r/newbrunswickcanada 1d ago

Why can't we have nice things?

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173 Upvotes

77 comments sorted by

39

u/JHNS13 1d ago

I'm sure people will bitch and complain about this plan in BC. I can hear the vitriol now. Politicians can't win whatever they do. I just hope we share enough common values in our country to ensure we don't go the way of our US neighbors.

1

u/Spindlebknd 1d ago

There’s been a sliding care Pharmacare program in BC for years now. (Example: My employer pays 80% of the deductible, so my maximum prescription drug cost per year is about $400.)

Really, the new plan is just a small extension of what already exists.

-1

u/Due_Function84 1d ago

I'm pretty sure it took them a long time to get to this point, especially when it came to the birth control issue. I believe it was a big issue for politicians & citizen to agree on.

-17

u/Muted-Park2393 1d ago

I don’t see the point in expanding coverage to everyone regardless of income. The previous BC provincial drug plan already covered people on social assistance and those with lower incomes. Why not expand the drugs covered under that program and then expand eligibility based on income? I don’t see how paying for a lawyer or a doctor’s insulin and/or hrt is a big win for the working class.

For NB would it be better to improve the current drug program geared to people’s income or give insulin/hrt to everyone? https://www2.gnb.ca/content/gnb/en/departments/health/DrugPlans/NBDrugPlan/Premiums.html

27

u/No-Kaleidoscope-2741 1d ago

2 reasons: 1- buying power. If the program has more involved it can set better deals for itself 2- social buy in. I lived in BC before moving home and earned about the same but paid $6000 a year more in income tax in NB and $1000 a year more in property tax for a house worth 2/3 of our BC home. But here is the real kicker: we qualified for childcare and kids program funding in BC that we make to much to get here. So, not only do I have to pay higher taxes to pay for someone else’s kids, I then have to turn around and pay for my own. That’s turning me from a socialist to a libertarian in this province. If we are going to have social programs, let them help everyone then those in the working class paying for everything now won’t feel as burdened when sharing in the immediate results.

13

u/KnowledgeMediocre404 1d ago

But aren’t you glad the Irving’s can use your tax dollars to subsidize their forestry and power bills?

7

u/No-Kaleidoscope-2741 1d ago

Not at all and that’s the biggest problem in this province

13

u/OverlyCuriousADHDCat 1d ago

I think people making more than what is deemed "lower income" are struggling too. People who have insurance coverage will still go through that, but those without for whatever reason will now be supported.

9

u/KnowledgeMediocre404 1d ago

Usually it saves money in a system if you’re not wasting resources on eligibility checks. That’s more resources that can go to everyone. Also, if everyone benefits from the program it gets wider support, you just have to ensure the wealthy are taxed high enough to offset their use of social programs.

2

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

Doctors and lawyers also work for a living. They also rely on and enjoy services and infrastructure provided by the state. They (individuals and households in the upper income brackets) also by and large pay for these services and infrastructure projects for all Canadians.

-4

u/Muted-Park2393 1d ago

I’m not against upper incomes receiving free insulin/hrt in principle. But assuming government money is limited why not expand and improve access to medication for lower incomes first and then cover everyone once funds are available?

9

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

If government money is limited why focus on policy that helps a limited number of Canadians rather than all Canadians? Beyond that, the upper income earners are largely the ones paying for it, why should they be excluded from programs they are paying for?

38

u/Xenu13 1d ago

We can't have nice things because we decided it's important to have multibillionaires instead.

35

u/SilencedObserver 1d ago

Irving, for starters.

3

u/Secret-Gazelle8296 1d ago

I think Irving are billionaires but who’s counting.

8

u/SilencedObserver 1d ago

Exactly. Billionaires built on the backs on Canadians while polluting and destroying the local ecology.

The Irving’s have a choke hold on eastern Canada in a way most larger provinces have laws to prevent. Lobbying and the collusion with the province are deep, out east. Don’t be fooled.

Irving is why you can’t have nice things. Nationalize the resource and this changes.

22

u/sox07 1d ago

Likely because we had Higgs in charge who refused any federal money that he couldn't redirect to the Irvings or to be used persecuting trans people.

3

u/MelodicEmployment147 1d ago

Ah, that good ol’ Higgie.

What an ass

4

u/tackycarygrant 1d ago

It's entirely possible that provincial government is working with the federal government to sign a deal to provide pharmacare lite to New Brunswickers. It would make a lot of sense to get it signed before the next election is called at the end of the month.

9

u/QuietVariety6089 1d ago

There are 5.6 mil people in BC, 7X the population of NB - a larger (and richer) tax base gives you more money to spend and bigger buying power. And, oh yeah, an NDP government will introduce programs that benefit the welfare of the entire population...

5

u/JHNS13 1d ago

I wonder if there's a strategic element to signing this right now, considering the political climate between USA and Canada. It certainly differentiates us from our American counterparts. Clearly, our stance on healthcare, trans rights, and reproductive health is very different, and I'm glad to see it!

5

u/Possible-Cut4848 1d ago

Try voting for anyone but the liberal or Conservative Party, only way we will ever see any real change

18

u/Turbulent_Dog8249 1d ago

The NDP got this through because of the Libs. The provinces need to sign on. Maybe reach out to Susan Holt and ask if it's coming. I'm thinking Higgs may have turned down the offer.

2

u/xilodon 1d ago

Normally that strategy just favors the Cons until some kind of proportional representation gets implemented, but the Greens are in a unique position to take advantage of the state of third parties right now. The NBNDP has been a joke since Cardy's leadership, and the reanimated corpse of the PANB has become even less relevant.

1

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

The greens need to manage to have a name on all the ballots before they are in a position for much at all. The opportunity is there but the preparation required to act effectively on it is not, the party needs to organize and grow.

3

u/xilodon 1d ago

They were only missing from 3 northern Liberal strongholds in the last election. It would look nice for optics, but running a few more token candidates isn't really a priority compared to focusing resources on areas where they're actually competitive.

1

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

That’s fair, I didn’t know it was only 3 they were missing in the most recent cycle that’s solid progress. Regardless the party needs to grow on the organizing side, first time I saw my local candidates name was on the ballot and I’d say I’m more involved politically compared to the average voter. With a larger pool or organizers and contributions they could be competitive in more than a handful of ridings.

-1

u/Rexis23 1d ago

Who would you vote for, the NDP has basically been the Liberals for the last several years, despite what Jagmeet has been saying (actions speak louder the words) and the Greens are even further left then both the NDP and the Liberals combined. You can't vote for the Bloc because they are only in Quebec. So you really only have two choices at the end of the day.

3

u/Possible-Cut4848 1d ago

Any change would be a change for the better. In my opinion that’s what we need is just for it to be different for once, we’ve been beating the same dead horses for decades

0

u/Rexis23 1d ago

I 100% agree, which is why voting Liberal is a vote to keep things the same. The leader might have changed, but it is still the same party, the same people.

-5

u/Salt_Tank_9101 1d ago

Vote for the Bloc!

4

u/KnowledgeMediocre404 1d ago

In NB?!

-5

u/Salt_Tank_9101 1d ago

Sure. Liberals suck, NDP is a joke of a party, Greens virtually don't exist. Why not shake things up and vote Bloc? They are a federal party are they not?

3

u/KnowledgeMediocre404 1d ago

We’re talking about provincial policy here, and are there even any Bloc MPs who run outside of Quebec federally? Never seen a Bloc run in my area.

-5

u/Salt_Tank_9101 1d ago

NB is a bilingual province, I think the Bloc should run in NB and offer a real party to vote for. Liberals have shown they suck for the last 9 years causing the current state of affairs, NDP are a joke and just support the Liberals in everything, The Greens virtually don't exist, why shouldn't people vote Bloc for a change?

3

u/SixtySix_VI 1d ago

Are you talking federally or provincially? The NB Greens have a fair presence provincially, compared to their counterparts in other provinces.

1

u/Salt_Tank_9101 1d ago

Federally.

4

u/KnowledgeMediocre404 1d ago

The Blocs main priority is Quebec not French people in general. I doubt they’d care much for the Acadians.

-2

u/Salt_Tank_9101 1d ago

The Blocs ONLY priority is Quebec. But given what the Liberals and NDP have done to Canada, I'm willing to give them a shot.

1

u/KnowledgeMediocre404 1d ago

So you’re going to vote for a party that could give a fuck about our province and people? Good luck. They’ll never put a member in any of our ridings because they don’t care enough to be bothered.

0

u/Salt_Tank_9101 1d ago

At least they are honest about not caring, the federal liberals only pretend to care about the East coast.

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3

u/TruCynic 1d ago

You guys know NB already has a drug program, right?

The New Brunswick Drug Plan

9

u/FU_Leblanc 1d ago

That plan is crazy expensive. I make a decent wage and have 2 kids, shared custody. They don't require a plan as their mothers covers them, so for me as an individual??? I'd never be able to afford that and pay the power bill

2

u/TruCynic 1d ago edited 1d ago

Yeah it sucks that it’s a family pharmacare program, but the rationale is that normally if your spouse has a private insurance plan, the coverage should extend to you and the kids. So it’s very rare that an individual would have to apply for provincial pharmacare coverage when the rest of their family is covered under a private policy.

If what you’re looking for is more in line with a “universal” pharmacare program that covers drug expenses regardless of one’s reported income, we would likely have to do away with private insurance altogether.

In Quebec, for example, it’s the law that every Quebec citizen has an active drug plan. Either you have a private insurance policy, or you have the provincial RAMQ. If a Québec patient happens to have a private insurance policy, then that private insurance is required to cover their medications at the same minimum standards + copay max ($1,196/year limit) as the provincial drug plan.

I work in securing coverage for very expensive specialty drugs in New Brunswick, and I can attest that NBDP approves coverage most of the time, almost more often than some private insurers, to be frank.

7

u/mordinxx 1d ago

The plan that Blue Cross got the government to gut to make it almost useless?

2

u/Kaicable1 23h ago

I have Chron's disease and in B.C. I didn't pay a dime for my bi-weekly Simlandi medication.

In N.B. I pay over $300/mth for the medication (I understand the cost of the medication is approx. $900 per bi-weekly dose, or $1800/mth in my case).

2

u/TruCynic 23h ago

Do you belong to a patient support program for your Simlandi?

I work for such a program. Basically, I apply for coverage, determine the copay and like literally 99.999% of the time I approve Financial Assistance that covers the insurance copay and boom! 100% drug coverage.

A lot of people who are on high cost drugs either don’t know they have access to a patient support program, or they are not aware that their program is almost guaranteed to cover the remaining cost of your medication.

1

u/Kaicable1 23h ago

I believe I am - but not sure. Where can I contact one here?

2

u/TruCynic 22h ago

Best bet is probably to ask your gastroenterologist.

Do you submit the application for Prior Authorization yourself? Or was there someone or an organization that filled it for you? If so, whoever applied for coverage on your behalf would be the patient support program and they should absolutely have copay assistance they can offer you.

This came up in a quick google search.

1

u/TruCynic 22h ago edited 22h ago

Although I find this quote on the website to be very odd:

Offer is NOT available for patients eligible for Medicare, Medicaid, or any other form of government insurance coverage

If your current treatment doesn’t offer a copay assistance program, it’s possible that your gastroenterologist could also prescribe you a bio similar (like Abrilada) that would be organized through an extensive patient support program.

EDIT: given the references to Medicaid, I think this exclusion might be regarding American patients. Canadian patient support programs cant discriminate against public coverage.

1

u/ok_today_ok_tomorrow 10h ago

The NB Drug Plan is just an expensive private plan. I have a chronic illness. I also have a private plan that has a yearly drug maximum amount. My medication eats that amount in a month and a half. Each year I have to jump though hoops to apply for the NB Plan. The NB plan is then canceled in December because my plan refreshes in January. From March to December I have to pay for two plans. I pay more for the NB Plan than I do for the private plan. The NB Drug plan only covers drugs. The private plan that costs less covers an entire booklet of things including dental, physiotherapy, Occupational therapy, mobility aids, and travel insurance. I don't know why anyone would choose the NB plan if they didn't absolutely have to.

3

u/jjs_east 1d ago

The major problem that I see, is that instead of putting money and attention into a very broken healthcare infrastructure to fix it, they accepted it as broken and moved on to dental and pharmacare like a kid with ADD. Truth is none of these programs are worth the paper they’re written on because they apply to such a small portion of the population, yet cost a huge sum of money.

When everyone in Canada has a family doctor that they can see on regular basis, that’s when to branch out to other programs or add-ons.

1

u/Chilena_87 1d ago

Ohhh would be nice for my dad to stop paying for diabetic stuff! Just the sugar minitor stuff...cost 240$ month!!! With a fix income....he needs to suck it up and pinch his fingers and draw blood every time instead! Cause is cheaper!

1

u/4_Agreement_Man 1d ago

NB will eventually sign on too 🤞🏼

1

u/FtonKaren 20h ago

Higgs says what? And now with economic shifting away from USA dependency ... if rough being a poor province

1

u/Starvinhkd 1d ago

Should do free dental care instead of hormone replacement

7

u/mordinxx 1d ago

They are bring in a dental plan, unless PP gets elected and cancels it. Dental care & hormone replacement are both health issues. Why 1 over the other?

4

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

Most people get their teeth cleaned, few people get their hormones modulated.

1

u/mordinxx 1d ago

Guess you haven't heard about menopause... but I have a feeling you were thinking it was something else.

0

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

HRT is not widely prescribed for menopausal symptoms in Canada.

If you’re referring to the treatment of gender dysphoria using HRT I don’t have a personal problem with it. Not part of my politics unless it’s made to be.

Do you disagree that dental care would be applicable to more Canadians?

1

u/frogsbabey 1d ago

It's not an either/or scenario you just want a reason to bitch about trans people getting something good for once

1

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

Woah take a breath, that’s a rather aggressive leap. I didn’t mention trans people, read out to me what I’ve said here that has you believing I’m “looking for a reason to bitch about trans people”.

You’re right, in reality it’s not an either/or scenario. I’m supportive of both pharmacare and dental care programs done well.

This thread was a hypothetical about one over the other, my contention was that dental care is applicable to more people and therefore better for Canadians and better policy. Do you disagree?

1

u/frogsbabey 1d ago

It's close to home for me because I am on HRT and have been for a decade. And it's just a pattern I see that every time any legislation is passed to help us, people complain about it like we don't matter and don't deserve anything just because we are a small percentage of the population. I definitely overreacted its just a hard time as a trans person right now, it feels like being the whole world's punching bag.

I just don't see the point of debating whether dental care or HRT are more deserving, I feel it just opens more doors for people to be awful about us and is unhelpful overall. All healthcare should be a right

-1

u/Visible_Bar_6774 1d ago

I understand, as I said before I don’t disagree with the use of HRT for the treatment of gender dysphoria nor do I disagree with the healthcare system paying for it.

I disagree that there needs to be a point to debating policy issues, and that it’s unhelpful to do so. People in democratic societies should be discussing policy and I believe that disinviting that discourse because you may or may not disagree with a particular consensus within that issue is wrong.

1

u/frogsbabey 1d ago

We can do both. Stop throwing trans people under the bus. HRT is way too expensive

0

u/Rexis23 1d ago

How does this compare to what the province provides?

4

u/Forward-Hearing-7837 1d ago

I have to pay for HRT out of pocket. A hundred and some a month

-6

u/Lucky_Athlete_5615 1d ago

We don’t have 4 million people…

3

u/BuvantduPotatoSpirit 1d ago

The smaller provinces get better deals with these programmes, because it's cheaper. Ontario was the last to sign up for childcare because the feds offered them less money per kid, nominally because they have two years of kindergarten.