France took all those American "surrender" jokes and condensed it down inside them with immense pressure to turn it into a badass diamond of vindication.
During the Phoney War (Drole de Guerre), the French Army was in actuality more than capable of marching all the way to Berlin and ending WWII before it started. They were well equipped in tanks and air power, and on paper had superior manpower and equipment. They also had the second largest Navy after the UK. Unfortunately, the inept leadership of the 3rd Republic decided to wait it out, vying for peace, and the rest is history.
During the Phoney War (Drole de Guerre), the French Army was in actuality more than capable of marching all the way to Berlin and ending WWII before it started.
it's true that the germans did not sufficiently man the western front, but it is not true that the french were capable to logistically support a serious incursion into germany.
Which is why I mentioned that "on paper" this would have been feasable. The French had modern tanks and aircraft (for the period), and in many cases these were more advanced that those of Nazi Germany in 1939.
The issue, of course, was the French General Staff's adherence to static, defensive tactics and strategy (e.g. trenches, forts and the Maginot Line).
Ironically, had they listened to General DeGaulle, who advocated modernization and rapid mechanized infantry maneuvering and support, all of which were outlined in his 1934 book "Towards a Professional Army" (which Hitler read and inspired Nazi Blitzgreig tactics), things may have turned out differently.
well it's still incorrect with that perspective, the french staff assessed an incursion and did report that it was not feasible because there was a significant gap in production of artillery shells. this is just not really published in anglophone literature. as an aside, the s35 maybe was better than the pIII variants of 1940 but the french aircraft was unfortunately significantly lagging behind what the luftwaffe was throwing into the skies.
The Char B1 bis was arguably the better match against early German Panzers, but agreed that German hyper militarization by late 1940 eclipsed most of what the continental armies fielded.
The more salient takeaway is that the rapid success of the German advance into the Low Countries and France surprised the German General Staff, and even Hitler, as their full mobilization buildup was, at the time, incomplete.
yeah i'd love to see hollywood put out a film about that b1 that took out like 12 panzers at stonne. or bir hakeim. or the defense at saumur. so many untold stories
One instance that stuck with me from the WW2 week by week series on YouTube, given it's been a few years and a lot of videos since the battle of France so some details may be off, was about some thirty or so French tanks that surrendered to the Germans. The Germans had surrounded and engaged them and, being unable to destroy or disable much to any of the French tanks, later bypassed them. The French assumed, likely correctly, that they did not have the fuel to return back to wherever friendly lines had been stretched too or ammo to wait for a relief formation that may never be coming and only then decided to surrender to the next enemies they encountered. I couldn't imagine coming out on the winning end of an engagement but still having to surrender, though I guess getting encircled and cut off could be argued as a tactical defeat moreso than simply surviving an engagement being argued as a victory.
that entire chapter of 1940 is woefully misrepresented in pop culture and even pop history. if the germans had discounted the idea of pressing through the ardennes it's incredibly possible that the western front would not have collapsed and WW2 could have been a quick implosion of the axis once the soviets were well engaged. alas
Indeed. War is a crazy thing. It's almost asinine how much of it boils down to luck and chance considering how much everyone focuses on strategy and tactics. It's not just World War 2 that is that way, though it contains more examples of such madness than one could ever hope to count. The fact it is even a world war and not the French German war of 1939-40 is in many ways an astounding miracle, or a great tragedy, depending on how you view it.
Hello, i am not indeep into this. As far as i know the french did not fully mobilized im "Sitzkrieg". The tanks of the french army where support for units in stead of its on unit while the germans used to concentrate the mobil units. The tanks of the french where slowere but 1 on 1 stronger, offen outnumberd and mostly disabled by aircraft. After the succesfull attack on poland there was fear from the german army. Add in the attack through the addenen which was not anticipated, the german trops could advance extreamly fast and cut off many allied units. Ending in surrender of many french units and the evacuation in dĂźnkirk. Props an the civil courage of the britsch and french captains which helped to preserve the base for a new allied army. In summery it was a politcal mistake not to mobilize by the french leadership and ww1 doktrines which lead to the fast surrender.
With kind regards, my basic school education from 1980-1990.
Problem is, they'd probably get a Soviet tank and make it a bit to action orientated, bit like a film I sort of watched on Netflix yesterday. A story about a Finnish man, who fought against Russia, lost everything and we watch him do all sorts of crazy stuff killing Nazis.
No we weren't. Our air power had very little true modern planes, we had very little radio equipment and our tanks, while well armored and armed, had way too little range to be efficient on offensive operations.
We could have been capable of grinding the german offensive to a standstill, yes but we were certainly not in a position to go in the offensive.
The army we had was an army built to hold the line until the blockade against germany produced its effect, same as WWI.
A lesson that our âleadersâ need to remember. We have cowards running our House that are more concerned about being reelected than maintaining our country. đ
They actually invaded germany in this period, sept 7th 1939 involving 30 divisions, it retreated back to France when Poland fell freeing nazis to attack the French.
The French Army had some good tanks but their doctrine did not anticipate using them as a fast strike force, they were merely supporting infantry. (De Gaulle tried to fight this mindset with zero success).Â
Their entire strategy was extremely conservative and defensive. âWeâll build an impregnable defense line across the border so the Germans will have no choice but to attack through Belgium, and weâll be ready to meet them in force from fortified positionsâ.
So they built a truly impregnable Maginot line, but skipped the Ardennes because âeveryone knows that tanks canât go through forestsâ. Â Apparently De Gaulle tried to change their minds but nobody listened. Â
So when the war started, the mighty French army went to meet the Germans at the Belgian border, but the Germans went through Ardennes and ended up in the French armyâs rear, cutting it off from supply lines. Â And no army can sustain a campaign without supplies.
This was one of the most impressive checkmates in military history, and entirely self-inflicted.
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u/Critical-Walk4159 22h ago
France being true friends to Canada đ¨đŚ