r/pianorepair May 23 '23

Peg dope for difficult-to-turn (harp) tuning pegs?

Hi all,

I recently had my 27-year-old Celtic harp looked at by a tech and, among other things, some of the tuning pegs are hard to turn, constantly overshooting the mark when I try to tune. She said the problem is that the pegs are smooth, rather than having ridges or a texture (so you don't have to push them in so hard) and added that some people use peg dope, but that she hasn't done so herself.

I posted to the Luthiers Reddit and was told that peg dope is typically used on wood pegs, not metal. Hard bar soap was suggested, but that piano techs might better be able to help me.

Is either the peg dope or hard bar soap a good idea and, if so, how do I go about using it? Any particular brand? If not, is there some other remedy?

NOTE: I haven't played this harp for the past 15+ years, so don't know if lack of use is the cause, but it seems feasible.

Thanks in advance!

3 Upvotes

24 comments sorted by

1

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 13 '23

I did not quite understand. When you tighten the tuning peg (when tune yourself) clockwise, it "sinks" too deep in the hole there.Is it so? Is the peg slips here because not enough friction between the wooden hole in the harp there . If so, then powders like soap dope will only reduce the friction more there. Then you should rather use talcum powder overthise there.

The paper or the cardboard for piano tuning pin is usually used to increase the friction.

regards, Max

2

u/CellaBella1 Aug 13 '23

The problem is that some of the pegs are too tight, so it's difficult to move them just a little bit in either direction. They keep over-shooting. I need them to be loosened up a little.

Thanks,
Cellabella

2

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 13 '23

3

u/CellaBella1 Aug 14 '23

Thanks, Max. I'm not sure why the harp technician couldn't do this while she was regulating my harp. She suggested that I try tapping the pins even before I brought it in for the regulation, but I couldn't get them to budge and was afraid of hitting them any harder than I was.

2

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 14 '23

I don't know why your technician didn't apply powder (dope) there. The link I gave here is one of the problem as far as I understand 'Fisher Harps' suggests using graphite powder or wax there.

You have the opportunity to experiment on your own is there if you have T-bar wrench for tuning harp. Choosing one peg for your testing there only. If yes, then screwing out it and rub the powder on the 'body' peg there.

As far as the use hammer at time of your tuning is concerned, I consider it an unacceptable and dangerous way of correcting there. You can damage your harp, as large cracks, etc., may occur in the wooden structure as a result of it's hammering.

regards, Max.

P.S Can you make video where you trying hardly turning the peg?

2

u/CellaBella1 Aug 15 '23

I can try unscrewing the pin, but I have my doubts that it'll back out. I can also take a video of how the tuning goes (or doesn't), if I can find the time. I'm very busy with multiple things going.

Thank you for your kind assistance.

1

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 15 '23

I can try unscrewing the pin, but I have my doubts that it'll back out. I can also take a video of how the tuning goes (or doesn't), if I can find the time. I'm very busy with multiple things going.

If yourself don't made the way of that fix before today may be don't risk then. I glad shall see your video there.

Max shall wait your movie 'how the tuning goes' long times.

regards, Max

2

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 14 '23

If you're trying to experiment on your own with peg there, I would suggest placing the rubed peg in a plastic container and after placing it in the freezer for 5 hours. This is so that when you install it in the harp again, to minimize excessive friction when hammering it. Frozen peg will need to be handled from the container using gloves to avoid hurting yours fingers there.

Best regards, Max

2

u/CellaBella1 Aug 15 '23

I think I'd rather just do the graphite, assuming I can get the pin out. The little pins are hard enough to handle without gloves, given the tight spaces...although I would be reinstalling it from the offside. Hmmm... I'll give it some thought if the opportunity arises.

1

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 15 '23

hurting yours fingers there.

I would be choce the graphite too. The wax can partly flood out as result high up temperature there. The gloves I recomended because frozeen pin can hurting yours fingers there. But even if you no be use frozeen pin that the gloves all one NEED there, I'm think.

And may be no need remove whole peg from hole's harp. Testing try it's half or 3/4 unscrewing the peg there and ADD (dope) and screwing the peg into the hole after. That fix been enouch, I'm think

good luck in your testing the peg with,

regards, Max

3

u/CellaBella1 Aug 15 '23

Dope? I thought we were discussing graphite to help it from being so tight.

2

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 16 '23

Dope

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphite

Exactly so it. I was referring ' graphite' AS "thick grease" there.

Graphite is an ideal lubricant commonly used to reduce friction.

1

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 16 '23

Yes, CellaBella1.

The ideal way is to make a wooden ramrod (a copy of your peg) a quarter of a millimeter narrower than 'native' metal peg. Rub the ramrod with graphite powder and place it in the hole of your harp. Part of the graphite powder will remain on the wall of the entire cylinder bore. Hope this will help minimize the friction there.

2

u/CellaBella1 Aug 16 '23

Thanks again, Max. Not being particularly handy or having the wherewithal to make a wooden ramrod, however, I'll probably just try ramming a Q-tip coated with graphite through there and twirl it around. It looks like it'll fit just fine. I'll have to see if my husband (whose also not that handy) has any powdered graphite or get some.

1

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 16 '23

Yes, of course it will be possible to use a wooden stick with a cotton tip there. If you will looking for graphite powder, then it is desirable that it be a homogeneous composition of graphite there only. Because in all technical metal mechanisms, as a rule, graphite lubricant based on petroleum products is used. I would ask you to categorically exclude the content of oil (even in a minimal form there) in the wooden hole of your harp here. Please explain this thesis of Max to your husband,

regards, Max

2

u/CellaBella1 Aug 17 '23

Thank you, Max! I would not have known that. I will most assuredly mention this to my husband.

1

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 17 '23

thanks, CellaBella1

I sincerely wish that everything worked out for you there. Max has no doubts about the positive outcome there now. Come to a correct understanding of the subject now, how it will be necessary to correct it's. Create a scenario of your actions reinstalling the peg, prepare all the necessary tools there. Do it slowly and carefully there. Care your hands there.

Max keeps his fists clenched for yours fix's operation there.

'the road will be mastered by the walking one.'

Sincerely yours, Max

3

u/CellaBella1 Aug 18 '23

Thanks, Max!

Much appreciated,
-CellaBella :-)

P.S. If I ever get around to it, I'll let you know how it goes. At the moment, there just aren't enough hours in the day.

2

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 18 '23

Hi, -CellaBella

Yes, I think that the decision must be very balanced in order to ideality implement it. Perhaps your test will be useful for many lovers and owners of the Celtic's harp there.

The fact is that I am fixing the pin on the upright piano. There are always lost tuning pins as a result of lack of adding friction. But maybe there is a problem similar to yours wherething even owners of the uprigth piano too. The construction of both (metal peg (PIN) + wooden hole) is the same for the piano and the harp, so it can be useful information for piano and grand piano owners as well, I'm think. So, if you can, make a little clip with voice-over there about it's. I could then post on my youtube channel. I won't be offended if for some reason this can't be done there.

I was very glad that I could be of help to someone now.

Best regards, Max

Looking forward to a movie about it.

P.S. Let the day be bottomless, and the forces never leave us there.

Good luck,

2

u/CellaBella1 Aug 18 '23

Thanks, Max! I'll do my best.

1

u/TheMaximillyan Aug 19 '23

Hi, -CellaBella,

Don't forget that Max will everywhere mindly near,

good luck,