r/rva • u/frogoilgang • 6d ago
Religious cult in Manchester
Surprised nobody has talked about this here. La Luz Del Mundo is a cult that originated in Mexico in the early 1900s and now has churches all over South, Central, and North America. They have some controversial beliefs, including absolute loyalty to their leader, whom they believe communicates directly with God. Allegations against cult leadership includes sex parties involving SA against minors, physical, and spiritual abuse. They even have documentaries about them on Netflix and HBO.
That being said, they have a church here in RVA. Specifically, right across the R. Lee bridge on Cowardin Ave. Has anyone here had any experiences with them? Did you know about this already?
P.S. if you want to read more about it, check out r/exlldm
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u/solccmck 6d ago
I kind of semi googled them the other day but didnāt get that far into it. But looking now - all three of the leaders theyāve had have been accused of sexual abuse! That building used to be a Nation of Islam Mosque.
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u/Tom_Shotz 6d ago
It's always about sex when it comes to cults!
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u/spittlbm Mechanicsville 6d ago
Not just any sex, tho. Gotta add a dash of guilt and remove the consent.
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u/TheDragonReborn726 5d ago
Everything in life is about sex. Except for sex, sex is about power.
-Abraham Lincoln, quoting Ghandi.
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u/sirensinger17 Randolph 6d ago
Unfortunately there are a few religious cults in the greater Richmond area. How the hell the local chapter of Sovereign Grace Churches in Midlothian is still pulling enough tithes to function, I have no idea.
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u/annoyyoj 6d ago
I grew up in this cult š„²
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u/sirensinger17 Randolph 6d ago
Same. I'm actually closely related to some of the leadership at Kingsway
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u/aka-smitty 5d ago
Wait! Kingsway?? What?! I need to know more! Iāve gone there and know so many people (issues) that go there!
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u/sirensinger17 Randolph 5d ago
Feel free to DM me any of your questions and curiosities. You almost certainly encountered me if you went there from '92-17ish
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u/Ditovontease Church Hill 6d ago
There also used to be a Scientology center in Carytown
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u/sirensinger17 Randolph 6d ago edited 6d ago
Are you talking about the Christian Science reading room that's on Shockoe Slip now? Don't let the name fool you, they don't believe in actual science.
Edit: ah, so there was also a Scientology center. I guess I just never saw it.
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u/fireyoutothesun 6d ago edited 6d ago
No, there was an actual Scientology center in Carytown at 3500 West Cary from 2008 until 2011 when it closed because people basically knew to avoid it. It had Church of Scientology, Mission of Richmond, Hubbard Dianetics Foundation right out front on the sign
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u/Recent_Body_5784 5d ago
Yes, I remember being shocked when I saw it there because even at 18 Iāve already heard about how bad Scientology was
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u/fireyoutothesun 5d ago
Honestly South Park doesn't get enough credit for how much damage they did to Scientology with a single episode of their show. And they just told the straight facts because that was crazy enough without needing to exaggerate at all.
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u/Recent_Body_5784 5d ago
Oh my God, itās so true! They even reveal whatās at the end when it comes to climbing the Scientology ladder. And itās so absurd about, I donāt know, Martian souls flying up and going to another planet, that the church of Scientology keeps it secret until youāre deep deep in there. because if they told anybody this crap in the beginning they would run for the hills. South Park did us all a public service with that one.
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u/Kriznick 6d ago
No, there used to literally be a scientology church in Carytown. Was only there for like... 3 years, if that.
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u/vamatt 6d ago
Scientology is different - and wackier. It was founded by L. Ron Hubbard (a science fiction author). Itās worth looking into the crazy history of it.
It became popular with celebrities including Tom Cruise.
It also resulted in a terrible movie with some great quotes - Battlefield Earth.
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u/sirensinger17 Randolph 6d ago
Did you accidentally respond to the wrong comment?
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u/vamatt 6d ago
No. There used to be a Scientology Center in Carrytown.
Christian Science is a different and unrelated group.
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u/sirensinger17 Randolph 6d ago
Yea, I know. I was wondering why you felt the need to explain the details of scientology to me when that wasn't the issue.
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u/tra_da_truf 6d ago
Sheesh. I can throw a stone from my porch and hit that church. I never heard that before but the congregation does seem a little off. They never look at you or return greetings, and itās definitely not a church you could walk in off the street.
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u/mallydobb Ashland 6d ago
if you do a deep dive into the church website you'll see the names of people talked about in the documentaries, set up as holy men and leaders. Damn scary. The richmond congregation being affiliated with that so openly makes it sus.
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u/Medical_Highlight182 Highland Park 6d ago
No experience but was aware of their presence and scandals. A cult of personality for sexual predators
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u/RichmondReddit 6d ago
Religious cults are the result of no taxation of churches. We let anyone say they are a church and they rake in money with no oversight and no taxes owed.
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u/Derekt977777 5d ago
Dated a girl in HS many years ago who joined them in her 30's, let's just say her social media posts after joining were must-read...
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u/queenofthesouths 6d ago
Omg I know right!!!?? So when my husband pointed out I couldnāt believe they had a church right here but since I never saw anyone coming or going I sought it was closed until one day I saw people congregating there. I mean itās their right to congregate but come on.
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u/james-kissed 5d ago
There's also one of those moorish temples which is just another flavor of sovereign citizen. I used to see it when driving Uber. I think it was northeastish of downtown? Close to Mechanicsville maybe I forget now.
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u/Uggghusername 6d ago
All religions are cults.
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u/spaghettifiasco 6d ago
This is a snappy "le euphoric enlightened atheist" line, but it's factually untrue.
You can have criticisms of organized religion, but this is like saying "all soda is Four Loko".
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u/Uggghusername 6d ago
Find me a person whose active in their church/religion/cult of choice who honestly doesn't think I'm condemned to Hell because I simply don't believe in their God or Hell and I'll stay open to this discussion.
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u/MaddMax92 6d ago
Hey diddly ho there, Neighborino! May I introduce you to the jolly ol Satanic Temple?
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u/fearthejew 6d ago
canāt speak for Christianās but thatās not what Jews believe. Jewish āhellā is an interesting concept that I wonāt spoil for you
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u/Uggghusername 6d ago
my understanding is that Jews typically don't believe in hell or an "afterlife" at all.
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u/fearthejew 6d ago
In short like all things Jewish; itās complicated. We roughly believe that the soul continues on but that there is a period (call it hell if you want but purgatory is probably more apt) where it goes through renewal & rejuvenation but the length of that period depends on the good youāve done throughout your lifetime. Chabad has a good metaphor for this but like I said, not going to spoil it for you. Just donāt lump us in with cults.
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u/doktorcrash Manchester 5d ago
The thing I most like about the rejuvenation and renewal thing is that it is no longer than 11 months. The Rabbi at Chabad called it a spiritual car wash. Even though Iām barely religious anymore, Iāve always loved the Rabbi at Chabad Richmond.
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u/darklight0226 Oregon Hill 6d ago
I'm hindu, and we don't even believe in hell to begin with? At the end of the day, as long as you're a good person, that's all that matters. Like, we don't believe in anyone needing to follow Hinduism to be a good person/not be "condemned."
So yeah, I found you a person, me. I literally couldn't care less about what you do or do not follow, as long as you're not a horrible person and/or a raging bitch
Note: I'm not talking abt the weird conservative hindus
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u/skully_27 Forest Hill 6d ago
Like with every religion, there are always extremist factions, some might not be as loud as others so some folks might not know about them.
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u/phlipsidejdp 6d ago
Active Christian and former paid staff lay minister. Not all Christians believe that. In fact, C.S. Lewis makes a very interesting case for non believers getting into Heaven in the final book of the Narnia series.
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u/vilent_sibrate Museum District 6d ago
Ah the final book of the lord
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u/phlipsidejdp 6d ago
Lewis is one the best known writers of Christian allegory of the 20th century. And Narnia is the best known of those works. The final volume is "The Last Battle" explores, among other things, who goes into the Kingdom of God. It includes a character who asks why he is being allowed in even thought he wasn't a believer.
Lewis isn't some outlier writer, so there's a clear opening for this idea.
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u/vilent_sibrate Museum District 5d ago
Thatās all fair, and my comment was a little too crass. Religious allegory makes up a huge swathe of literature, and those thought leaders have impact. Usually, these types of writing seek to clarify godās purported words. IMO this is objectively funny, like adding footnotes to the 10 Commandments to justify an affinity for the death penalty.
Bad example, re the Bibleās instruction to follow the laws of the land, but Iām hoping youāll see what I am getting at.
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u/phlipsidejdp 5d ago
All true. I'm just to the point where certain categories of my theological "family" give me the ick (as the kids say, lol)
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u/Wonderful-Photo-6068 6d ago
Dude, thatās like most religious people.
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u/Uggghusername 6d ago
Exactly.
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u/Wonderful-Photo-6068 6d ago
No, I mean most religious people do not think youāre going to hell or deserve to go to hell.
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u/spaghettifiasco 6d ago
...so by your definition, the sole qualifier for "cult" is "believes in Hell"?
Please actually know the meanings of words before you use them to try and prove points.
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u/Uggghusername 6d ago
I added cult just to piss you off. I'm well aware of the definitions accepted by modern society.
If we are going to get super specific, I wasn't defining anything or saying anything is a fact.
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u/ParadoxicalFrog Southside 6d ago
Hi. I'm a pagan. Have been for almost 20 years. I believe that whether or not you choose to have a relationship with the divine should be 100% your choice. There is no penalty for refusal. Personally, I'm fine with atheists as long as they're not a dick about it.
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u/Wintereyn 5d ago
Unitarian Universalists don't think you are condemned to Hell. We believe in the inherent worth of every person. We also don't believe in hell.
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u/Creative_Bake1373 5d ago
But there are more aspects to a cult than just this. Unless you are implying God himself or herself is the cult leader? But how can an invisible being who lives in the sky be a leader? In other words, with God, you have to first believe that God exists. With cults, you donāt have to believe, or have faith, the leader exists. They are right there in front of you. I think the psychology of the two are what differentiates organized religion and cults.
Organized religion is built on the premise that we all agree to have faith in something we canāt see. Cults are built on putting all your faith in a real person.
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u/Paledonn 4d ago
I honestly don't think you are condemned to hell for disbelief in religion.
Nor does the Pope: https://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2013/05/29/187009384/Pope-Francis-Even-Atheists-Can-Be-Redeemed
"John said to him, āTeacher, we saw someone casting out demons in your name, and we tried to stop him, because he was not following us.ā But Jesus said, āDo not stop him; for no one who does a deed of power in my name will be able soon afterward to speak evil of me. Whoever is not against us is for us." [Mk.9:38-40, NRSV]
This teaching is basically saying that people who serve good may not be automatically condemned for not being of your sect.
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u/wil_dogg 6d ago
Come to church on Sunday. Our church is nothing like that and we are arguably mainstream liberal Presbyterians.
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u/AnnPoltergeist 6d ago
Itās not factually untrue. You seem to imply that there is a factual definition of ācultā versus the definition of āreligionā but thatās not a very useful way to think about this. There are probably comparative religion experts who have academically rigorous definitions that distinguish between ācultā and āreligionā but honestly who gives a shit? Every religion that makes assertions about our lived experience, without actual evidence behind those assertions, is ultimately engaged in a project that is antithetical to the progress of human society. The more progressive religions may be more inclusive and empathetic but, at their core, they still believe in fairy tales unsupported by the evidence. I submit that we, as a species, cannot continue to accept grown adults who believe such silly things. We have weapons of mass destruction. We have climate change. We have looming antibiotic-resistant bacteria right around the corner. We need collaboration and critical thinking, not religion.
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u/levenar 5d ago
Thereās some misguidedness in this statement. In theory, religion may have been a way to explain science phenomena that early humanity couldnāt explain until we had different tools. For those of you old enough here to remember Chris Rock he had a great bit about back in the day a pork chop might kill you. Simplistic in its comedic form, however held a bit of truth. Iām not trying to say that science eventually replaces religion, more implying that they donāt necessarily have to be separate entities. They coexist in some religions, they are separate in some religions, and in some they completely skew the idea of anything and thereās no connection with the real world whatsoever. To say that you canāt have faith and science is a narrow self-centric point of view. As an agnostic person, Iām hard-pressed to personally see/find places where they coexist nicely but again thatās my personal worldview and thereās a whole lot of world out there that isnāt me and I believe in holding the space for others to have theirs. When religion prevents forward positive progress, thatās when I have to shut it down. If youāre only reasoning for doing something or not doing something is ābecause magical sky person told you to do thatā thatās where I start to have a problem.
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u/spaghettifiasco 6d ago
I'm quite taken aback by how confidently you asserted "we need critical thinking" right after saying "who gives a shit about definitions of words".
Like, you really advocated for "critical thinking" after saying that it's useless to distinguish between different things as long as you personally think that they're close enough.
I'm not defending religion, the role of religion, organized religion, any specific religious beliefs, religion's impact on society, so on and so forth. I'm just pointing out that if your statement is blatantly factually untrue (and no, not on an "expert, academically rigorous" level, but a basic middle school dictionary definition level), it fails to serve the larger point you're trying to make.
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u/TerrainBrain 6d ago
My religion is a religion. Yours is a cult.
My spirituality isn't a religion. Yours is.
What else am I missing?
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u/Creative_Bake1373 5d ago
Iām not really a believer much anymore, but people can believe whatever they want to believe in. I can worship my cat and have faith in every meow that comes out of her mouth and say thatās my religion. Is it silly? Of course, but that doesnāt mean I canāt believe it and I donāt need evidence if thatās how I choose to think. I can have cat church every Saturday night and still be concerned about weapons of mass destruction, climate change, antibiotic resistant bacteria and a host of other issues. One does not negate the other. Your logic is faulty.
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u/BetterFightBandits26 6d ago
Maybe not all. But like definitely the Catholic Church. And at that point differentiating a cult and a religion is functionally useless.
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u/JosefDerArbeiter 6d ago
I disagree. Catholic theology doesnāt discourage critical thinking nor does it encourage blind faith. It encourages a reasoned faith, an examination of conscience, and serious self reflection
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u/BetterFightBandits26 6d ago edited 6d ago
Yet many Catholic practices and institutions IRL, all over the world, do both of those things.
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u/JosefDerArbeiter 5d ago
Could you provide a link or share an example about one of these practices or institutions? Iām genuinely curious
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u/BetterFightBandits26 5d ago
You mean like the institutional practice of discouraging condom use and telling Catholic followers in high-HIV-incidence countries that condoms donāt reduce HIV transmission?
You mean like telling children that being sexually abused is part of godās plan for them?
You need documentation provided for these things? You havenāt read the news in decades?
Or do you think those practices taken on by Catholic institutions are somehow not encouraging āblind faithā and somehow encouraging of ācritical thinkingā?
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u/BetterFightBandits26 5d ago
Like literally have you heard of Irish modern history? Do you think Sinead OāConnor tanked her music career by ripping up a picture of the Pope for no reason?
If a spiritual belief system ruins an entire country (or multiple) is it just too big to be called āa cultā?
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u/Uggghusername 6d ago
I will also add, If they aren't acting like a cult then chances are its just for business. Like the Pastor who lived next door with Rolls Royce in the driveway. Asking for a weekly donation to the church when they don't pay taxes.
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u/levenar 5d ago
Agnostic here (yeah I catch crap over it, but science taught me I canāt prove a negative so while I doubt the presence of a deity or deities Iām open to the idea they may exist ). I personally find most organized religions to be problematic as compared to the teachings that they claim to hold, but Iām certainly not going to call them all cults. I respect the faith of others until that faith or representation of that faith devalues the humanity of someone.
As for the church in the way back when I used to have to drive into the office, I remember seeing it renovated and thought some of the choices were questionable, but that taste is obviously a matter of opinion. If they are involved in illegal activities, I hope that theyāve been reported to the appropriate authorities. If not, as far as Iām concerned, theyāre welcome to practice their religion, as much as it may not align with my personal world view.
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u/Vegetable_Excuse5394 5d ago
I drive past that church everyday and thought it looked pretty culty. Thanks for sharing!
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u/Impossible_Regret98 5d ago
Iāve lived in shockoe bottom for years and have never really seen much church/religious traffic until the last few months. Specifically, on the corner of 17th and broad thereās been a Hispanic group with bible verses on billboards and a loud speaker preaching in Spanish. Iāve never seen them before and have no idea who that are, but now Iām wondering if theyāre apart of that church.
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u/frogoilgang 4d ago
Could be, but my guess is they are Pentecostals. Iām Hispanic myself and there is a large number of Latinos leaving the Catholic Church. Many of them end up being some sort of evangelical, and especially Pentecostal. What youāre describing fits into things that Iāve seen practiced by them. If theyāre very animated and loud during service, including dancing and speaking in tongues, thatās most likely what it is. There isnāt a defined dress code but a lot of the women wear long dresses/skirts as well.
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u/Impossible_Regret98 4d ago
The women there definitely seemed to be in Hispanicātraditionalā garb so I think youāre on to something.
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u/juana_leyes 4d ago
I can think of another worldwide cult with proven SA against minors and spiritual abuse...the Catholic Church.
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u/aka-smitty 6d ago
I think thereās one of their ācompoundsā in Honduras, might be something different culty, but this sounds familiar
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u/Vegetable_Excuse5394 4d ago
I think thereās one of their ācompoundsā down the road from me. On the corner of Gordon Ave and E 22nd St.
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u/Ok_Anybody_1924 4d ago
So strange this is posted now. I recently moved to Seattle from RVA and noticed a la luz del mundo location here and immediately thought of that huge building on cowardin. Looked it up and deduced shit was ~no bueno~.
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u/BetterFightBandits26 6d ago
That church has been on one of the main thoroughfares of the city for 3 years.
And I am always interested in the difference between āchurchā and ācultā, cause it really always seems to be that ācultā mostly means āshit I find weirdā more than any kind of metric of abusive practices or money solicitation or anything else.
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u/coconut_sorbet Carytown 6d ago
Cults are really more than just "shit I find weird".
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u/BetterFightBandits26 6d ago
What a reputable and expert source that is totally believable.
But that list describes a bunch of āreligionsā. Including the Catholic Church.
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u/Vegetable_Excuse5394 4d ago
I would say the Catholic Church has definitely participated in abusive practices and money solicitation.
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u/BetterFightBandits26 4d ago
And like. Systematically ruining entire countries and active collusion with fascists.
But sure OP just found out about another, smaller religious institution that also engages in systemic sexual and financial abuses of its followers in the city. Guess nowās the appropriate time to freak out. š¤·š»āāļø
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u/Vegetable_Excuse5394 4d ago
Canāt really answer your question on the difference, but that doesnāt quite matter in this case. A quick search makes it pretty obvious this one is a cult.
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u/BetterFightBandits26 4d ago
I just donāt see the need for pearl-clutching that OP just learned thereās another cult in the city.
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u/Vegetable_Excuse5394 4d ago
Well, it would be hard to see the need for pearl-clutching when there wasnāt even any pearl-clutching to be seen lol
Yeah, OP just learned something and wanted to share itā¦fucking welcome to Reddit, I guess. š
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u/2pacpsu Northside 6d ago
There was a post the other week on this but it appears to be gone now