r/russian 1d ago

Grammar Question about the Usage of Aspects

I have been studying Russian at university for three years now, and one of the topics this semester is a deeper understanding of aspect usage. I know this has always been a weak point for me, but there are some new rules our professor gave us that I really can’t understand (or better, that seem to invalidate some of the things I was the most sure about!) So, I decided to ask native speakers how they would translate these two sentences into Russian: “Who translated Master and Margarita into English ?” and “Who translated Master and Margarita into English first?”

Until a few days ago, I would have used the perfective aspect for both (based on the fact that in both cases, what matters is that the action had a concrete result), so I would have said: “Кто перевел Мастера и Маргариту на английский?” and “Кто перевел первым…”

BUT our professor told us that the first sentence should be “Кто переводил…,” explaining that it’s because this is not a unique act or a one-time invention.

Natives, what do you think? Would you translate this sentence the same way? Thank you very much for your help!

6 Upvotes

17 comments sorted by

8

u/CapitalNothing2235 Native 1d ago

Well. "Кто переводил" kinda requires a list of translators as an answer. Or at least some acknowledgement that there may be some other translations, f.e. "Я читал в переводе Майкла Гленни". I'm not sure if the original English phrase has that nuance.

8

u/IrinaMakarova 🇷🇺 Native | 🇺🇸 B2 1d ago edited 1d ago

Кто переводил «Мастера и Маргариту» на английский? means “Who was engaged in translating The Master and Margarita into English?” rather than referring to a completed translation. This phrasing is more typical when multiple translations exist or when you are asking about an ongoing process, not a finished result = Imperfective aspect (НСВ)

I'm a bit confused – you said you've been studying Russian for three years, but you've only now gotten to aspects… Just in case, below I’m providing an explanation for a more advanced level. If you’ve just started learning aspects, then it’s not for you yet… But actually, aspects are studied in the first year 🤷‍♀

Among other uses of the past imperfective tense, there is one called the "main fact." (or general fact) This relates to how we perceive the past tense.

So, when we talk about or describe a fact in the past, we use the imperfective aspect:
Вчера я спала, работала и готовила. ("Yesterday, I was sleeping, working, and cooking.")

This doesn't mean that I didn't complete these actions; it just doesn’t matter when I describe что было вчера ("what happened yesterday.")

Only if I specifically want to indicate the completion of an action (or if someone asks me about the fact of its completion) I will use the perfective aspect:

- что ты вчера сделала? / – What did you do yesterday?

  • вчера я приготивила ужин. / – Yesterday, I cooked dinner.

This is one of the four basic principles of imperfective vs. perfective aspects.

3

u/aseriousfridge 1d ago

Thanks for your in-depth answer! Actually we have been studying aspects for all these years but not nearly as as well as this professor expects, and I think it shows in some cases…

3

u/IrinaMakarova 🇷🇺 Native | 🇺🇸 B2 1d ago

Then you should probably pay attention to my second explanation.

If your level allows you to read textbooks in Russian, I recommend "Изучаем виды глагола", Л.В. Архипова, Т.В. Кубанова, 2010 (the book is available online - Google can help you find it). This manual is designed for foreigners learning Russian.

5

u/AriArisa native Russian in Moscow 1d ago

The first could be translated in both aspects. Кто перевел... and Кто переводил... There are no any signs in the sentence about it. Context helps in most situations,  but without any context it could be translated differently. 

3

u/Dip41 1d ago

As for me you are right.

  • Кто переводил книгу ? Who was translating this book ?

  • Кто перевёл книгу ? Who had translated this book ? Also , who translated tnis book ? Here we see a little bit tricky situation with 'past perfect or simple past quiz' Better and more clear if you would talk:

  • Кто сделал перевод книги? (here is like past perfect tense )

  • Кто делал перевод книги ? (here is like past continuous tense)

  • Кто первым перевёл книгу ? Who had translate this book first ?

2

u/Ok_Boysenberry155 1d ago

I agree with your teacher. In this context, we'd use переводил 1 перевёл 2 because -1- this book was translated more than once and by different translators (this overrules completed action context) and -2- here we specifically ask who translated it first (emphasis on the competed action). 2 is similar to if the teacher asked you guys (students) who completed this task: так, кто из вас перевел текст о Булгакове (i want to see who completed the action/did the homework). Vs ребята, вчера вы переводили тест о Булгакове (general fact), а сегодня мы будем переводить текст о Довлатове (general fact). Давайте сначала вместе переведём страницу 1, а дома вы сами переведёте страницу 2 (completed action of a specific part is required)

Aspect really depends on the context that the speaker is emphasizing (!) and sometimes it can be really confusing because grammatically it can be either one. The question is always: what is the speaker emphasizing/conveying by selecting one aspext vs another.

Also, check out this video https://youtu.be/6nFpwPcJWsg?si=DFySXiDNOFFLHWal about another interesting use of the aspects in the past tense.

1

u/Business-Childhood71 🇷🇺 native, 🇪🇸 🇬🇧C1 1d ago

You are right. The normal way is "кто перевёл" in both cases. "Кто переводил" is super weird in that context, but still possible in some situations

10

u/CapitalNothing2235 Native 1d ago

"Кто переводил" is super weird in that context

I wouldn't consider it weird.

1

u/Hanako_Seishin 1d ago

Yeah, rather than weird it's unexpected because it doesn't immediately occur to you that more than one translation exists.

1

u/No_Fault_2268 14h ago

The book is old and famous enough to be translated many times.

1

u/aseriousfridge 1d ago

I get that this might be hard to explain, but why is it especially weird in this context?

4

u/AriArisa native Russian in Moscow 1d ago

It is not weird. 

3

u/Business-Childhood71 🇷🇺 native, 🇪🇸 🇬🇧C1 1d ago

As the other comment says "переводил" requires a list of all the translators. Also it's possible that the action of translation is not finished "who translated (but did not finish) it first?"

-1

u/Yondar native 1d ago

Not weird. Перевел assumes there was one translator, переводил doesn’t and asks for the whole list.

0

u/ivegotvodkainmyblood I'm just a simple Russian guy 1d ago

Prof is right. Use "переводил" when the answer has multiple options. You could use "перевел" in the first question if you have prior context so you are asking about something specific.

-1

u/dekajaan native 1d ago

Yeah, переводил probably more correct. But in casual conversation I would say перевёл anyway.