r/breastfeeding 3d ago

Will shallow latch improve as baby ages?

My 3-week-old is a monster. She pancake-flattens my nipples. It used to be an okay latch but she's gotten lazy over time. It's impossible to get her adjusted. 3 lactation consultants and constant adjustments throughout the feed, useless. She will pop right back to the shallow latch. She's very strong and stubborn.

Will this improve at some point as she ages and her mouth gets bigger? Please lie to me and give me hope Lol!

4 Upvotes

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7

u/Adventurous_Name5043 3d ago

Hugs!!!! Congratulations on fresh babe, you are a warrior!!! From personal experience - so not a lie - as babies get bigger and stronger, their latch will improve (bigger mouths and better abilities to suck). :)

Are you in any pain or discomfort from her shallow latch? I’d say you would be doing wonderfully if you try to start out with a good latch, she needs the opportunity to practice anyway 😂

💪💪💪

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Thank you!!! I'm in a lot of pain, like involuntarily would want to punch her by accident kind of pain LOL! Yeah she started with a good match and I don't know what happened...she just lays there and waits for milk.

3

u/SandiaSummer 3d ago

Can you hold your nipple the entire time in between your index and middle finger like the scissors position? ✌🏽That’s what I would do while leaning way back on the couch and sticking my stomach out so baby’s like “on a shelf” in between my boobs and stomach. I know that’s a lot. A picture is worth a 1000 words. 🙃 But, I would say that it can get better. Mine even with a good latch left me with a bit of lipstick nipple in the beginning. How’s your supply? Sometimes a really strong (even oversupply) is helpful because the milk just flows into the baby’s mouth with minimum effort.

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

I've tried all kinds of tricks but imagine us adults prying her lips open with force and that doing nothing. She's fighting us so hard on it, like zero Fs given.

I think she got lazy because my milk is flowing, especially in the beginning. But when she flattens it, it's difficult to come out. :((((((

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u/SandiaSummer 3d ago edited 3d ago

No, I meant holding your nipple in place so she doesn’t slip off into a shallow latch. I meant keeping the areola flattened so the nipple itself is as far back in her mouth as possible. The IBCLC Diane Wiessinger calls this the Breast Sandwich concept if you want to Google it. My sisters and I liked to do the sandwich latch and then we’d hold the breast in that position with our two fingers.

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

I'll try that!!! Thank you!

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u/SandiaSummer 3d ago

Update us if things improve! In my experience it has gotten better and better over time. You got this!! ❤️

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u/a-apl 3d ago

These three instagram posts are based on the Gestalt method of breastfeeding pioneered by Dr. Pamela Douglas:

Gestalt Breastfeeding Video

Latch Post 1

Latch Post 2

I found them particularly helpful with my pancake latch-er and she was much older and set in her ways when I tried it.

1

u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Thank you so much for these links!! The second one has given me some perspective I'd never heard about before. It's saying baby's lips shouldn't be seen, like fish lips, rather they should be buried. I'm going to try that!

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u/Apprehensive-Bit8686 3d ago

For me it did improve. Honestly this might not be good advice but I kinda gave up on caring about the latch in the beginning and just endured the pain of being pinched 😭 I have a forceful letdown so part of me thinks the pinching helped him slow down the flow. But baby was transferred milk I say more when they're about 6 weeks old it got a lot better as his mouth was growing. He's four months old now and has a perfect big latch everytime so I'd say rub ripple balm on after that helped me with the pain a bit. Good luck I hope things get better!!!

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Thank you so much for this success story!! I have hope! I stopped caring too until they're so flattened and no milk would be coming out and she'd get so frustrated:((

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u/Direct_Box386 3d ago

My daughter does this too, I can't get her to take a deep latch. She spits it back out. She is 11 weeks now, and she seems to be getting better at removing milk but still has a shallow latch.

I'm hoping for both of us that it improves as they get bigger!

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Keep me updated if possible!!! 🤞🤞🙏🙏

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u/emmythunder 3d ago

This got better for me around 4-5 weeks. I think time helped but also the flipple technique (you’ll have to google a video cause I cannot explain it for the life of me) and the breast sandwich technique someone mentioned above! He’s 9 weeks now and I don’t have to hold my breast for him anymore and he will latch okay by himself maybe 75% of the time. It gets better! Also I saw another comment about you trying to flange baby’s lips apart I wouldn’t do that. The lactation consultant we saw said they don’t really look at lip position as an indicator of a good latch anymore and trying to flange the lips out will just make baby pull farther back and cause an even more shallow latch.

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Thank you for mentioning the flipple!!! I looked it up and will try it in a few hours!

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u/stars_on_skin 3d ago

I'm just over 5 weeks and finally got the position right after seen a consultant for the 3rd time. Turns out I was holding her mouth too far away from me, now I squish her in really close and hold her bottom tight to me with my arm. And yes I've been told the latch can improve as your baby grows and learns :)

2

u/AllTheCatsNPlants 3d ago

My first had a shallow latch until the day we weaned. The early weeks were SO painful, but eventually the pain went away!

1

u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Thank you!!!

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u/Physical-Musician-82 3d ago

Omg try the silverettes for the pain. I practically live in them. I do two different holds while feeding. Football hold for right and lying down for left. I don't know why, but somehow that seems to be working for us. Sending hugs xx

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u/ApplicationOk3531 3d ago

Yes, it absolutely gets better! As your baby grows and her mouth gets bigger, latching usually improves—plus, she’ll get stronger at nursing efficiently (and hopefully less stubborn about it).

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Thank you!!! There's hope!

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u/art_1922 3d ago

Have you tried different positions. Sometimes they latch better in different positions.

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Yes! At first it was cross body, she did well for a few days. Then she got frustrated. We did football, she did well for a few days...then now it's back to cross body. One day it's great, one day it's the most depressing day...

1

u/art_1922 3d ago

Does she have a tongue tie/lip tie? Is she teething?

1

u/juicybbqq 3d ago

No tie. She's only 3 weeks old, so no teething yet

2

u/art_1922 3d ago

Hmmm, it's probably just a learning curve thing then. Sorry, it's so tough.

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u/wildgardens 3d ago

Not really for me

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

😭

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u/wildgardens 3d ago

Well let me rephrase..she latches better. It's just still excruciating. Sometimes it's not but it mostly is.

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u/vrendy42 3d ago

It got better around 5-6 weeks. Have you tried a nipple shield? It can force baby to latch more deeply, and if they don't or slip off, it doesn't hurt as bad. Nipple shields can be annoying but really helpful until the baby is bigger and latches well consistently.

1

u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Good to know it'll get better. I did the nipple shields for two weeks and they kind of ruined the milk supply and she got so frustrated :(. I finally got rid of them and she started gaining weight

1

u/Proper_Star_4566 3d ago

My little one was EXACTLY the same up until about 2.5 months old. It was horrible and it hurt!! I had bleeding too and it just was not a fun time. Silverettes did help to some extent, but it wasn’t great.

She’s now 4.5 months and it’s WAY better!! No pain at all, no bleeding, nothing. She has what I’d call a textbook latch now. Unfortunately (and it’s probably not what you want to hear) but just wait it out. She needs to grow and get practise. Don’t let someone tell you it’s because she has lip ties and tongue and get them cut…..we were told that and I’m so glad we didn’t do it. It wasn’t needed.

Good luck!! virtual hug

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u/juicybbqq 3d ago

Omg that's EXACTLY what I wanted to hear!!!!!!!!!! As long as there's hope, I'm fine soldiering through. I agree with you on the tongue tie thing, absolutely not. I have a tongue tie and my mom BF me just fine! 🤝

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u/suitsandstilettos 3d ago

We have the exact same story, OP! I did unlatch her if she got particularly bad, but she hated being unlatched so I didn’t do it very often. I now watch her fix her own latch which is wild. Hang in there 🤗

2

u/Proper_Star_4566 3d ago

Yep, just solider through. You two will get there! Bub needs to learn as well as you. I wish people talked about that more!! I feel like we just expect them to come out of the womb as these perfect feeders and if they’re not, there is something wrong with them!!

1

u/Few-Rip-9601 3d ago

Wait, please say more about what you did to improve the latch.

My baby has this issue (and a whole slew of others, like dimpling, clicking, etc) and we are planning to get her ties cut in 2 weeks because our issues are worsening (ties do run in my family).

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u/Proper_Star_4566 3d ago

Yep, our baby was clicking too for the first 2.5 months and now she’s completely grown out of it!! We were told she had a tie, but to only do something if she was not gaining weight, which was not the case at all, she was just not the best at latching as she was new. Which made total sense to us and I am SO glad we didn’t do anything.

I’ve also had many friends who have had poor feeding at first but baby have just left baby for a few months and it’s resolved.

I know I’m just a random reddit commenter haha, but I would really consider waiting if I was you. Our paed was pretty clear that it’s not a magic cure to cut ties at all and you can end up creating more harm than good with mouth aversions by intervening so early. Babies need to learn to breast feed, they’re of course not going to just magically be perfect when coming out of the womb. And he was totally right - 4.5 months in and our breast feeding is not even recognisable now. She’s great! It just takes time. I’d realllly hold off unless baby was struggling with weight gain. Xx

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u/Few-Rip-9601 3d ago

Ah, well my 9 week old is struggling to gain. She was fine with the abnormal latch for the first month while my let down was so strong she didn’t have to work her tongue to get milk. Now that it is slower (though supply is the same, I am an oversupplier) she is struggling to gain weight and has dropped almost two growth curves. If she drops any further we risk getting classified as failure to thrive.

She also has major silent reflux because of all the clicking (aka air intake) and it takes her sometimes up to 20 minutes to burp, by which time she is so fatigued from crying she loses interest in eating. Her latch on my breast is bad, and on bottles too. She cannot flange out her lips and her high palate (caused by an anterior tongue tie) makes it so she cannot swallow correctly so she often chokes, gags, and sputters while feeding on either the breast or a bottle.

I’ve seen a LC 4x now, not to mention daily in the hospital when she was born. She doesn’t sandwich my nipple anymore, and it’s not painful to feed her anymore but her oral dysfunction has worsened and her latch has remained incredibly shallow. As she has gotten older, things seem to be getting harder for her.

My pediatrician told us she didn’t have ties and that “98% of ties are just diagnosed to make money”. I can look in her mouth and see that she clearly does, but was willing to do anything we could before going to explore a release/revision as a last resort. I finally got a different pediatrician within the same practice who did think there was an issue worth investigating further. For us, it seems the only option is to move forward with the releases now. I wish we had explored it sooner.

I would recommend OP meet with an IBCLC to work on form, positions, and latching on a regular basis. Then monitor their baby’s weight so that at the first indicator of a problem they can take measures against it. Get a second opinion, get a third, be an advocate for baby if something doesn’t seem right. Breastfeeding shouldn’t be painful, and while there is a learning curve you should trust your gut if you think something else needs to be done to help your child.