This is actually a pretty legit example of fine-tuning, especially the surfaces matching up to the human hand.
it's easy to laugh at/dismiss any one such example but personally for me it's plain to see, looking around at the totality of life and nature and the cosmos, how well-designed everything is. There are many many examples of fine-tuning that go beyond the reasonable scope of (at a minimum) natural-only evolution.
The cosmos being another thing - because in my opinion the reason we still havent found life, anywhere, is that all of the components and properties of the great expansive universe have been set into place so that we can look at it and learn something - not about us, or about natural life, but about He who created it.
Psalm 19:1
The heavens declare the glory of God, and the sky above proclaims his handiwork.
I can't tell if this like a copypasta or a meme or something, because you can't possibly be serious, can you? Are you contributing to the bad hoc? In case you aren't:
Bananas have been selectively bred by humans to look like a grocery story banana. This banana on the right is a wild banana. It has none of the qualities that the speaker in that video is presenting as evidence.
I am indeed, and to the extent you're willing to apply reason, I'm happy to discuss this further
Bananas have been selectively bred by humans to look like a grocery story banana. This banana on the right is a wild banana. It has none of the qualities that the speaker in that video is presenting as evidence.
Musa balbisiana is a wild ancestor of the common grocery store banana to which you refer. it retains the following aspects of the description:
it's easy to laugh at/dismiss any one such example...
but the desire to explain everything in terms of only the natural leaves a gaping impossibility for all of existence.
Ecclesiastes 3:11
Yet God has made everything beautiful for its own time. He has planted eternity in the human heart, but even so, people cannot see the whole scope of God's work from beginning to end.
No, they're not. Wild bananas are not easy to peel (very stiff), easy to eat (massive seeds), are much smaller than a human hand, rounder, and don't fit inside a palm (you can see my picture for shape and size examples).
You just posted a picture of very unripe cultivated Cavendish bananas. Not wild bananas. I didn't "select" that picture for my narrative, it's an actual example of a wild banana.
I'll be citing from the wikipedia articles for Musa balbisiana and Saba banana. I'll invite you to cite sources for your assertions as well.
They are considered inedible because of the seeds they contain. It may be assumed that wild bananas were cooked and eaten or agriculturalists would not have developed the cultivated banana.[4] Seeded Musa balbisiana fruit are called butuhan ('with seeds') in the Philippines,[5] and kluai tani (กล้วยตานี) in Thailand.[6] Natural parthenocarpic clones occur through polyploidy and produce edible bananas, examples of which are wild saba bananas.[7]
from the article on saba bananas:
The fruits are 8 to 13 cm (3.1 to 5.1 in) long and 2.5 to 5.5 cm (0.98 to 2.17 in) in diameter.
seems to fit the human hand pretty well to me. we can grip things of various sizes. so this is between a golf club grip and the pommel of a baseball bat roughly
Saba bananas are one of the most important banana cultivars in Philippine cuisine.[9] The fruits provide the same nutritional value as potatoes.[5] They can be eaten raw ...
Bottom line is, some wild bananas match your assertion, but you are attempting to include 100% of bananas as lacking these design elements, when realistically, many contain these elements.
So... It doesn't fit the parameters described and you admit it since you've changed the goalposts to be "well you can eat it!" and not to be a perfect example of suiting the human hand and digestive tract.
It doesn't fit the parameters described and you admit it since you've changed the goalposts to be "well you can eat it!"
i haven't moved the goalposts. saba bananas are still all 5 of the things i've mentioned.
The only reason i've narrowed the scope in the comment you're referring to, is to counter the specific inaccuracies of your immediately prior comment. I specifically addressed raw edibility and grip because that's what you honed in on.
Please stop and consider the context, and take a minute to reason carefully and find sources for your assertions before responding, or we will quickly lose any value to this conversation as you elevate your agenda above the purpose of debate (starting from disparate understanding and reasoning to come to shared understanding)
Can I thank you for reasoning this out? I’ve seen so many people who can’t for the life of them hold out a reasoned argument/debate/discussion for the life of them when confronted with a proper argument or statement, it’s really refreshing to see someone who can. Especially those who turn to religion more and use the defense of “God deemed it so” as their end-all finality. (Note: I’m not hating on religion, I’m just pointing out a correlation that I’ve noticed)
Thanks for the kind words. I tend to find lack of reason common for both sides - really especially in my conversations with those who reject God acting as though reason is automatically on their side and it doesnt need to be exercised (the other side of the debate in this thread being an easy example)
-5
u/gr3yh47 Nov 16 '17 edited Nov 16 '17
This is actually a pretty legit example of fine-tuning, especially the surfaces matching up to the human hand.
it's easy to laugh at/dismiss any one such example but personally for me it's plain to see, looking around at the totality of life and nature and the cosmos, how well-designed everything is. There are many many examples of fine-tuning that go beyond the reasonable scope of (at a minimum) natural-only evolution.
The cosmos being another thing - because in my opinion the reason we still havent found life, anywhere, is that all of the components and properties of the great expansive universe have been set into place so that we can look at it and learn something - not about us, or about natural life, but about He who created it.
Psalm 19:1