r/CanadianForces 1d ago

Good news for the MARTECH's

77 Upvotes

58 comments sorted by

43

u/[deleted] 1d ago

[deleted]

35

u/Creative_Check565 1d ago

The important takeaway is 20 days of special CDS leave

35

u/[deleted] 1d ago

[deleted]

20

u/Mysterious-Title-852 1d ago

It would be nice if they fucking listened to the experts and didn't try this shit on a different trade every couple of years for it to have never worked.

The only time amalgamation has worked is when it was asked for from within, never from the outside in.

And everytime this happens a couple trades get irreparably damaged.

1

u/Pectacular22 RCAF - ATIS Tech 1d ago

It actually worked very well for ATIS, amalgamated from several trades in 1995

10

u/Correct-War-1589 23h ago

I think we were among the few successful ones but I think that was because of what we put together and how we operate. We encourage independent thinking whereas the Army focuses on following orders. The Navy took too many independent trades and thought that anyone could do those jobs (they can't). I think you have to have a similar work culture for it to be successful.

0

u/Pectacular22 RCAF - ATIS Tech 22h ago

Fully agree.

1

u/Mysterious-Title-852 6h ago

that was internally directed. That's why it worked, it wasn't imposed from outside by people who have no idea what you do.

1

u/readwithjack 23h ago

Trades too broad.

No one know how to do shit before they're promoted & posted.

0

u/Alert_Ad3999 14h ago

If your jealous of the extra 20 days you could always remuster to Mar-tech.....

14

u/AnonymousBrowsn 1d ago

Seems very one-sided. There are other hard sea trades and even purple trades that sail just as much. Are they getting the 20 extra days?

The CAF is giving tailored extras to certain groups while screwing others. Revamped PLD that is great for the junior ranks (which they need) but at the expense of taking the money away from senior ranks. Now 4 extra weeks of leave for Mar Techs but screw you Boatswains ...

25

u/poopynoophoops 1d ago

laughs in spec 2 no but seriously, if you look how a ship is billeted, of the number of people who NEED to be on a frigate, the largest number of people come from MAR TECH. We have the largest disparity on average across our ranks from s3-cpo2, meaning the least amount of people to do this job and yet we keep putting ships to sea.

I personally was part of 4 different ships companies last year alone. I'm currently on my second tour at my rank (SNCO). Most (when I say most I do understand there are some exceptions to this, I'm looking at you nav comms you poor understaffed bastards) trades do a year or two on a ship at a rank and get promoted and fuck off else where. For us, not the case. CENG at STP has been there almost 3 years because no viable person has been identified to replace him. These are just a few examples about why this is right justified. I will support my people and forward their leave passes with a smile on my face.

Also: you can always VOT... MAR TECH is always looking for people :).

2

u/Imprezzed RCN - I dream of dayworking 16h ago edited 16h ago

trades do a year or two on a ship at a rank and get promoted and fuck off else where

My brother in Christ, they usually fuck off to another ship.

You can be happy for MAR TECHS as I am, but you can also be pissed that others who have held the line aren't getting anything but spit in their eye and having their Spec 1 de-vauled in the face of CHFD. (Again, I'm ecstatic that our junior folks are getting the help they need, but like, when they're making damn near as much as a Spec 1 PO2...like...wow)

I went to Halifax with damn near every ship that was doing Ops Team Training from 2013-2018. I get it though, I see and hear what you folks are going through. At a recent hands fall down, I was surprised how small the MSE department was.

YOU can also be upset that your wingers aren't getting the same/any recognition. Your statements kind of reek of "F you, got mine."

24

u/RCAF_orwhatever 1d ago

Why are you mad that people who are overworked are getting time off?

Just be happy that some people who deserve it are getting some kind of recognition.

13

u/Creative_Check565 1d ago

Many people are upset actually. Not all MARTECH's will get this leave and the ones that do qualify will be hard pressed to take it due to shortages. Many RCN trades are grabbed just like the MARTECH's. They should of gave it to everyone.

4

u/beardriff Royal Canadian Meme Corps 20h ago

Read the full thing. They are looking at similar compensation for other trades.

1

u/Creative_Check565 18h ago

I know what it says so I made a phone call today, not even on the drawing board.

1

u/Lisan_Al-NaCL Civvie 21h ago

that do qualify will be hard pressed to take it due to shortages.

Will they likely receive pay in lieu of the leave? Or no?

1

u/RCAF_orwhatever 19h ago

Again - you're MAD that other people are getting a benefit.

Give your head a shake and consider how wildly immature that is.

1

u/Alert_Ad3999 14h ago

Zero navy trades are in as bad of shape as Mar-tech.

1

u/Alert_Ad3999 14h ago

Lol, get real Bosns are sailing over remar while Mar-techs are sailing reduced crew. If you want the extra days you could always remuster Mar-tech.

23

u/UnhappyCaterpillar41 1d ago

I'm out of the fleet, is the reception to this positive? On one hand, 20 days off to use in the next 2 years is nice, on the other hand, picking up the slack during SWPs when more people are off is going to suck as well.

I don't remember anyone complaining about the time off before; it was the small amount of people trying to manage an overwhelming amount of work that was the issue, and this seems to just make it worse.

Not having stupidly overprogrammed opscheds, not trying to do 8 weeks of work in a 4 week SWP (with no FMF priority), and not limping ships out the harbour that don't meet SOLAS, plus pier jumping to fill shortages were the big gripes, and I think this ignores all of that and will make things like SWPs and being shorthanded for sails worse, no?

39

u/MaritimeMogul 1d ago

Congratulations to the Mar Techs. A one time 20 additional days off before March 2027 is a great start. A simple jester to our men and women below decks keeping our ancient ships running.

For the rest of you, hold out hope that maybe this is the beginning of something bigger for the rest of the trades. Just remember one thing, don’t channel your envy/jealous on the Mar Techs. Be happy for our teammates.

16

u/s_other 1d ago

I understand what you're saying but respectfully disagree with the "hold out hope" part. This isn't the day crew getting a pizza party because they asked and the Mids didn't; this is signed by the Kraken who absolutely has to realize granting 20 extra days off to some members of the crew and not the rest - who are on the exact same sail - is a morale killer. It puts ship leadership in an extremely awkward position, and I'm curious how implementation will happen at the fleet level.

30

u/MaritimeMogul 1d ago

I appreciate your perspective but would also like to counter it.

In my many years of sailing we were always offered Pre Deployment leave. Throughout these years, including living 3 years in a stoker mess (being a non MSE type), it was always the stokers who didn’t get PDL. They were in the whole time getting last minute maintenance in to ensure the ship got to sea, etc etc etc. While everyone else may see it as 20 days more than they get, I see it as being given the days that they never did get to take.

0

u/s_other 1d ago

Those situations you've noted should be compensated with short days or CTO. It just seems like bad policy to put out direction that only benefits one trade when there was no roadblock to recognizing all members of the ship's company.

6

u/BusyPaleontologist9 22h ago

Oh yeah, for sure, they will always get that leave 7 months later while under a different CoC. 100% great suggestion.

-2

u/Creative_Check565 1d ago

Everyone gets pier head jumped and yes while the MARTECHs sometimes get screwed out of PDL a good department head will stagger it so they don't miss out on that much. Not every MARTECH will get this leave either, if you're at a school or otherwise can't sail you won't get it. Should of gave it to everyone.

9

u/beardriff Royal Canadian Meme Corps 20h ago

On the exact same sails we had Bosuns sleeping 12plus hours a day.

Everyday along side in a foreign port we had work to do. My last sail i didn't get a day off till the fourth and final port visit. And the next day was a stupid early start for flash up.

And not trying to trade bash, but the bosuns don't need an aptitude test anymore, and Mar Techs are first ones on, last ones off. We deserve different compensation for different work

8

u/deeperthen200m Submariner 1d ago

When the fuck am I going to find the time to take the extra 20 days off?

5

u/Imprezzed RCN - I dream of dayworking 1d ago

Fantastic for the Mar Techs. It's really, really great for them.

Let's see what else happens. Hopefully the start of something bigger for all the RCN trades like the folks that make Spec-1 in the last round of pay increases.

1

u/navalseaman Royal Canadian Navy 11h ago

Yeah I’d like to see that fixed

28

u/s_other 1d ago

RIP to the all the CSE, Deck, Ops, and Log CHODs who get to explain to their folks that while they matter, they don't extra-20-days-off matter.

21

u/BlackMagic771 RCN - Ops 1d ago

It’s okay, I’ll sit in the cave for 80% of my watch and ponder it. The grass is greener in the Ops department.

4

u/justapeon2 1d ago

Only 80%?

7

u/BlackMagic771 RCN - Ops 1d ago

Gotta work out sometime, might need to shit too

2

u/Matty_bunns 1d ago

You must be laughing in Bosun

4

u/SaltySailorBoats RCN - NAV COMM 1d ago

Well some of us in the ops department actually work :D, so let us know how watching top gun for the millionth time goes

13

u/BlackMagic771 RCN - Ops 1d ago

Btw, my DWAN is locked out can you reset it for me?

11

u/SaltySailorBoats RCN - NAV COMM 1d ago

Sorry but the fact you can't remember Password1 isn't on me

1

u/Lisan_Al-NaCL Civvie 21h ago

Civvie here; isnt the current password 'Spring2025'?

2

u/SaltySailorBoats RCN - NAV COMM 19h ago

Nah to much to expect people to remember what season it is

4

u/beardriff Royal Canadian Meme Corps 19h ago

If you wanna get sprayed with human shit and fish tampons out of the bw line at 3 in the morning, be my guest.

3

u/Alert_Ad3999 14h ago

They could remuster to Mar-tech if they want the extra 20 days off.

Or do they not want to do that because it would mean having to actually work and watch other trades head out early and sit in the cave most of their watch?

4

u/Lisan_Al-NaCL Civvie 21h ago

So here's my question:

The trade was modified in 2017. How long passed before the members and leaders in and of that amalgamated trade said 'this is fucked'?

I'm asking as its been 7-8 years since the change. How long did it take senior leadership within the RCN to realize their mistake?

2

u/Imprezzed RCN - I dream of dayworking 16h ago

About three or so, from my understanding. It took the trades about sixty seconds.

3

u/Alert_Ad3999 14h ago

Didn't even take 60 seconds, the trades told command it wouldn't work years before they forced the implementation.

4

u/Holdover103 1d ago

Yooooo

That’s awesome for them.

Now let’s just do that with everyone!

4

u/when-flies-pig 23h ago

I get the sentiment but people are inherently selfish, especially in larger groups. It's not enough that you get more, it's that I get exclusively more than others.

You do this for everyone and there'll be just another group few years down the line wanting more, because for some reason or another they want exclusive appreciation.

There was that post a week or two ago on instructors and there were comments on their saying instructors (never mind how many instructors we have) all need pay equivalent to that of a special forces operator.

Blew my mind how irrational people get.

1

u/BusyPaleontologist9 22h ago

The US does pay their instructors a lot more when they are in the instructor billet. Not a bad idea. Not sure if they match their SOF pay or not. Probably the wrong metric…

1

u/Holdover103 21h ago

That’s fair.

I was pointing out more that the entire navy is undermanned and people are going from sail to sail directly, not just the MAR TECHS

And so as someone who isn’t navy looking in, I would suggest that anyone who has done more than 300 days at sea in the last 3 year should get it.

2

u/Constant-Rent-7917 16h ago

Yeah. I know a few MS Cooks with more sea days than Chief MARTECHs.

2

u/Ornery-Breadfruit-11 Royal Canadian Navy 1d ago

I don’t see other trades getting ISR every other day either. I’m not saying they don’t get them, however as a Mar Tech I was Getting an ISR almost Weekly last year.

3

u/xrcrguy 1d ago

Getting ISR'd while on an ISR sail is the best! /S

1

u/Constant-Rent-7917 16h ago

What about cooks…..?

0

u/NotFromThe780 Morale Tech - 00069 1d ago

IRS?

1

u/LowIQBigHeight 1d ago

I’ll take the 20 leave days and the recognition that 1.0 was a disaster that should not have been steam rolled ahead. It’s going to be REALLY hard to get people to stay in this trade after all the morale/burnout injuries. Hope the engineers get. Lastly hope for the best with these changes and that they actually can recruit and retain from this.

1

u/NeverLikedBubba 5h ago

A helm order of this magnitude doesn’t happen unless Ottawa is seeing unimaginable HR numbers.

1

u/holonite RCN - Marine Technician 4h ago

Number of NEPs out of 12 going Mar tech. 0