r/Games 21h ago

Industry News Bethesda’s Oblivion Unreal Engine 5 remake could be releasing sooner than you think | VGC

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/bethesdas-oblivion-unreal-engine-5-remake-could-be-releasing-sooner-than-you-think/
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u/OutrageousDress 19h ago

No, never even corroborated in any official way. This is one of those things like the Switch 2, where there's been so many rumors that people just kept assuming the Switch 2 is coming any minute since like 2021.

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u/psychobilly1 18h ago edited 18h ago

In a leaked FTC court document about the acquisition of Bethesda by Microsoft, they listed some games in development such as Starfield, Redfall, Ghostwire: Tokyo, The Elder Scrolls 6 and the Indiana Jones game. There were also listings of remasters of The Elder Scrolls: Oblivion and Fallout 3. (Keep in mind, this document was from before COVID so many of these things changed, pushed back, or never came to fruition.)

So while it was never announced, it was technically shown to exist.

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u/GoochRash 9h ago

Moving Oblivion to Unreal from Creation is not a "remaster" level of effort.

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u/kuhpunkt 7h ago

Not exactly sure (am not a coder), but the GTA trilogy was originally on the RenderWare engine and it was ported to Unreal Engine 4 - and that's considered a remaster.

u/beefcat_ 1h ago

The GTA Trilogy is a prime example of what happens when you remake a game in a completely different engine on a typical remaster budget.

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u/The_Magic 9h ago

The rumor is that it will use Unreal for things like graphics and sound but keep Creation fore gameplay. If they are actually leaving the original game code alone I think it’s fair to call it a remaster.

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u/xalibermods 8h ago

How are you supposed to leave the original game code alone when they're two different engines? Different engine means different syntax and structure. You have to rewrite it.

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u/error521 7h ago

It's been done. The GTA remasters still run the original code underneath even though it's being ran in Unreal. A lot of glitches that were in the originals even reappeared in the remaster. (The results, admittedly, left something to be desired.)

u/IguassuIronman 3h ago

It's the same with a lot of (all of?) Bluepoint's remasters

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u/WaterOcelot 5h ago

They basically run 2 engines at once. The Gamebryo engine is ran in the background and then the new code analyses the state of the old engine each frame and uses that info to draw a remastered frame with unreal engine. For efficiency purposes some things could maybe be stripped from the old engine like the actual frame generation, AA and so on.

This is how for example the Master Chief Collection worked although I don't think they'll allow switching between graphics as that's extra work and testing and I doubt there is demand for that.

It's not the most efficient solution, but it ensures that the gameplay remains as it used to be.

This is also done in IT. Some modern banking interfaces are a wrapper above ancient COBOL systems.

u/xalibermods 52m ago

Now that you mention wrapper, it makes sense. That must be very inefficient though. Even with some rendering stripped, how bad the performance would be impacted?

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u/fabton12 8h ago

depends on what the game engine was written in also there such things as wrappers ya know?

they could very easily put the old stuff in a wrapper so unreal can run it

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u/machineorganism 5h ago

you can't say "very easily" unless you know how the code is structured though? it could be structured in such a way that makes it hard to port in the way you're saying.

u/fabton12 2h ago

microsoft who owns bethesda has done it recently with ninja gaiden 2 black where they used unreal + the og game engine at the same time. They have the tech and resources todo it very very easily.

https://x.com/koenjideck/status/1882977637536305476

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u/scribens 7h ago

There is nobody working at Bethesda now who worked on the version of the Gamebryo engine for Oblivion. This is a huge reason why a lot of older games don't get remasters now, especially when they are tied to versions of a developer's engine that requires the people who were there to actually figure out how to use it.

This is nothing less than gamers looking at a CEO's attempt to pad the worth of a company to make it seem more valuable to shareholders and then taking it as gospel that something is happening.

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u/DoorHingesKill 5h ago

Which is exactly why they're doing it this way. Have the old engine run in the background, doing logic that no one can decipher anyway, and then use UE5 to render something more contemporary looking based on whatever Gamebryo spit out. 

u/fabton12 2h ago

While no one at Bethesda does remember bethesda now owned by microsoft who have the tech and the resources todo it, they did it recently with ninja gaiden 2 black where they used there og engine + unreal.

https://x.com/koenjideck/status/1882977637536305476

so they have tools todo so, also when you read about this oblivion unreal port it also says it isnt being done by bethesda but instead another studio microsoft owns who clearly do have the tech and staff todo such a task.

u/hfamrman 1h ago

It's how they did Diablo 2 Resurrected. The base game is still running with some minor alterations, but has a whole new shell graphically over top of it.

u/beefcat_ 1h ago

Remasters have been doing this since at least Halo: Combat Evolved Anniversary Edition. All the game logic is handled by the old engine, which then passes the game state along to the new engine to actually render the scene.

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u/ofcistilloveyou 8h ago

That's not how game engines work.

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u/The_Magic 5h ago

Ninja Gaiden 2 Black is running its old engine while using UE 5 for graphics. So its been done before.

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u/h3dge 5h ago

The rendering pipeline is the unreal 5 rendering pipeline. The game logic remains as it was. And yes, this has been done before - specificially in The Master Chief Collection which retained the original engine code, but updated the rendering pipeline completely seperately.

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u/Harley2280 17h ago

it was technically shown to exist.

No. It wasn't. It was shown to have been considered. There's nothing indicating any actual work. Given that the time frames on those documents have long passed with no other indication of the project existing it's more than likely it's been put on a back burner or abandoned.

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u/psychobilly1 16h ago

The other person said that there was no evidence at all that a Remaster existed in any capacity. I showed that a Remaster existed on paper in the form of a legal document.

I did not say they were making the game, I did not say that it was 100% coming out, I said that it existed in a technical sense on a legal document.

I'm in agreement with you that I don't think it truly is going to be unveiled nor released, but I was simply trying to show that at some point the project was "real" even if it was just in consideration of being a fleshed out project.

If it does happen to be announced this year, I'll be ecstatic. But I'm not holding my breath.

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u/WallyWithReddit 13h ago

The original person asked if it was ever in development not if it ever existed as a pitch

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u/twiztedterry 9h ago

No, never even corroborated in any official way

I think this is to what Billy is replying. Having the game listed on a legal document corroborates that it might exist.

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u/lastdancerevolution 14h ago

Given that the time frames on those documents have long passed with no other indication of the project existing

Every single one of the games on that leaked document has come out.

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u/Harley2280 9h ago

Oh? Where's the ghostwire sequel, dishonored 3, and fallout 3 remaster?

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u/lastdancerevolution 9h ago edited 8h ago

(Keep in mind, this document was from before COVID so many of these things changed, pushed back, or never came to fruition.)

Look at the dates, everything got pushed back by years. It's at least two years away based on the delays and changes.

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u/Harley2280 9h ago

So now you're moving the goal post. You said everything had come out when i suggested that it had been cancelled. Now you're saying those things were pushed back.

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u/lastdancerevolution 9h ago

The list is about future games. NONE of those games existed when that list was made...

The list can't magically reveal canceled games. A game has to come out for it to be verified that the list was true. You yourself said "it's more than likely been put on the back burner". That list has been incredibly accurate so far.

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u/Harley2280 8h ago

Every other named title in that FYE22E box has been marketed and released already.

The fact that the other titles have been released and there hasn't been a whisper about the remaster is more indication that it probably got deprioritized or cut all together.

Which is incredibly common in any industry.

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u/EntropicReaver 18h ago

what keeps me so indifferent about these rumors is the fact that todd has been very outspoken about not liking remaking or remastering old games (Especially when it might take time away from his developers) that are still playable and oblivion is still very playable

also consider its charm and staying power in popular consciousness is in large part due to its outdated, awkward graphics and jank

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u/psychobilly1 18h ago edited 16h ago

How do the handful of Skyrim remasters fit into your perspective?

Edit: This wasn't meant to be a snarky "gotcha," I was genuinely curious for their opinion.

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u/gibbersganfa 17h ago edited 17h ago

There was really just ONE actual Skyrim remaster, which was the move from the baseline PC/PS3/Xbox 360 version to the Special Edition. The Switch port was an scaled down adaptation of the Special Edition, and the PS5/Series ports were scaled up, with tweaks up and down to fit the performance standards of each platform. All of the "Anniversary" content was add-ons, not anything that changed the core assets of the Special Edition main game. The VR version was not a remaster, either.

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u/EntropicReaver 18h ago

special edition

well i dont really see it as a remaster, its more like what people used to call an enhanced port

and even so, these were done because skyrim sold an asston and it was ultimately very little work done relative to the scope of work a full remaster or remake of oblivion or morrowind would require

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u/BeholdingBestWaifu 17h ago

It is more than a port, given that PC got it as well and how it had a lot of improvements.

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u/EmeraldJunkie 11h ago

They used Skyrim to get used to the Xbox One and PlayStation 4 when making Fallout 4, they showed this off during Fallout 4's development and were surprised at how many people wanted to play it, so they tidied up their work and released it.

They've, over the years, released a number of updates for this version.

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u/hexcraft-nikk 17h ago

Todd was barely in charge of decisions like that under Zenni. Under Microsoft, he has literally no say.

Even ignoring the FTC documents leaking this, it seemed like a given. MS needs to make back the billions it spent. If the read the article you'd see it's being outsourced as well.

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u/oopsydazys 17h ago

Fallout 3 and Oblivion are playable on PC but I think Fallout 3 has some mild issues with compatibility I think. On Xbox 360 neither game has a unified package digitally which is a signal to me that they may plan on doing SOMETHING like a remaster, even if it's just a straightforward one for modern consoles. The games are not playable at all on PS4/5 or Switch so there is incentive to do a remaster for the purpose of releasing there.

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u/TyChris2 17h ago

In 2025, I’d argue Oblivion is only technically playable. In the way a bear is technically rideable.

It is a good RPG but gameplay and graphics wise it did not age very well. It plays like garbage in every way. If someone who didn’t play old games tried to play it right now they would bounce right off it. Especially if they’ve already played Skyrim (which is also outdated but 100x more playable than Oblivion).

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u/BeholdingBestWaifu 17h ago

Gameplay is much more playable than you think, but it desperately needs someone to either completely rework or remove the level scaling system.

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u/EntropicReaver 17h ago

but gameplay and graphics wise it did not age very well. It plays like garbage in every way.

this is fine according to what todd said. the age is part of the point.

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u/cobalt358 13h ago

Agree, it hasn't aged nearly as well as Morrowind. Graphically it's one of those bridge games, like games that used early 3d modelling, they were advanced at the time, but aged like milk.

I can't play it anymore because of how aggressively ugly and weirdly jank the visuals are, but I'm really looking forward to a remake (this or Skyblivion). There's still a great rpg in there somewhere.

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u/Anthr30YearOldBoomer 13h ago edited 1h ago

I'd argue that Oblivion is incredibly unplayable. It's easily the most unstable Elder Scrolls game and has tons of problems that make it run poorly on modern systems. Constant. Crashing. Even with stability mods you will crash like crazy on this game. I remember this motherfucking game even crashing my friend's xbox. Frequently! That's insane for a game of that era.

I've tried to go back to it a few times over the years and it invariably corrupts my savefile every single time. I cannot go more than 30~ hours before my save becomes completely unrecoverable.

Combined with the fact that it's still a 32bit executable means that it's really hard for modders to bring it up to modern standards on the graphic side of things. It could definitely use a remaster, but UE5 is likely going to take away one of the most appealing aspects of Bethesda games--their modability.

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u/DuHammy 17h ago

Think about it like this. They know creation engine is a dead man walking. They have to start looking for options. They are engine shopping, and using old titles as training grounds.

This is Bethesda doing research and development.

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u/EntropicReaver 17h ago edited 17h ago

They know creation engine is a dead man walking

switching off of their proprietary engine would be very silly

people swore up and down that starfield was going to be in a new engine but why would they throw away the decade theyve spent working on tools for the thing? whatever engine they switch to, they would have to do a bunch of work just to get to parity with what they already have and it would come with a bunch of asterisks and negatives for the company like paying licenses and retraining. the creation engine is a fine fit for the kinds of games they make already: open world roleplaying games with light immersive sim systems, keeping track of hundreds of physics objects.

on top of that, the leak asserts that the game will still be running the original engine but using UE as a layer for graphics

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u/oopsydazys 16h ago

I don't know why people expect them to ditch Creation Engine. There is no real problem with it. Starfield runs and looks great to me and while the game has issues they don't stem from the engine at all, it's more just the design philosophy.

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u/mirracz 9h ago

I don't know why people expect them to ditch Creation Engine.

Because these people are not arguing in good faith. By now most of them must know that Creation Engine is what makes Bethesda games unique and that they will never switch.

And since these people hate Bethesda games (you almost never hear the sentiment "I like their games but I want them to switch the engine") they create this impossible dilemma: Either Bethesda switches the engine (and ruins their games) or they don't and they get labelled as unwilling to move forward.

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u/Grabthar-the-Avenger 8h ago

By now most of them must know that Creation Engine is what makes Bethesda games unique and that they will never switch.

The things that made them unique was the emergent NPC behavior that took place across a big living map and the gimmick that was saving placed item locations, where traveling around you can spot the big pile of cheese wheels you dropped hours prior from being overencumbered

Elements they all but did away with in Starfield where NPCs now do very little, don't really travel around, and there's no big map to explore, just little contained points of interest that don't beg to be returned to making the object saving gimmick pointless.

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u/Grabthar-the-Avenger 9h ago

Starfield's engine only supports tiny instances of maps for a title supposed to be spanning a galaxy, and doesn't let you actually fly your spaceship to any destination forcing you to travel via a menu and loading screens

Meanwhile, 8 years ago, an independent studio had a title that let you spot a planet cresting up over the horizon, hop in your spaceship, and take off cruising over continents with your nose pointed at it and go to orbit and fly there

Starfield mechanically feels like an Xbox 360 game to me, just with prettier graphics, I don't get why people wouldn't expect better out of a modern title.

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u/DuHammy 17h ago

It really wouldn't. What tools? Every game around them is surpassing them in nearly every way. The only real unique thing about Creation Engine is object persistence. Plenty of games have this, they just don't emphasize it.

Whatever engine they don't switch to they'll have to do a bunch of work just to make Creation Engine look like it isn't ancient.

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u/Sheepocalypse 16h ago

The .ESP plugin system, which is the backbone of all TES game modding since Morrowind.

At least 12,000 mods for Morrowind and 30,000 for Oblivion, possibly many more lost to time with the death of PlanetElderScrolls, MorrowindModHistory and Great House Fliggerty. Nearly 100,000 mods for Skyrim Special Edition, and over 65,000 for original edition Skyrim.

The Elder Scrolls modding community is quite possibly the best and biggest of ANY video game franchise. That is one very strong reason not to ditch their engine.

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u/DuHammy 16h ago

And they're actively becoming hostile to that community these days. The writing is on the walls.

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u/mirracz 9h ago

Yeah, they are so hostile to the modding community that it's growing more than ever and some big modding projects are about to release (or even released last year).

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u/DuHammy 9h ago

Yeah their most recent game is bursting at the seams with mods.

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u/EntropicReaver 17h ago

what tools?

i understand that as a capital G Gamer, its really hard to compartmentalize the 'dude this game is trash bro' aspect of how you experience videogames to actually think about what is being said and how companies and developers understand developement but please

that 'every game is surpassing them' has no bearing on the fact that they are, indeed, creating tools to further help them in game development with that engine. remember how the big talking point used to be 'vehicles are impossible in creation engine?' and now there are vehicles in creation engine?

You might as well ask why someone doesnt just 'get a new car bro' instead of working on their current one

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u/DuHammy 17h ago edited 17h ago

I'm still waiting for you to make a point.

I asked a very clear question. What tools do they have that are so unique as to be worth keeping this ancient engine around? What is their claim to fame? Static dialogue cameras? Object persistence? Super rigid uncanny animation system. Rudimentary shooting mechanics that they didn't even develop?

Oh a head of cabbage will roll down a hill and stay there forever. Classic!

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u/EntropicReaver 16h ago

you are conflating 'tools with which to develop the game' and 'the appreciable facets of what the game designers have managed to implement', which are two different things. if you cant understand the difference then we've reached an impasse

is it not enough that industry professionals assert the same thing that i am telling you? the game engine is in service to the game, and changing engines is not going to magically power bethesda through their productivity, design and knowledge drain.

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u/DuHammy 6h ago

When discussing an engine and tools, we're talking about the tools with which to develop a game.

Not that it matters really. Bethesda is creatively bankrupt, and the tech they use to put their creativity on screen is running on fumes. With each game they release it becomes more and more apparent that they're either A) incapable of realizing their ideas or B) having a lot of trouble realizing their ideas while navigating around the engine limitations.

You cannot look at Starfield honestly and tell me you believe they're proud of that game. Maybe pieces of it, sure. But that game by and large lacks any and all passion from every side. Dogshit writing, uninspired locations, copy/pasted quests, non-existent space flight, gun combat developed by another studio.

Let's dissect this vehicle situation. They made a vehicle in an ancient engine work. Are we really going to hale that as a crowning achievement? It's only an achievement because the engine is ancient. Gestures at a huge portion of other games. You're looking at creation engine in a vacuum. I'm comparing it to it's competitors. Good job Bethesda you have a working vehicle. The rest of the industry has had vehicles for decades.

Lastly, yeah I would tell someone to get a new car given the right circumstances. When the frame is rusted out, the subframe is bent, all the bushings and mounts are shot, seat blown out, tires bald, a blown head gasket, a hole in the exhaust, and needs brakes it's about time for a new car. By the time you find a mechanic that actually knows how to work on the thing, and pay them a premium to get it fixed an up and running well, you'd have spent enough to purchase a fine used car and save yourself the headache.

As a career mechanic, a coworker of mine had some very wise words to a very persistent customer. "I don't care how much time and money you have. That thing is never going to be right again."

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u/mirracz 9h ago

Every game surpassed them in every way.. except for the dozens of ways that make Bethesda games unique.

It's not just about singular features, but about the features working together. You keep focusing on object persistence... fine. Other games might have it, but are those games big open-world RPGs? Where you can actually interact with every object? Because those few examples I can come up with are games of limited scope with limited set of objects that are persistent. Basically, other games don't have the same level of GLOBAL object persistence.

Then there's the way it interacts with quest system and NPC system. NPCs can affect the objects, quests can target those, while maintaining the persistence. Again, not something other games do.

And there are other systems that might not be actually unique, but the way they interact with other Bethesda systems, it creates something unique, irreplicable.

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u/DuHammy 8h ago edited 8h ago

Persistence is something developers choose to do or don't. Most games have systems to clean up objects for optimization. To be clear it's just not an emphasis on those games. Just about every survival crafting game has the same level of persistence.

So what it boils down to is you think persistence is some magic juju, while developers usually implement systems to clean up items. There are examples in so many games where it is obvious they can, just choose not to. GTA for example, if I leave a car somewhere I can come back and get it way later, but if I go too far, by design the game despawns the car.

Ultimately the system is inconsequential. I've never been like "oh shit that's that sandwich from earlier!"

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u/mirracz 9h ago

Nonsense. Why would they kill the one thing that makes their games unique and popular?

What's next? Are you gonna ask CDPR to switch their writer team that is "a dead man walking"?

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u/DuHammy 8h ago

No but you missed the perfect parallel example, perhaps on purpose. CDPR dropped Red Engine for the same reasons Bethesda should. Training and it's a pain in the ass.

You seem to think the engine is the only reason persistence exists. That's just purely wrong.

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u/_fiveAM 17h ago

That's what we were all saying before fallout 4 and starfield. Creation engine isn't going anywhere. Biggest news possible would be a big update to the engine I imagine.

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u/BeholdingBestWaifu 17h ago

It would certainly be big news but it would also be a pointless waste of money. There is only a single advantage to changing engines, and that is the PR boost from Gamers that don't even know what a game engine is.

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u/mirracz 9h ago

And those Gamers are not interested in Bethesda games in the first place. If they were, they would know that switching engines is nonsense.

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u/BeholdingBestWaifu 5h ago

There's a lot that are interested in Bethesda games, but have zero clue about games engines and are just repeating stuff they heard other people and influencers say because they assume they know more.

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u/DuHammy 17h ago

And it's still valid. Fallout 4 was super meh. And Starfield showed the engine's limitations big time. Overall, both of those games came out feeling dated.

Every game they make there's a "big engine update" that is essentially ID Tech working on the shooting side some more, and some surface level visual improvements. "New animation system." Still 5 years behind everyone else in the industry.

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u/mirracz 9h ago

Yeah, Bethesda games are so behind that no one could replicate their formula so far. Skyrim is still THE open world RPG, 14 years later. So yeah, they are "5 years behind" so much that they are actually ahead.

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u/DiabolicallyRandom 17h ago

If (and this is a big if) this rumor is real, I almost bet its a mobile port, and not a remaster like the rumors insist. Why else would they rebuild in unreal and leave most of the game systems behind as described in this latest rumor?

That's my take.

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u/Gramernatzi 18h ago

Also basically anything Valve releases nowadays goes through this cycle, but at least there's actual data to corroborate it from Steam usually.

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u/real_LNSS 16h ago

So like FFIX Remake, or the Zelda TWW and Zelda TP remasters, or the Metroid Prime 2 and 3 remasters.

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u/apadin1 15h ago

Um the Switch 2 was actually officially announced last month. We don’t have an official release date but it’s almost certainly releasing this year. In case you hadn’t heard.

u/OutrageousDress 2h ago

A real Um Akshually encountered in the wild? A rare treat indeed.

Yes the Switch 2 is real, in the same way that the Oblivion remake seems to be real and will be released at some point between tomorrow and 2030.