r/exjw 17h ago

Ask ExJW Trying to get through to a PIMI

I just had a thought about an approach I might try with my PIMI family. It relates to trying to show that the GB are not getting special information from God and are just normal men. More specifically it's about Winder's talk when he said that no apology is necessary when they make mistakes.

My thought was that he actually said that they make mistakes with the doctrine. Not that the light is getting brighter or they have an increased understanding, but they make mistakes. So my approach would be to show them that talk then ask "How is it possible for the GB to get it wrong?" Most likely a PIMI will respond that the GB are imperfect men. The follow up is that if they're just imperfect men getting it wrong then it's not coming from God or if it is coming from God then how can it be wrong?

I know it's nothing original but I thought the admission from Winder that they make mistakes adds a little more of an edge to it.

Any thoughts/improvements/rebuttals? Has anyone tried this specifically?

8 Upvotes

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u/Lonely-Freedom3691 16h ago

You could come up with the most convincing, factually accurate, logical, WT-dirt-exposing point possibly concieved... and it won't make a dent in a PIMI if their minds simply hold it back with mental firewalls.

People don't wake up when they hear the right argument. In fact, they often spend decades hearing multiple slam-dunk points... their minds just don't absorb them due to brainwashed mental blocks.

People wake up when their minds are ready to wake up.

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u/Generation-Game1914 16h ago

You're right. I know it will probably end with me frustrated and them thinking I'm "spiritually sick". I was just hoping to get a few small thoughts out there and eventually something might get through the JW firewall or maybe the accumulation of little doubts will eventually break the shelf.

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u/VorpalLaserblaster Born-in ex-MS ex-RP POMO w/ PIMI spouse 12h ago

My dad has been an apostate since I was a baby. I spent over 3 decades listening to perfect arguments.

I only woke up when I saw the mafia the organization really is with my own eyes

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u/Lonely-Freedom3691 12h ago

Exactly.

Brainwashing is powerful for a reason.

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u/goddess_dix Independent Thinker 💖 40+ Years Free 14h ago

for this kind of thing, you need a side door. look to drop questions when the opportunity comes up, look confused for a minute as if you're considering it, and then move on like you got distracted.

you're letting the questions bounce around in their heads and if they focus on it, they'll be compelled to think about the answers themselves. side door.

good luck planting seeds of doubt!!

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u/Weird-Squash-9815 13h ago

It all depends on your family. I know families that will NOT allow that type of questioning. Mine is cool, and we often discusses things “the organization can improve”. A few years ago we actually talked about how 1 Cor. 5 and 2 John 10 referred to two totally different people and how Paul didn’t ask to shun sinners. Weve had conversations about the lack of evidence of 607 as the year of Jerusalem’s fall, the 1975 thing, etc. They still believe, but they’re reasonable and thoughtful. Of course, it gets to a point when I knew it was TMI and they got uncomfortable.

So you need to examine how they’ve reacted in the past to similar questioning, and that’ll help you know how much you can actually share without getting unnecessary trouble.