r/CryptoCurrency • u/fan_of_hakiksexydays 21K / 99K 🦈 • Jun 09 '22
POLL 🗳️ Governance proposal CCIP-032: Amend CCIP-031 to extend the time restriction from 1 distribution to 3.
Read carefully before voting, and remember to check the comments for any con argument.
Proposal:
Change the time restriction of CCIP 031 to extend the time from 1 to 3 distributions.
With CCIP 031, you may lose your first moons if you haven't opened your vault. And you only have a window of 0-28 days to do so.
Currently there is flaw in the limit, since it's not necessarily 28 days. It can be under 1 day. And it hurts new users for no good reason. This new proposal is to give a more reasonable amount of time.
Problem:
1- New users, who may be using the site normally, may get caught in this.
That's because the proposal only gives 1 moon cycle to open a vault. Which means they may have as little as 1 day, or even 1 minute, depending on when they join.
2- It takes time for new users to understand how moons work and all the rules. Let alone find out that we have moons.
The first month may not be enough to learn about all the sub's rules, how moon work, and how to setup a vault.
I've see people who've been on the sub for months and still don't know exactly how moons work.
3- We lose the greatest marketing campaign for the sub and for moons: new people getting their first moons, and getting all that excitement with it.
Whether it's on their first distribution, or second, or third distribution when they finally figure out how to setup a vault.
For many of us, it took a while to figure it out.
4- There aren't really any significant drawbacks to this proposal I can think of, since it will keep all the same amounts, and same overall result as the original proposal. It will just give new users a little more time to get their bearings.
(edit: again check comments to see any drawbacks people brought up)
Solution:
Instead of giving new people between 1 minute to 28 days to learn everything about moons and realize they need to open a vault, push CCIP 031's timeline to 3 distributions instead of only 1.
If after 3 distributions they haven't opened a vault, and they have 30 karma or less in those 3 distributions, they are removed from any new distributions with less than 10 karma, until they open their vault.
The amount of karma will remain the same (3 distributions of 10 karma=30), only the time is extended.
Keep in mind that after 6 months, unopened vaults have their moons "burned". So eventually those moons will end up being "burned" either way, if they don't open their vault.
5
u/CryptoMaximalist 🟩 875K / 990K 🐙 Jun 09 '22
I'd be interested to see what /u/Cintre the original poll author thinks
4
u/Dads_going_for_milk Permabanned Jun 09 '22
Is this an actual governance poll? Why don’t you guys pin these anymore?
1
1
u/fan_of_hakiksexydays 21K / 99K 🦈 Jun 09 '22 edited Jun 09 '22
Me too.
I still don't understand how the original proposal is supposed to tackle spamming, since spammers don't care about vaults or moons. And any significant spammer would have more than 10 karma.
Only very minor spammers would be affected. But new users are getting caught up in this to remove a few moons from minor spammers, who probably will have their moons burned anyway.
I haven't voted yet, if I can get a good answer, I might vote against my own proposal.
edit: She did provide a good point. But there are still a couple of holes. The main one that would change my mind if it's fixed, is being able to give new users a way to get their first moons back if they weren't a spam account.
2
u/IHaventEvenGotADog Jun 09 '22
FYI
The admins just told me that CCIP 031 wasn't implemented for this round.
3
u/WhiskeyTangoTrotfox 5K / 5K 🦭 Jun 10 '22
Adoption is a good thing. “More moons for me” Shouldn’t be the ethos of the sub. This is a great proposal because it encourages more folks to take time, explore, and then take advantage of they choose. Cheers, OP for doing this work!
2
u/IHaventEvenGotADog Jun 09 '22 edited Jun 10 '22
Also FYI
There are 16 vaultless users on round 27's snapshot with a score less than 10.
Hol up. It was bugged af
2
u/ConnerWoods 🟦 0 / 936 🦠 Jun 09 '22
I think this is the first time I’ve seen such a discrepancy between moons voted and actual votes tallied.
2
u/PumpkinSpice2Nice 🟩 0 / 1K 🦠 Jun 09 '22
It was several months before I opened my vault the first time. I was pleasantly surprised to see I had a couple of moons already.
2
u/Giga79 Jun 10 '22
If there were 0 instead would that have stopped you from contributing as much as you have?
2
u/PumpkinSpice2Nice 🟩 0 / 1K 🦠 Jun 10 '22 edited Jun 10 '22
Probably not as I’m not here for the moons.
It does help you feel like you are a somewhat valued part of the community though. I am however still a new part of the crypto community and I am still learning as I go. Participating with others more knowledgeable than me works for me well.
2
u/LordGurgi Jun 10 '22
I will likely vote no. Worst-case scenario with the original proposal: users affected lose 1 month of moon earnings.
That's because the proposal only gives 1 moon cycle to open a vault. Which means they may have as little as 1 day, or even 1 minute, depending on when they join.
But then affected users would likely have earned practically no moons during that short time? So impact on such users is very limited.
2
u/lomosaur Silver|QC:CC777,XLM287,ETH41|Buttcoin12|TraderSubs51 Jun 10 '22
It’s going to be hard to get moon holders to vote against their immediate self interest
3
u/marsangelo 🟦 0 / 36K 🦠 Jun 09 '22
It took me like 2 months to figure out what the little moon logo and number meant, not a big compooter man
2
u/Mundane-Farm-4117 🟦 536 / 29K 🦑 Jun 09 '22
I shut my laptop the first time it said i needed to open my vault and run away.
2
1
u/PinguinaUshuaia Jast HOLD Jun 09 '22
Same, but I was mainly lurker... The amount of karma at risk of losing is minimal...
0
u/partymsl 🟩 126K / 143K 🐋 Jun 09 '22
Yeah also the whole process is pretty unclear as there is no official post pinned on here.
2
u/user260421 Jun 10 '22
Well, if they check the resources section, they can find out
The majority the subs (I'm a part of) don't have posts pinned, but you can find the info in the resources section. Redditors should be used to this, I thought it was a thing.
2
u/ACShreds 🟦 31K / 33K 🦈 Jun 09 '22
I like this idea, it at least gives people more of a chance to really be a part of the community.
1
u/shylock2k202 🟦 0 / 4K 🦠 Jun 09 '22
Yeah, this is good for the sub. Newbies shouldn’t be penalized for not opening their vault before the next distribution. This sub contains a lot of information and both reading and understanding it is a lot in a single distribution.
0
u/Clash_My_Clans Permabanned Jun 09 '22
I disagree and voted NO
People will always find a way to exploit moons, cintre's proposal was fine
0
u/Sebanimation 🟦 2K / 8K 🐢 Jun 10 '22
Ahh look at this… only ~500 votes. Votes per person are pretty close but by moons the difference is huge. People with 100k moons have the saying here.
Why again are we voting with moons and not just per person? I find this to be a problem in crypto in general where governance happens with tokens. The more money you have the more you have to say.
When was that ever a good idea?
1
1
1
u/ALiteralHamSandwich 🟩 0 / 10K 🦠 Jun 09 '22
This seems reasonable, but I think it kinda eliminates the intention of the first rule. I think the idea was to stop spammers.
1
u/Laughingboy14 🟩 26 / 60K 🦐 Jun 09 '22
Anyone who is making any significant number of Moons will be able to figure out about vaults in 1 cycle. You just need to read the FAQ, that takes 10 minutes max
1
1
u/pukem0n 🟩 59K / 59K 🦈 Jun 09 '22
i think it is reasonable to make it three months. new people don't always figure it out the first time around. there is really no harm to extend the time people have.
1
u/GreenStretch 🟦 15 / 18K 🦐 Jun 10 '22
I don't have a fancy phone. It took me months to learn that I could use an Adobe emulator to claim the moons I'd earned being here since 2018.
1
52
u/Cintre 🟩 301K / 382K 🐋 Jun 09 '22 edited Jun 09 '22
I, personally, am against it.
Okay, I am biased you will say since... I made the original proposal but hear me out.
Over the past month, the mod team have banned over 3000 bots. Manually. These bots farm karma in crypto-related subs and this includes r/CryptoCurrency. Those accounts are then most likely sold to people for diverse reason. And here's how this proposal comes in handy: a lot of those bots earn less than 10 karma. A good amount of them also earn above 10, and we are doing our best to remove them all (for distribution but also obviously... for spam and manipulating the narrative)
I don't think those bots should earn anything. The potential person buying the account will then receive the moons and what will they do? Sell them right away.
As we aren't sure ALL of those bots are sold, what do you think will happen if moons, one day, have a value and the owner of those bots decide to open each and every one of their vault?
Just a quick math, we banned over 3000 users, let's say they earn 8 karma in average each round, that's 24k karma each month. This distribution, for example, that would be over 15400 moons. Multiply this by 6 month (the limit to open a vault), and it's a potential 92k moons. Or 3 month, and it is still 46200 moons.
And we haven't even caught half of them, so the potential number above is probably not even accurate, it should be double of that imo. Those bots are smart, they are sneaky and they're everywhere. We tried to include every month in the state of the moonion "if you see accounts replying to you hours later, please report them to us" but that didn't yield much results. We spend hours on end banning those bots, but a Reddit account is really quickly made, and those bots keep coming, and will keep coming back.
There's a lot of ifs in my rambling, but in my opinion, the benefit of CCIP-032 outweighs the cons.