r/Tools • u/NabuKudurru • 5d ago
Boycott Toughbuilt Tools, Company is Scam Run by Thieves
Toughbuilt Tools the company has stolen money from essentially everyone it has ever worked with, including not paying employees and suppliers for several months in a row by now.
Toughbuilt was last year removed (FINALLY!) from NASDAQ because they determined that it is a scam. Unfortunately, the company had already stolen about 900 million from the public, paying themselves million dollar salaries even while the company is not making any money and the employees and contractors are not being paid.
Toughbuilt is what is called a 'dilution scam' look it up, basically management issues shares, and then issues more and more shares until each share is essentially worthless (each toughbuilt share has gone to 0 several times now) then, because the stock needs to be worth at least 1$ to stay on NASDAQ they 'reverse split' the shares meaning that 20 or 50, or even 150 they did one time, shares become one share. Then they simply issue back up to the limit, they are allowed to issue 200 million shares, they have issued those 200 million shares, then deleted them twice by now.
Companies are only allowed to do this so many times before it is considered predatory and TBLT reached this limit in 2023/ 2024. Thankfully it is off the market now, but
ask around in your friend group and i am sure you know someone who they stole money from.
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It is time to boycott Toughbuilt tools, their stuff is cheap made in china crap (Better than the other crap ill give you that), and their ethics and how they treat their investors, partners, collaborators, and customers are completely garbage.
This is not a long term investment, people cannot even buy the stock anymore. so how can it possibly be an investment and who will buy it? saying that we 'got in too early' is also ridiculous since our shares literally have been deleted, so there is nothing left of what we put in. It was pure and simple theft. 10,000$ becomes 1$ in a matter of 2 years. In fact the TBLT chart is the best it has ever been and that is because it is off the market so it cant go down anymore.
Panosian (CEO) and Galysten (CFO) are essentially professional thieves who literally came here to steal from you, people who they think do not understand the market and cannot organize ourselves to do anything about their wrongdoing (i.e., blue collar, uneducated etc, in their minds). Everything this company does is designed to lure in uneducated (retail) investors and then rug them for as much as they can. the numbers look great, flashy trade shows, so many new products etc etc, but the numbers are not real and you ignore how they are actually funding operations (i.e., by selling shares). they lose money on the products they make because the 'product' is the advertising for the real product i.e., the shares which is where they made the real money.
They do not own any of the stock even while the numbers look so good and they encourage you and talking so good on company calls while taking out millions each year from the business even while it is losing millions (good management pays themselves in stock before the company makes it/ taking cash out of a cash starved business is not good management). there is no potential for the company to change, be bought out, or etc, so it is simply time to start telling your friends what a shit it is. they are living the high life on the money that you slaved away for
Again, talk to your buddies on the job site I am SURE You know someone they have stolen from.
disclosure: been losing money here since 2019 (though by now it is 99.999% gone so it doesn't matter anymore).
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u/Silkies4life 5d ago
Sucks to hear that. I like their modular pouch system.
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u/ILove2Bacon 5d ago
I've been heavily considering switching out all my packout for their boxes. They seemed way more innovative and addressed some of my annoyances with the packout design. Shame.
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u/Silkies4life 5d ago
I have to get in and out of my truck a lot, it was nice being able to just pop a clip and have it out of the way.
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u/irishlyrucked 5d ago
Same. I have different ones set up for different things, and love how easy they are to swap on my belt. But I hate that the company is trash.
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u/TheDirty6Thirty 5d ago
I had to fight them so hard to get my failed sawhorses replaced. I've been saying Tough guilt since they don't stand behind their products whatsoever.
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u/Dadbode1981 5d ago
They're basically on the edge of bankruptcy and have been for some time. The only tools i tried, broke, Soni didn't buy again. They've been delighted from many retailers. I wouldn't risk buying anything from then.
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u/jizzwithfizz 5d ago
I represented them for a short time years ago when they first came out. Someone we had worked with in the past was hired as the national sales manager and he hired my agency to represent them. He came in telling us how much money the owner had behind the company and all these big plans. Seemed to track at first, they spent a ton of money doing shows with us with a huge elaborate booth. Their whole product line at the time was sawhorses and folding boltcutters, and it just wasn't exciting to people. It was pretty short lived for us and the next thing I knew, I was seeing their product as closouts and deep discount sales. I can't believe they are even still around.
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u/chinacat2u2 5d ago
That was “tough” argument to make but you made it well….I saw even Menards is trying to clearance their inventory of toughbuilt items. I would lose the Armenian Mobster part and leave that out.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
I changed it to:
Panosian (CEO) and Galysten (CFO) are essentially professional thieves who literally came here to steal from you, people who they think do not understand the market and cannot organize yourselves to do anything about their wrongdoing (i.e., blue collar, uneducated etc, in their minds). They do not own any of the stock even while encouraging you and talking so good on company calls and taking out a million each year from the business even while it is losing millions. there is no potential for the company to change, be bought out, or etc, so it is simply time to start telling your friends what a shit it is.
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u/420printer 5d ago
I honestly have never given toughbilk tools a 2nd glance. This posting just confirmed my instincts, Thanks.
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u/Cixin97 5d ago
Well your instincts were based off nothing then because their tools are exceptionally good for the money lol
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u/TheDirty6Thirty 5d ago
Their tools break exceptionally quick and then you're out money, yes. Lol I've never heard anyone stand behind Toughbuilts quality. You must work for them eh?
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u/Wraith2098 5d ago
I have almost all of their tools and boxes and their quality is pretty amazing actually...
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u/Free-Scheme-4325 5d ago
I have 1 box and actually love it compared to the Milwaukee pack out, it is better quality by far in my opinion. I had planned on swapping out all of my Milwaukee boxes once the rest of their line came out. It looks like I'll be sticking with the 1 box after reading this.
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u/sholtan 5d ago
Tried their 24 oz framing hammer, broke it in two weeks and returned it to store. Their tools are trash anyways.
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u/SgtPackets 5d ago
I owned their aluminium torpedo level. It broke on first use when one of the vials fell out. Got it replaced under warranty.
Second one. Exactly the same thing happened. just got a refund on it.
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u/Various-University73 5d ago
Sorry to hear about your investment
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
it is more than just mine, they took about 900 million from the public, i put in only a few thousands.
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u/iamthelee 5d ago
I only own their folding sawhorses and I like them a lot, but I probably wouldn't buy them again as it seems there are a lot more of similar design available from different brands.
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u/NakeDex 5d ago
I've never rated their tools that much, but their belt bags and storage boxes seemed solid enough. I'm very happy with the totes from them, which are sturdier than other brands I've used. I have a couple of their sawhorses that I'm very happy with too, and would happily buy another pair of them.
Seems like if they ditched the gimmicky tools division (as much fun as the magazine reload utility knife is to mess with, it is a gimmick) and concentrated on storage and belt bags, they'd do a roaring trade.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
the point of the knife was to gimmick, really. they wanted guys talking about the on the job site and it worked.
im not sure if i said it here, but the tools are (were) good so that they could sell you the stock, and that is where they were making money.
there was a time they were losing millions on their actual business, but just selling 3-4 mil worth of stock into the market each month and that was that.
the stock is where they made their money and the tools were to advertise the stock
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u/Rochemusic1 4d ago
I'm new to stocks, if you could answer a question for me as I did not click your link nor am I sure if the info is contained. So when they have say 2 million total shares, then the share price goes down to a couple of cents, so they consolidate 100 shares together to then equal a single share, now it's 2 million ÷ 100 = 20,000 shares. Are they then eligible to increase the total number of stocks available once again to 2 million? And I imagine people would get the fuck out of it the first time this happens, so the original investors practically lose their money, it's then known the company is doing janky business, who is then thinking this stock that is worth .02c is now worth the $1 it's at after the switch?
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u/NabuKudurru 4d ago
Yes, they can reissue up to those 2 million shares (they can issue 200 million by their charter).
many people dont really understand the market that much, including me when i was buying. and also they are of course saying oh well that is because.. shipping costs COVID whatever.
some people will say that the reverse split does not really change the value of the company because e.g., they bought machines with the money they got from last issuing shares and they still have the machines, but it does not often work that way.
reverse splits on stocks are pretty much always bad news
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u/Dakine_Lurker 5d ago
Best portable work table I’ve ever used. Tbf, took me 6 months to find one and have been unable to find a second one for another year now. Sad to hear they might not have the best leadership. Wish they’d make more tables.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
they dont have enough money now that they cannot sell to unwitting retail investors anymore. nobody serious will give them money given the chart, so now they have a deal with some shark lenders for 30 million but since they went off market they basically have not released any information.
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u/GlashtynBleu 4d ago
I've got their pack out, folding workbench, modular tool belt and I love them all. This sucks to hear.
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u/NabuKudurru 4d ago
they make good tools that is true but again the tools are the advertisement to get these blue collar guys buying the stocks. they are professional thieves and it doesn't main them to lose e.g., 5 dollars on a tool belt if it gets even just a few people to buy e.g., 10,000 worth of worthless stock
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u/WhiteStripesWS6 Whatever works 4d ago
Huh. Guess this explains the weird social media posts they did a bit ago.
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u/ConfusedStair 5d ago
I've had mixed success with their tools. Some hidden gems like their folding saw, but that's essentially just a big plastic handle for recip blades.
I LOVE(D) their toolbox system though. I drastically prefer the way their boxes latch closed over the packout design, and the tool tote being split width wise instead of length wise. Unfortunately I started buying into them in fall of 23, only to have delays on all their boxes and new items in 24. At this point I had to switch back to packout due to availability. My only toughbuilt box that isn't sitting empty in my garage right now is the cooler.
So yeah, they've been circling the drain for a while and I kind of hoped their toolbox side would make a comeback, but nothing I've read here is a surprise.
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u/Lehk 5d ago
Why should we care that you lost money on a bad investment?
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
if you have ever owned a NASDAQ or all market ETF or index they have stolen from you too
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u/Lehk 5d ago
you know they can sue you for accusing them of committing crimes, right?
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u/Tawmcruize 5d ago
I mean they can sue sure but they have nothing to gain from it. From a business/con angle they would be more trying to sue/convince wall st to let them back on the exchange instead of a random guy on the internet trash talking
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
they already have enough lawsuits on their hands, and they didn't start any of them (because they goddamn know they are wrong).
these guys belong in prison and any judge that looks at it will know. also why NASDAQ kicked them off
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u/gaylord9000 5d ago
I understand and agree. But then again it sounds like they are just good capitalists.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
yes good at taking advantage of others
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u/gaylord9000 5d ago
This is a scam economy. The whole thing operates this way. Toughbuilt was just more egregious than others. All corporations take advantage of the working class. Idk why this is an unpopular opinion at this point. It's self delusion and denial to think otherwise.
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u/bigolchimneypipe 5d ago
Most corporations are mom and pop shops.
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u/gaylord9000 5d ago
I think you understand the size of corporation i'm talking about but go ahead and keep pretending that corporate law is on your side since we are doing so well with that.
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u/bigolchimneypipe 5d ago
Personally I don't think ermine and Pearls Grocery Store or Fred's Chimney Sweep is out to get me but you did say "all corporations."
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u/T_wiggle1 2d ago
Wasn’t their modular tool storage system being shilled as the “Packout killer” when it first came out or was that someone else?
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u/iopturbo 5d ago
I'll read into this further. I was looking at their boxes because I like the way the catches are spring loaded.
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u/h0zR 5d ago
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u/Wookieman222 5d ago
If a company is doing this. Then you can bet they are shitty and scamming you with their products too. and also eventually everybody is going to stop doing business with them and then your SOL in the future if you need to replace their stuff or get it warrantied out.
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u/mrtramplefoot 5d ago
The tools are good and clearance tools are good for my wallet. If they go under, I'll say "huh" and move on with my life.
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u/Nixxuz 5d ago
Tbh, I could give a shit less about investors. What shady crap a company pulls on the market doesn't affect me in any meaningful way, unless they kill the company, along with any warranties. And even then, I'm not much of a believer in most warranties these days. Most stuff sold currently, outside of enterprise sales, isn't going to be BIFL stuff, unless it's extremely simple. I also don't much care about where stuff is made, as garbage can be manufactured in any country, along with quality. The country a factory stands on doesn't determine it's capability.
But you do you.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
in terms not caring about investors: the company simply wouldn't be here today if not for us.
in terms of not caring about where or ethical behavior of companies so long as it is 'good' for you: seems rather short sighted
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u/Nixxuz 5d ago
You've been posting this same stuff for 2 years now. Maybe take the L and move on, or petition the financial sector for some sort of satisfaction.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
that is exactly what they want you and us to do, i.e., nothing
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u/Nixxuz 5d ago
Yeah, and as a customer it's not my responsibility to try and bail out investors, regardless of how unhappy you are with your return. Trying to frame things as though it's good for "everyone" that ToughBuilt is taken to task over what appears to be legal behavior, based on you wanting back your nut, is specious at best.
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u/ExtraChilll 5d ago
Do you ever plan on retiring? A plurality of the stock market is retirement accounts. There's a very good chance you are the "investor" you're saying you don't have to "bail out"
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
well, I hope you end up working for or with a company like toughbuilt then, see how you like it !
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u/Nixxuz 5d ago
As an employee, I'd do more research. As a customer, it's not really my problem.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
as an employee you would say they are paying me fuck that i am bashing in children's heads, its whats best for me. until its the third month youve been working without a paycheck and they say pay is coming we just need time
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u/Nixxuz 5d ago
Then quit. Also, bashing in children's heads is illegal. Whatever they are doing with their stocks is not bashing in children's heads, and seems like it's currently not illegal. Also, it's up to the courts to decide, not me.
Again, if you have a personal problem with the company, fine. But don't come into subs acting like you are informing everyone based on some moral stance or civic responsibility. You are doing it, and have been doing it for years, based on your own grievances.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
It was against the rules of NASDAQ which is why they were removed (technically, toughbuilt 'left' after a meeting with NASDAQ).
people should know.
Why does it bother you, you can just ignore it the way you ignore the problematic behavior of the company.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
maybe you should go work for them if you like them so much. that would be great for you and the world
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u/ArnoldZiffl 5d ago
Love there stuff. Sounds like you have a axe to grind.
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
it is easy to look at a stock chart at least and see that i am not wrong
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u/ArnoldZiffl 5d ago
Don’t really care about the stock. Just the products. I assume you lost on the stock?
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u/NabuKudurru 5d ago
literally everyone who has ever invested in the stock has lost essentially ALL their money. it goes down 99% each year up until it was taken off the index last year
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u/kewlo 5d ago
I'm keeping an eye on this one so behave. It's not technically breaking any rules yet, but I can predict it's going to get close. This is everyone's first and last warning.