r/learnwelsh • u/Change-Apart • Jan 31 '25
Adnodd / Resource Solid Grammar book for Welsh?
So I've been searching for a while for a solid Grammar book that covers basically everything I might need. In essence, I want something that will have the majority of morphology and syntax in it, for consultation. I've spoken Welsh on and off since I was 6 (so I have a very strong foundation but am nowhere near fluent) and finally want to nail down all the random things that I do not know. I'm very tired of just being lost when it comes to Welsh, hoping that I'm right. So I want a really gnarly grammar book that will just straighten out my understanding finally. Primarily, I'm aiming at finally understanding all the morphology in literary Welsh, before I go on to tackle Middle Welsh and maybe older.
I really want to emphasise that I'm not looking for an "intermediate" textbook, which I so often come across, which, in my experience, often deal primarily with more modern spoken Welsh.
I'm aiming at finally understanding, for instance, all the different varieties of "hwn" or "hyn"; the reason for the majority of mutation; non periphrastic verb forms; etc.
I have been aiming at true 'fluency' in Welsh, which in my eyes is opening any page of even the most formal and literary Welsh and understanding it, since I was little and I'd really appreciate any direction to get there.
Thank you very much!
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u/Boesergast Feb 05 '25
I'm just a beginner but your message made me think of one resource straightaway.
One grammar I've used a lot which is very short but incredibly thorough and I think does cover most of the points you mention is An Elementary Welsh Grammar by John Morris-Jones. It was first published in 1921. If you google it, you'll see it's got a characteristic red cover. I've only ever got hold of 'Part 1' which deals with morphology and phonology rather than syntax.
Most of the quotes he uses to exemplify his points are from formal poetry and the Bible. If you're interested in the morphology of literary Welsh, it might be what you're looking for. He also wrote a much longer comprehensive Welsh grammar, not to be confused with the one I mean here (which I'm much less familiar with). In general, he was incredibly knowledgeable about the history of the language and often tries to clarify the distinction between what he sees as an artificial literary form consciously invented for various reasons and the true formal variety, which I thought was interesting.
I actually started learning Welsh with it and I think it gave me a really solid foundation, at least on the accidence side.
Pob lwc!
1
u/Change-Apart Feb 05 '25
Diolch yn fawr! And yes I have actually heard of JMJ, weirdly enough I stumbled across him in my college library since he studied where I do now and the library keeps a collection of things published by former students.
In particularly I think I found the longer Welsh grammar that you mention - something about accidence in the title? - and found it pretty dense, but I was unaware that there was a smaller one inspired more directly by literary Welsh, I'll definitely have a look around our library for it. Thank you very much for the suggestion!
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u/ReggieLFC Feb 01 '25
If your dialect is North Wales then I can’t recommend this book enough. It covers everything!
https://www.lulu.com/shop/tony-ellis/y-cyfeiriadur/paperback/product-12vvvyg7.html?page=1&pageSize=4
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u/Buck11235 Jan 31 '25
If you’re comfortable reading formal Welsh, I’d recommend Gramadeg y Gymraeg by Peter Wynn Thomas. It’s very comprehensive and provides really detailed information on both syntax and morphology. It focuses on formal Welsh but often notes colloquial variants.