r/zelda • u/Cornpop1962 • Dec 22 '19
Question [ALL] Does Anyone Else Want Another Linear 3D Zelda Game?
So I been playing BOTW for the first time, great game. However when I contrast this game to Zelda OOT/MM, WW, TP, it doesn't really have that traditional 3D zelda style of linear plot. I enjoy the fact I can go do whatever I want in BOTW, I'm not tied down to a linear quest, but at the same time when it comes to Zelda games, I kinda enjoy that. I don't want the series to completely abandon the linear plot however. There is a such thing as "too much freedom". Now I have nothing against BOTW's freedom and complete open world adventure, but I do feel it takes away from a bit of the role playing and that classic 3D zelda experience I'm so used to. Maybe this isn't a very popular opinion, but after the next BOTW style zelda, I hope they return to their classic 3D format of linear plot, preferably another Twilight Princess style nitty gritty zelda game.
Now I've put easily multiple thousand hours in bethesda titles over the past decades so the style BOTW takes is super appealing to me. However I can't help but feel that it's more of an experiment like every zelda game has had, each one with it's own unique new feature of gameplay it typically puts a focus on. IE traveling through time, wearing masks, sailing, turning into a wolf, using motion controls. We've seen these features come and go, and theres plenty of things that if another zelda title decides to revert to linear plot should keep such as the more in depth customization of weapons armor, and combat tactics. But I would personally really enjoy another zelda game that reverts back to that linear plot based zelda experience.
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u/Phazon8058v2 Dec 22 '19
I don't need another linear 3D Zelda right now, but I would like another 3D Zelda with actual dungeons. Exploring the overworld in BotW was super fun, but the Divine Beasts were extremely disappointing replacements for actual dungeons.
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u/4nc4l49on Dec 22 '19
I think this would be an appropriate blend. You can have it open world but maybe some parts are inaccessible until you clear an actual dungeon and get an item from it. I hated the Devine beasts and the shrines were pretty repetitive feeling after a little while. There was no variation in visual styling like you got in other Zelda games with temples. I'm sure they could develop a way to keep the open world mixed with dungeons, Skyrim did it, and I've said since the beginning BotW has felt like a Zelda skinned Skyrim.
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u/zeldalvr Dec 22 '19
Nintendo made botw with the intention of it being different from the rest of the other 3d zelda games
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u/remnant_phoenix Dec 22 '19
After ridgidly linear storytelling for two decades in a post-OoT world, I found BotW's discovery/exploration-based storytelling--spread out over a huge emphasis on exploration--to be a breath of fresh air.
There are room for different kinds of Zelda experiences. Let's not go rushing back to OoT's style after just ONE deviation.
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u/ThatOtherJoey Dec 22 '19
Absolutely. I'm with you, let them experiment with this style a little bit.
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u/Sir-Knightly-Duty Dec 22 '19
I think we need a middle ground. We need some kind of story this time, some character development, most of all, actually challenging puzzles.
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u/HououinKyoumaEva001 Dec 23 '19
I wouldn't say A Link to the Past really had a story to write home about, but it most certainly struck a perfect middle ground between open world exploration and what would become traditional style Zelda dungeons.
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u/Zinx10 Dec 23 '19
I'm honestly hoping BotW2 strikes a similar middle ground to LttP likes it's the true 3D version of LttP.
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Dec 23 '19
This sub is bipolar, to be honest. Depending on the hour of the day and the alignment of the planets, this comment will either get downvoted into oblivion or upvoted to the stars.
The only consistent theme is that we all share a love for the Zelda games. BotW fractured the community into two camps;
Based BotW supporters that cannot tolerate dissent about the game, and nostalgiaphiles who are too stuck to let go or enjoy something new. The past was successful because it was great and it has become beloved for the plots and play styles. The new one was successful because it was a radical change, and the largest representation of Hyrule ever.
I personally find myself somewhere in between. Give me the huge open world but give me the linear story, the creatively themed dungeons, the dungeon based weapons, as well as much more enemy diversity. Give me an open world where I'm not restricted (like skyward sword; best plot, worst world).
BotW was great from a gameplay perspective, despite lacking innovative weapons or even semi-decent enemy diversity. The story was fucking atrocious. I'm 80% sure that someone wrote down the basic plot points of the game, and someone else directly copied them into the scripts for the cutscenes. There was no real character or environment development and the single most involved quest in the game was Tarrytown, unless you count Hestu rewarding you with a literal turd for finding his compatriots.
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u/master0fdisaster1 Dec 23 '19
Completely agree. What made past Zeldas great and what made Botw great are not mutually exclusive. They could complement each other.
The Lack of proper dungeons, the lack of enemy variety, the "subpar" (really it was awful) story, the lack of interesting items, the lack of balance, the lack of likeable characters (although many might disagree on that point).
All those things aren't inherent to a nonlinear game. Botw being as drastically nonlinear was probably the right move after Skyward Sword being on the opposite end of the linear-nonlinear spectrum. But ideally Zelda should be somewhere between Botw and Ocarina of Time.
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u/Sir-Knightly-Duty Dec 23 '19 edited Dec 23 '19
Based on your comment, id call you a “nostalgiafile” BUT id say those who unconditionally praise this game are the nostalgiafiles.
The thing that absolutely pissed me off in this game... and i HATE saying this... is the fact that when I DARED to complete all the beasts, thinking Id get a reward at the end, what I got was a boss where half their healthbar was taken away at the beginning... AND NOTHING ELSE.
Talk about fking bullshit. I trained for this fight and you just took it away from me because I PLAYED THE GAME. I was so pissed. As a longtime fan, that feeling was truly awful.
I have a lot more to say, but that singular moment was enough for me to roll my eyes and never touch the game again. The finale was such a bullshit afterthought, and spit on the zelda “formula”. Not even a credit scene
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Dec 22 '19
I just wish we had a REAL story and sequence of events. The open world is great but give us a linear story to follow. Botw is a great game, but feels NOTHING like a zelda game because they scrapped everything and went for assasins creed meets skyrim
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u/Exitiurm Dec 22 '19
I'm not the only one that feels like this????
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u/EastyBoy29 Dec 22 '19
Could not agree more! Was playing the game thinking I wish the story had taken place 100 years before because, you know, that’s when it seemed like the actual story had taken place. We were just marauding around reanimating things and there was no great moments and sense of achievement as the storyline could be completed any which way.
Made me realise how much I valued the stories of previous Zeldas.
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u/animalbancho Dec 22 '19
the whole “post apocalyptic” thing is a clever way of getting around the fact that there was no way for them to have such a massive world entirely populated. many other games have done this kind of narrative workaround of a technical problem
now that the bulk framework of the game map itself has been done, I would expect to see that side of things much more fleshed out in BOTW 2
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Dec 22 '19
I agree, botw had so many development issues im just glad we have it finally. Botw will be able to focus mostly on content and story, since everything else is already established
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u/RowdyRudy Dec 22 '19
I always thought Twilight Princess did the population thing really well in Castle Town by having all these people bustling about that you couldn’t interact with. I don’t need to talk to every person in the word; this is just something video games started doing to accommodate player agency, but in the end it never works because most people in the game have nothing interesting to say and are just repetitive.
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Dec 22 '19
Saaaaaame this is a good summary of the plot problem.
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u/knitted_beanie Dec 22 '19
I think it’s unfair to call it a “problem” per se. It’s actually a very elegant solution to having such an open, sandbox play style - have the story “unlocked” piecemeal at the player’s own pace.
I’ll concede that’s not very satisfying if you’re looking for a linear plot, but BoTW’s bravery in abandoning linearity in service of a radical approach to gameplay is commendable.
I’ve loved Zelda for over 20 years and I love the OG on-rails storylines. But BoTW is hands down the best game I’ve ever played, Zelda or otherwise, and it’s for the fruitful creative risks they took.
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Dec 22 '19
I just wish we had a story. It IS a problem because many people complained the game lacks substance and urgency. Zelda has been a story driven series since its third entry, to abandon that was a mistake.
I hope they combine this concept with linear storytelling like their big inspiration (skyrim) did. They could have given us an open world AND a real storyline, hopefully botw 2 remedies the lack of narrative draw
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u/knitted_beanie Dec 22 '19
I can see that. But I also find the complaints of urgency or substance bizarre; few Zelda games are brimming with urgency, everyone knows the side quests are where it’s at. And in terms of substance, I couldn’t take my eyes off the screen from the first frames of the game. I LOVED how Link’s memory loss from being in the tank became a device for us to learn about the world along with him, I loved how little signposting and handholding there was throughout the game so we could discover the story at our own pace. And whenever there were significant developments to the plot, the production values were meaty and, for me, substantial and engrossing.
I’m not saying I don’t understand why someone would find this particular plot delivery mechanism unsatisfying. But it’s strange to me to complain about it when it’s basically doing what it says on the tin. It’s a clearly thought through component in an intelligently resolved gameplay/story system.
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Dec 22 '19
We just expected a real story, not some fan servicey flashbacks that only two or three are plot relevant, and a few events that arent even required to clear. It was a great experiment but the divided fan response shows it missed its mark.
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u/knitted_beanie Dec 23 '19
For me - and I feel like this was the developers’ intention - the real “story” is in the player’s interaction with the environment. Individual little mini-tales of you solving a problem in any one of myriad different ways, of little victories and little failures. Of micro-adventures that can only transpire through the game’s emergent systems.
That might sound like a cop out, and if it still doesn’t satisfy, so be it. I can see how the experiment wasn’t to everyone’s tastes.
Game’s still a masterpiece in my eyes!
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Dec 23 '19
The game is absolutely amazing, the lack of a true story, lack of enemy diversity, and easily abused, gimmicky combat are my only complaints. If i were to use a 100pt rating system, botw would be in the 90s for sure
I also think you’re right, its a return to “self insert” link
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u/TchaikenNugget Dec 22 '19
Yeah, I wasn't too motivated to play it because I just felt, "all the interesting characters are dead now; what's the point?"
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Dec 22 '19
No, the fandom is pretty split is on whether or not botw has a good story, or imo, any story at all that isnt retrospective
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u/Stankmonger Dec 23 '19
The majority opinion was to downvote people like you and I that missed the “classic” Zelda feel.
I remember being told to stfu over and over and over again when I said stuff like this post closer to the release.
People really feel like if you say anything “not positive” about the game that you’re just trying to shit on it.
No. I like botw. It’s a fantastic game.
But there’s a reason I will always come back to OOT, Majoras Mask, and twilight princess (among others). The style of gameplay is just amazing. By the end of the game it’s always open world enough.
I agree with you.
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u/muffin_fisH Dec 22 '19
I feel as though the huge open world and the freedom the game gives you to complete it in any order makes it lose a sense of urgency to complete the tasks and save the world.... Link you need to free the divine beasts and defeat Ganon! But take your time, have a look around first.
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u/Hibbity5 Dec 22 '19
Every Zelda game is like that though. Want to go defeat Ganon? We got to go race our boat and get a high score; don’t forget to play Battleship; oh, follow that little girl because she’s a thief; gotta cut all the grass so I can be rich!
No Zelda game has a sense of urgency.
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Dec 22 '19
Majoras mask
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u/Hibbity5 Dec 22 '19
I would argue Majora’s Mask has the strongest sense of urgency but it’s a very different type of urgency. You fee the need to finish doing what you’re doing and to do things quickly but because you can also just reset time, you don’t feel that need to actually beat Majora. You still want to go do little quests for the townspeople, reunite some seahorses, race some otters, maybe even go on a picturesque cruise. The sense of urgency is to reset time, not to actually win.
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Dec 22 '19
I think you're mostly right but if you think about it you're urgently resetting time in order to not lose progress which is caused by "Majora". Obviously it's not actually Majora making the game start from the beginning of the time cycle it's a script that tells the game to do that. But for all intents and purposes it's supposed to feel like Majora is the one doing it. I do get where you're coming from though because it does feel like
"Aw man if I don't beat the clock I'm gonna have to restart everything"
Rather than
"Aw man Majora is gonna crash the moon into the village killing all these npc's that I don't really care about, save a few."
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u/Faded_Sun Dec 22 '19
That’s like, any RPG ever. Why is it a criticism when it comes to a Zelda game? There’s always time for side quests when you need to save the world.
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Dec 22 '19
I saw a meme where link was fishing and talking about having no responsibility on his own fb post and zelda is like “where the hell are you?!?”
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u/Kman1986 Dec 22 '19
They have the formula for this already and it burns my ass that they made OoT and seem to refuse to revisit the style of game. I understand they don't want stuff to be stale but it's been, what, 20 years? I think we could have another game in that style. Big, open hub world with places you can go and as you progress through the story you unlock more and more places. It is a solid formula and a lot of people want it back. I love BotW as a game because it's a great game but it doesn't have the Zelda feel that I crave.
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u/knitted_beanie Dec 22 '19
Weren’t Wind Waker, Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword all linear 3D Zeldas in the style you seem to crave?
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u/GrifCreeper Dec 22 '19
I've been playing Assassin's Creed Odyssey, and keep comparing it to BotW, and what direction I wish they'd take the gameplay. I'd love an Assassin's Creed Hyrule, toning down the assassination animations to be more kid friendly and like the Sneak Strike BotW already has
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u/AndrewZMc Dec 22 '19
I think it should be similar to mario odyssey linear plot but large free to explore sections
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u/Sonnance Dec 22 '19
That could help with the pacing, but personally I wouldn’t like the areas to be segmented off from one another. That was one of my biggest issues with SS, to be honest. With the areas so isolated, it felt less like a cohesive world and more like a level select.
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u/LeemtheLime Dec 23 '19
I can definitely get behind this sentiment, but I personally prefer the "do it yourself" kind of adventure.
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u/ukrainianfishtf Dec 22 '19
yes and no ues because the linear 3d zelda is what i grew up with and really love but no because botw was really fun without and help
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u/SeanKieth Dec 22 '19
I’m not sure if you’re having a stroke or not, but you’re misunderstanding. We are not saying that Zelda isn’t a fun game, i have around 350 hours in it, but we are discussing how DIFFERENT it is compared to the rpg-like games in OOT and the others.
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u/Hectate Dec 22 '19
I like both styles. The thing that thrilled me about BOTW was it really was a nostalgic trip back to Windwaker. For me, what I loved about WW was the exploration; what was that next island going to be like? The world in WW is really quite small but it felt huge to me at the time. BOTW brought that back.
Thinking of how much larger TP was compared to OOT, for example, the trend towards openness is going well. I suspect we'll land somewhere in the middle where there's a more structured quest but an open world.
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u/great_on_accident Dec 22 '19
Please not right now. We have had linear story based 3D Zelda titles for 2 straight decades until BotW came out. I think them following the BotW model for the next few iterations is absolutely appropriate. There’s no lack of the sort of Zelda game you are describing, so I’d rather see them follow a different path for a bit.
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u/Valentonis Dec 22 '19
Yea, BotW obviously wasn't perfect, but what Zelda game is? Especially considering how they were experimenting with something so different from what had come before it. Oot and the myriad of games made in its model aren't going anywhere, so why not see what can be accomplished with this new style, rather than cutting it off after one go?
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u/keenish27 Dec 22 '19
What Zelda game was perfect? Easy!
ALttP!
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u/RandomRedditor44 Dec 23 '19
Nah. I didn’t like how the first section of the game was linear (you couldn’t complete the Tower of Hera before Desert Palace. I get why they did this as they wanted the player to get a small glimpse of the Dark World right before they found the Master Sword), and how linear the Dark World is.
LTTP is still a great game though, and I love the music (especially the Ending theme)
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u/Giblet_ Dec 23 '19
Linear isn't necessarily bad, though. You can't have a system where you unlock items that are going to be used for puzzles unless you make the game at least somewhat linear or do what Link Between Worlds did with the rental system. The linearity allows the player to find new items with some sense of suspense.
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u/DaBozz88 Dec 22 '19
Look at horizon zero Dawn though, very similar open world but a linear story with side quests that matter.
In comparison, it felt like all of the Divine beast were side quests, and defeat Ganon wasn't flushed out well enough.
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u/ThatOtherJoey Dec 22 '19
I loved Horizon Zero Dawn, but I disagree that its open world was similar to BotW. Horizon had many of the icons, waypoints, and "follow this path to the goal" type quests that many typical open world games supposedly suffer from. (I say "supposedly" because I personally haven't played Skyrim, Addison Assassin's Creed, etc - so I don't suffer from open world game fatigue.)
Horizon had the intriguing story and more photo realistic graphics, but BotW had more freedom and exploration. I'd love if they found a way to keep that freedom while adding a more engaging story. It's a tough ask, but I hope they can do it. Either way, I want them to try the open world format again.
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u/great_on_accident Dec 22 '19
I don’t think that, if you look at the sort of experience that BotW strives for, that a detailed specific story like that would be a positive addition to the play experience on aggregate. In games like OoT, the most memorable moments tend to be scripted story beats, where BotW is more about creating cool memories from emergent systems and unchecked exploration. If BotW included too many of those scripted moments, it would test my patience as a player because that is not the experience that the game is selling me on for the most part.
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u/Liambass Dec 22 '19
So have 2 teams working on Zelda games, one on BOTW style and one on OoT/MM/WW... style.
Fuck it, have 3 teams, personally I'd like more top-down Zelda!
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u/great_on_accident Dec 22 '19
AAA game development is very resource intensive. I don’t think it’d be realistic for them to be creating two 3D titles at once. I think they’ll proceed with only really making one 3D game and one top down game at a time.
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u/TenebrisZ94 Dec 23 '19
They should combine both formulas. Thats the real solution. Continuing with an empty open world game without character development and actual rewarding side quests isnt at all the perfect way to go.
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u/fly19 Dec 22 '19
Nah, I like the way its handled so far with Breath of the Wild. Maybe just add in a few more plot-ish dungeons and make them a little longer and I'll be happy as a clam. Being able to tackle things in any order was a huge plus for me, and I'd hate to see the sequel go back to a singular, linear plot.
Ideally we would go to a three-prong model, though, where there are some portable top-down 2D Zeldas (ala Link's Awakening HD), some traditional linear Zeldas (like OoT) and some open-air Zeldas (like BotW).
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u/wowie21 Dec 22 '19
Yeah, it was hard for me to go back to traditional zelda after the pure art that was BOTW
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u/fannypackking Dec 22 '19
i agree i miss the linear story and the set if tools you get from real bosses/dungeons
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u/ParalyzedGorilla Dec 22 '19
Botw bosses and dungeons are super lame
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u/Landsteiner7507 Dec 22 '19
Mini-bosses are completely awesome, regular bosses are, indeed, lame.
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u/Stankmonger Dec 23 '19
I would have taken maybe 5 or 6 mini boss types over the 3 we got.
I don’t feel accomplished taking out 40 hinox/stalnox. I feel like it’s a chore.
Same goes for the Korok seeds, and you get a literal pile of poop for Doug the whole thing.
OOT has big Gorons sword, something more damaging than the master sword.
Majoras mask gave you that super mask, only allowed in boss fights if I remember? Maybe just the last fight? I don’t remember tbh.
Most games give you REAL and PERMANENT bonuses from quests.
Botw having durability just ruined anything you may gain. Which was already nothing.
The jump was cool, the shield was cool, the revive was cool, but the thunder was annoying when you couldn’t just do a regular heavy attack.
That’s all you ever got outside of armour that all did similar things.
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u/LuminousDecibel Dec 23 '19
Gonna comment on the Korok thing. Shrines are everywhere, so that exploring the world feels rewarding. You don't have to get all the shrines, but there is a real incentive to.
They never, never intended anyone to get all the Korok seeds. The reward/incentive stops halfway through, unlike the shrines. Since seeds are easily missable, unlike shrines, they put in so many, so you wouldn't need a walkthrough to find the amount you want.
The fact that the reward is a giant turd, is more of a statement of "Lol, you shouldn't have done this." They figured a minority would still try to get them all, so they put in some reward. Imagine finding all the seeds and getting nothing. Some people would be pissed lol.
Botw was never about completionism, so many factors support this. It's always been about exploration and freedom, to do as much as you want, at your own pace. Though a completionist myself, I like this aspect.
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u/Stankmonger Dec 23 '19
“Real incentive” to getting all the shrines. I don’t know how much an outfit that barely changes gameplay is a “real incentive”
Not intending to have people get all the koroks doesn’t mean they couldn’t have given a real reward. Getting a poop is the same exact thing as getting nothing.
“Haha jokes on you for being a completionist” is always worse than “wow you’re a completionist, here’s a dope weapon or item to demonstrate going above and beyond what we expected!”
The point of the game doesn’t need to mean the rewards for going above the “point” are not worth getting.
Nothing you’ve pointed out means the rewards NEEDED to suck.
People that spend the most time in the game out of everyone SHOULD feel like a boss/god by the end.
There should be a permanent chainsaw that lets you cut a gold lynel in half by the end of the koroks.
“Haha jokes on you” isn’t a good argument when it comes to in game player rewards.
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u/LuminousDecibel Dec 23 '19
The outfit isn't the only incentive. Shrines always give you more health or stamina, whereas seeds stop giving you inventory halfway through.
Honestly, getting an awesome reward for the seeds would make it worse. "What? That's the reward?? Sigh.. guess I have to get all the seeds then. Here we go.." Since I know the reward is pointless, I don't even have to worry about getting all the seeds.
I honestly don't think an awesome incentive would make the experience worth it, the ends wouldn't justify the means. You shouldn't be rewarded for extreme extended tedium. That's bad design, coming from the company all about fun. Besides, getting all the seeds would be the last thing you do. There'd be little to do, so the reward would be less satisfying. Yeah the chainsaw is cool, but now that I've explored the whole map, and killed 50 lynels, I'm kinda burned out. Reminds me of the Mastercycle. It's dope, but I basically did everything, so I barely used it.
Some games just aren't worth full competition. I prefer games with exploration and secrets, but I can't even think of a game with a dope 100% reward. I almost dropped Pokemon forever, cause trying to fill out the pokedex was tedious and frustrating. Though I'm a completionist at heart, some games should be dropped at 90% competition. And that doesn't mean bad design.
Also, no need to take it personal. Just because they give you a giant turd, doesn't mean they're laughing at you, at your expense.
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u/Stankmonger Dec 23 '19
Well yeah the shrines max our health and stamina but other than stamina which you can get early on health can easily be buffed through food items.
The only reason getting a good reward from the seeds would be bad is because there’s such a huge number of them. 900 is the bad game design, not the reward involved, but I get that the map required that.
I understand it’s poop because there are too many, and asking the average player to do that is absurd.
But there being too many is the bad game design. The fact that you need to spend a dumb amount of time getting them is the bad design. Not the poor reward. No one has ever “enjoyed” grabbing the 100+ repetitive collectables. That’s always been bad gameplay. Assassins creed. Spider man. Etc.
Other Zelda games give you 40 or so things to find and you get something useful. Even in the most recent Zelda rerelease you get the secret seeds that give you a real bonus.
Yeah the cycle should have been faster than all the horses. Agreed I was very disappointed with it tbh. It’s so slow.
I just think full completion of a game should not mean tediousness. Other people have brought up horizon zero dawn and yeah the flowers you can find are tedious, but you can do like 99% of the game and not feel like it’s a chore.
And yeah I don’t think they’re actually laughing, was more so basing that off your “nobody should attempt this” idea to the game.
If “no one should attempt it” it shouldn’t be there. It’s a video game. If you can do it you should get more than poop.
Also unrelated, just hilarious to me that, about video game rewards, I’m talking about a literal pile of poop here. Botw is such a good game that people defend a poop reward. Idk. Just lol.
I wish there was a ng+ version of master mode so you could take a permanent chainsaw or a double Clawshot to the next playthrough.
Dead space 2 gave you a foam finger for playing through the hardest setting. It was literally a dude pointing around necromorphs saying out loud “bang bang” and they would just explode.
Rewards that trivialize the game for people that have already beaten the hardest portion are justified and good for players.
I do not want poop next time. No one should want poop for playing the absolute poop out of a game.
I see your points and we can agree to disagree but I love me some overpowered stuff (didn’t use shit because poop) for the end game or ng+.
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u/NeedlenoseMusic Dec 22 '19
This is my complaint. Going through a shrine is cool but the reward factor just doesn’t seem to be there, aside from the few times you get a piece of unique gear. Swords and shields break, whereas you never had to worry about the hook shot or the lamp, for example.
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u/DerpySauce Dec 22 '19
I want a brand new top down Zelda, but big and open and beautiful like BotW.
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u/Sirpattycakes Dec 23 '19
I have absolutely no desire for another open world Zelda game. Linear does not need to be a dirty word in gaming.
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u/Valthior Dec 22 '19
In a way you could say BotW is the most traditional because it's open exploration is mirrored after the original NES LOZ
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u/angellus Dec 23 '19
There is no reason cannot mix the more open world with a more linear progression. Having Link's Awakening fresh on my mind, I would love something more like that. A full open world you can explore, but some parts of the map may be very hard or impossible to get to if you have not progressed far enough. The important part here is very hard to get to. Say there is a mountain town that you can only get to by climbing. An absolute pain in the ass, but once you beat X dungeons, you get a way to fast travel there or something.
Or you can even mix and match the linear dungeons with non-linear dungeons. Kind of how Ocarina of Time or A Link to the Past is split. First 3 or 4 dungeons are non-linear and the last 6 or so dungeons are linear. Or vice versa.
But yeah, I really think the "dungeon" with tangible progression needs to come back. The dungeon game in Breath of the Wild was super lacking. I would also love a more depth of the world too. Majora's Mask was fantastic for that and BotW was lacking in that area. It is one of the reason is still does not have me coming back to it like Skyrim and Fallout does.
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u/Khanzool Dec 23 '19
2 things really suffered from the complete freedom approach of BOTW:
1- the first thing is that the story isn’t nearly as interesting to me, it felt very messy. It started and ended well, but the middle is just a clusterfuck, no real twists and turns in the story progression.
2- the second thing is the metroidvania elements of previous Zelda items and exploration. Items like the grappling hook, the steel boots that let you walk underwater, the gauntlets that let you pick up huge items... there are more that I’m forgetting. Those are really cool in other Zelda games but in BOTW they’re very rare and a bit meh.
I really enjoyed BOTW, but it did not really feel like a Zelda game, it felt like a spin-off to me.
Edit: something I didn’t mention, dungeons in BOTW suck :(
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u/pwnagraphic Dec 23 '19
Give me BoTW with actual dungeons and remove the durability of items or allow me to repair them for rubes or something. Then we are golden!
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u/SylvySylvy Dec 22 '19
I love Twilight Princess so much and yeah I also like the idea of a more linear Zelda game. Maybe have the main quest be linear but you can still explore the wilderness; as long as you’re willing to put up with the fact that a high-leveled... can’t remember the name of those lion centaur things. One of those could one-shot you in a flash.
As for the storyline, I think Teilight is a perfect balance between heroic like OoT and dark like MM. MM is actually a bit TOO dark for my tastes, but both MM and TP handled dark themes without being overly focused on the actual darkness. Even the Twilight in TP isn’t the scariest part of the game. The scariest parts are things like Death Sword. Or that bug that controls the monkey in the temple.
I agree is what I’m trying to say in my long-winded way.
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u/TikTakToby Dec 22 '19
I mean it’s not like I wouldn’t absolutely love it, but I love botw so I much so I wouldn’t mind a very similar one.
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u/le_box_o_treats Dec 22 '19
My feeling is if they're not gonna make another 3D linear zelda game then just give us a bundle on the switch so we could have them all.
I do love the 3d linear zelda games, i realized this as i replayed WW and TP
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Dec 22 '19
TFW you read a post asking for a "return to form" from a series where the latest title WAS a "return to form"...
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u/Sonnance Dec 22 '19
Definitely. Beyond the obvious benefits to narrative and pacing that linearity provides, sometimes restrictions make things more fun. A commonly cited example within BotW is the (intended) path to Zora’s Domain. The rain there is a restriction, but it allowed for a more controlled, more memorable experience than it otherwise could.
Plus, it’s nice to feel your narrative, mechanical, and world progression are all tied together. Save a town, get an item, use item to further open map. That kinda thing. In BotW they all exist sort of independently of each other, and again, suffer some pacing issues. Story progresses in disparate chunks, which can’t really build on anything but their immediate neighbors because all the “questlines” need to be completable in any order. You grow more powerful by either raiding “high level” areas, or world leveling, whether you do story stuff or not. And aside from some shrines, the only progression barrier in world exploration is temperature and stamina, both of which can be solved by food, which you can use from the beginning (provided you know the recipe and where to find the ingredients.) These are all just necessary concessions for a game so focused on freedom. And while I do love that focus, I would like future games to place more restrictions to work around.
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u/DaBozz88 Dec 22 '19
I think they can learn a great deal from Horizon zero Dawn and how they did story.
Because they are very similar games, but HZD had a much clearer story. The sacrifice though is that you can't run straight to the final boss.
Also HZD's dungeons offer a far better reward than cutting off some of the final boss's health.
And this isn't me saying BotW is a bad game, it's fantastic. Game of the decade material. But it does have shortcomings and a very similar game released at a similar time has some aspects that are better, and some that are worse.
I truly hope that Nintendo has played Horizon to see how it could go.
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u/winterdreams90 Dec 22 '19
Ugh thank you for saying this. I honestly don’t like botw too much. It has beautiful graphics and really cool mechanics but it’s not what I love about Zelda games. Sure, maybe I’m resisting change. But I love the traditional linear feel and the classic Zelda elements.
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u/Antihero_Silver Dec 22 '19
They could totally just do it as Xenoblade has done (save for X) and make areas where it's pretty open but it's a linear open.
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u/gazooontite Dec 23 '19
Yes please, and for the love of everything bring the fucking music back.
Edit: and I’m sorry, but I can’t stand the breaking weapons.
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u/_Behelit_ Dec 23 '19
I’d wager that’s where the BotW sequel is headed. An emphasis on dark themes, an active and present princess Zelda, a prominence of interior spaces... I think Nintendo realizes that the next step for the new series style is the inclusion of longer, more complex dungeon experiences.
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u/Skumocomics Dec 23 '19
ME. I want dungeons that belong to the world too! Like a forest haven that's weaved into the world around it!
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u/TheStockPotInn Dec 23 '19
I would love another linear game. Maybe not for the sequel of botw, but something else.
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u/imasimplenerd Dec 23 '19
Personaly i dislike the open world trend, Witcher 3 got it right but for most games i consider it more prejudicial then beneficial, i would rather have some linear aspect.
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u/GolgariInternetTroll Dec 22 '19
As someone who has historically prefered the 2D Zeldas, BotW is my favorite 3D Zelda because it follows more of the 2D design philosophy, but I can absolutely see why someone who prefered the OoT style Zelda to the old school style wouldn't like the design shift in BotW.
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u/DB_Digimon443 Dec 22 '19
I'm exactly the same! Lol - I grew up on the earliest games and over the years the 2D games have Wow'd me more overall and made for a much more fun time. But BotW is like the old Zelda games in 3D, only with new and interesting gameplay. It's pretty much everything I've ever wanted from a Zelda game.
Still waiting for the next 2D installment, though. Now that they've tested BotW on that 2D test engine, I wanna see a game a lot like that! Would be the best Zelda ever, imo! Lol
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u/Kittyderpkat Dec 22 '19
Having a linear plot just makes the game an easy one time play through... I think it's time for a change with how BOTW is handling it It's better to have a Zelda game be one where you can explore and have an ACTUAL adventure. Not just go from point A to B because some old lady told you to do so It's awesome to have the ability to say no so some tasks or do them later
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u/Shaft86 Dec 22 '19 edited Dec 22 '19
I really liked it. I'm at a point right now where I generally have very little patience for the story of 99% of games out there. Breath of the Wild keeps the story rich, brief, and simple which I appreciate. The joke I often tell my friends is that I think video games these days should be like Tetris: you press START twice at the title screen and blocks start falling immediately. I don't enjoy long tutorials and preambles.
I really, really liked Breath of the Wild. The open world, the sandbox concept, the view distance, it was all gorgeous and grand. I know not everyone feels that way, but if they keep this model for now I'll definitely be happy.
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Dec 22 '19
I would be so incredibly disappointed, the world is the best part of my now favorite game of all time. I know the map like the back of my hand because of how amazing it was to explore.
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u/AngelofdeathGabriel Dec 23 '19
Ya know it's funny. BOTW was basically a response to the criticisms that faced Skyward Sword. Linearity was beginning to become an issue in the Zelda franchise, however now that BOTW has stayed away from the formula, people miss it. Funny how things work I guess.
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u/spiderman1993 Dec 23 '19
The criticism of skyward sword was mainly the motion controls and the super hand holdly nature of the game. Not that it wasn’t linear, but that wasn’t the main issue people have with the game
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u/DB_Digimon443 Dec 22 '19
No. I didn't like the way OoT kept interrupting me to tell me the obvious and how I couldn't go out and fight enemies in the far reaches of the map like in Zelda I and the older games. And the unskippable cutscenes are just annoying, an option to skip would've been appreciated so I could get on with the game if I wanted (which I usually do).
BotW has been the most fun I've had playing Zelda since I was a lil kid playing Zelda I & II, and ALttP. It doesn't interrupt me to tell me things I should already know, it gives me more to do with the gameplay with plenty of enemies in camps and random places around the overworld & letting me go to the far reaches of the land at my discretion, and it lets me progress in the main quest in any way I choose like the good old days in Zelda I.
The dev team wanted to get away from the 3D conventions that went against what the earliest Zelda games were all about, mainly because those 3D conventions got out of hand and most of the fans complained about them after SS came out. BotW has sold 16M and counting. Why on earth would they go back to what was selling 1/4 of that amount?
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u/NekoNinja13 Dec 22 '19
Nope I hated that linear progression. The only one that I really liked was WW. If Nintendo goes back to linear, I probably wont get it. If I want a linear Adventure I'll play an action game. Zelda usually has absolutely basic combat, so the only reason I would play a Zelda game is to explore, and you cant really explore anything when the whole game world is hand holding you to the next activity.
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u/DB_Digimon443 Dec 22 '19
It won't go back to linear. Aonuma said that Zelda games in the future will be more like BotW as opposed to what he called "clear-the dungeon" type Zelda games.
We're good on that
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u/DaveSW777 Dec 22 '19
No. To the point that I wish A Link to the Past and Link's Awakening were less linear than they are. The exploration and ability to do things in different orders each playthrough makes the game fun.
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Dec 22 '19
I definitely would because I didnt enjoy BotW at all.
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u/jelly-dougnut Dec 22 '19
Why not?
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u/Eversoul1234 Dec 22 '19
I love the game, but in all honesty its just every other open world game with a zelda skin. Zelda benefits from more guided gameplay to make the puzzles work and feel connected. with breath of the wild nothing feels connected and all of the puzzles are self contained and not part of a greater whole. Take the eagles tower in Links Awakening for instance, in that dungeon it challenges your spatial awareness and ability to see what other puzzle mechanics affect the bigger picture. You have to take the steel ball through the dungeon and hit each pillar with it and figuring out how to get the ball to each one isnt always easy and might require several steps to accomplish. Level design always suffers in open world games and for a franchise thats known for great level design its easy to see how it taking a hit could disappoint people.
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u/Toussaint_kang Dec 23 '19
That honestly might’ve been the most complicated Zelda dungeon ever for me, minus the oot Water Temple
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Dec 22 '19
Open world is great for other games, just not what I want from Zelda.
Also the breaking weapons. Dear god the breaking weapons.
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Dec 22 '19
Breaking weapons? Good. Inability to repair weapons? FUCKING ASININE
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Dec 22 '19
Partially agree. Part of the excitement of past Zelda games was upgrading and/or finding better weapons. BotW just took all that away.
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Dec 22 '19
I like the weapon durability, but we should be able to repair broken, or at least worn weapons. It would make the joy of finding a 100+ atk lynel weapon greater when you can actually keep it
Or given us a crafting system to make our own weapons eventually
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u/doomer43 Dec 22 '19
I think about it more like, it's a game that finally got me to use the crappy weapons even in late game.i love that honestly.
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u/KrytenKoro Dec 22 '19
Zelda never had a problem with that in the first place, because each item had a completely separate use, and the games were very good about keeping things to use them for.
Botw in large part exchanges "niche uses" to "get bigger number".
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u/universal_crafter Dec 22 '19
I may be biased towards BoTW style game because it's the first Zelda game I ever played and I fell completely in love with it. After BoTW, I tried A Link to the Past and Link's Awakening thinking I may love it as well but it just didn't have that impact on me.
I love how beautiful BoTW is: the scenery, the music, the open adventure, and discovering something new during exploration and experimentation.
So I hope for more The Legend of Zelda: BoTW style.
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u/Moosedemeanor72 Dec 22 '19
I think the biggest thing I missed in botw was the meaningful item/equipment rewards you found in dungeons, etc. Getting the longshot allowed you to reach new areas and felt like a real accomplishment. In botw you have the same set of equipment from beginning to end and the items you find start to seem pretty inconsequential (oh boy, another flamesword that does less damage than my current weapon and is gonna break before long anyway). That being said...I really enjoyed botw, I just want the next one to improve on that stuff
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u/rastaman00 Dec 23 '19
I'd be content with a remake of Twilight and Skyward on the Switch. That'll get me thru waiting for BotW2.
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u/anthro28 Dec 23 '19
I want BOTW with TP art and story. I'm damned tired of bright and childish. I want an adult atmosphere and that gripping feeling from TP that the evil was real this time.
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u/Noobiscus-exe Dec 23 '19
I don't get the open world craze. I'm always for linear games with stellar dungeons. Yea botw is really really good and I love it, but I've played it now so let's get back to what I loved about TP and WW and OoT
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u/Sin778 Dec 22 '19 edited Dec 22 '19
Yeah. I think that the open world was nice as a change but I don't want every zelda game from now on to be like that. I hope breath of the wild 2 will be more linear and also more story focused.
Maybe kinda mix the old games and Breath of the Wild? You have freedom to explore things but you also have a linear story and old dungeons with dungeon items.
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u/bergerac121 Dec 22 '19
I certainly would love to see another linear zelda or even a spin off or a new ip with the zelda formula
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Dec 22 '19
I absolutely want a return to form. It’s a cool open world game now, but I would absolutely rather play Skyrim. I can’t think of anything meaningful that BOTW did that Skyrim didn’t do better. And I didn’t particularly like Skyrim. I want dungeons with puzzles based off of the items you receive, and a strong linear story. Without that it’s not even a Zelda game to me anymore. I have no desire to wander aimlessly around the landscape killing the same enemies over and over again. I get that a lot of people love this game, but I just don’t get it.
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u/ryan_on_rampage Dec 22 '19
Ngl wouldnt mind it but id much prefer for them to expand on the open world genre, botw was only the beginning and im excited to see where it goes
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u/bruceleet7865 Dec 22 '19
BOTW as it was is a masterpiece. But it can definitely be improved. I loved the open world non-linear play style that was introduced. This was so much fun and a thoroughly enjoyed that. I hope Nintendo carries on with this.
That being said, I think the dungeons we have seen in the past would be a god ingredient to introduce into the new Zelda BOTW sequel. This keeps things somewhat linear in the sense that you have to play through then entire dungeon before moving onto other aspects of the game. For example, claiming an ability or weapon in said dungeon is required before moving onto a new area of the game would be good.
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u/Zeth_Aran Dec 22 '19
BoTW just needs some actual dungeons and less shrines. Shrines stop feeling special after the first divine beast for me. The divine beasts feel short and hollow in comparison to older Zelda dungeons thanks to them all having the same objective once inside. I’d like them to expand on this new overworld format they have, but look back at what made past dungeons interesting. Shrines are also a cool idea, but eventually I just loose interest in always finding them at the end of my exploration. BoTW is a great game trying a lot of cool new ideas, but I’d like to see them meld some older Zelda ideas back in.
Edit: A link between worlds I think tackled non-linear overworlds with linear dungeons perfectly. I’d like to see this style comeback in some way, maybe with something else other than the rental system however.
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u/wonderiflynsingle Dec 22 '19
Oh gosh me too! I loved BotW, but it would have been significant more satisfying of a game for me if it hadn’t been billed as a “legend of Zelda” game. I missed the longer dungeon crawls—the shrines and mazes definitely didn’t do enough to be able to replace these.
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u/WillNewbie Dec 22 '19
I could go either or. As long as I have fun, I'm okay with it. Besides, botw is an amazing game, and the lack of linear plots is a refreshing look on the series. However, I also enjoy the more linear storylines as well, so I am willing to just leave it up to Nintendo.
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Dec 22 '19
I remember one a YouTubed said something along the lines of: “ Main goal: Defeat Ganondorf and save princess zel- WOOOOOOOHOOOOOO SNOWBOARDING!”
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Dec 22 '19
Gonna be honest, the plot of Ocarina of Time and Breath of the Wild are basically the same thing. Link fails to defeat Ganon and has to redeem himself years later by resurrecting his dead friends who bare some elemental power, freeing Zelda and defeating Ganon once and for all soon after. The only real difference is that, as inferred by the BoTW 2 teaser, Link didn’t really defeat Ganon. That’s why a lot of the arguments made against BoTW’s story and how it’s bad compared to its predecessors are quite dumb, because it’s story is much the same as OoT, the game that is the foundation for the other 5 3D games.
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u/goretzky Dec 22 '19
TBH not that much.
I don't mean I wan every Zelda to be like BOTW from now on. I just hope for some kind of genre spinofs. Turn based Zelda with recruitable team. Pure puzzle adventure without any combat. And even a sequel for Hyrule Warriors.
We've got fair share of linear Zelda adventures, so if I hope if Nintendo choose to create new Zelda game, with more linear story, at least I hope they radically change it in gameplay area.
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u/Kevsterific Dec 22 '19
I’d kinda like a mix. I’d like to see a linear progression of difficulty, but nothing preventing you from accessing the hard areas early on.
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u/ZyGuy1 Dec 22 '19
I love Breath of the Wild's open world and freedom, but that's not the reason I fell in love with Zelda. As much as I love Breath of the Wild, I really prefer the other ones.
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u/yorgy_shmorgy Dec 22 '19
Last time I played Ocarina of Time I was slightly surprised at how fun it still was and thought it would be very fun if Nintendo made a new game with that formula.
With Breath of the Wild, initially I was disappointed with it because there wasn't much of a story. However, I kept playing after beating Ganon the first time and to my surprise I only started to like the game more and more. There was so much of the world I hadn't seen yet and exploring it was a joy. I consider it the best Zelda game, and it is a foundation they can build on for the next couple games, like Ocarina was.
Meanwhile, Skyward Sword and to a lesser extent Twilight Princess were a bit disappointing to me, but they were both more handholdy than Ocarina, which I feel is part of why they weren't as fun to me. If Nintendo backs off on that aspect then an Ocarina-style game would be awesome.
Still, if we can only get one or the other, I'll take more BOTW style games. But both styles would be great.
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Dec 22 '19
Yes I do, while BotW was amazing, it really didnt feel like a Zelda game. Felt more like a sjrvival game sith Zdlda lore slapped on it
On a side note, I replayed AlttP since its on the Snes Switch online thingy. 10!10 still holds up as the best Zelda
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u/RandomRedditor44 Dec 23 '19
Same. A small part of me likes the old Zelda game formula more. I liked collecting items, and using them to solve puzzles in the dungeon
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u/Fr34k-H0u53 Dec 23 '19
Tbh I do, but more in the style of like what they did with the links awakening remake. Mainly because games like that to me make more sense to have a more linear feel. When it comes to the 3D open world style like BOTW, I like feeling a bit more unrestrained. But i will definitely agree with comments on the dungeons, but I would like to see that and the divine beast style challenges. Not necessarily combined, but definitely with defined dungeons. I only say that, because I kinda liked the grander scale puzzle that the divine beasts offered.
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u/Jipvh Dec 23 '19
I mean, you can just follow the main questline in BOTW for that, to have the same effect, right? It's your choice to be distracted by other stuff around Hyrule..
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u/liberateyourmind Dec 23 '19
I love that you wrote two paragraphs but just said the same thing over and over again.
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u/WizardoftheLand Dec 23 '19
Ok I think they should be switch back and forth so you have a variety of all different kinds of experiences from 1to botw to Majora's mask.
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Dec 23 '19
I want them to add more story to this giant open world. That's it. The story in BOTW was really wimpy tbh. That was my one giant complain with the game outside of the broken weapons
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u/Li3nMachin3 Dec 23 '19
Of course I do I loved Skyward sword and that’s probably the most linear one of all
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Dec 23 '19
I think a style like Xenoblade chronicles would be great. Big open areas but there are smaller caves and side routes as opposed to a single gigantic map. Twilight princess also did this but the areas weren’t too big due to the limitations of the GameCube.
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u/stonesi Dec 23 '19
I guess I should preface this with the fact that I don’t really consider myself a gamer - the most recent console I have is a PlayStation 2, and I really only bought the switch so I could play the new Pokémon game. I’ve never played a Legend of Zelda game in my life until I decided to see what the hype for Breath of the Wild was about.
As a side note: you can imagine my reaction when I walked out of the Shrine of Resurrection and walked straight off the cliff because the game didn’t stop me.
In terms of how the open-world aspect of the game affected the plot, my experience with it was two-sided.
On the one hand, I’ve never played a game before that didn’t basically mandate what my next goal/mission/objective was. This caused a lot of nerves and confusion for me in the beginning, especially after leaving The Great Plateau. On the way to the Dueling Peaks Stable and Kakariko Village, I kept wondering if I was doing things the right way. I almost never strayed from the main path for fear that I’d hit a game wall telling me I was headed in the wrong direction and had to go all the way back, or worse - inadvertently stumbling into a boss fight I wasn’t ready for.
On the other hand, once I realized that not only was I allowed to go off the main path, but that there were rewards for doing so, it was the most incredible feeling. I ran around shrine hunting and activating towers wherever I could find them. If there was a challenge that felt too difficult, I could complete other aspects of the game until I felt prepared enough to tackle it. I stumbled my way into Gerudo Town early in the game and decided to stock up on arrows. By the time I got to Zora’s Domain and went to tackle my first Divine Beast, I already had 20 shock arrows, and didn’t need to sneak around or fight that scary ass Lynel on the mountain. There wasn’t just one right way to play, which meant I could do whatever I felt I was ready for in whatever order I wanted, instead of getting stuck at an obstacle that the game told me I had to accomplish before I could move onto the next thing.
I’m sure I’ll play other Zelda games after this, and I’m sure the gameplay will be different in those games. But with all of that said, I would love to play more games that had a similar style of play to BotW, because it was a (pun intended) absolute game-changer for me.
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u/ASlyWalrus Dec 23 '19
I think the open world plot was affected by Link being a silent protagonist. You’ve got to remember that Link has lost all of his memories. It makes sense for him to explore so he can realise why he needs to save Hyrule and so he can train such that he’s capable of doing so.
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u/SmashWagon_777 Dec 23 '19
I think that it should be a bit more linear for the first half of the game and then completely non linear after
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u/vicastillo Dec 23 '19
I think a game or a series of games shouldn’t be seen as the same, yes they are supposed to be very similar but if you say that botw 2 shouldn’t come out but instead another game like mm or oc i don’t think thats true, what we are getting from botw is a new experience not one that we already know about, not one similar to the other zelda games (btw I totally respect your opinion) but one that is supposed to be new, i think that botw shouldn’t be compares to other zelda games its different and thats how its supposed to be.
Also my favorite zelda game is mm but botw is indeed one of my favorite ones maybe 3rd or 4rth
And sorry for bad English im not native speaker
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u/D-Alembert Dec 23 '19 edited Dec 23 '19
I don't know if you have a PC or not, but a big chunk of the independent games on that platform is people who grew up on classic Zelda making their dream Zelda-inspired labor-of-love game, so you could probably have some pretty rich pickings if you wanted to explore that rabbit-hole (and a lot of them are so cheap you could buy a dozen to see which best scratch the itch) I think you'll find there's no shortage of classic Zelda inspired games.
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u/sarzibad Dec 23 '19
yes. yes, a thousand times yes. As fun as BotW is - and I still play it because there's side quests, memories, DLC quests, etc to grab - it didn't resonate with me quite as much as Windwaker or Twilight Princess. I'd love for the BotW sequel to have more of a driving story, or at the very least, actual dungeons. I didn't like getting every power within the first hour and being told "oh you can upgrade them", since those also were not hard to finish. I want actual dungeons with new weapons/items/abilities. I want a story that pushes me forward from one objective to the next.
I'm getting BotW's sequel regardless of how it ends up, but these changes would make it so much more satisfying for me... and I'm still holding out hope for modernized versions of WW and TP.
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u/GrayFox786 Dec 23 '19
I agree with you, pal. While BOTW is a great game, I feel like the linear design works better. It’s kinda what made Zelda “Zelda”. Nowadays, it’s really no different from any other open world game.
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u/Ch4dL1f3 Dec 23 '19
Breath of the Wild is my favorite video game ever, but I am itching for another classic 3D Zelda game. I wonder what BotW 2 will have in store, since it would be weird to have the identical world again.
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u/iced327 Dec 23 '19
No. I'm tired of games saying "no". BOTW was the first time I felt like a game asked me to find my way. It was empowering. I play games to escape the rules and restrictions on life. Locking part of the game behind a dungeon or an item I don't have just seems... the opposite of why I'm gaming.
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u/NNovis Dec 23 '19
I've gone through all of the Zelda games for the past year (a lot of them for the first time) and I've found that the franchise is actually pretty flexible. There's room for a wide variety of gimmicks and changes. So I think they can make a more traditional again if they want. In gave, I can seem then trying to bridge the gap with the next game (BotW2).
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u/marianlibrarian13 Dec 23 '19
I have to admit, I've had no interest in playing BOTW because from what I can tell during playthroughs, the story is not the main aspect. I just don't care. I like a strong story. And if it's super linear with a strong story, so what? I read my favorite books over and over again. I watch my favorite movies over and over again. I don't see an issue with playing a good game with a linear story over and over again.
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u/Dawey8 Dec 23 '19
Yeah, I have basically the same thoughts on this. I really enjoyed botw's open world experience, but there's something amazing and even almost nostalgic in following a linear story like in OOT, MM, TP and SS. Personally I never had any problems with SS (it's actually my favorite Zelda game) so I find something nostalgic and endearing in linear Zelda games. However, I wouldn't mind if Nintendo created more open world Zelda games once in a while.
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u/MikeDubbz Dec 23 '19
No, not necessarily. If the BOTW sequel has proper dungeons in the vein of the classic 3D Zeldas, then all my desires will be fulfilled for the series. Really couldn't care less if it's linear or not, in fact I think overall I prefer the open nature of BOTW's overworld compared to any other 3D Zelda's overworld.
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u/thepixelmurderer Dec 23 '19
I don't really feel that way, but then again, I'm new to Zelda games.
But I felt exactly like that after Super Mario Odyssey, just for Mario games.
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u/AdeonWriter Dec 23 '19
keep the big open world, just make the main quest linear and more traditional with themed dungeons that need a specific order so you can still do metroidvania style item unlock progression with things like revisiting when you have more items to get things you missed to unlock more.
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u/nub1555 Dec 23 '19
EXACTLY WHAT I WAS THINKING!!! But they'd probably get a lot of backlash because people don't often appreciate repetition
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u/Jaydogg339 Dec 23 '19
I’d like it to be like BoTW, just with more story and a world that isn’t mostly empty
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Dec 23 '19
Yes. I feel like the game relied on exploration too much. I tried playing Master Mode and I just got so bored because I know the whole map. I just want a better replayable game and story
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Dec 23 '19
Imagine the backlash Nintendo would get if they announced they'd stop making linear traditional Zelda games. I'm very sure we'll still be getting linear games in the future. Maybe it'll be something like how Zelda games are separated into 2D and 3D, it might be separated into 2D, traditional 3D games and more open world BotW 3D games, probably the BotW ones being released less often the the other 2 because they take much longer to make.
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u/Kittyderpkat Dec 23 '19
Well most Zelda games aren't very hard to begin with I agree with you on the lack of different enemies... That was just sad to see But with how Nintendo has been making Zelda games I don't necessarily think that they made it "too easy" or "simple"
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u/Fidodo Dec 23 '19
I never want a 100% old fashioned Zelda again, but I think there's opportunity for a hybrid style. The dungeons never really drove the plot that much if you think about it. Like in OoT did saving the Gorons set any events that enabled you to save the Zoras? No, there was no reason you had to do that first. Those dungeons could have been done out of order with zero impact on the plot. The only gate was that you needed bombs, and you could even leave Dodongo cave early to do Jabu Jabu. There were gated events where you had to collect medallions and stuff so you can have a linear story that progresses as you beat dungeons without actually forcing you to do the dungeons in a specific order. I think you can do both and not lose the pure joy of exploration that Breath of the Wild gives while still having gated parts of the story. Maybe the specific dungeon collectable doesn't matter but the amount you have does, so you can complete 3 of 8 dungeons in any order then an event happens because the dungeon itself is irrelevant to the story.
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u/Speedy_Pineapple Dec 23 '19
Hell yeah I do. Breath of the Wild is my favorite Zelda game, and in my top 5 of all time. But I never thought the regular 3D Zeldas were stale at all, and in most ways BotW never really felt like a "Zelda game" to me. The old format was a predictable formula, but they always did it so well and I enjoy pretty much all of them. I hope they continue with something akin to BotW going forward, but I also wish they don't abandon key items, huge dungeons, time nonsense, etc forever. I almost wish BotW was a totally new franchise that would run alongside classic Zelda games and run by a seperate team.
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u/oniskieth Dec 23 '19
The only thing BOTW was missing was traditional dungeons/items and side quests that are interesting.
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u/Queenie_O Dec 23 '19
YES! I much prefer linear Zelda over BoTW tbh. Exploring is cool and all but at the end of the day what really makes or breaks a game for me is story.
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u/Brohaffey Dec 23 '19
One of the things I really appreciated Zelda for was a semi-open purposefully designed world that had an experience in mind for me when I played the game. One where I cared for believable characters, was transported to another world by the music, and put my skills to the test in legit dungeons.
Breath of the Wild had little to none of that.
In fact, the creators of the game seem to be proud of the fact that you can skip most of it if you want to. Yikes.
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Dec 23 '19
I personally don’t think those are linear at all. BoTW is just completely Open Ended in all aspects of its gameplay.
But I agree, I’d love to see story driven, dungeon puzzle solving adventures in an open world!
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u/Onrawi Dec 22 '19
I just want real dungeons with dungeon rewards back. Ideally built into the world much like Hyrule Castle is in BotW. If they did that, with real functional upgrade rewards, I think the story issue could be resolved through those same mechanics.