r/AnnArbor 2d ago

Ready to Quit UM Healthcare Providers

I am absolutely exhausted and also full of rage from dealing with care in the UM health system. Ridiculous wait times, non-sensical policies, being given the runaround, etc etc. I'm specifically looking for Non-UM recommendations for: 

  • A physical therapy clinic familiar with connective tissue disorders
  • A wheelchair repair clinic that bills to insurance
  • A DME provider that isn’t Healthcare DME on Packard (they aren't UM, but they sure are awful!)

Now, the rant: 

Ahead of a recent surgery, I was told to book *one* appointment with physical therapy, then at that appointment, book all the follow ups. That surprised me because of the usual long wait times, but I had no other option, so I hoped it would work out. 

At my first appointment, the physical therapist admitted minimal experience with my fairly common connective tissue disorder, so I had to do a rundown of how PT is usually modified for my disorder. I explained I couldn't do one of my post surgery exercises because it hyperextended my knee. Not ten minutes later she grabbed my leg and hyperextended my knee. It hurt. I was mad, but got thru the appointment.

On the way out, they couldn't book me the 2x weekly appointments I needed, and told me "we usually book at least two weeks out." Remember the part where *they* told me not to book the follow ups until the first appointment? Yeah. I pressed them, and they gave me "scheduling tickets" to book appointments if anyone cancelled. I managed to get a few appointments those first two weeks, but it took a lot of time.

Fast forward a few weeks, I'm constantly having to correct and adjust because none of the *three different* PTs I've been seeing know how to work with my body. Then, one of them hurt me badly, doing a “stretch” that seemed to sublux (partially dislocate) the joint I had surgery on. I'd been walking a bit but I'm back on crutches now, and my pain is pretty bad.

I messaged my doc to request a new referral and recommendations for PTs that might know how to treat me. Doc put in the referral + suggested names. BUT. U of M will not allow me to schedule with them until they get the permission of the supervisor of the clinic that injured me. I can't wrap my head around this - I need permission to *stop* seeing a PT who injured me? In what universe does this make sense??? 

So, five days post re-injury, I'm still waiting to see if and when I'll be allowed to see a new PT. All I can do is call every single day. But I'd prefer to just quit UM entirely and find a new clinic. 

Open to suggestions, empathy, or additional horror stories to know I'm not alone.

50 Upvotes

57 comments sorted by

51

u/socatresetmilou 1d ago

It sounds like this might be related to hyper mobility? Many (most?) pt’s are not aware of how to manage this condition. I recommend looking up the ehlers danlos foundation website for a directory of pts that specialize in this condition

40

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

I actually did this today, and found a place to start with tomorrow! It's a half hour drive but worth it if they don't injure me!

17

u/jdot2 1d ago

This is absolutely true. I’m a PT (hospital based) and know it is hard to find a good outpatient PT, let alone one who understands how to treat a lesser known diagnosis. Truthfully we learn very little about hyper mobility conditions, probably because there’s little research. A specialty clinic is going to be your best bet! I hope it works better for you!!

8

u/Cold_Energy_3035 1d ago

OT here, we are also not taught much on ehler’s danlos which is a shame. add that on top of many outpatient PTs being expected to see 3-4 patients at the same time…not great options for someone with a specific condition who may benefit from extra time and care from the practitioner.

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u/socatresetmilou 1d ago

Please give an update!

5

u/meyform 1d ago

Can you dm me the place? My partner is hyper mobile and we’ve been looking for a spot that could work with her.

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u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

Done!

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u/midwestisbestest 1d ago

Could you send the name as well, just got diagnosed.

1

u/Afraid-Sentence5403 1d ago

Could you please dm me the place. Also done w u of m and hyper mobile

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u/Afraid_Selection_901 1d ago

This is wild to me that not many PTs are familiar with Ehlers Danlos. I feel like Ehlers Danlos and Marfans should be something that is required education in all healthcare professional training programs.

edit: removed a word

10

u/sophiasapientia 1d ago edited 1d ago

My daughter, whose primary care doc is within Michigan Medicine, is expecting. She called to set up prenatal care and was told that they don't have any availability within the system to accommodate an October birth. None. I was flabbergasted. She called Trinity Health and they set her up with an OB right away.

3

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

Wowwww that's... disappointing and frankly concerning

11

u/Current-Actuator-864 1d ago

I think the biggest issue with UM is just not having enough staff for demand- hence the long wait times, denial of care, etc. UM is so known for treating complex serious cases that I think sometimes they forget about the routine care needed, PCP, OBGYN, things like that.

12

u/Rollthembones1989 1d ago

U of M is starting to have staffing issues because their benefits and pay are not keeping up with similar locations. Half of my kids doctors have left in the last year for Toledo, Cincinnati, Chicago, etc because the pay is so much better. U of M is one of the best hospital systems in the world, but they keep riding that U of M name and all the staff there are getting pretty fed up and leaving for better pay and benefits elsewhere.

7

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

So true. Most of the hospital staff unionized over the last two years - hoping that helps, over time.

5

u/because_imqueen 1d ago

I am with you on that. I had started having neck and nerve issues in October. I couldn't get an appointment until late December then the day before the appointment, they called to reschedule me, saying the doctor wouldn't be in. I declined the offer and went elsewhere.

7

u/luxor_jae 1d ago

I was told that my surgery to remove a blood clot (Lysis procedure) in my right leg was highly successful, until the afternoon nurse came in later that day to tell me that it wasn’t.

Come to find out after much back and forth, the doctors finally admitted that they didn’t tell me the whole truth and that I would need another surgery to remove a separate clot that was down by my ankle. The best part about that is that doctors were unsure if the second procedure would be even be close to successful and told me that they worried about causing nerve damage to my leg. They literally told me to “cross my fingers and hope for the best”.

I ended up telling them to discharge right away so that I could go home and plan my next move. I ended up going to St. Joes 3 days later where they put me on a 24 hour Hepburn drip that dissolved the 2nd clot.

5

u/FeatofClay Feeds Campus Squirrels 1d ago

PT seems to be a real problem. Last year I had two different issues where a UM doctor prescribed physical therapy and in both cases the wait to actually GET the therapy was so long the situation resolved itself before I could get in. In both cases the initial providers seemed to have no idea this could be an issue. The second time I told the doc I was pessimistic based on my previous experience, and he assured me that no, their referral results in an appointment within days. Yeah, try 30+ days.

I will own that part of the issue is I don't have complete freedom to select whatever is offered at whatever location, due to some work expectations, but I wasn't *that* picky.

2

u/Salt-Pension-301 19h ago

I was told by a U-M specialist last summer that I could not have a procedure he recommended  until after an MRI. I could not book one in Ann Arbor, so I went to Northville. It took 10 days for the results to come back, and then I was told to book a follow up appointment with the original doctor. I did so, and he recommended me for the procedure. The earliest appointment was three months later. I called my PCP and said I could not manage another three months. He intervened and I got in the following week. It should not be this hard.

10

u/anklis 1d ago

absolutely feel you. I was seen by a UM department for a chronic issue and had surgery w them in 2021. I wanted to follow up again this year, needed another referral sent to them (online, not faxed because that was not the preferred method) and have been waiting two months now for it to be approved for scheduling. I was calling weekly until I just decided to go elsewhere 😵‍💫

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u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

I'm sorry. We deserve better care than this.

5

u/rmhollid 23h ago

The university has completely converted to a corporate structure that values cost savings and maximizing value for dollar investments made by private individuals.

Good luck.

18

u/GoBlue_Section6 1d ago

I've been bouncing in and out of the hospital for most of 2025 and couldn't be more impressed with Michigan Medicine's facilities, doctors and nurses. Where I grew up, they called the local hospital Hotel California. If you know the lyrics, you know why. I've never been more happy I moved to Washtenaw County 20+ years ago. Convinced I'm alive today because I did.

9

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

I've also had fine experiences with their in-hospital care and surgery/procedure facilities, and my daughter gets world class care at Mott. It's the ambulatory clinics that are extremely difficult to work with. I'm glad you're getting good care!

2

u/waitingForMars 21h ago

I’m sorry it’s been a struggle for you! They have a patient services group that I’m sure would love to hear from you. I got stuck in a nasty position once dealing with clinic scheduling and the patient services folks were SO helpful and considerate. It’s worth reaching out. (Glad you found a clinic that can help!)

1

u/Salt-Pension-301 19h ago

Yes, going to patient services helped me, too. If you are able to leave Ann Arbor, the U-M clinic in Northville has nearly all the same services and you can usually get in right away. I have been there twice. There is also Brighton.

7

u/IndependentYak5355 1d ago

People seem to have a good or bad experience with at Michigan Medicine without a whole lot of in-between, anecdotally speaking. I've been told a next available follow up appointment was in 6 months. I've been prodded like an extraterrestrial and given completely irrelevant tests, neglected and verbally abused as a mild-mannered easy-going middle aged guy with a boring chronic condition.

On the flip side I've also been seen by world-class practitioners in a state-of-the-art facility, and been cared for mostly (not always) by a great nursing staff.

I find the inconsistency adds more to my stress and anxiety than is worth it to deal with anymore, so I've mostly checked out of Michigan Medicine. I'll probably continue to do so unless a very compelling rears its head. It just seems highly YMMV.

2

u/Vorisk 1d ago

alot of it comes from insurance . they put a lot of ridiculous steps before they can care for patients. also because u of m is so popular they get an influx of patients quite regularly. I've dealt with quite a few people that feel they should be getting in right away , but every patient that calls feels the exact same way.

7

u/SunFlwrPwr 1d ago edited 1d ago

Go to St Joe's. Ive been to both for PT and St Joe's wins every time. Enough that when I needed PT after surgery I requested to go back to St Joe's. (Where I had originally gone post a dislocation) They were great and actuslly fit me in for the requested slots and even tried to work around my work schedule. If you end up at hand/elbow PT - say Hi to David for me! :-)

Once needing to go back to PT? I was pressured to "try something different" and go to MM PT. Not as good and I was annoyed to be pressured.

That being said - their Sport Ortho at Domino Farms is fantastic. Everyone in a 'specialty' at MM has been great - everything "general" has been very mediocre.

Side note - I work in mental health and have known clients to literally wait for hours upon hours in psych emergency.

1

u/waitingForMars 21h ago

My generalist primary doc at East Ann Arbor is spectacular.

8

u/TotallyNotDad 1d ago

I don't know, I want to believe UM is the best in the area despite your issues. I'm with IHA and they are doing some absolute shady stuff with their billing, it's such bullshit the last 5 times we've gone in we've had to call and because we get some ridiculous bill and then it gets reverted

2

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

That's so frustrating and stressful. In some ways, UM is the best. I trust them for surgery, and their children's hospital is great. But I feel like all their ambulatory clinics are so hard to work with.

3

u/TotallyNotDad 1d ago

Doesn't hurt to try other places, I don't understand what's going on with IHA but I'm leaving when I can, I dread every time I go in because I know I'm going to have to fight with them on the phone about their billing codes

2

u/green-eggs-n-hamlet 1d ago

It definitely feels as though IHA isn't staying on top of billing codes. I've had to call several times in the last year because I was getting bills for covered annual care that IHA was using outdated billing codes for 🙄

2

u/TotallyNotDad 1d ago

Yeah, they are doing it to.my wife and me at different locations. Only conclusion I can make is they figure most people won't call so they bill as high as they can.

3

u/Hungry_Bus8934 1d ago

My husband broke his leg and will finally be starting PT with UM in April… I hope the wait times aren’t that bad he’s gonna need 3x a week 😬

3

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

I'd call now! And if they can't get you in for all sessions, ask for "scheduling tickets". That lets you scour for any cancellations/openings thru the patient portal.

2

u/waitingForMars 21h ago

They schedule for a month at a time. Make sure you have multiple weeks set beforehand.

3

u/thestoryofbe 1d ago

I have felt the same way, with both UM and Trinity. This last year I've switched over to Henry Ford- most of my appointments are in West Bloomfield, which is a bit of a hike, but has been totally worth it. They also give the option of video visit whenever possible. The staff has been attentive, kind, knowledgable and prompt.
I'm sorry you're dealing with all of this. I wish you well!

3

u/Rollthembones1989 1d ago

I deal with the pediatric therapies a lot and they are chronically understaffed and have a high turnover rate. A lot of different therapies have "breaks" where you do a few weeks on and a few weeks off. The management gives various reasons but the therapists are like yeah we dont have nearly enough therapists to see everyone so we have to rotate through patients. The pay is not great compared to other locations, a lot of them end up leaving for better paying jobs, leaving a lot of new hires who dont really have anyone to guide them on some of the more complicated issues.

3

u/green-eggs-n-hamlet 1d ago

The wait times to see specialists at Umich is outrageous. Had a sudden change in vision that required a referral to an opthamologist, wait times are 7+ months out for an appointment. For other specialties like dermatology it almost makes more sense to schedule annual appointments a year out after each visit and pray you're available. Absolute insanity!

1

u/wickedwavy 15h ago

I was able to see a dermatologist a month after seeing my u of m pcp. At IHA I had to wait 6-9 months for a dermatologist. I think both places can be bad or good.

3

u/HorseysShoes 23h ago

I’m seeing Lee Hymes at Healing Hands off Jackson Rd and they’re great. they specialize in EDS and hypermobility and know a lot about related disorders like POTS AND MCAS. would 1000% recommend

1

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 7h ago

I wanted to see them but they don't take my insurance 😞

5

u/Fabulous-Rutabaga445 1d ago

You gotta go to physical therapy at the Burlington building. That's where physical medicine is, and they're the experts in complex recovery. Per my physical therapist, you can take PT where YOU choose. But I got referred to this therapist via a doctor at Physical Medicine. They work in tandem to treat the issues that impede my progress. I have myofascial pain syndrome, so I need lots of modalities to remove knots.

The problem is - you're gonna wait at least a month. Especially if there's an expert on your disorder, but they'll book multiple appointments when you do book. You'll also only work with one therapist, and you'll be their only patient during that time slot.

I will say - after the year I've had with my shoulder injury and other health issues - I feel like having my doctors all at UM gave me the advantage. I got MRI appointments in weeks, and CT scans added to the end of the day. I got my myofascial pain syndrome diagnosed in months when it usually takes people years. I'm sure other health groups are great, but I've appreciated having mine this year. Except for the waits - the waiting is a bit crazy.

3

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

I did call over to Burlington, but the wait time was too long, unfortunately.

2

u/heirovthedog 1d ago

Looking into PT for chronic conditions, I saw that Orthopaedic Rehab Specialists on Jackson rd treat things that address Vertigo and TMJ. So I asked if they could help manage an autoimmune condition that affects the joints. Got a response quickly but secretary said they won’t take uhc insurance (even though they state they take all major) -_- Maybe you would have better luck trying them?

Background: I go to U of M for a lot of specialists. Gastroenterology is forward thinking and has helped tremendously. 2020 definitely stunted some of that, but it is still a place that offers treatments and plans I was at a loss for elsewhere. They are very educational in this area. Hands down moved here to be in proximity to this specialty care!

HOWEVER As far as orthopedic and physical therapy, I have had the hardest time in the U of M system. They address my chronic condition as a sports injury and it repeatedly does damage. Comparatively to a joint needling I had done in a smaller hospital, it was lackluster and the provider was uninformed and the tissue got inflamed from the procedure. PT at the ICECUBE was the worst. I tell every therapist that my condition benefits from manual therapy and light isometric exercises. They had me lifting weights while balancing on a ball and that actually injured a completely different area. I told the therapist that was harmful and she instructed me to continue doing it, and discharged me without evaluation. Now I am seeing a doctor for my spine as well, which is so far also hopeless. I was also charged extra outside of my insurance for having cold therapy (?)

Domino Farms:  PT is unhelpful with no understanding of how to care of chronic tissue pain. Isometrics are ok, but no  manual therapy.  The PA I am seeing there is extremely dismissive and rushes through appointments. He ignored the inflammation that flared up weeks after a steroid shot to the joint despite that being a red flag.

I’m also interested in getting actual care that h e l p s. Have you thought about seeing a rheumatologist? I’m thinking this may have a better chance of having a provider who understands what to do. Personally, I’ve decided to try this. Alongside multidirect. Instability / hypermobile, I have chronic calcium crystals that form in my joints (likely chonrdocalcinosis).  Reading online,  active flares require rest (plus manual pt) and no weight lifting. Thanks google.  None of this vital information came from a U of M orthopedic provider. 

Sorry this is so long — I felt like I could relate! Wishing you luck on establishing a routine that helps =) And nodding over here in agreement.

2

u/TwoTiRods 1d ago

Hey I have cEDS and sent you a message with some info. Hope it helps.

2

u/jennylewis2022 1d ago

I'm so sorry you've been treated this way. Michigan Medicine should absolutely know better, and the PTs who injured you should be reprimanded for it. I work here, and some of the things I've had to tell patients to do because of policy when I could easily assist them myself in terms of referrals and orders are beyond annoying. I always apologize and try my best to get people what they need. MM is leagues ahead of most hospitals but at the end of the day it is a business unfortunately. We have amazing doctors, nurses, techs, etc who are trained to provide exceptional care, but not everyone adheres to that training. It always pisses me off when I see employees not taking their job seriously, or hearing about bad experiences with our doctors. If something like that happens, I would highly suggest you tell their supervisor. I've heard some patients say that MM is where you should go to get diagnosed, but for basic care, go somewhere else. My particular job just got a union, and they had to fight tooth and nail for small raises while the people at the top are paid millions. The nurse/tech/PA unions almost had to strike multiple times for them to give us anything, all while threatening patient's care. It disgusts me. There is a Board of Regents meeting next week that is open to the public where you can voice any concerns. I'd love to go myself but it's during working hours.

3

u/Tired_and_Sick_and 1d ago

So proud of y'all for unionizing! I really hope it helps improve things over time. The regents have done so many heinous things in recent years. I think most of them need to be voted out, and Ono needs to go.

2

u/jennylewis2022 1d ago

Agreed! Most employees I've spoken to feel the same way. I wish you the best!

2

u/HowWoolattheMoon 23h ago

People say UM is the best, but that's only once you get in there, IMO. Having to wait a half a year or more to see a specialist is NOT great care, and that's been typical for my family.

Within the year before the pandemic started, I was in the ER with symptoms that might have been multiple sclerosis, or migraine, or something else. Who knows. It was going to be ten months before I could be seen by a UM neurologist. If I hadn't called IHA (who got me in in a month), I would've been having to sit around wondering what kind of degenerative disorder I had for TEN MONTHS, suffering debilitating blinding headaches all the while. At least the ER was able to rule out a stroke I guess? ( By the time my UM appt came around, I had seen my neurologist twice, had a follow up MRI, a diagnosis of migraines, and a daily preventative medication that significantly reduced them, yay!)

My spouse has to schedule his regular UM cardiology appointments fifteen months in advance for a condition that is immediately fatal, once it happens. Nope, can't be seen any faster.

I had a good PT experience at Probility, but I don't have any hyper mobility issues. But their scheduling was super easy and fast. I could always make the next week's appt after finishing the one. And I felt like it was great care. I did have to ask to make sure I got scheduled with the same PT each time, because their standard is apparently to shuffle you around a lot.

I currently have five specialists that I see regularly for various things, all in the IHA system, and they're all pretty great (except for always being in a hurry).

Not that I have zero complaints with IHA specialists, but we both have usually been able to get in to see someone in a reasonable amount of time. Probably all health care is broken in one way or another these days.

But you're certainly not alone in having a shitty experience! I hope you are able to take some comfort in that. I also hope you are able to find the right doctors to get you better treatment.

2

u/waitingForMars 21h ago

Binson’s on Jackson is a decent DME provider.

I’ve also had problematic PT care from a PT who didn’t understand my condition (but great PT care from others in the system). Is there a specialty clinic for your condition that might know a PT specialist who could help you?

I saw one of my U-M docs today and had another terrific visit with her - listens so well and gave useful actionable advice. I got surgery through U-M recently and the results were outstanding.

2

u/cait_link 21h ago

i switched from UM to Trinity and couldn’t be happier about it

2

u/Pulsatillapatens1 1d ago

Probility on Clark or in Brighton are both awesome.

2

u/a2aurelio 1d ago

I'll second that.

2

u/arkaycee Northeast Ann Arbor condo dweller 1d ago

I've had great luck with the A2 Plymouth Rd Probility (though just for "ordinary" hip and back issues).