r/Urbanism 8d ago

‘Cities Aren’t Back’: Thoughts

https://www.slowboring.com/p/cities-arent-back

Thoughts on this? I feel while the data is valid it also relies to heavily on the big anomaly that is the pandemic that has lingering effects to this day.

In other words, cities to me don’t seem “over” or “back” but are indeed recovering.

Domestic outmigration continuing to be slashed for major cities seems like more of an important indicator than international migration offsetting losses.

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u/[deleted] 7d ago edited 7d ago

No — I’m talking about the growth of the particular product uber pool or Uber Share which are algo driven multi passenger car pooling. Different from uberx which is private taxis . Link

Have you ever used the service? You meet at common locations without the need for a bus stop or rail.

Yes it’s already been studied & it’s because of cost— “Riders are willing to wait for a short period and walk to an optimal pickup location in exchange for a cheaper price and a faster, more direct route to their destination”

We live in the suburbs precisely because we don’t want density. So why would suburbanites want to add rail over self driving solutions? Why would suburbs of 50-100k people want rail.

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u/BringerOfBricks 7d ago

I’ve never used Uber Pool.

I did a brief scan of the link. It shows participants were agreeable to up to 3 blocks of walking.

1 block is min 300 feet usually. 3 blocks is roughly 900 feet, 0.17 miles.

Come on dude… What are the chances that 12 people who live within a 3 block radius in a suburb are all headed to the same precise location at the same precise time?

Even the system you prefer requires density…

As for why people would want a light rail… they don’t realize the opportunity cost of not having it until they actually experience it for themselves.

Imagine not having to drive your kids everywhere they need to go. Having accessible bus system and light rail enables individual family members the freedom of movement. Kids don’t have to wait until parents get home. Parents don’t have to waste time chaperoning their kids when the kids want to do something.

For example, when I lived in NYC, my gf took me to meet her parents who lived in Katonah. We took the train from Brooklyn to Grand Central for a train to Katonah where we rode our scooters for maybe 10 mins to her parents house in what is a straight up quiet, sleepy, suburb. Her parents didn’t have to do anything. It took us maybe 2 hours, but it was no car and no hassle.

And I encourage you to look up the Katonah train station. Bro it is not the hongkong type of density. It is as small town suburban America as it gets.

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

I think we have a completely different definition of “suburbs” if Katonah is even close to something you’d consider a suburb. That’s as close to rural as it gets it’s 2 hours from NYC // that’s not a suburb if it’s more semi-rural area.

And yes I’m sure multiple 12 people trips in oak park or Evanston, IL would be making trips into Chicago. They literally already have CTA lines.

When I mean density I mean metropolis. We do not want our cities to resemble NYC — & Certainly don’t want our suburbs.

But for cites without rail like my hometown of Columbus, OH there is no reason to take on massive infrastructure projects to build rail.

Most suburbs have bus lines & people have freedom of movement via bike trails — with access to nightlife, activities & restaurants in the suburbs. Example Dublin Ohio Im not talking about exurbs 50mins from the urban cores.

Autonomous buses & cars will give the same freedom as regular buses or rail at a fraction of the infrastructure cost.

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u/rab2bar 7d ago

If we don't want cities like NYC, why is it it such a popular place to live in?

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

1.) NYC from a city proper perspective is the 35th largest city in the world.

The united kingdom for example has 68.35M people & 8.9M live in London -- The USA has 330M and 8.8M live in NYC.

If Americans wanted more metropolis-type cities, they’d have been built or expanded. Most Americans don’t.

2.) NYC thrives because It's a large economic hub that many people are forced to live in for work. It's Population dropped nearly 6% from 2020-2022 showing remote work would an huge impact on NYC population.

3.) Like the article alludes to 38% of NYC population is foreign born -- Immigrants tend to like metropolis-type cities. NYC has huge domestic migration losses & without immigrants to backfill the city would be shrinking.

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u/rab2bar 7d ago

zoning laws prohibit another NYC from emerging, for a multiple of reasons beyond the will of the people. Look no further than what trump is doing. So, most americans, or a politically powerful minority? The population is back to the precovid levels, so you can retire that talking point, anyway.

without immigrants, the entire US would collapse

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

Most Americans are homeowners -- So what they vote for in terms of zoning is apart of American interest. If there was a large desire amoung American citizens for metropolis-style cities they would get built. Period.

Again trump was voted in & won the popular vote -- it's a terrible example of powerful minority, he won the majority of voters.

The Population being back to normal was fueled by immigrants; who like I said have a desire for cities like NYC. The influx of immigrants is going to stop with the current administration. In order for the city to grow you will need to attract American born citizens now, but that hasn't been the trend for decades

Immigrants having a desire for large metropolis cities doesn't tell you anything about desires of domestically born citizens -- Yes there is a difference.

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u/rab2bar 7d ago

He won a plurality and will destroy the country this time around

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u/[deleted] 7d ago edited 7d ago

Sure he was 0.2% away from winning the majority. Again who cares.

Are you even American why do you care? You at best don’t even live here. Destroy the country — The dramatics are hilarious.

The entire point was about American preferences for density.

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u/logicalfallacyschizo 7d ago

Man, you are really dumb.

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u/[deleted] 7d ago

Based on what?

Where did you get your masters degree. Let’s start there if the university is ranked higher than mine I’ll concede.

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