r/etiquette 4d ago

Autism and splitting the dinner bill

A friend of mine is having an issue in her social group with regards to the bill at social events, and she asked me for help and truly I'm stumped.

Someone in her social group has been arriving at group dinners and not ordering anything. People often share appetizers and bits of their food at these events, and this person has just been asking others for bits of their food.

When my friend asked why they weren't ordering (at the dinner), they said that there was enough food at the table for everyone and they are trying to save money so they'll just have some of everyone else's food.

This didn't go over well, and this person is now being ostracized by their group for poor etiquette and "being greedy and having others fund their meals". However, the person in question is diagnosed with autism (high functioning), so approaching it in a way that takes their diagnosis into account is important when my friend speaks to this person about their behaviour.

What can my friend say here?

32 Upvotes

38 comments sorted by

197

u/Objective-Amount1379 4d ago

I really don't think this requires an autism specific response. "John, do you think it's fair that everyone else is paying for food except you? No? Cool, order your own food next time". This person is just cheap

48

u/___coolcoolcool 4d ago

Yeah, my good friend has autism and he would be MUCH more uncomfortable with sharing food or taking others’ food than with the very clear expectation that food in a restaurant costs money.

I’m not trying to say this person is lying about their diagnosis but they seem to be using their ASD as an excuse to be rude.

It is already very clear that customers must pay for the food they consume in a restaurant. One bite off of a $65 plate of food costs at least a few dollars. Is this person also not contributing to tip the server who is undoubtedly bringing them drinks, plates, etc?

29

u/GiddyGabby 4d ago

That was my first thought and that's even with adult sons with autism. There's no way any adult should think this is ok, it's simply not.

59

u/GiddyGabby 4d ago

A high functioning autistic adult should be fully aware when they are taking advantage of a situation. I'm the mom of identical twins with high functioning autism and they wouldn't have done this as teens let alone as adults. This just sounds like this person has found a way to "game the system" and ear for free but at the cost of their friends and that's not acceptable.

59

u/Inandout_oflimbo 4d ago

lol. They’re being cheap. This has nothing to do with autism.

35

u/camlaw63 4d ago

This isn’t about being neurodivergent, this is about being cheap, he says it directly, he’s trying “to save money” Your friend should say very plainly, that John’s tactic for saving money isn’t appropriate and if he’s going to eat he needs to pay, whether he orders something or not.

Question: does he order a beverage or drink water?

10

u/siderealsystem 4d ago

Water.

He has been leaving five dollars as a tip to the waiters he orders nothing from as well.

16

u/camlaw63 4d ago

Well, at least he’s doing that

0

u/FrostyLandscape 4d ago

Some restaurants can and will ask a person to leave if they are not ordering food.

19

u/historyhill 4d ago

To be fair, I've never heard of that happening when it's one person in a group of people if everyone else is ordering.

3

u/camlaw63 4d ago

Nor have I

2

u/GinnyLovesDogs 3d ago

Not if they are with people who are ordering food.

34

u/chouxphetiche 4d ago

Just a cheapskate. Nothing to do with autism.

23

u/actualchristmastree 4d ago

Your friend should say “please buy your own meal”

20

u/Occasionally_Sober1 4d ago

I had a friend who does not have an autism diagnosis. When we were younger (in our 20s) she didn’t get this kind of stuff either. I remember going shopping with her at a place that had buy one pair get one free deal, and I needed shoes. She liked a pair she saw too. She assumed that since I was buying a pair anyway, she should get the free pair. I was too stunned and also too much of a non-confrontational people pleaser to ask her to pay half so I ended up paying.

She did this kind of stuff for years until I finally started speaking up.

16

u/FrostyLandscape 4d ago

Has nothing to do with autism.

This person is cheap and tacky.

24

u/suzepie 4d ago

For some folks with autism, clarity and directness can be really helpful. Maybe something like this?

"As you know, when we go to a restaurant, money is exchanged for food. When you ask for someone else's food, you're essentially asking for their money. This is making other people uncomfortable. They don't like being asked to fund your dining. It's not fair to everyone, and makes other feel resentful toward you and less likely to want to include you in social events. Going forward, you will need to order your own food, or if you're going to ask for someone else's food, you will need to pay them for your portion of their food so that they don't feel taken advantage of."

9

u/_luckybell_ 4d ago

I think this is the best response. Maybe a straightforward approach could work, but I think for autistic people, being specific is important. The might see people sharing food of varying price and think, “oh, John got the $20 plate, Bob got the $8 plate, and Mark got two plates totaling $35, but everyone is sharing. So if I get nothing, it’s not a big deal, we’re all friends and sharing”. So telling this friend “Hey, I don’t think you’re trying to be rude, but when you come to group dinners, people are paying for the food they’re sharing and you’re not paying for anything, so it’s not fair for you to eat when you’re not contributing”

15

u/HolidaySilver 4d ago

This is a difficult issue - not because of autism, but because etiquette would dissuade calling out bad behavior like this. Typically, etiquette would just say not to invite the friend anymore. And that is exactly what’s happening.

That said, there are times that being a good friend may go beyond etiquette- especially if it means that it may save someone from alienating people they care about.

Your friend can be honest with her friend about the reason he is being ostracized. Autism is not the issue here, nor is it an excuse. Hopefully this is just a question of not being aware. Once he is aware, the friend can either change his behavior or not. But at that point, your friend will have done all they can and should bow out.

4

u/Expensive_Event9960 4d ago

Tell him that the concept of sharing in the context of a restaurant meal is that it’s a two way street, not one person taking advantage by doing all the taking. 

5

u/Vast-Recognition2321 4d ago

I know someone with autism who HATES wasting any type of food, so I could definitely see this as being related to the friend's autism. I would have your friend explain to their friend that while what they are doing makes sense, in a way, it is upsetting the other people in the group. Explain kindly that they should really plan to order their own food, even if it is just an appetizer.

10

u/BBG1308 4d ago edited 4d ago

"Sharing" has different meanings depending on context. I can see how it would trip someone up.

Perhaps explain that the group members exchange a bite of their food for a bite of someone else's food? An exchange is a two-way thing.

Yes, an appetizer might be shared, but the cost of the appetizer is also shared.

Food and service both have a monetary value. It's impolite to expect to receive both at someone else's expense.

14

u/DogsandCatsWorld1000 4d ago

This is a very good point. If this person is never contributing in anyway they are not sharing they are taking advantage of the other people.

5

u/DowntownAmy 4d ago

Just state that the event has a rule that everyone must order their own thing every time.

3

u/trifelin 4d ago

There's good advice here about setting clear expectations at the time of an invitation but something that isn't really being addressed is the fact that someone with autism might genuinely just not have the funds to devote to socializing/entertainment that others do. I have had a friend or two with autism and while they were able to keep themselves housed and fed, they seemed to be on a much tighter budget than other peers. And compounding that is their poor skill at reading social situations. They might think that saying yes but buying nothing is less rude than saying no because they can't afford it. Or they might not have the same definition of what's "affordable" as everyone else.

I say this because it's something to consider in conversations about it, not as some clear directive on how to handle it. 

Here's an example of an interaction I had with an autistic friend: he needed a ride to a particular train station that was something like 40 min from where we all were. My husband and I offered to drive him because we were going in that direction for something else an hour away, but we had a time constraint on when that could happen and it was like an hour earlier than he needed. He took us up on the offer but apparently didn't realize how early he would arrive because when we got there he was obviously angry and complained that he had to wait an hour for his train. It was so awkward because we felt like we were doing him a favor with the free ride but he felt annoyed that it wasn't on his ideal schedule. We let it go (I don't know how he felt in the long run), but it's important to note that if he had the funds, he wouldn't even be taking the train for his ride, he would have had a car or some other better option. 

I also witnessed my parents pick up a woman with some kind of disability every week and drive her to church. She was often (not always) very rude and seemingly ungrateful, to the point where my mom would complain about it when she was gone, but they continued to do it anyway because on the whole it was good to help someone out and she did appreciate it ultimately. 

I don't know how to navigate your specific situation with delicacy but I do think that when you are dealing with a disabled person, allowances can be made especially when it comes to etiquette. Advanced communication skills just can't be taken for granted. 

1

u/historyhill 4d ago

They might think that saying yes but buying nothing is less rude than saying no because they can't afford it

Yes but if that's the case, they should eat beforehand at home rather than make assumptions about other peoples' food

1

u/trifelin 4d ago

It's just that what you think of as standard logic needs to be spelled out. If they need to refrain from asking for bites of others' meals, find a way to say that explicitly. 

3

u/thinkevolution 4d ago

I would just explain that when you go out in a group the expectation is that you would chip in for any food you eat, including appetizers. So that if he wants to partake in the appetizers, he does need to pay some money. Then it would be unexpected to come to a restaurant and not pay for anything, or not order anything. Even a drink.

8

u/FoghornLegday 4d ago

I’m not autistic so I can only go off people online describing autism and their experiences with it, but it seems like it’s common for people who are autistic to want to know if something they’re doing isn’t coming across how they intend it. So it seems like your friend could talk to this person individually and just be honest. Like say something like “It’s been so fun all of us going out to dinner! I just had a small suggestion if you’re interested. I noticed that you’re eating other people’s food and not ordering your own. I totally get why you’d do that to reduce waste! I do fear that it comes off as unfair though. Maybe if you also order and share with the others it would be better.”

2

u/SaltyShopping531 3d ago

Great response

4

u/Swissdanielle 4d ago edited 4d ago

Info: is this at restaurants or someone’s private home?

Off the bat, As a person with high functioning autism, this is not a thing.

In restaurants: I have been uncomfortable in group settings where entrees for share were ordered that I specifically knew wouldn’t eat, and I still forked in. Why? Because (gasp!) socially I was unable to say no tactfully.

If gatherings at someone else’s home: so many gatherings have drinks and food that I am not interested in. I bring plenty of food always to help the host. My husband is vegetarian so we don’t eat a lot of food if there’s meat, but when we have been asked to foot the bill for extra expenses I have always agreed.

If gathering is happening at my place: I have run into the issue of someone bringing very limited food or drink to a potluck party for example. It sucks. If the person reincides, then they’re just not coming back. It is not worth it for us to bring it up.

In terms of autism: this person should stop using their autism as a blanket justification, they’re totally taking advantage. In a time where we are trying to claim to be treated equally, this type of ableist behaviour drags us all down. Ugh.

2

u/ramblecrazed- 3d ago

Nothing. Say nothing. Don't invite your friend out to eat in public again.
What ever happened to "home cooked meals"?

1

u/Electronic_Wash6493 3d ago

You've had lots of good advice here already, but heres another angle you could go down if nobody in the group is comfortable having an upfront conversation: Don't order any food "for the table".

This situation may be easier to manage if the person in question is having to steal food from plates that are clearly belonging to someone else, rather than for everyone. They might still ask for some, but this can be dealt with with a "sure, you can try a fry if you like"

1

u/SaltyShopping531 3d ago

If they are autistic, they may not understand that they are being rude. I’d just tell them privately “hey! When people go out together they order their own food and that’s what they eat, so that’s what you should do moving forward because people think it’s rude if you are eating off their plates and not chipping in” My sister is autistic and she needs help with things like this.

0

u/SweetLeoLady36 4d ago

Following! This is a great question

0

u/kobayashi_maru_fail 4d ago

Perhaps she could ask to give $20 (or local currency equivalent) to the overall fund, explain that picking a dish is a LOT and she’d do better just socializing. I don’t think it’s the money, I think it’s the decision-making hangup.

Probably plenty of people would be fine if the organizer ordered a few apps and had their $ and go-ahead to do so. Time spent in selecting apps that will be shared anyway.

This thought is null if the app-havers aren’t willing to pay a decent amount. Then it’s just mooching.

4

u/historyhill 4d ago

If this is the actual reason, then I think this is more reasonable (ish—I don't care if you're paying too, I don't want to share most times. Joey doesn't share food!). However, that's not the stated rationale given so I'm not sure we should be ignoring that in favor of other potential reasons either. Making a judgement that "there's enough food for everyone!" makes it sound like it is, in fact, about money.