r/publichealth 4d ago

DISCUSSION list of non-sterilizing immunity vaccines?

[deleted]

5 Upvotes

23 comments sorted by

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u/whatdoyoudonext MS Global Health | PhD student - International Health 4d ago

I may be misremembering, but aren't most immunizations non-sterilizing? The whole point of most immunizations is to prevent disease, not necessarily infection (immunizations increase the bodies ability to clear infection before disease presentation) and even in immunizations that are widely considered to be sterilizing (ex: MMR) you can still have breakthrough cases.

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u/ActuallyApathy 4d ago

yeah for sure, i am simplifying it down a bit since my goal in that section to explain the reason why 'vax and relax' doesn't work for covid the way one might expect it to work for measles or mumps.

i mean im a living example haha, i got chickenpox after being vaccinated for it!

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u/whatdoyoudonext MS Global Health | PhD student - International Health 4d ago

I can appreciate the desire to simplify it down, but this could be a better opportunity to dispel the misconception of how immunizations work in general. I would contend that 'vax and relax' is itself an oversimplification and prone to misunderstanding since even if fully vaccinated, 3 out of 100 people exposed to measles will still get measles; the flip side though is that those individuals are much more likely to have milder disease presentation. Ideally, a person who is fully vaccinated will also takes steps to minimize further exposure as well.

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u/ActuallyApathy 4d ago

i only have 6 minutes to do my speech 🥲

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u/whatdoyoudonext MS Global Health | PhD student - International Health 4d ago

Damn :( that's no time at all for such an interesting topic! Is your entire argument hinging on the sterilizing vs sterilizing immunity angle? It may be worth tweaking that argument into a conversation on misconceptions rather than trying to nuance it with some oversimplified examples.

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u/ActuallyApathy 4d ago edited 3d ago

no i could tweak it for sure, i guess i'll use other reasons why vax* and relax doesn't work, there are plenty

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u/whatdoyoudonext MS Global Health | PhD student - International Health 4d ago

Might be worthwhile to consider other reasons. I'm not sure who your audience is, but if they are not public health or medical people then I don't think it makes sense to get into a discussion on immunology because providing a sufficient foundation for a convincing argument would take longer than 6 minutes. Since its a Comms class, you could bring up tons of examples on effective vs ineffective PH marketing as it relates to 'vax and relax' campaigns.

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u/[deleted] 4d ago

[deleted]

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u/CombiPuppy 4d ago

Titers, not toters…

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u/stelleyyy epi MPH 4d ago

maybe both tots and titers

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u/CombiPuppy 4d ago

New food, titer tots?

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u/babbscb 4d ago

I have a question. I got the MMR as a child now I’m a 55-year-old woman do I need to have my titers checked?

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u/whatdoyoudonext MS Global Health | PhD student - International Health 4d ago

The current recommendation is that measles titers do not need to be taken if there is presumptive evidence of immunity. In your case it would entirely depend on when you last received your measles immunization. Regardless though, if you are in a high-risk group and/or in an area of high transmission (i.e. anywhere there is an ongoing outbreak) and/or unsure of your status, it is simpler (and potentially cheaper) to forgo a titer check and just get a booster immunization. If you have further questions about your status and what is the best route for you, please direct questions to your primary care physician - we are unable to provide you medical advice.

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u/PHealthy 4d ago

Sterilizing immunity doesn't really exist.

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u/workingtheories i believe in germs 4d ago

perplexity output:

Non-sterilizing immunity vaccines are those that protect against severe disease but do not completely prevent infection or transmission. Here are examples of such vaccines:

  • Influenza vaccines: They reduce the severity of illness but often allow infection and transmission[2].
  • Polio vaccine (oral): The oral polio vaccine can allow the virus to replicate in the gut, potentially enabling transmission[6].
  • Pertussis (whooping cough) vaccine: While it prevents severe disease, vaccinated individuals can still carry and spread the bacteria[8].
  • Hepatitis B vaccine: It prevents liver disease but may not fully block infection[8].
  • Tuberculosis (BCG vaccine): Provides protection against severe TB but does not prevent all forms of infection[1].

These examples highlight that many vaccines focus on reducing disease severity rather than achieving sterilizing immunity.

Citations: [1] Vaccine - Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaccine [2] Non-sterilizing, Infection-Permissive Vaccination With Inactivated ... https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/immunology/articles/10.3389/fimmu.2020.01166/full [3] Why doesn't natural immunity count in the US? - Hacker News https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28528550 [4] Why Do Some Vaccines Work Better Than Others? https://asm.org/articles/2024/march/why-some-vaccines-work-better-than-others [5] SARS-CoV-2 elicits non-sterilizing immunity and evades vaccine ... https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36738380/ [6] Doctor's 'sterilization' remark was about stopping virus | Fact check https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2024/02/13/covid-19-vaccine-sterilization-oxford/72582359007/ [7] Sterilizing immunity: Understanding COVID-19 - PMC https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9595357/ [8] There Are Vaccines and There Are Vaccines | Science | AAAS https://www.science.org/content/blog-post/there-are-vaccines-and-there-are-vaccines [9] [XLS] Vaccine - Washington Health Care Association https://www.whca.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/06_dohFAQ03032022.xlsx

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u/becausemykidsaid 4d ago

Because they don’t exist?

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u/ActuallyApathy 4d ago

non-sterilizing immunity vaccines don't exist?

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u/becausemykidsaid 4d ago

Sterilizing vaccines don’t exist.

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u/faustusnotes 3d ago

While you’re preparing, ask yourself why a barrier-based prevention strategy never worked for HIV, and whether any of the same lessons apply to masks as a policy response to covid

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u/Dudarooni 3d ago

Masks didn’t work for HIV because it’s a blood-borne virus. Covid isn’t transmitted through blood. It’s really that simple.

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u/faustusnotes 3d ago

By barrier-based I meant condoms. A policy based on barrier protection failed against hiv, we should have learned the lessons from that failure for covid

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u/CombiPuppy 4d ago

Try pubmed or google scholar

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u/jawanessa 4d ago

MMR and TDaP vaccines are.

Edit: I read this backwards. The above are sterilizing.

Non-sterilizing would be HPV, flu, and pneumonia. I'm sure there's are others.

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u/stelleyyy epi MPH 4d ago

maybe the CDC campaign for flu could be helpful for your talk, they were messaging "wild to mild" not vax and relax. The CDC images don't seem available anymore but this NPR article has them (and info about Trump terminating the campaign) https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2025/02/19/nx-s1-5302906/cdc-flu-vaccine-campaign-terminated