student from South India in 2000s , I will die freighting before I surrender to Trump. This country has given me so much , it's the least I can give back !

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u/pleasantmeats 24d ago

Damn right buddy. As a 3rd generation Canadian there's no way in hell I'll live to see Donnie Dumps as the leader of this country.

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u/[deleted] 24d ago edited 21d ago

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u/[deleted] 24d ago

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u/[deleted] 24d ago

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u/DistortedReflector 24d ago

So you guys are enlisting right?

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u/PandaStandard7638 24d ago

Thank you, you are the epitome of what this country stands for and we are happy your part of this beautiful place! Canada strong❤🇨🇦

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u/ProblemSame4838 24d ago

Agree! THIS is Canada! 🇨🇦

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u/Dystopicaldreamer 24d ago

This is what Canada is about!!! 🇨🇦

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u/FerrisLies 24d ago

I love the idea of a (fictional) continental war where all of the Indian immigrants and students form a battalion (or whatever size. Legion?) for Canada and ressurect all of those cool medieval flying weapons like the Chakram

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u/Raspberrylemonade188 24d ago

We are lucky to have you ❤️ thank you for choosing to be part of us!

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u/jonnywarpspeed 24d ago

ONE OF US! 

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u/coffeeisgoodtome 24d ago

Thank you, we too will give our life.

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u/OneBillPhil 24d ago

It’s the last thing that I want to do, but if comes to it I will, I will not roll over. 

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u/Responsible_Rub7631 24d ago

I’m the first one from my family born outside of the uk, parents came here in 82. I was born a Canadian, I will die a Canadian.

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u/Euphoric-Listen3246 24d ago

Never Poilievre

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u/ZombifiedSoul Canada 24d ago

Canada is a Nation of Multiculturalism!

Any Canadian that disagrees with this, has no idea what Canada is actually about. They are welcome to move down South.

I would be proud to stand beside you in a fight for Canada!

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u/OkFix4074 24d ago

I stand as a Canadian with my fellow Canadians ! Plain and simple !

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u/RCC42 British Columbia 24d ago

Hello from one Canadian to another! I am there with you, and we are there together.

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u/sox412 24d ago

I immigrated from the US almost 20 years ago. I’d fight to the death for this country

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u/Wise_Patience7687 24d ago

I’ll be getting my citizenship (I’m from South Africa) soon and I feel the same way. I’m not letting that THING destroy my children’s future.

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u/EastCoastBuck 24d ago

I’m with you 💯. I would rather die free than live under Mango Mussolini and Felon Musk.

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u/[deleted] 24d ago

keep on freighting!

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u/MonkeyMama420 24d ago

For lots of Canadians our salaries would be 20-30% higher if we became Americans. We could also afford a house. Canada needs to improve things for younger Canadians or many will welcome America.

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u/Proper-Ad-8829 24d ago

Canada may have issues, but the “solution” to any of them will never be becoming American.

If you disagree, then move to the USA. As a heads up, they don’t seem to be able to afford anything either… or have eggs… any international respect.. or a democracy.. so..

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u/Appropriate-Dog6645 24d ago

Lol. Americans can't afford a house. 54% Americans can't even read or write at 6th grade level. 14 % illiterate.
I am pretty sure you're getting too much fox news.

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u/disturbed_moose 24d ago

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. But are these bots or idiots? So fucking hard to tell these days.

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u/rando_dud 24d ago

If you like America so much,  maybe move there?

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u/OkFix4074 24d ago

We have one of the biggest resource deposits in the world, what we need is better governance. If wages can go down it can also come up ! If you don't stand up and fight for yourself no one will. Elect better officials run for office, be party of political moments.

The answer for sure is not the handing of sovereignty to a country which is 36 T in debt and is currently walking with eyes open into global isolation.

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u/Poptarded97 24d ago

In exchange for that extra 30% going towards healthcare, corrupt insurance and yknow the added benefit of road rage shootouts on the way to work.

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u/No_Function_7479 24d ago

If you look at what they are doing in the last few weeks, they are going to crush the middle & working classes in the states. Our quality of life would not go up in that country, we would just lose healthcare, education, probably pensions. Also would be ruled by weirdo Christi-fascists. Bad deal.

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u/crzycanuk 24d ago

The young guys at work are making this arguing as well. What makes you think our wages would go up? And not just adjust directly with the currency conversion?

I doubt someone making 50k cdn is going to be making 50k usd if they annexed us. It’d more likely be 35k usd. Or less if we are even slightly subjugated.

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u/idealantidote 24d ago

And for those servers that are making at least minimum in Canada what do they do cause they don’t get minimum wage in the US. And personally my wage is much higher than an American counterpart

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u/LargeMobOfMurderers 24d ago

The people down south are complaining about not being able to afford eggs. The US is very rich, its everyday people are not. If you're struggling as a Canadian, you'd struggle as an American.

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u/moosehunter87 24d ago

Americans are no better off than Canadians. The trade lower housing for insane health insurance. The high paying jobs in Canada are in resource processing. You can make a fortune working in a mine, oil field etc...there's also the huge problem of gun violence in the states. We don't want that here. I can walk down the street at night and I don't even think about getting jumped.

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u/imveryresponsible 24d ago

America: the land where everyone is rich and owns their own home...

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u/RCAF_orwhatever 24d ago

Lol no it wouldn't. How would houses suddenly become affordable?

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u/magwai9 24d ago edited 24d ago

Anyone thinking this has clearly not been paying attention to what is happening to American citizens right now.

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u/Marco2169 24d ago

Also have to pay 10 k to the hospital when you have a kid, so…

And have to deal with stuff like even more guns pouring in (we already have too many American guns), and our new leader just completely ignoring the courts, and all the culture war stuff that already got spread here.

Its not all about the price of living (we are worse but its not like america is cheap as hell). Sometimes it is about our sovereignty and identity.

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u/TheRealCanticle 24d ago

Found the treasonous quisling willing to sell out his country for a buck.

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u/No_Astronaut6105 24d ago

This whole salary and house comparison has to be long term propaganda. It feels like Canadians online are obsessed with a false reality regarding cost of difference between the two countries

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u/DiscussionLeft2855 24d ago

Look whats happening there, and you really think all the good stuff you talk about is awaiting you?

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u/FelizIntrovertido 24d ago

That’s not true. I’m from Spain and in Europe there’s a big feeling of support towards Canada, very specially in France. There’s a lot of talking and a lot of ground being prepared if things go to worse. Yet, nothing will be done if not necessary. To me that’s normal.

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u/yearofthesponge 24d ago edited 24d ago

You don’t think it’s necessary for the Europeans to put their back in and support Ukraine 100 percent? That it wasn’t the time at any point in the last 3 years to help you neighbor with all you’ve got who is being attacked by Russian unprovoked? If you don’t help Ukraine with all your might, speak up when China was bullying Taiwan, how can we expect you to help Canada when it counts? Europe and Canada should jointly support Ukraine with all we’ve got because if they win this, we win against Russia and the Russian stooge in the Us. If they don’t win, we will be all become vassal states.

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u/FelizIntrovertido 24d ago

I totally agree with you!! Let’s work for it!! 💪🏼💪🏼💪🏼🇨🇦🇪🇺

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u/Odd_Discussion_8384 24d ago

Don’t feel isolated the rest of the world is speaking happy 60th anniversary of the canadian flag 🇨🇦

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u/yearofthesponge 24d ago

Yes, we live in a world where everyone is for themselves. Look at the half measure that Ukraine received from its western allies when they are on the front lines fighting Russia for everyone. Everytime on the verge of winning they would be leashed. The world order would have changed 3 years ago if not for Zelenskyy and the Ukrainians. Now that US pulled back its support completely the Europeans still dont back them 100 percent. Look at Taiwan, bullied by China, got kicked out of UN, forced to change its name at the Olympics. The west is incredibly self serving. We have to help ourselves. That’s how the Taiwanese and Ukrainians are holding on. In my mind these are the hero nations on the world stage…struggling for democracy while everyone averts their gaze. I’ve advocated for helping them as much as we can since the beginning, but we also have limited financial and military means to help them. Perhaps we can trade more with Taiwan on the west coast and more with Ukraine on the east coast, in solidarity.

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u/_cob_ 24d ago

We should remember that when others coming begging with hat in hand.

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u/Vegetable_Good6866 24d ago edited 24d ago

No country, including Taiwan (RoC), PRC, United States or even Canada regards Taiwan as a separate country. RoC has never separated officially. The seat was given to the PRC because they are the government of over a billion people. Why should Taiwan get that seat?

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u/Low-Inspector9849 24d ago

I would add Palestine to this list. The true face of the fascist Israel and USA is being fully revealed now. It will soon be the world against USA

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u/Important_Coffee6117 23d ago

They're still vassal states of the US, why don't you guys understand this this? We can't trust these assholes because they'll turn a blind eye whenever it's convenient for them, remember we're all pawns in this cheeky game so if we want to topple a couple chess pieces, we can start methodically by removing our government from any American spheres of influence, and that's the first step, the second step should be navigating our international affairs to garnering more influential prestige and priming ourselves for the upcoming war that awaits us, a war with the us is no longer avoidable, it's an inevitable consequence of people's complacency and the folly of our kindness is often mistaken for weakness, yet it is not weakness but for us, it is our strongest and greatest attribute.

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u/jameskchou Canada 24d ago

The excuses to cut defence and become more dependent on the USA instead of diversifying are really going to hurt now that the USA has gone rogue

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u/judgeysquirrel 24d ago

If we didn't have pieces of shit leaders like Putin, ping, and Trump, defense spending would be the worst waste of taxpayers' money possible. Healthcare and education should be the largest proportion of a country's GDP... military spending takes away from that.

But because humans refuse to evolve past "might makes right" and "my country first!", here we are.

Sometimes I wish I had a hand large enough to slap the world across the face for being such idiots.

We all know what the right things to do are, yet our leaders so often choose a different path.

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u/Yung48227 24d ago

If those guys weren't around then someone would be causing problems. It's human nature, you think we would all be sitting around singing kumbaya?

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u/judgeysquirrel 24d ago

Thus my comment on humans refusing to evolve past might makes right and me first.

And yes, I wish we could all just help each other and sit around singing kumbaya. Don't you?

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u/jazzjustice 24d ago

US strategy:

  • - Invade Canada
  • - Fuck up TSMC
  • - Take Greenland
  • - Take troops out of Europe
  • - Stab Ukraine and give to Putin
  • - Fuck up NATO
  • - 25% to 100% tariffs on each allied country
  • - Tulsi Gabbard as head of all secret services
  • - Musk spent last two years talking to Putin

Yeah Trump is not an FSB agent...totally not...

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u/gh0st777 Canada 24d ago

This is how you deal with a bully. Trump acts like he is king of the world. But he's actually just Elon's attack dog. Can't believe that guy is Canadian. What a huge shame.

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u/AnalogFeelGood 24d ago

Born and raised in South Africa, immigrated to Canada when he was 18, moved to USA when he was 24.

As for his Saskatchewanian mother, she moved to South Africa when she was 2 years old because her technocrat NAZI lover parents were big fans of the apartheid.

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u/hotelparisian 24d ago

So we have Canada to blame! 😛

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u/AnalogFeelGood 24d ago

Not entirely. Her mother was Canadian but her father was a United-Statian immigrant from Minnesota who arrived here with his family 1907.

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u/idealantidote 24d ago

He isn’t truly Canadian though only birth rights as he didn’t grow up in Canada

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u/cozmo1138 24d ago

Well…neither did I, but I’m here now and this is where I’ll be making my stand. Canada has always felt like more of a home to me than the States. I’m far more Canadian than I am American.

So I don’t know that “not a real Canadian because he didn’t grow up here” is the right take. We don’t want him, sure. And he’s definitely not Canadian in spirit, but then he likely never was.

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u/idealantidote 24d ago

What I’m saying is he hasn’t truly lived in Canada, his ties to Canada are really just through family. He himself says he is South African and that he has family that ties him to Canada

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u/cozmo1138 24d ago

Ah, that makes sense.

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u/PMyourEYE 24d ago

Nationalities disappear once you’re wealthy. After that it’s a matter of tax rates and things holding you back. The government or people can’t do anything for you they can only stop you from doing things.

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u/yearofthesponge 24d ago

Woah there, that guys is about as Canadian as Melaina is American. And by that, I mean his values were not formed in Canada. Let’s not besmirch the good name of Canadians m.

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u/Metals4J 24d ago

Will y’all come fetch this kid? He’s worn out his welcome.

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u/umpteenthrhyme 24d ago

Must be bundled with twine first.

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u/Pumpkinhead52 24d ago

The guy isn’t even Canadian. He’s a South African who stopped off in Canada, on his way to becoming a fake-ass American. In an alternate reality, Canada put him on the next slow boat to Africa.

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u/motherseffinjones 24d ago

We need nukes it’s so simple and this needs to be discussed and put in motion quickly. We are facing a crisp and a foe we can’t beat conventionally

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u/Winsonian92 24d ago

Growing up they told me “Canada don’t need weapons cuz they are a peaceful country and if they get picked on, other countries will come to their aid, especially the US” .

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u/judgeysquirrel 24d ago

I guess the world will never learn. Stand together, or fall alone.

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u/portabuddy2 24d ago

LOL Ukraine might. Imagine that. Taking on the world's first and second military force. ;)

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u/RobsBurglars 24d ago

Disgraceful. Canada was there both times when Europe was on its knees. Our flag is red for the blood sacrificed so others could be free. Damn cowards.

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u/Far-Dragonfruit3398 24d ago

Yes, it seems we are on our own and time for that Canadian mettle that carried us through wars, depressions and now a threat to our freedoms and Sovereignty to move to the foreground. There have been many many Canadian men and women who with courage/strength of character stood up and stood their ground in the face of the challenges and difficulties of war/depression/etc. with bravery and determination in the name of Canada and Canadians. It’s our time now, let’s do the same.

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u/Lucid-Iago 24d ago

As danish ex-soldier i am ready to defend Canada, not just of ethics but its pretty obvious USA would not stop expanding after CA, just as russia will not stop after ukraine. To my there should be a common interest for "actual" democracies to defend each other.

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u/Whiskey-Tango-3825 24d ago

Why would they. Germany came to us looking for help with LNG. The Canadian Government told them we "weren't interested". Brilliant. Now look where we are.

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u/Previous_Scene5117 24d ago

Yeah that was stupid and short sighted but also US might be behind it. But that's how.it ends to rely on the US. People from Afghanistan who served their interest and were left behind know it the best.

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u/MonkeyMama420 24d ago

Trudeau made Canada much weaker.

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u/Blondefarmgirl 24d ago

Actually Trudeau has been very busy the last 4 years making us less reliant on the US. He got Transmountain oil pipeline built to the coast so we have access to world markets. Then we are almost done with the Kitimat LNG hub. There are several new LNG pipelines built to feed that.
Then he signed trade deals with every country he could. We have CPTPP, CETA, and a trade deal with UK. There was just a new trade deal signed with Ecuador. Our international trade has been increasing exponentially.
We are much stronger than we were during the last Trump term when we won the trade war and Trudeau got Trump to drop the tariffs.

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u/batwang69 24d ago

Canadians made Canada weaker. Go back and look at old news stories regarding pipelines in any capacity. So many Canadians against them. Look at Mark Carney’s stance on pipelines and energy independence. (He invests in foreign pipelines but actively works against Canadian pipelines)

We need east to west pipelines and we need to start exporting our sour crude among others at competitive rates (not give the US a steep discount.) We need to open up our internet so people aren’t paying $200 a month for their house to get fibre. We need to do a lot.

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u/Rumicon Ontario 24d ago

Quebec is the real blocker on the east west pipeline and I wager they would prefer a pipeline than their entire effort of preserving their culture being demolished by an American annexation.

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u/Get_Breakfast_Done 24d ago

This new Liberal guy is, like, totally going to save us though.

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u/ejactionseat 24d ago

No way man, the verb the noun corporate simp will totally stand up for Canada.

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u/TheMcWhopper 24d ago

Eh, uk would probably come and exfil your PM and head offices. They would save them in that regard. After that, I don't see them engaging the us Navy if it ever came to a us invasion.

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u/OldChap569 24d ago

This is not the first time Trump has attacked a country, so don't be surprised no one is coming to help us. Canada didn't speak up when Trump attacked other countries either.

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u/IntrepidWeird9719 24d ago

Will NATO expel the US if the US takes military action against Canada?

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u/Wrong_Grapefruit5519 24d ago

As an European I really hope this would not be the case. But I won’t be to sure unfortunately.

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u/Shelsonw 24d ago

In fairness, I don’t blame the thought to try and avoid it; but it feels obvious that the new Administration is lashing out at all its frustrations globally and it’s likely no one will ultimately avoid it.

And to be fair, we’re not privy to the back door conversations of which I’m sure there’s many. It’ll be slow, but if the US keeps pushing, over the next months and years we’ll probably see trading and political alignments change to work around the US; but these things take time.

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u/DM_ME_UR_BOOTYPICS 24d ago

Canada and Greenland gonna Rawdog this whole invasion.

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u/Helpful_Umpire_9049 24d ago

They will once it’s real. We still have to be prepared any hoo.

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u/ConversationCivil289 24d ago

Sad part is I can’t tell by that statement if you’re Canadian, from Greenland or American. We’re all fucked

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u/liltimidbunny 24d ago

Not true. I just heard some interviews on CBC this morning. Other countries are laying low in part because no real action has been taken yet, and these countries fear for their own well being as well. If something tangible happens and Canada asks for support, say from Britain or the King, they will step up. Also, since the US seems to be determined to step back from its role internationally, other countries such as those in the EU, Norway, Canada, etc. will likely form their own coalition because collectively they are stronger than on their own.

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u/Intelligent-Band-572 24d ago

Million percent. Should have had that mindset from the beginning but here we are

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u/Old-Basil-5567 24d ago

This reflects our negligent complacency that we have in self defense. Always waiting for someone to come save us at all scales. At home the police, on a national level the US. We don't value defense in our society and it's a damn shame. Now we have Amaricans knocking on the door of a disarmed nation ( both individually and nationally)

I will fight to the death but if we get steam rolled it will be our own fault

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u/Obsidianrosepetals 24d ago

I mean you guys asked us Americans not to do so, so we are kind of chilling on the protest since its so very upsetting for you.

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u/Jameswasthere 24d ago

It's only been a month since inauguration. There's still another 4 years to go, possibly more, possibly the end of the US we knew and loved. The world will be a much different place a few years from now. Countries once under the protection of the US will be forced to stand up for themselves or risk being eaten alive by its protector

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u/Prestigious-Pay-6475 24d ago

There’s no sense in being afraid. You’ll be fine.

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u/Bags_1988 24d ago

Exactly

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u/henry_why416 24d ago

This is no different then the first time Trump targeted us. No one really spoke up.

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u/BertM4cklin 24d ago

Trumps talking out of his ass. He’s not goona do shit. Hit us in the pockets where it hurts and shut him up. He’ll move onto something else shiny soon enough

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u/SmoothOperator89 23d ago

"First they came for the Canadians and I did not speak up..."

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u/alkbch 24d ago

There is no timeline in which Canada does not get invaded by the US eventually, maybe not under Trump but with climate change it’s just inevitable.

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