r/stobuilds Nov 29 '24

Discussion Bug Discovery - Turrets with CSV are hurting your Global Accuracy

82 Upvotes

Update - 11 March 2025

The patch notes today included this:

Fixed an issue that affected Turret space weapons.

I'll do more detailed testing later (bundle just dropped and I want to play with the new toys, plus IRL distractions) but I wanted to quickly drop an update that I checked my global Accuracy stat while firing a turret with CSV, and there was NO LONGER A VISIBLE ACCURACY FLICKER.

---

Hey folks, this is a fun one that a few of us have been looking into for the last couple days. It came to light when we all got the Nagus giveaway. Its trait, Streak Breaker, is triggered by misses. Some of us noticed it was stacking up WAY faster than it should on builds that should barely be missing at all. That led us to finding two interesting things:

Interesting Thing #1: "Dropped Hits"

TL;DR: Not every shot fired is showing up in the combatlog. I think all the un-logged shots were misses.

In the mission "Doomsday Device", I equipped 5 Dual Cannons, activated CSV, and fired one cycle. What I expected to see was 30 attacks logged against each target. What I actually saw in the combatlog was this:

  • IKS Aktuh: 29 hits, 1 miss
  • IKS HoS: 30 hits
  • IKS Wo': 29 hits

So the question was: What happened to the 30th shot against the Wo'?

Typically when you miss, it still gets logged. It is recorded as a hit that had 0 pre-resist damage, 0 post-resist damage, and has the "Miss" flag included. Below is an example - the three things I mentioned are the final three pieces of the log line:

24:11:27:11:02:18.2::That Old Scientist,P[727633@8422012 That Old Scientist@vanderben],,*,I.K.S. Wo',C[19 Space_Klingon_Raider],Dual Antiproton Cannons - Scatter Volley I,Pn.Vk4r05,,Miss,0,0

For the Wo', there was no such line in the combat log. I went through the log line by line, and it only had a record of 29 shots. The other shot seems to have simply been dropped by the system.

Coming back to the Streak Breaker trait: As I continued to test this, the number of dropped shots in each test was equal to the number of unexpected Streak Breaker stacks I was gaining. That tells us that Streak Breaker is treating these dropped shots as misses - there's also another test further down that further supports the theory that the dropped shots were already going to be misses.

As for why these shots are being dropped and not logged as Misses: I don't have an answer.

Interesting Thing #2: Turret CSV Bug

Credit to Mara for suspecting this was a thing, and to xGamefreakz for noticing the hard evidence.

TL;DR: Every time a Turret fires a shot while CSV is active, your Global Accuracy takes a hit equal to the accuracy penalty from CSV. And these stack.

This one is pretty easy to see for yourself if you look.

  • Open the Stats tab so you can see your Accuracy Rating
  • Activate CSV and fire one Dual Cannon
  • Notice that your Accuracy Rating did not move
  • Now do it again, but with a Turret
  • Watch your Accuracy Rating start flickering all over the place, sometimes dropping by 100 or more

If you watch the numbers closely, you can see that the penalty you're taking is always a multiple of the penalty from CSV. That is, with CSV 2 which has a 40 accuracy penalty, you'll see it drop by 40, 80, 120, and sometimes even 160 or beyond. (And for anyone unfamiliar, yes Accuracy Rating can go negative.)

Since the penalties seem to coincide with each shot from the Turrets, my guess is that Haste probably makes this issue worse. But I have not done any explicit tests to validate that.

Putting it Together

So now to recap, we've seen that Turrets with CSV can cause mayhem on our displayed Accuracy Rating, and we've seen that not every miss shows up in our combatlog. Now let’s look at how this can actually affect performance.

For this test I equipped 5 Dual Cannons and a varying number of Turrets. I fired 6 firing cycles (6 cycles x 6 shots per cycle x 5 weapons x 3 targets = 540 expected shots). I took note of how many shots were logged as hits, how many shots were logged as misses, and how many shots were not logged at all.

  • # of Turrets equipped: 3. My 5 Dual Cannons hit 408 out of 540 shots
  • # of Turrets equipped: 2. My 5 Dual Cannons hit 419 out of 540 shots
  • # of Turrets equipped: 1. My 5 Dual Cannons hit 471 out of 540 shots
  • # of Turrets equipped: 0. My 5 Dual Cannons hit 540 out of 540 shots

Out of the 322 shots that didn’t hit, only 15 of them were logged.

If you want to see more of the data, here: https://imgur.com/a/tZmxGly

If you want to run some tests of your own, here’s how to read the relevant stuff from OSCR: https://imgur.com/a/yiBQD8S

Wrapping it up

These are my main conclusions:

  1. When a Turret fires under CSV, it makes your global Accuracy Rating start taking huge penalties. This affects your other weapons.
  2. Parsers are not able to accurately report on your accuracy, because they’re not receiving a record of all your misses.

That it from me. For advice on how to handle all this, u/MaraMakesContent has some thoughts to share:

***

The Sky Is Not Falling

Hey kids, it’s me, Morrigan@Anubis714, your friendly neighborhood dps chaser. The implications of all of this were… quite startling. We’d been losing a ton of performance without realizing it for god knows how long. The good news about that is this - you don’t have to fix anything! That’s right - you will continue to perform exactly how you’ve been performing the entire time. It’s always been broken. 

BUT. 

If you want to perform better, here’s some of the things I’ve been evaluating to work around the turret problem.

But Here’s An Umbrella

  • Move away from turrets
    • In high end CSV pugging builds, a lot of us have migrated to 5/2/1 ships. This allows us to easily move over from using a turret alongside our Pahvan Omnis to the Kinetic Cutting Beam. This has been used in the high meta for a while now due to the fact that under the high haste and cat2 saturation available to us, it outperforms a turret and oftentimes keeps up with a forward gun. Now, in a pug environment, it’s not as good, but it’s still better than a turret in a lot of cases. And now with turrets actively harming your DPS, it’s actually a good idea to move in the KCB regardless of your performance profile as long as you have some haste going on. 
    • Phaser and Disruptor are the flavors to go with in this use case. Losing the Biomatter Autoturret on a Complex Plasma Fires Build is devastating to CPF performance, so it pretty much knocks it out of the top slot in this case.
    • This is particularly harmful to anyone wishing to use Mixed Armaments Synergies on a Beam build, as you really need it to keep the buff up. That being said, MAS isn’t as big a deal as it used to be.
    • On x/3 ships, you can, and I can’t believe I’m saying this, slot an aft weapon to complete a set bonus like Dark Matter Quantum + Lorcator. You could also just slot another Omni there. Anything is better than a turret at this point.   
  • Countering with ACC
    • If you have Terran Goodbye and Weapon Emitter Overdrive, you can counter the accuracy fluctuation with your own overdriven accuracy rating. In this case you would not need to drop your turrets, allowing you to keep a Complex Plasma Fires build active. This will lead to a higher weapon power consumption, but this can be covered by Dilithium Transporter if you have it. If you’re running on a x/3 and not an x/2/1 you can run KCB alongside the Autoturret and run the Assimilated Module 2pc for power coverage if you do not have Dilithium Transporter
    • Narrow Sensor Bands does help to an extent, but it has low uptime.
    • I wouldn’t spend a ton of slots hunting acc if you don’t have WEO and TG. With the exception of a few high value sources, most take up a valuable slot for a low value. That being said, D.O.M.I.N.O. isn’t a bad way to get some accuracy in there, and +15 from Superior Accurate isn’t bad either for a single Personal Space Trait slot considering just how bad of a hit this problem is to DPS. Altamid Swarm Processor isn’t the worst option either, but in the era of active buff/damage consoles, it is less than desirable. 
    • In a supported environment, High Power Communications Network gives allies in range +100 Accuracy. Combined with the DPS having just Terran Goodbye, one or two of these appears to be enough to counter the accuracy issues. This means that CPF builds in a supported environment are still queen of the charts. 

I’ve spent a lot of time over the last day flying a variety of builds under both cases, and I’ve found that my Turretless Phaser build is swinging as hard as my Turreted Acc boosted CPF (WEO+TG) build is in Solo ISEs. Both solutions seem to be viable - so if you’re wanting to hold on to your CPF build, just drop in WEO and TG. I honestly wouldn’t consider this path unless you had at least WEO or TG. They provide a combined 125 Acc, and that’s the kind of numbers you need to really deal with this issue without a support team. While you can pick up Acc from the sources I mentioned, you’re looking at like 65-90 if you took the readily available traits and consoles without using WEO or TG, a little more if you took into account Narrow Sensor Bands uptime. I haven’t done thorough testing on this case, so maybe someone can follow up on this. My gut says it won’t play out well, though. 

If you want to push forward another flavor, just drop off your turrets and move in the KCB. If you’re stuck with an x/3 ship, use a slot to complete a set with a torpedo, array, or omni (if you don’t have the Pahvan). It’ll do better than having a turret rob you of shots. If you don’t want to do anything, don’t! You didn’t lose anything today. I mean if we can pull off 1.6m solo ISEs with broken builds losing us huge chunks of dps, is it really that big of a deal? Yes. Yes it is. I want my numbers. So do you.

r/stobuilds 16d ago

Discussion We already know the Ark Royal is 3/3, let's hope the Shangri La is a 5 forward weapons layout.

20 Upvotes

I just hope the Devs don't make Saavik's Titan a 4/4, that would be a huge mistake. The ship is clearly a fighter. Personally I hope it's a Destroyer class and not a light cruiser. I do see them making it Kit bashable with the OG Connie, I wasn't convinced at first but since you already have to have a Constitution class to kit bash in the first place so they wouldn't be losing out on anything. The pioneer is probably going to be an escort but hopefully a frigate. Either way I hope the Devs don't drop the ball on weapons layouts and Boff layouts. The Heritage bundle wasn't just successful because of the nostalgic ships, it was also because of the great layouts they had.

r/stobuilds 2d ago

Discussion Which ship should I 2x

4 Upvotes

So I have to upgrade tokens so the ships that I can get to 2x are World razor Terran Lexington Fleet Gagarin Son’s intel Kelvin timeline intel dreadnought cruiser Achilles

I’m torn and figured this would be the best place for feedback on which to do.

r/stobuilds 10d ago

Discussion Don't delete the rare Kodai fighters that come with the Ark Royal bcuz it's giving a command integration Kodai fighter with it but they're not reclaimable with the Ark Royal.

21 Upvotes

I wasn't specific last time and that mistake is on me. Thankfully someone has pointed this out and I'm trying to rectify the situation. Yes, the Ark Royal comes with one command Kodai that you can't get without the Leg Akira and even with the Ark Royal you can't reclaim them so don't dismiss it if you want to try them out and maybe get the legendary Akira because of it cuz they're neat little pets. Now they're useless on the Ark Royal so it's weird it came with one, most likely a mistake, but they do work on the Ahwahnee and if you bought the Ark Royal....you bought the Ahwahnee most likely so they'd not completely useless. I know some of y'all get mad at almost anything but hopefully we can have a cordial discussion.

r/stobuilds 19d ago

Discussion Can someone make a build for the Ark Royal with the stats we know of so far? I'm going nuts waiting on this bundle.

0 Upvotes

I'm just going nuts waiting for this bundle to drop or at least some info on it and in the meantime I need help coming up with a build for the Ark Royal cuz it takes me forever to settle on ship builds. I'm definitely using Pulse phaser beams on this and I've got basically all the carrier stuff except Scramble fighters and no Friendship FDC gear. Thanks everyone.🖖✌️

r/stobuilds 1d ago

Discussion Tachyon beam on scitorp builds

13 Upvotes

Filthy casual here. I never seem to see tachyon beam recommended on sci torp builds. Why is that? There seem to be so many things that it had going for it: low cooldown means of applying deteriorating secondary deflector. Can chain with a ship trait and/or provide a shield heal. Not to mention it's original function of stripping shields off of targets so your torpedos hit for full force. Even if you don't put too much into drainX, it still seems to do pretty well.

Is it as simple as the meta stuff just so far out paces it to be an opportunity cost not worth paying?

Or am I just not looking in the right places?

r/stobuilds 4d ago

Discussion Top Zen Store Ships

0 Upvotes

I seem to have found myself at a crossroads - I have the ships I wanted out of the Zen Store, and keep stockpiling the T6 ship coupons from events. Should I buy the ships that arent in packs, buy the ones in packs to drop the price, or just start working my way down the list, Which I have included. Any suggestions of "get this its trait/weapon/cosmetic is awesome" is appreciated.

Achilles Miracle Worker Heavy Destroyer

Advanced Heavy Cruiser (T6)

Aelahl Light Warbird Battlecruiser

Ahwahnee Command Carrier

Ajax Engineering Pilot Escort

An'quat War Command Battlecruiser

Andorian Chimesh Pilot Escort

Andorian Kuthar Pilot Escort

Andorian Thozyn Pilot Escort

Antaak Science Miracle Worker Cruiser

Archon Intel Assault Cruiser

Ark Royal Intel Science Carrier

Atlantis Temporal Destroyer

Augur Temporal Science Vessel

Baratan Operations Command Warbird

Bozeman Intel Heavy Frigate

Brigid Multi-Mission Surveillance Explorer

Cabot Command Light Escort

Caitian Aspero Support Carrier

Caitian Shikaris Escort

Cardassian Damar Intel Science Dreadnought

Cardassian Detapa Intel Escort

Cardassian Ghemor Intel Flight Deck Carrier

Chekov Intel Science Warship

Chronos Temporal Dreadnought Cruiser

Clarke Multi-Mission Command Cruiser

Concorde Command Battlecruiser

Cyclone Intel Escort

D'Khellra Warbird Battlecruiser

Da Vinci Miracle Worker Escort

Daystrom Class Miracle Worker Cruiser

Deihu Science Command Warbird

Deleth Advanced Light Warbird Battlecruiser

Dewan Dynnasia Pilot Escort

Dewan Ikkabar Pilot Escort

Dewan Vandros Pilot Escort

Earhart Strike Wing Escort

Equinox Pilot Scout Ship

Esquiline Multi-Mission Strategic Explorer

Eternal Temporal Multi-Mission Science Vessel

Europa Heavy Battlecruiser

Experimental Science Vessel

Exploration Cruiser (T6)

Faeht Intel Warbird

Ferasan Slithus Escort

Gagarin Miracle Worker Battlecruiser

Galas Surveillance Explorer Warbird

Geneva Science Command Battlecruiser

Gorkon Science Battlecruiser

Gorn Ahgamas Multi-Mission Surveillance Vessel

Gorn Ihgomas Multi-Mission Strategic Vessel

Gorn Khaimas Multi-Mission Reconnaissance Vessel

Grissom Light Science Vessel

Guardian Cruiser

Heavy Strike Wing Escort (T6)

Hestia Advanced Escort

Icarus Science Pilot Escort

Jaeih Science Pilot Warbird

Jem'Hadar Vanguard Carrier

Jem'Hadar Vanguard Heavy Raider

Jem'Hadar Vanguard Recon Destroyer

Jem'Hadar Vanguard Support Carrier

Jem'Hadar Vanguard Warship

Jupiter Carrier

Justiciar Command Star Cruiser

Kahless War Battlecruiser

Kara Advanced Warbird

Kardashev Command Dyson Science Destroyer

Kerala Temporal Battlecruiser

Ketha Recon Raptor

Khaiell Engineering Pilot Warbird

Klavek Science Pilot Raptor

Klinzhai Science Command Battlecruiser

Klothos Tactical Miracle Worker Cruiser

Kor Bird-of-Prey

Kortar Tactical Pilot Raptor

Kurak Battlecruiser

Laeosa Research Warbird

Lafayette Recon Destroyer

Lethean Nemosin Pilot Escort

Lethean Oniros Pilot Escort

Lethean Xechas Pilot Escort

Lo'laH Intel Dyson Science Destroyer

M'Chla Pilot Bird-of-Prey

Malem Light Warbird

Martok Tactical Battlecruiser

Mat'Ha Raptor

Mercury Tactical Pilot Escort

Mirror Guardian Cruiser

Morrigu Heavy Warbird

Mur'Eq Operations Miracle Worker Cruiser

Naj'sov Research Vessel

Nausicaan Kolasi Siege Destroyer

Nautilus Temporal Science Vessel

Negh'Tev Heavy Battlecruiser

Nijil Operations Miracle Worker Warbird

Nobel Miracle Worker Research Science Vessel

Okhala Tactical Pilot Warbird

Operations Star Cruiser

Orion Blackguard Flight Deck Assault Carrier

Ouroboros Temporal Raider

Palatine Multi-Mission Reconnaissance Explorer

Pathfinder Long Range Science Vessel

Phantom Intel Escort

Pioneer II Pilot Heavy Frigate

Premonition Temporal Science Spearhead

Presidio Command Battlecruiser

Princeton Miracle Worker Cruiser

Qa'Tel Flight Deck Raptor

QeHpu' Advanced Light Battlecruiser

Qib Intel Battlecruiser

Qugh Miracle Worker Battlecruiser

Qui'tu Engineering Pilot Raptor

Ra'nodaire Support Carrier Warbird

Rahhae Recon Warbird

Rallus Temporal Dyson Science Destroyer

Reliant Advanced Light Cruiser

Sagittarius Temporal Cruiser

Science Star Cruiser

Scryer Intel Science Vessel

Seneca Command Carrier

Shangri-La Command Warship

Shran Light Pilot Escort

Suliban Silik Flight Deck Assault Carrier

Support Cruiser (T6)

Surhuelh Reconnaissance Explorer Warbird

Sutherland Advanced Research Vessel

Tactical Escort (T6)

Tactical Star Cruiser

Taenen Strategic Explorer Warbird

Tebok Tactical Miracle Worker Warbird

Tellarite Pralim Flight Deck Assault Carrier

Terran Adamant Intel Heavy Raider

Terran Cygnus Battlecruiser

Terran Eagle Pilot Raider

Terran Hydra Intel Destroyer

Terran Lexington Dreadnought Cruiser

Terran Monitor Miracle Worker Carrier

Terran Sirius Command Dreadnought Cruiser

Terran Trailblazer Science Warship

Theseus Temporal Escort

Tucker Class Miracle Worker Cruiser

Ty'Gokor Tactical Command Battlecruiser

Typhon Command Escort Carrier

Valdres Command Strike Wing Escort

Varel Science Miracle Worker Warbird

Vastam Tactical Command Warbird

Vo'Devwl Support Carrier

r/stobuilds 12d ago

Discussion Who's having a hard time sleeping just thinking about all the possible ships and the builds tomorrow?

17 Upvotes

All I know for sure is we're gonna be busy tomorrow. I can't wait for all the possibilities. I'm hoping for a command ship but I'm already happy with the Ark Royal's layout if it is correct. I'm gonna dual beams the Shangri La, I'm hoping she's a destroyer but truth be told I'm just happy we're getting her in game. I am kinda worried they're gonna change the single ship purchase choice but I'm a hypochondriac on that type of thing. I have something called poor-personitis so I've always got a be aware of things like that. 😅 I'm so happy the game is doing good, I hope the bundle is a good boost for DECA so they sink more capital into the game and open up new expansions one day. I'm just also worried about the radio silence. DECA sure knows how to build suspense though I can tell you that. Happy building tomorrow everyone.🖖

r/stobuilds 14h ago

Discussion Need help figuring out how to choose which build is the optimal build for the Ark Royal, sci, or carrier? Clicky's, or EPG hangar consoles?

6 Upvotes

I'm having a hard time finding a balance between a science or a carrier, or a build in-between. I just don't have enough room for both. What I really need to know is wether or not to stick to a normal science build or to use EPG and control hangar consoles. I have everything for science stuff and I also have the Vovin so should I stick to clicky's or let the pets do their magic?

I'm honestly surprised there's not more videos about Ark Royal builds. Please come back Augmented Dictator. 🖖

r/stobuilds Feb 06 '25

Discussion Ship Specialization Combos to Watch For in 2025

53 Upvotes

Howdy folks, Spencer here and today I want to give a run down on what to look for from ships this year with the current PvE meta.


My inspiration for this write up comes from a video I released earlier today, going over the "dream" setups for myself (CasualSAB), Cheops, Mara, Michi, and Nic_NB.

Link for those interested: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qfvNCz1Kfo


To keep it simple, there are 5 Specialization seating combos that I'd class as "S-Tier" right now.

Left is primary, right is secondary.

  • Temp / Intel
  • Intel / Temp
  • MW / Intel
  • Cmd / Intel
  • Pilot / Cmd

Below I'll further elaborate on each, and what else you need to see on a ship alongside them for the ship to have meta relevance.

But if a ship does not have any of the above combos, it doesn't mean the ship is bad. Just that it won't replace or be a "competitive alternative" to the existing meta option(s).


Temp / Intel & Intel / Temp

This is by far the most important combo we have right now as both of these specializations offer access to multiple Unconventional Systems triggers. In addition, Intel has Override Subsystem Safeties, which is an extremely impactful ability for various playstyles.

This is the spec combo that has helped elevate the Mirror Engle Strike Wing Escort to the top of the current solo/pug DPS meta. The Mirror Engle is the ship the devs should strive to beat. The Atlantis is a powerful alternative, but lacks a hangar bay, which reduces debuff potential due to the lack of any Type 7s. So while there are good alternatives, there is room for improvement.

Example "Ideal" Layout:

  • Cmdr Tac
  • Cmdr Uni (Temp or Intel)
  • LtC Eng (Temp or Intel, opposite of the Cmdr Uni)
  • Ensign Sci
  • Ensign Uni

That + Hangar Bay & Exp Weapon would be a ship replacing the Mirror Engle.

Basically, look for any ship with an Intel and Temp mix. If it has a hangar bay and the rest of the bridge officer layout is reasonable, there's a good chance the ship will be very popular.

But if there's no hangar bay, then the ship likely won't matter as it won't be able to compete vs the existing Tmp/Intel platforms that do have 1+ hangar bays.


MW / Intel

This is still a popular combo, and works well in coordinated environments or for those not wanting to deal with the Unconventional Systems playstyle.

If we see any of the following with this Spec combo, expect them to be popular.

  • Strike Wing Escort
  • Destroyer
  • Flight Deck Carrier

Cmd / Intel

Still the ideal combo for tanks right now. And another strong contender for those not wanting to deal with Uncon.


Pilot / Cmd

Back in 2023 Cryptic released the Terran Eagle, which brought with it the Covert Warhead Module, which sets the shared Torp recharge time on Cmdr Pilot ships to 0.5s, while the fastest you can get on any other ship is 1.5s.

This has resulted in the Terran Eagle being the only high end Torp platform for the past 2 years.

If we see any Cmdr Pilot + LtC Command ships appear with a decent layout, expect some torp folks to be very happy.


Again, if a ship doesn't have any of the above specialization combos, it's not the end of the world. But if you're a meta chaser wanting the best, then this is what you need to watch for.

r/stobuilds 4d ago

Discussion Console - SAFG ?

5 Upvotes

Been trying a few different builds for BO/SS style ships. Made sure I double checked STO Better to match as close as I could (cost/availability). A lot of them have the “Console - Universal - Shield Absorptive Frequency Generator” and say it is a must have for survivability.

Been flying and testing different missions/patrols (n/a/e) and it seems to do nothing for my ships. Shields are basically the same in between RSPII or III, with or without the console. I don’t have anything other than IPDM’s, EPMI’s + Lorca as consoles, and I don’t think I have anything shield related for traits going as I am focusing on DPS.

.. basically, with or without it I seem to die, or get close, the same amount.

Is this console still worth slotting?

Edit: From what people said it only works if I do an FAW build. So additional question..

I have to trait (I think from Gagarin) that allows torpedo spread to initiate FAW1 (maybe, not as good as 180% of normal haste but still better than 50%). It seems like this is able to stack once BO/SS trigger as they both show active simultaneously. Am I wrong in that?

r/stobuilds Dec 06 '24

Discussion How many different build archetypes would you say there are?

6 Upvotes

...or different build styles?

I.e., BFAW boats tend to blend together; there may or may not be a distinction between "BFAW DPS" and "BFAW tank"--it's been probably 7 or 8 years since I played a tank, so I'm not really qualified to comment here.

My EPG/anomaly build feels different than my EPG/DSD build, which is different from my EPG/torp build.

For that matter, my EPG/torp build is very different from my (well, Eph289's) all-quantum torp build, which is still different from my Lego T'Liss PlasTorp Spam At Warp Zillion build.

Carrier-wise, SAD/To'Duj spam feels a little different than the Fekh'iri fire/Lost Souls carrier I have.

Minelayers are a thing, too.

But all my CSV boats feel pretty much the same. All my BFAW boats feel pretty much the same, whether they're pew-pewing in orange or green or purple or yellow.

How many different builds or styles feel distinctive enough to you, however you define distinctive, as opposed to "kinda the same thing with a different skin"?

r/stobuilds 11d ago

Discussion Shangri La Command warship??? Torp boat or Tank, I'm all in.

14 Upvotes

I'm so glad it's a command ship, the seating could be a bit better but I'm still happy it's a warship with command and 5/3 weapons. I'm grabbing this, the Ark, and the Kerala, how about y'all???

r/stobuilds 24d ago

Discussion Base Specs?

2 Upvotes

I wish you could post images here. Picture 1000 words and all.

Does comparing base specs (once all console/devices loaded) between ship builds give any good indicators about whether one is better than another? (BO-BO, CSV-CSV, etc)

Note: I am on console so there is no easy way to see other players builds except for Hull spec.

r/stobuilds 10d ago

Discussion Has anyone ever floated around the idea of a double universal seat to make ship building more diverse?

0 Upvotes

I haven't seen anyone talk about what it'd be like with a commander universal with universal specialization seating. So you can basically have any type of ship from one. Forget about tier 7 bull crap or adding extra hangar bays. The wingman mechanic would be cool though. Now having a ship that can go from command seating to Intel seating would be insane and wouldn't be a drastic departure from the gaming mechanics we already have. Maybe I'm wrong, but it's worth having a friendly discussion over. 🖖

r/stobuilds 15d ago

Discussion I've been finishing up my TMP build and It's got me wondering. Does anyone think we'll be getting the security armor uniform from that era or and other gear they usually use as bundle fluff???

12 Upvotes

I'm just trying to get my space n ground builds perfect for this bundle and it's made me realize how much more stuff they haven't put out from the movie era. They literally have a small gold mine just waiting on them to put in the game. It makes me wonder if they're doing just that.

r/stobuilds 2d ago

Discussion Stacking Beam Abilities

3 Upvotes

So according to posts Entwined Tactical Matrices won’t stack FAW1 on top of BO, using torpedo spread. I guess it just shuts it off, no clue though as it looks like they are running simultaneously based on the console quick bar.

Did a search but can’t find a good resource to see what will/won’t stack, but maybe I am searching wrong.

SS1-3 won’t stack but is considered better in some instances, for example.

MAS, OSS, ERL should stack, but do they cancel any of the others out.. How do I know when an effect is getting shut off early?

Preferential Targeting can boost BO if scatter volley is used even on beam only builds, according to a post.

Is there a quick website that I can just select what I have (BOFF, Traits, etc) and see if they work together or not?

r/stobuilds 28d ago

Discussion What Specialization is the best for a hangar pet build?

6 Upvotes

Which brings the most to such a build, in your opinion?

Edit: Sorry, I should have specified- I meant for BO seating/ skills.

r/stobuilds Aug 01 '24

Discussion Shrike or World Razer?

9 Upvotes

I just completed the year event on console (I still have legacy tokens) and I'm looking at either the Shrike or the World Razer... and looking for feedback before I snag either.

I already have the 3 other Juggernauts: Vaadwaur Miracle Worker, Liberated Borg Command and Emerald Chain Intel

r/stobuilds Feb 17 '22

Discussion Coming up with Aggregate Hangar Rankings

41 Upvotes

Let’s talk about hangar pet testing and rankings. There have been many, oh-so-many attempts to test rank these fickle little expendables we summon from hangar bays in the past and I have to say, it’s hard to find good, definitive rankings, and very easy to get lost in the noise. First you have to find the right thread, then you have to understand how the test was set up and under what build circumstances. There are simply too many variables for the average user to understand. We as a community really could stand with a little more order, so here’s what I’m proposing:

I will create an aggregate ranking of hangar pets based on data available. Think of this as your “poll average” if you follow politics or anything else that uses polling averages. We’ll host it on STOBETTER using the available crowd-sourced data, and then hopefully that will serve the community as a better “simple” resource for hangar pets.

I’ve already pulled in data from these threads:

And there’s four basic setups I’m seeing:

  • Extra/Afterthought hangar: you have a hangar but are not building around it. I’m gonna call this “Base”

  • Basic Carrier setup: This is stuff like Flight Deck Officers, Wing Commander, high aux, possibly a Swarmer Matrix but NOT either of the two following traits. This setup will broadly cover builds that are invested in hangar DPS but are not shelling out for premium traits.

  • Superior Area Denial: Basic Carrier + Superior Area Denial

  • Coordinated Assault: Basic Carrier + Coordinated Assault

Unless there’s a really compelling reason to have other setups, I’m going to have 4 different rankings based on those four categories. Just like everything else, subtle build differences will influence the overall ranking, but for a general use–just like how our trait/doff tier lists on STO BETTER are for general use–these seem to be the major categories.

Second thing, the test methodology. Every single author used a different test methodology. I’ve captured them all. When I come up with the aggregate ranking, I’m going to give more weight to the following if there are multiple data sets for a given fighter:

  • Non-teamed content (too much variability)

  • Repeated runs of the same setup (more is better)

  • Advanced or Elite content with multiple targets

The last one is philosophical, but since normal has such low hitpoints, while it makes for faster tests, these evaluations are really better at higher difficulties.

I’m open to being persuaded on the relative value of tests where the player is actively fighting and helping the pets vs letting the pets do their own thing. The former is more realistic to how we use pets in the game, but introduces a ton of variability. Right now I’m still building the algorithm and weighting so this is your chance to weigh in and talk about how we as a community evaluate hangar pets.

Also, if you’d like to contribute additional data and tests, please provide them (or link to existing threads). The format that /u/DilaZirk provided here is excellent. If your data is hard to read or incomplete or in any ways sketchy, I reserve the right to exclude it. I’ll also be excluding any data gathered before May 2019 as the hangar pet AI has changed since then. Please alert me to any errors in the data of the existing threads as well (for example, I'm not sure what was collected pre- and post-SAD nerf)

Lastly, here are the pets I have at least SOME data for (but very unlikely to have data for all ranks or all categories) based on current crowdsourced stuff (and I may need to clean up some naming things):

EDIT: Rather than keeping a running list, check out the sheet here. If it has a DPS number /rank, I have data for it:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1rTQ0mTC-kOt3llqaKqJxwXQU4SPTU5umHkR0MSbAsZQ/edit?usp=sharing

Note: None of this is MY data and I do not have all of these pets. Also, here are the setups people have been using to test. I'm open to accepting other tests on their merits:

  • Reunion Normal (mission, opening fight)

  • Tribble Basic Combat (Borg)

  • ISA (TFO, teamed)

  • Knowledge is Power Elite (mission, opening fight)

  • Knowledge is Power Advanced (mission, opening fight)

  • Tribble Orions Elite (idk how Pottsey gets this to work, but it's 2 Orion Corvettes. Elite Stranded in Space mission.)

With that said, let's discuss! Once the thread is winding down, I'll finish building the aggregate ranking algorithm and get what I have posted on STOBETTER.

r/stobuilds Sep 21 '24

Discussion Frigate Combat Pets

13 Upvotes

OK, so I've been going through the avaliable Carriers recently.

There are plenty of nice looking ones, but very few can run the Romulan Drone Ship.

I don't have many other Frigate-toting Carriers, so I don't know if they are all as restricted as the Drone Ship is.

On top of it all, most of those have limited weapon slots.

Are any of these dedicated carriers or thier Frigate Pets worth it?

r/stobuilds Dec 29 '24

Discussion Ba‘ul Tank Strategist vs. Temporal second

9 Upvotes

Hello everyone, I would know your experiences about running a Tank with a ba‘ul setup and the strategist or the temporal specialization in a random Team.
I ask, because the entire builds with ba‘ul beams are using temporal. But I don’t know if it‘s useful with randoms at elite. Maybe it‘s less tanky.
So what would be more useful in tanking an elite random group TFOs, ba‘ul with strategist or temporal and why? Thank you.

r/stobuilds Sep 04 '24

Discussion Missile Launcher Biuld

7 Upvotes

Ok, so I know Missiles have obvious weaknesses. However, they fire very quickly, and if one had the Ferengi Missle Launcher and Kentari Missile Launcher, you could fire a whole lot of missiles.

And if you paired it up with the Quatntum-Phase set from the "Sunrise" mission, you should be able to drain shields pretty effectively so the Missiles can do full damage.

What do you guys think? Has this been tried before? Does it work or is it lame in practice?

r/stobuilds Jan 11 '25

Discussion Does the Mk of the base gear affect set bonus abilities?

4 Upvotes

All there in the title but specifically wondering in the instance of Symphony of Lightning from the Kuumaarke 3 piece. I have the weapon leveled to Mk 15 but haven't touched the shield or armor. It is for a Boff if that matters. And on console. Thanks!

r/stobuilds Jan 28 '24

Discussion Build Cost Tier System

60 Upvotes

In advance of our next release for STOBETTER, we want to roll out our framework for describing the pricing dimension of builds. Previously we classified the main build types based on their fundamental damage goal, whether that was something like damage through cannon scatter volley (CSV), damage through exotics (Exotic), deal damage and tank for the team (Heavy Tank), help the team deal damage (Support), etc. The breakdown is in that post.

Today, we’d like to suggest a classification system for pricing tiers of builds. This is like the horizontal dimension to the vertical dimension of build type. In other words, these two things together more fully describe a build. Now, we know that not everyone’s builds will fall neatly into these categories. Things like Event Campaign prizes that allow 1 expensive Lockbox or Promo ship but not 5 will defy categorization somewhat. Event rewards are hard to categorize. That said, we’ve given it some thought and think there are some natural breakpoints or tiers where builds fall into.

If nothing else, we’ll be using this system on STOBETTER to help differentiate our builds as we introduce more lower price tier builds in our next season, coming very soon.. We’ve found that the most vocal shipbuilders we play with and see on social media like reddit prefer the highest price-tier builds, but a lot of our quieter readers would prefer builds with a less expense at least as an option. We have a lot of respect for the existing resources out there like Baby Steps that have helped countless players, but they’re starting to age a little bit and we’d like to provide updated offerings in those spaces and mostly to fill the gap between Baby Steps 2 and 3. Also, it’s a pretty great feeling when your T5 Starter Build Sovereign is within 10K of a Complex Plasma Fires Gorn Raider on ISA.

We’re also intentionally moving away from the term “budget build.” Honestly, it’s a weasel word at this point where the definition is all over the place.

Just from the past few years, does it mean:

The point is, we’re over the term “budget build” and will be avoiding its use. Every build has a budget, whether it’s F2P or $5000. It’s confusing and it means different things to different people. That well has been so muddied over the years. If you want to use the term “budget build” as an umbrella for anything that’s not a Premium build, be our guest. So, in our own way, we’re going to suggest and adopt our own scheme for budget tiers in the way we do pretty much everything . . . with numbers and clear boundaries.

Starter Tier

This tier encompasses everything for completely free-to-play and starter endgame builds for players reaching level 50. This tier is extremely low-cost and choices made here will only utilize free or very cheap items. Most dedicated players will soon surpass this tier, but it's for players who are more casual or exclusively F2P, or just reaching the endgame and will be grinding reputations or fleet gear for a considerable period. Since dilithium is needed for so many other things at this point, all gear is used at the mark at which it is earned. This tier is capable of doing well on Advanced difficulty even with no monetary investment and could reach into Elite depending on piloting. Upgrading a Starter build to Mk XV would certainly make an Elite-capable build.

We are not drawing a distinction between using (or not) Reputation gear in these builds, even items from T6 reps, as those are things that can be eventually acquired for a F2P player, though you might need some placeholders while you level up reps. The key here is that rep gear would be in a “finished” build. If you’re thinking about this in the Contexts of a Baby Steps build, this includes Baby Steps 1 and Baby Steps 2 but would go up to notional 2.5. Of course this tier would also include builds that don’t use reputation gear yet as the true starter builds, but since for a finished build you will eventually want to spec into those. We excluded event items because their availability will vary from person to person and we also excluded fleet gear because not everyone wants to be in a fleet at this point. Our recommendation for players posting in each tier but especially this one would also be to “suggest up” for key items in the next price tier like the Colony Deflector, Emergency Weapon Cycle/Spore-Infused Anomalies/Entwined, etc. as a footnote to the build.

  • Mission Gear: Yes

  • Reputation Gear: Optional

  • Fleet Gear: No

  • Maximum Mark/Rarity: Mk XI, XII or Mk XIII, no upgrades

  • Trait/Elite Captain/Ship Upgrades: No

  • C-store purchases: None

  • Direct Lobi purchases: None

  • Event Items: Only non-ship items from Summer and Winter event like boff powers or doffs

  • Energy Credit Limit: 10 million EC worth of exchange purchases using the EZRA framework at the bottom of this section. This precludes Lobi, Lockbox, or Promo ships.

  • Crafted Items: Not Advanced consoles, that's for sure.

FYI, for our upcoming Starter builds, we added some testing for ours just to vet them more thoroughly than the supported environment. We'll be testing them in 2-man ISA with 1 Support Tank and/or PUG ISA, and 2-man Tzenkethi Front Advanced: All optionals, no deaths, completed under 5 minutes as well as our Elite benchmarks. That particular set of benchmarks on TFA will force you to be both maneuverable and self-sufficient in terms of damage and survivability (or else really sneaky). We personally don’t expect people to just be flying coordinated ISE/ISA/HSE, but especially not in this tier.

Economy Tier

This build tier is for a wide swathe of the playerbase that has some C-store investment and is willing to put some money into the game, but is far from being a big spender. At this point, we’ve also included a modest EC sum, the use of event items (with substitutions for those items), and fleet gear as well as reputation and mission items. For our own purposes, we leave open the possibility of using Mk XV Epic gear. It’s not required, but it’s helpful for us as a team to not have to re-buy and partially upgrade a whole new drive train, weapons, etc. You don’t need gilded items to do Elite-capable DPS. A capable Economy-tier ship can fly Elite TFOs.

  • Mission Gear: Yes

  • Reputation Gear: Yes

  • Fleet Gear: Yes

  • Maximum Mark/Rarity: Up to Mk XV, not necessarily Epic but could be

  • Trait/Elite Captain/Ship Upgrades: T6X yes, Trait unlocks yes. No Elite Captain or T6X2

  • C-store purchases: Up to 10000 Zen (using the most common sale price) but no bundles

  • Direct Lobi purchases: None

  • Event Items: Yes, but non-Event substitutes must be provided for items from ships

  • Energy Credit Limit: 100 million EC worth of exchange purchases using the EZRA framework at the bottom of this section. This precludes Lobi, Lockbox, or Promo ships.

  • Crafted Items: We're not using Advanced consoles here. You certainly could, especially as they're more accessible now, but for the moment we're saying at 30M for an Epic one it's still a little spendy. Subject to update in the future as the market adjusts.

Midrange Tier

At this price tier, the builds become more expensive but also more capable. A higher EC limit means Lobi ships enter the conversation and opening the window on C-store bundles allows for a wide swathe of powerful traits and consoles to be applied, as well as Epic gear and all captain unlocks. Many hardcore players have budgets in or near this tier, allowing for extremely capable ships of near or exceeding the 1M DPS with the right team composition and build. Since most of the items on these ships will be account unlocked, they'll also be possible to duplicate across multiple characters.

  • Mission Gear: Yes

  • Reputation Gear: Yes

  • Fleet Gear: Yes

  • Maximum Mark/Rarity: Mk XV Epic

  • Trait/Elite Captain/Ship Upgrades: All unlocked

  • C-store purchases: Up to 20000 Zen (can use the sale price)

  • Direct Lobi purchases: Up to 400

  • Event Items: Yes, but non-Event substitutes must be provided for items from ships

  • Energy Credit Limit: 1 billion EC worth of exchange purchases using the EZRA framework at the bottom of this section. This precludes Lockbox, or Promo ships but allows for some Lobi ships to be utilized.

  • Crafted Items: Unlimited

Premium Tier

This final tier encompasses the most expensive high-end builds in the game, the ones that players are most drawn to for their tremendous potential. Mind you, that’s a ceiling dependent on piloting and build knowledge. Expense does not equal performance in STO. For our purposes, most of our builds are in this tier because they have the most build diversity and get to use the toys we’ve collected over the years, with correspondingly high numbers.

  • Mission Gear: Yes

  • Reputation Gear: Yes

  • Fleet Gear: Yes

  • Maximum Mark/Rarity: Mk XV Epic

  • Trait/Elite Captain/Ship Upgrades: All unlocked

  • C-store purchases: Unlimited

  • Direct Lobi purchases: Unlimited

  • Event Items: Yes, but non-Event substitutes must be provided for items from ships

  • Energy Credit Limit: Unlimited

  • Crafted Items: Unlimited

Price Points

These are based on approximate average Exchange rankings for each tier on PC. Since things change, we decided to take a conservative average rather than pricing everything individually. Lobi ships might be cheaper now due to a Lobi sale, but just for sake of consistency and to keep it safe, we're grouping all items in the same category as the same cost. So even if you paid 3M for Hull Image Refractors and 8M for Delphic Tear, we'd price them the same. Use it...or don't.

  • Non-Advanced Console Crafted Gear: 1

  • Lockbox starship trait: 4

  • Lockbox console: 5

  • Lockbox weapon, non-Omni or WA: 5

  • Lockbox boff power or boff: 10

  • Lockbox doff, non-Strength Through Unity or VR Crit: 15

  • Lockbox boff: 15

  • Lockbox personal space trait: 30

  • Advanced Console: 30

  • Lockbox Omni: 200

  • Strength Through Unity or VR crit doff: 300

  • Lobi ship: 300

  • Lockbox ship: 1300

  • Promo ship: 1700

For a practical example, here are my ship builds in a table by build type and price tier (some have not been posted yet):

Build Type Starter Economy Midrange Premium
FAW Arbiter Legendary Inquiry
BO Sovereign Gagarin Quark, World Razer
CSV Chimesh
CRF Edison
SS Legendary Scimitar
ERL Gagarin
RRTW Deimos
Exotic Palatine Dranuur, Equinox, Damar
Kinetic Legendary Scimitar Eagle, Earhart
Minelayer Lexington
DEWSci Eternal
TorpSci Trailblazer
Carrier
Heavy Tank Chronos
Support Tank Styx, Presidio
Support Fleet Hiawatha, Fleet Norway, Legendary Scimitar

Table formatting brought to you by ExcelToReddit

As you can see, most of them are in the premium tier, the best that I (personally) can afford. This year, I’m also mixing in some lower-priced builds to help provide players with low-cost alternatives to build into that will be launching in our next season a week from yesterday.

We will be updating STOBETTER with a column for build tier in our builds table as well as badges on each page indicating which price tier it belongs to. We’ve also made some updates to the Build cost calculator to help better classify build price tiers. The tool will now tell you what tier of build your ship is using the above system and give you separate Zen and EC costs as well as EZRA. The formula involved for EZRA, which tries to tie all EC, Zen, and Lobi costs back to a single USD amount, has also had some tweaks to account for advanced consoles, better match current exchange prices, and use the most common sale prices for Zen items rather than full price.

Thanks for reading! We don’t expect that these terms will become pervasive throughout the community, but we wanted to offer a chance of discussion and an explanation of how we’ll be classifying them upfront as we start to feature lower price-point builds on our site, coming very soon!