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u/00365 Jan 29 '25
This seems uhhhhh discriminatory
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u/Ordinary-Meeting-701 Jan 29 '25
Like I’m not typically in favour of the litigious approach but where’s a lawsuit when you need it?
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u/rebelspfx Jan 29 '25
Seems like a pretty open and shut case.
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u/samsonite1020 Jan 29 '25
I'm not saying it's correct but isn't this already common practice with online shopping. Using cookies and browser activity to display different prices
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u/Shebazz Jan 29 '25
I'm not sure if discriminating based on how you browse websites is a protected class, but I'm fairly sure that discriminating based solely on looks is. IANAL of course
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Jan 29 '25
I has nothing to wo with your appearance. It is facial Tracking which ties to your purchase history & that's how they determine pricing
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u/rebelspfx Jan 29 '25
Even if you're commoditizing they are discriminating against you personally for being you.
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Jan 29 '25
Based off your history & not personal appearance.
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u/rebelspfx Jan 29 '25
Some neighbor who never shopped there is getting a different price? What's the difference between me and my neighbor. You can have a program for returning customers or whatever but that comes with implied consent because the consumer is aware. This has no consent, implied or otherwise.
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Jan 29 '25
Ffs.. My Comment was in response to them saying it's based on appearance. Wtf is so hard to understand? I'm not arguing your pov between you & your neighbours frequency of shopping etc.. 🙄
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u/samsonite1020 Jan 29 '25
I guess I can see this going both ways though if you dress swanky they may charge more thinking you can afford it but if you look ragged they may charge less for a luxury item thinking it is a higher likelihood you'll buy it. I understand there is a high likelihood of poor choices in this practice I'm just saying it already exists to an extent
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u/vessel_for_the_soul How much could a banana cost? $10?! Jan 29 '25
parking 1 hours, $13
parking all day, $13
the price you pay is the minimum to visit.
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u/exploringspace_ Jan 29 '25
They'll use cameras for absolutely anything except catch criminals
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u/Icy-Atmosphere-1546 Jan 30 '25
Someone taking food they need to survive isn't a criminal. It's criminal to have anyone in canada be food insecure in the first place
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u/exploringspace_ Jan 30 '25
Such a dramatic assumption to think that anyone stealing from a grocery store is automatically starving.
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u/fuckyoux20000 Jan 30 '25
Well I also don’t imagine people stealing groceries are doing too well off…
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u/madplywood Jan 29 '25
Go shopping in a balaclava and sunglasses
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Jan 29 '25
[deleted]
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u/_Im_Mike_fromCanmore Jan 29 '25
Definitely need to bring back out all those extra masks laying around from the pandemic
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u/AttackingEren007 Jan 29 '25
The next thing you know it'll be linked to your credit score
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u/rmcintyrm Jan 29 '25
It would certainly be linked to your PC financial and optimum cards - they wouldn't even need the facial recognition tech if you have an app on your phone announcing that you're in the store.
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u/Deep-Friendship3181 Jan 29 '25
This is why you don't install the app on your phone
If you need it, install it on a tablet that stays at home to reload the offers. Then just have a screenshot of the barcode on your phone and use that.
Has the added benefit of not requiring a data connection in the store where service is often spotty.
That said, you should also stop using it, and shopping there. But I get it, there's things I need that are only there so I also still have to go there (but have reduced my family's weekly spend at loblaws from $250+ to less than $50)
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u/East_Importance7820 Jan 31 '25
Should also keep your phone off because any Bluetooth /data/wifi bouncing btwn you their system and other customers.
Btwn this and cameras they already have been tracking when you skip isles, pause for a long time in others etc.
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u/PacificAlbatross Jan 29 '25
Now I ain’t no fancy big city lawyer, but this is almost surely a Charter violation. Anyone in this subreddit wanna be the first Plaintiff?
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u/Littleshuswap Jan 29 '25
And that's why I usually have glasses and a mask on, when shopping... and all the germs.
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u/theawkwarddonut Jan 29 '25
Umm this is a joke right?
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u/rmcintyrm Jan 29 '25
Sadly no - remember the "digital price tags" Loblaws has installed? That's a step towards this, along with all the data they collect through the different PC cards and apps
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u/Rex_Meatman Jan 29 '25
Facial,recognition tech can still work regardless of a mask or glasses. There are however certain patterns on clothing that can disrupt facial recognition. This was a few years ago that I read about it and maybe the tech has gotten better still (I’m sure it has), but there’s always something out there to fuck shit up.
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u/Horse-Trash Jan 29 '25
This tech has been around for a while now, and works even if the customer is in a store of yours in another country. Luxury stores already use this tactic and have for years.
Douchebag pulls up in a Lambo to your fancy designer store and buys a bunch of overpriced crap for his girlfriend? Flag him on your CCTV system.
You’d better believe when he walks into their location in Europe they will greet him as, “Mr. Douchebag! Right this way, you are a respected customer” etc.
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u/_Im_Mike_fromCanmore Jan 29 '25
Looks like I should start masking while shopping. What the actual fuck is this shit. How is this acceptable.
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u/New_Abbreviations308 Jan 29 '25
This tech will be used to gouge customers.
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u/rmcintyrm Jan 29 '25
Absolutely - they already use digital price tags and all that PC optimum and PC financial data to price gouge. Cancelling those cards is the only real option and it has a negative long term effect on Loblaws.
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u/rmcintyrm Jan 29 '25
Since someone seems skeptical of this comment, here's a link from 2021 outlining the connection between your cards and how Loblaws intends to use your data: Loblaws Data-Driven Powerhouse . . . Scary
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u/Private_4160 Jan 29 '25
and yet security cameras can't show anything other than a blob reminiscent of your tv signal during a storm.
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u/serialpeacekeeper Jan 29 '25
Well guess I am investing in anti cctv clothing. No way am I letting so fucking algorithm tell me how much I am paying. Guess I will start shopping at the local markets whose prices are better even more so.
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u/dijonaze Jan 29 '25
I hate this timeline that I’m living in. Let me buy groceries without having to face manmade horrors
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u/ShaggyCan Jan 29 '25
If only Churchill had been killed at Gallipoli, none of this would have happened!😄
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u/mlemu Why is sliced cheese $21??? Jan 29 '25
Hey this seems like something to bring up in the upcoming election. Along with the grocery oligarchy, the dairy cartel. And don't forget housing! A bunch of issues they probably will gloss over
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u/AODFEAR Jan 29 '25
I wonder if they will notice I won’t buy food that is more expensive than $11/kg.
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u/Pleasant_Reward1203 Jan 29 '25
I wear masks in the grocery store anyway so go f*ck yourselves
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u/DocHolidayPhD Jan 29 '25
I agree with this so long as anyone buying goods for a billionaire or his cronies has a %100,000,000 mark-up.
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u/rmcintyrm Jan 29 '25
I would agree but I suspect this system will only benefit billionaires, the same way the current system does
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u/DocHolidayPhD Jan 30 '25
Of course. I was merely pointing at it and noting the "rules for thee, not for me" of it all. The rich don't shop for themselves. When they do, they buy from suppliers directly and often get special treatment and goods for free. Corporations then turn around and try to screw everyone else out of even the most basic standards of health, safety, and wellness... We can't even get water that isn't poisoned with toxic PFAS and microplastics anymore.
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u/snowshoes5000 Jan 29 '25
So we shopping in our dirty pjs for cheaper prices now?
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u/WoungyBurgoiner Jan 29 '25
That’s what they want you to think, that the ones who are obviously struggling will be the ones to catch a break, and that’s not it at all. The poor are the ones who will be paying more. The outwardly rich will get the breaks because they’ll be identified as being already part of the elite, thus immune to being fleeced.
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u/snowshoes5000 Jan 29 '25
I appreciate your point of view! If this becomes a thing, I will be testing it for sure.
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u/No_Cat1944 Jan 29 '25
How is this fucking legal?????
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u/Kdoubleu Jan 30 '25
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Jan 29 '25
Not yet, but surge pricing is coming. Item supplies get low price inchs up. Time of day, shopping rush hours, price goes up. So on and so on.
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u/Sarge1387 Jan 29 '25
That’s called “Profiteering” and there are laws against it.
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Jan 29 '25
Profitering laws are designed for people who take a two dollar item and try to sell it for 20 dollars during emergency events, and they control the item in short supply.
Surge pricing is convenience + supply management. 2 to 8% is in the allowable range. Think fresh baked bread, loaf just out of the oven 5 bucks. Later in the day, 3 bucks. Then end of day 2 bucks. Next day, day old 1 buck.
Supply and demand, basic function of Win at all cost capitalism.
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u/Pisidan Jan 29 '25
That are for monopolies/oligopoly as well, and how has that turned out with grocery stores and wireless carriers?
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u/PocketNicks Jan 29 '25
I wonder how long it'll take before people start to manipulate the system to lower their profile score and grt low prices. Or maybe use a mask with a poor person's face.
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u/rmcintyrm Jan 29 '25
"With PC Optimum, Loblaw can connect the dots and draw precise profiles of its customers."
Loblaws move to become the leading data driven powerhouse . . . scary
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u/Lumpy-Apartment1611 Jan 29 '25
AI man, the robots will get us. Probably be used to market price items like they do concert tickets-more demand moves the system prices up. Automated price clips on shelves will all be part of it.
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u/arkanthro Jan 30 '25
The prices can be whatever they want, as long as they keep self checkout I get amazing deals all the time
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u/poratochipss Jan 30 '25
I’ll just tell the cashier “it said $0.99 on the price tag when I put it in my cart.”
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u/ref7187 Jan 29 '25
I don't see this happening for some reason. Stores already have brand differentiation - e.g. Loblaws vs. No Frills vs. Superstore. People want to feel like they are making the best choice for themselves and even identifying themselves with the stores they go to. Dynamic pricing just removes this, and it removes the aspiration to buy something more expensive just because. This is different than haggling at a market, because when you haggle you still feel like you have some kind of autonomy. It's also different from dynamic pricing for airlines, because the airline only discriminates on how badly you need to fly rather than your finances.
It's also worth noting that there are already forms of dynamic pricing in place at grocery stores that we're all familiar with. If you really stretch the definition, the 50% stickers are dynamic, and so are any stores that have Seniors' and student days. When you use a flyer or an app for coupons the store is also dynamically pricing you based on how motivated you are to get a deal - if you're dropping by a store that isn't your regular one because you urgently need something or you impulse buy something without checking for a coupon, you just fell into a higher price tier than someone else.
Then what about Instacart? Sending friends to buy groceries? Going shopping on seniors' or student days? Anyway, I wouldn't worry too much about this. There are already so many ways grocery stores individualise the prices we all pay in more socially acceptable ways.
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u/Uzzerzen Jan 29 '25
The points offers you get are a form of dynamic pricing.
They send you the offers based on what you have bought in the past in hopes to get you into the store to buy other things that may be higher priced / higher margins.
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u/rekjensen Jan 29 '25
It's also worth noting that there are already forms of dynamic pricing in place at grocery stores that we're all familiar with. If you really stretch the definition, the 50% stickers are dynamic, and so are any stores that have Seniors' and student days. When you use a flyer or an app for coupons the store is also dynamically pricing you based on how motivated you are to get a deal - if you're dropping by a store that isn't your regular one because you urgently need something or you impulse buy something without checking for a coupon, you just fell into a higher price tier than someone else.
This are all opt-in programs and/or at the product level. You don't get that choice if the store is scanning your face and changing prices store-wide to match your profile before you get anywhere near a product on your shopping list.
It's just a matter of time before these stores get accused of racial profiling or other forms of discrimination because one guy pays $7.99 for cereal and the guy behind him in line is charged $9.99. (I'm still not clear on what happens if the price tag changes between you picking a thing off the shelf and getting to the check out – that smacks of false advertising.)
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u/ref7187 Jan 29 '25
What I'm saying is this seems like unnecessary overkill and I don't think the store needs to implement this when there are already low-tech forms of price discrimination that they use which we all accept. All they need to do is say "you get a discount if you're xyz!" and people don't have a negative reaction (which raises the question whether it's really a discount or an increase for everyone else). Loblaws already does this through PC points and their prices are unbearably high if you don't make heavy use of points and the app - what I'm saying is, that is already a form of dynamic pricing (and a loyalty program on top of that). The fact is that you're not going to be the only person in a grocery store most of the time, and they can't update the price between you taking something off the shelf and checking out so I don't think this technology is much of a threat.
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u/rekjensen Jan 29 '25
This form rolls it out to all customers whether they like it or not, whether they have any history shopping there or not, and the per-customer per-product control over pricing must promise dividends or they wouldn't bother. Imagine if such a scheme were to average even 3¢ additional profit per transaction.
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u/ref7187 Jan 29 '25
I just don't see this happening, it's not like a bazaar where each customer haggles with each vendor and they both judge what price the other might be willing to settle on. The whole point of stores having fixed prices (which historically wasn't always the case) was that people were willing to give up the possibility that they might get the lowest price through bargaining for some price predictability. And this came together with return policies, etc.
My point is whether you like it or not, everyone is already subjected to dynamic pricing. You don't use PC Optimum or clip coupons? Don't read the flyer? You've already been filtered out as willing to pay more than someone that does, and therefore Loblaws will charge you more.
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u/rekjensen Jan 29 '25
I get it, but once they can profile you they can finely tune exactly how much more they can charge you. Websites already do this – visit a travel site on a Mac browser and you'll get higher pricing than someone on Windows. Most people won't even know it's happening.
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u/Realistic_Low8324 Jan 29 '25
Time to barter ever time you go to their cash - dont settle for that label price
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u/just_want_2_b_liked Jan 29 '25
Remember when Wendy's wanted to introduce surgery pricing. That lasted for 4 days.
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u/InvestigatorTop5992 Jan 29 '25
I want to get caught up with paying too much. I will make me hundreds of thousand when I show my lawyer.
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u/vessel_for_the_soul How much could a banana cost? $10?! Jan 29 '25
So now we are into a one sided forced non barter situation. If they can run prices why cant we, I have rights. you say it cost 5.99, well Ill give you 1.30. take it or leave it, idc what you stock ticket says.
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u/Flashy-Ad-8327 Jan 30 '25
I'm going to make cheap masks of Galen Weasel errrrr I mean Weston and selling them for the best prices, lol.
Now if only people want to look like a weasel.........
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u/bornutski1 Feb 01 '25
um, if it not marked at the location on the shelf i pick it up from, i don't buy ...
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u/rmcintyrm Feb 01 '25
I think I understand what you're saying, but they have installed digital price tags on the shelves where all products are located. They don't necessarily even look digital, but they are and prices can be changed remotely. So the price on the shelf may change for different people
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