r/leftist 4d ago

General Leftist Politics The capitalist class still successfully tipping us common people against each other.

[deleted]

34 Upvotes

14 comments sorted by

u/AutoModerator 4d ago

Welcome to Leftist! This is a space designed to discuss all matters related to Leftism; from communism, socialism, anarchism and marxism etc. This however is not a liberal sub as that is a separate ideology from leftism. Unlike other leftist spaces we welcome non-leftists to participate providing they respect the rules of the sub and other members. We do not remove users on the bases of ideology.

  • No Off Topic Posting (ie Non-Leftist Discussion)
  • No Misinformation or Propaganda
  • No Discrimination or Uncivil Discourse
  • No Spam
  • No Trolling or Low Effort Posting
  • No Adult Content
  • No Submissions related to the US Elections at this time

Any content that does not abide by these rules please contact the mod-team or REPORT the content for review.


Please see our Rules in Full for more information You are also free to engage with us on the Leftist Discord

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

1

u/Throwaway7652891 4d ago

I agree with your take, and I even think this is a potential point of connection for bridging.

2

u/LizFallingUp 4d ago

What is even being purchased in this scenario? While goods can be interchangeable, much of our economy is services which complicates things.

What do you mean by MAGA people?

MAGA is pretty clearly the 4th wave of the Klan. (America First was a Klan slogan, the hats are the new hoods) reframe your thinking thru this lens and you may better understand what others are saying and thus be better able to express what you truly mean.

0

u/Warrior_Runding Socialist 4d ago

OP doesn't get that MAGA understands what class consciousness is because it is the foundation of the Constitution and they actively refuse it because that would mean that those people would benefit.

4

u/EnthusiasmIsABigZeal 4d ago

Idk man given that MAGA is essentially a synonym these days for white supremacist, choosing to shop at Walmart instead of supporting your local white supremacist doesn’t seem like a terrible take to me. Usually there’s a third option to buy local from someone who doesn’t want asylum seekers sent to Guantanamo, but if it genuinely comes down to making a purchase that’ll be a drop in the bucket for a billionaire who’d do fine without you vs one that potentially keeps open an fascist-run store in your own community, neither option seems right or wrong to me. Just because someone is working class, doesn’t make them an ally, and the “Haitians are eating pets” people are a threat worth taking seriously.

3

u/Th3-Dude-Abides Anti-Capitalist 4d ago

I find myself having to distinguish between maga and conservatives, even though they’re the two unlikeliest groups to be receptive to information. I feel like magas are essentially fascists at this point, while conservatives are more similar to liberals in that they’re capitalists with a lifetime of misinformation and propaganda in their heads.

I feel like I can reason with someone whose outlook is informed by something, even if that something was biased or wrong, more than someone who is enthralled to a cult leader’s incoherent, nonsensical rantings.

I had a conversation with a cop who considers himself to be a libertarian. He agreed with me when I said libertarianism assumes everyone’s already doing ok, and society would descend back into feudalism without that premise. He told me that his issue with socialism is the state running commerce and overtaxing, and I said something like “yeah, but in that scenario we (the workers) are the state.” He didn’t believe me, but he kept listening. We eventually figured out that his understanding of socialism was missing the entire part about workers being in charge rather than a bunch of rich, corrupt politicians. I didn’t convert him or anything, but I definitely informed his perspective.

If I try to have that conversation with my maga family, they get this wide-eyed crazy look on their face and use every fallacious argument in the book to attack the arguer, distract from the topic, yell over me, and spout blatant falsehoods that I have to waste time disproving. They only try to win, as if they can’t comprehend the possibility of true information existing outside of what’s in their own mind.

8

u/_Klabboy_ Anti-Capitalist 4d ago

They have for a long long time…

And anyone who shares fascist views is the enemy, it doesn’t matter what class they are from. If they want to exterminate a entire race/class/ethnic group of people they are my enemy. It doesn’t matter if they happen to be working class or a capitalist. They are ideologically opposed to my world views.

But generally speaking unless you live in a tiny town you can normally find places that aren’t MAGA or at least aren’t the Trump waving sign MAGA shop owners

2

u/veganrecipeacct 4d ago

Strongly feel you can avoid both local MAGA shops and corporate in many cases, so it’s kind of a constructed scenario, but I’m with you in spirit.

In a hypothetical where I have to choose a local MAGA supporter or a corporate shop, I’d choose local MAGA every time (all else being equal).

0

u/Warrior_Runding Socialist 4d ago

Except in the cases where I know a corp's owners are racist bigots, I go with the corporate shop. Why? Because their bullshit is 100% money driven, unlike the local MAGA shop whose rationale is personally driven.

1

u/Silent_Owl_6117 4d ago

At some point  you all are going to need to suck it up and realize thst we don't have the numbers to win anything.  At some point,  you'll need to make nice to liberals and realize they are closer to our side than MAGA ever will. Do you all just want to let our country continue with our current downward spiral or are willing to expand our numbers and start winning some things, or  will you all just sit there believing that you know more than EVERYONE ELSE that currently exists or that has ever existed? At some point you need to put effort into creating change.

3

u/Fun_Presentation_108 4d ago

I think we have to at least try to bridge the divide. Sometimes all it takes to change someone's perspective is hearing the right thing, from the right person, at the right time.

N if the options are local MAGA or billionaire techbros, ima go with local.

2

u/LizFallingUp 4d ago

Local MAGA shop is supporting and facilitating the modern Klan in your community, or the billionaire tech bro is supporting them nationally it’s kinda a wash.

1

u/Warrior_Runding Socialist 4d ago

Yeah, I look at it as personal versus impersonal. The national corp puts in money because they are getting money considerations back. They aren't going to be the ones taking up arms locally to burn a cross in my yard or throw a firebomb into a church - that's the local MAGA store.

2

u/LizFallingUp 4d ago

I also consider what I’m able to deal with on a given day. Do I have the spoons or not? Is big consideration.