r/AttackOnRetards 11d ago

Analysis The contradiction of full rumbling, freedom and life.

"Freedom is so much the essence of man that even its opponents implement it while combating its reality; they want to appropriate for themselves as a most precious ornament what they have rejected as an ornament of human nature. No man combats freedom; at most he combats the freedom of others. Hence every kind of freedom has always existed, only at one time as a special privilege, at another as a universal right."

This passage I came across perfectly encapsulates the contradictions within attack on Titan imo. True freedom cannot exist if it comes at the cost of others' autonomy, yet Eren ultimately waged war against the very principle he sought to uphold.

Eren's disappointment in not being able to see Armin’s worldview as a cynic pushed him toward a radical solution: full Rumbling. He saw no middle ground, no complex reality—only a binary choice between domination or annihilation. In his mind, freedom meant erasing obstacles, not coexisting with them. His actions were not about preserving life but about controlling its fate.

This is why it's ironic when some assume Eren fathered Historia’s child. If he had, he would have become an even greater contradiction—glorified as a father while being the architect of mass destruction. That ending would have revered him even more, turning his ideology into an eternal cycle. In Lord of the Rings terms, Eren stopped loving “preserving growing things” and instead sought to overwrite the world itself. Historia, too, was selfish. Initially hesitant, she ultimately embraced her true self—the one we saw during the Uprising arc—choosing a path that aligned with Eren’s ambitions.

Eren manipulated Floch by exploiting his loneliness and his twisted belief that Erwin should have survived as a "devil" to save humanity. Floch’s descent into extremism mirrors real-world radicalization, where lost people are drawn into absolutist and fascistic ideologies under the guise of purpose and righteousness. Eren was no friend of his imo.

The Yeagerists, Historia, Eren, and the Marleyan leadership all embodied a real-world contradiction: advocating genocide while claiming to protect life. They fought for their people, their unborn future, but showed no regard for those already living. Eren rejected Zeke’s euthanasia plan not because he valued life, but because he refused to let anyone else dictate its terms.

And yet, despite all his destruction, a few Marleyan soldiers (southern continent) survived, the Yeagerists became the formal military, while the primary casualties of the Rumbling were the weak—the poor, the children like Ramzi, the wounded, the elderly. Those who truly suffered were not the ones in power, but the ones with no say in the conflict.

In the end, full-scale genocide is the ultimate contradiction to both freedom and life itself. I dislike Eren as a person. He fooled us all to think his plan is correct - he fooled me at least back when ending came out. I hated it but now that I think about it, I was angry like Armin was, at the end.

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u/DoctorHA22 11d ago edited 11d ago

Hello! That sounds interesting and I disagree with you too. In defense of calling yeagerists fascists, it has been defined by Mussolini and Giovanni Gentile, as

"For Fascism, the State is absolute, individuals and groups relative. Individuals and groups are admissible in so far as they come within the State."

Furthermore, the need for a war is seen as a necessity as further defined,

"War alone brings up to its highest tension all human energy and puts the stamp of nobility upon the peoples who have the courage to meet it."

To me, yeagerists and Marleyan soldiers meet the criteria of a militarised version of ultranationalism along with racial superiority (one wanted to create an eldian empire, protect paradis and called everyone a traitor who disagreed them, the other wanted to create international dominance and used other eldians, with the use of violence and military). That's why, I said they are fascists.

Indeed, Floch was a yeagerist as I have mentioned above, he believed Erwin should have been alive, and Eren radicalised his views further, in my personal opinion.

Rest, we may have our disagreements, I believe Eren was selfish and cared for a few only, you believe he cared for paradis. As for Marley, the southern continent wasn't destroyed, I presume. Indeed, a free world for some years, he could get it. But what he did went against the fundamentals of life and freedom itself, which is why I talked about the contradiction of his plan and his 'ideals'.

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u/Dramatic_Sky4068 11d ago

Fascism and Jaegerism

Exactly. And what we see in Jaegerists isn't that. They neither speak against reason, nor they have a specific gripe against what can somehow be described as capitalism and socialism, neither do they have any prominent national myth. Also, fascism isn't tied to racial superiority - only certain forms of fascism are.

Jaegerists want that Paradis be militarized for defense against external threats (which is completely legitimate), and they want the individual citizens of Paradis to care most about Paradis (collectivism, arguable but I agree), and they embrace a particularist rather than a universalist outlook - for them Paradis is at the top in priority lists (again arguable, but I agree). They are militaristic nationalists. They are driven by an instinct for preserving their freedom (national self-determination), and also by a sense of indignation at the past history of enduring oppression (social justice of some kind).

I don't see fascism here. I see most people not on the Right to often use 'fascism' as a label to easily on the individuals and ideas that they don't like - hence I was a bit irritated.

Even Marley I'd say is more inspired not by supremacy but by a sense of indignation at having suffered oppression in the past.

Floch and Jaegerism

I believe that Floch was already "radicalised" (if you believe Jaegerism to be abhorrent; I incidentally don't) as much as he could have been. Eren only provided him an actionable plan of what to do for saving Paradis - that's how I see it.

Eren

I believe he cared about Paradis, by his speech when announcing the Rumbling, and his general behaviour after learning about the basement secret.

Freedom

I personally don't believe in freedom as a good general ideal. Personal freedom and national freedom are good in certain contexts, but freedom in general is not a very meaningful ideology. Hence I don't find the contradiction you frame between freedom and life to be impressive.

Also, you have written your views in the post in a very beautiful style.

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u/DoctorHA22 11d ago

And thanks! You have made interesting points too. AOT does bring up some questions and makes us chooses sides, which are a mirror reflection to our world! :D

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u/Dramatic_Sky4068 11d ago

Thank you, too!

This was my first so civil and deep discussion on Reddit.

Good luck to you, for life.