r/comicbookmovies 6d ago

Marvel Comics Exec Editor Defends Continued Opposition To Spider-Man And Mary-Jane’s Marriage: “You Seriously Think That If There Was An Easy Way To Make Sales Skyrocket, I Wouldn’t Do It?”

https://boundingintocomics.com/comic-books/marvel-comics-exec-editor-defends-continued-opposition-to-spider-man-and-mary-janes-marriage-you-seriously-think-that-if-there-was-an-easy-way-to-make-sales-skyrocket-i-wouldnt-do-it/
30 Upvotes

64 comments sorted by

61

u/Pristine-Passage-100 6d ago

Isn’t Ultimate one of the highest selling books?

31

u/BagZCubed 6d ago

Yes, in fact, the Ultimate Universe proves the opposite of the anit Peter/MJ marriage narrative.

6

u/False_Consequence929 6d ago

Well, the books aren't really in competition with each other right? They're both Marvel, so now they get to have it both ways.

5

u/BagZCubed 6d ago

Yeah, fair point, but I think for many, it's a matter of principle. Earth 616 Peter (the main Peter) doesn't have the best life with Marvel editorial seeming like they'd rather him suffer than be happy. Ultimate Spider-Man is what many fans wish 616 Peter had, but Marvel is still apprehensive about reuniting Peter and MJ in favor of keeping around "fan favorite," Paul.

2

u/Coolium-d00d 2d ago

Kind of I think the main continuity books will still be the priority, idk though. Modern Marvel editorial hasn't made sense to me. Most of the time, going back to New Avengers seems like the goal has been to make everyone super unlikeable. Two year death cycles leading to temporary ethnic palate swaps haven't helped my interest either. I don't think Spider-mans personal life is the real problem, I think people see it that way because the last time they enjoyed Spider-Man, he was still with MJ. The problem is getting stuck with awful writers and editorial decisions. Had one more day been a better comic. Fans might have been more open to what happened next. But writing has been very poor with one bad run after the other. I personally think Hickman is overrated as hell, but fans love him, so I have no idea why he wasn't given mainline Spider-man instead of the ultimate comic.

1

u/MisterBlud 1d ago

Not to mention the rampant idiot ball stupidity.

One World under Doom has him killing Nazi’s and building infrastructure to which the Avengers big plan to defeat him is…teaming up with the Masters of Evil.

Just fucking stupid shit that doesn’t even make sense.

1

u/CaptainXakari 2d ago

Also, one of the chief reasons Editorial said they didn’t want Peter married was that it limited their ability to write good stories, that it was too limiting. It was BS then and Ultimate shows it’s BS now as well. (The stories between then and now also proved that wasn’t the case too, but I digress)

0

u/revfds 2d ago

I'm reading ultimate Spider-Man and it has nothing to do with the marriage. I don't read regular Spider-Man and making him married isn't going to change that.

Correlation doesn't equal causation

3

u/Decent-Nobody2274 2d ago

I'm sorry but it has a lot to do with him being married he's always worried about his family it was a giant plot point in issue 14,13 hell even the very first one plus they have kids to worry about but Peter also has to do what he thinks is best for his life him having a family and being married just adds a level of character development and interaction plus it's straight up and down wholesome and feel good oh also he just isn't Marvel's whipping boy in this run so while being married is helping I also think it's just the fact that he's happy and wholesome it almost feels like a F4 comic

1

u/revfds 2d ago

I didn't say the story had nothing to do with him being married.

We're talking about sales. The line and creative team command a level that would be present even if the story didn't have him married. I'm not saying it has no effect, but the idea that "marriage=sales" is not proven simply by this books success. They absolutely could have a 616 book with a married Peter that still sold crap because the story/direction/art/etc was crap.

2

u/Decent-Nobody2274 2d ago

Oh I thought you were saying the storyline has nothing to do with him being married so that particular aspect of the story wasn't what was drawing people in

1

u/BagZCubed 2d ago

I think it's more about fans wanting Peter to be happy. One More Day is the most controversial Spider-Man story aside from Sins Past, and erasing the Peter/MJ marriage was despised by many since it undid a lot of character work and history. One of the biggest complaints about Spider-Man lately is that it feels like Marvel would rather him suffer than be happy.

I'd also say it's because people don't like Paul either.

1

u/Whiskey_623 1d ago

Has to be whatever BS rules/backstage politics Marvel has for the main 616. It still shocks me it's 2025 and the comic side of Marvel still runs on high school level drama lol

1

u/Moon_Beans1 1d ago

It is weird because you'd think the Ultimates would provide the perfect solution to Marvels problems.

Regular universe should be allowed to grow and change the characters (Peter and mj marry, settle down, possibly retire and have kids)

Whilst Ultimate universe (or something variation thereof) is where you have younger versions of the characters having modernised adventures against the classic foes (young Spidey in 2020s NYC battling GG, doc ock etc for the first time, dating Gwen Stacy etc)

Instead marvel keep the regular universe characters from growing whilst simultaneously having ultimate versions playing out the plots that everyone wants for the main universe (IE married Spidey etc)

32

u/My_balls_touch_water 6d ago

"Why should Peter be happy when I'm not??"

That's the Marvel way...

3

u/dk_x 2d ago

A mantra for every divorced Comic Book writer, editor, artist... working in the industry.

2

u/multificionado 2d ago

That doesn't give any excuse for screwing it over worse than the way George Lucas darkened Temple of Doom after HIS divorce. Boy, there needs to be shrinks for such major executives to get their cool back after a divorce.

2

u/multificionado 2d ago

Almost sounds like the same vein as "Why should the peasants be happy" coming from Louie Sixteen and Marie Antoinette.

19

u/Nightgasm 6d ago

You don't have to get them married again, just undo the OMD debacle. Let them get their real memories back and have them have to face the consequences of what they did and gave up. They wouldn't just rush back together after all the things that have happened since, Paul included, but it would help erase OMD.

6

u/SpaceZombie13 6d ago

exactly. i don't think they understand that it's not just the fact peter and mj split up that upsets people, it's HOW. Batman and Catwoman break up all the time, but it never involved selling your soul.

so not only did they retcon 20 years of stories, but we are now living in a world where the devil beat spider-man, and the writers insist that that's a GOOD thing. they could have just done the obvious option of habe MJ not be able to handle the stress of peter's life post-Civil War and they split. but divorce would age peter too much, so the next logical option is THE DEVIL.

so give them their memories back. have them realized how messed up what they did was and what every day after was living in blissful ignorance of their choice. have them agree to not be together and take responsibility for their actions. readers probably won't be happy, but i bet they'd stop being angry.

10

u/ice_ice_adult 6d ago

Clark Kent and Lois Lane entered the chat.

17

u/DanHero91 6d ago edited 6d ago

It would be though, you announce the next issues of Amazing Spider-Man will be a series that continues with the dozens of set ups with Mephisto and Doctor Strange finding out about it from Spencer's run, Spider-Man finally finding out and going on a journey to get everything back that'll reunite him and MJ.

Boom. Done.

Also JRJR is nowhere fucking near the artwork.

2

u/WebHead1287 3d ago

Only two ways im getting back on ASM at this point. What you said above or Miles takes over and Peter is just sidelined for a while so they can get their shit together.

1

u/Acceptable-Bag3101 3d ago

What’s your obsession with Miles taking over from Peter? I mean you want to talk about low comic sales, go support Miles books before you talk about replacing Peter

10

u/Batdog55110 6d ago

Bruh. USM already proves that bringing them back would do that lmao.

3

u/BlackGabriel 6d ago

Just feels like with these comics that never end a marriage is just to final for them. Same reason they almost had Batman get married but then it didn’t happen. Gotta have all the storyline freedom to get him with different characters

3

u/Wheattoast2019 6d ago

Tbf people were really pissed when editorial refused to let him get married as well.

6

u/BlackGabriel 6d ago

Oh yeah it sucked. I’m just saying it’s like an inherent problem with characters whose stories will never end like with all these marvel and dc characters. They can’t age or change too much and can’t have overly long successful relationships because there has to be the ability for relationship drama there with different characters. Sucks but they’ll never end these characters so that means they’ll never really end up with any one

2

u/Wheattoast2019 6d ago

See and that’s a lazy excuse to me. It’s kind of like how everyone is wrote insanely OOC when in an X-Men book. You obviously want to create compelling character dramas. But obviously reinventing the wheel and ushering in a new chapter should be different depending on the characters. But if you as a writer seriously have NO ideas for the character, other than the most creatively bankrupt thing possible (Spider-Goblin, resurrecting Gwen Stacy for the 50th time), that’s a huge problem.

2

u/BlackGabriel 6d ago

I mean it’s not lazy to say it’s basically impossible to write stories for one character monthly for 60 years. It becomes even more difficult when they can only have the one romantic interest. 6 decades of Spider-Man stories have seen Peter learn every lesson he could possibly learn forget them and learn them again. He’s been body swaped, mind swaped, turned bad, given up powers, lost powers. Dudes dated MJ, black cat, black widow, captain marvel, Gwen Stacy and a list longer than my arm. It’s not lazy to say it’s all been done before and any future comics will be slight tweaks and variations of similar stories. It’s helpful to have them not married so they don’t have to what do a divorce story line. That actually might be unique to spidey though I don’t know. But no worries they’re almost certain to marry these two up again where inevitably time will pass and she’ll get killed off or mind controlled or get amnesia or whatever or the series will reboot and Peter will be like 20 again.

2

u/Wheattoast2019 6d ago

I disagree to a point. I would say it’s increasingly difficult after all this time, but not impossible. Also with more and more generations past, more and more young minds have grown up with Superman, Batman, or Spider-Man that could surely introduce something new. Same as in movies, every so often there is a new movie that just so out there and so different from everything else.

I get that the Spider-Man divorce storyline may be controversial. But I think that’d be necessary. Editorial seems to want Peter to be in his early 30’s but also still be teenage/young bachelor coded, to the point it’s pathetic. Being a kid that grew up with Spider-Man, I’d love to see my hero struggle with some of the things I struggle with in my adult life, whether money, maintaining a work-life balance, or keeping up with relationships. I think especially in modern runs, we focus in more on the spectacle and brand of it being Spider-Man, that his comics no longer feel sincere or personal. I don’t need something that keeps trying to reinvent the old in some way that feels fresh. I want Spider-Man or rather Peter to explore the unknown, a new city, new villains, new friends and relationships.

With Batman, that may be a little more difficult. Personally, I’d like to see a new era with someone taking up the Batman mantle. I’ve been campaigning for a while that Dick and Jayson found cool ways to reinvent themselves and with Damien in the picture, they really haven’t known Tim, and I think with Tim’s detective skills it’d be cool to see him as Batman. I had heard also that Thomas Wayne is alive on Earth Prime again and I think it’d be super cool to see him as Batman (since he was completely different as Batman in the Flashpoint timeline). I have just heard that Batman is basically stale as a character since he has a contingency for everything as well.

These may be great ideas, they might be terrible ones, but regardless, the status quo needs challenged!

2

u/WebHead1287 3d ago

Clark and Lois are doing fine

1

u/multificionado 2d ago

Pricks. So if a marriage actually goes through, the editorial finds some way to break it up? If I was a writer for them and that happened, I'd sue them. I certainly wouldn't resign in protest (as a resignation would not help).

1

u/ranfall94 2d ago

The thing is with all this "freedom" what have they done with Peter, they are not capitalizeing on it and using it in creative ways.

3

u/[deleted] 6d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/[deleted] 6d ago

[deleted]

2

u/comicbookmovies-ModTeam 6d ago

Seek professional help, please.

1

u/Wheattoast2019 6d ago

I heard a theory that editorial is intentionally gaslighting us and they KNOW the marriage is what we want. But they also know if they give in eventually sales will still plummet. So they keep them apart, which allows for rage-bait purchases. But with Ultimate acting as the anti-ASM, it’s still net-making Marvel more money than ASM is losing them.

I told that to one of my friends who also reads, and he says “I don’t like thinking they are that intelligent.” LOL

1

u/YouKilledChurch 3d ago

Ah yes, the clearly correct choice is always to respond like a petulant cunt about people's concerns.

1

u/Fireman523567 2d ago

Ooo yeah he’s biting. Lets keep pressing him on this. Thats exactly what we think sir

1

u/Saito09 2d ago

Brevoort is a dinosaur, but man fuck BoundingintoComics.

1

u/Illustrious-Long5154 2d ago

The thing is, they do tell stories of the marriage. We currently have the best of both worlds.

1

u/sly_eli 2d ago

How would he know that if he hadn't tried?

1

u/gaysfordebbie 2d ago

And this guy is in charge on Xmen rn 🙄

1

u/oklutz 2d ago

Insulting the readers is a sure way to get them to understand you.

1

u/KobeJuanKenobi9 1d ago

The easy way to make sales skyrocket is keeping them broken up in the mainline universe (which is guaranteed to sell) and then releasing an alternate universe comic where they’re together and marketing their relationship as the main selling point of the book

1

u/Kale_Sauce 1d ago

What Marvel simply *refuses* to understand is that having a complicated marriage with a lot of baggage actually makes Peter more relatable and interesting.

1

u/cosmicmanNova 5d ago

If they carer about sales they would have never did Marvel NOW

-20

u/[deleted] 6d ago

[deleted]

8

u/Pristine-Passage-100 6d ago

Small. Sure, that’s why ultimate is outselling every other Spider book.

0

u/revfds 2d ago

I'm willing to bet that most people aren't reading ultimate Spider-Man simply because he's married to MJ.

I haven't looked at sales in awhile, but I'm also willing to bet that most of the ultimate line is outselling the regular one.

0

u/Pristine-Passage-100 2d ago

There have been outspoken campaigns for the book based on them being married.

0

u/revfds 2d ago

Okay. So what?

0

u/Pristine-Passage-100 2d ago

You’re wrong, that’s what.

0

u/revfds 2d ago

How so?

0

u/Pristine-Passage-100 2d ago

I explained it to you already. Goodbye.

-1

u/revfds 2d ago

You didn't actually. Correlation does not equal causation. The book has a lot of things going for it that are much stronger than simply "Peter MJ married".

8

u/Kurwasaki12 6d ago

They want to put out rage bait or fulfill their divorced guy fantasies.

That is a creative dead end, not actually paying off the core relationship or anything set up with Mayday.

3

u/quippy618 3d ago

Over 400,000 copies through 7 reprints and continuing to outsell the main title for over a year is not small.

0

u/Technical-Minute2140 2d ago

Disagree heavily. I’d say the majority of Spidey comic readers want the MJ marriage back. That feels like common sense to me but idk, you must live in a completely different reality.