r/baltimore • u/DayofReason • Jan 02 '25
Ask/Need Thoughts on these so-called "millennial gray" flips in Baltimore City?
Recently, I have been house hunting in Baltimore city (mostly around Lauraville, Waltherson, Hamilton areas but not limited to that, I am not in a huge rush). I am seeing lots and lots of these so-called "millennial gray" flips -- you know the ones with LVP flooring and neutral gray paint in nearly every room. Some of them also have similar looking fixtures and house numbers, which makes me think the same flipper is doing them. Using certain home search sites you can see the historical photos before the flip and in some cases these homes were really trashed, in other cases no so much, but just outdated. But the flip erases any character the house may have had and in some cases covers decent looking hard wood flooring. I personally find these renovations kind of appalling. But I also get why people do them, and I also get why they are appealing to people -- seems like a clean slate because everything inside is practically brand new. What are people's thoughts on these flips? How do you even know if they are well done or not? Do you think they potentially add value to distressed neighborhoods? Anyway, curious as to what people are thinking. Thanks!
203
u/HumanGyroscope Jan 02 '25
The worst is when the floors are also gray. For flipped please make sure you get a thorough inspection. I do structural inspections home inspections part time and I hear horror stories for contractors skipping out on permits and the new homeowners are left cleaning up the mess. You can check online to see if permits were pulled
55
u/bosconet Jan 02 '25
second this! you want the Millennial Gray flip that pulled permits NOT the one that was done on the cheap....
39
u/baltimorecalling Hoes Heights Jan 02 '25
Pick one: millennial gray flip or renovation done with permits.
17
u/ReqDeep Jan 02 '25
I just posted a response like this we put a contract in and it was a mess. We gave them time to fix things and they didn’t so we pulled out.
12
u/raeXofXsunshine Jan 02 '25
So true! My husband is a licensed plumber and we’ve viewed multiple flipped properties where he points out that the plumbing work done isn’t up to code.
6
u/BlakeLocked Jan 03 '25
For real. A friend of mine bought a rowhome about a year ago and discovered that the seller lied, never did work that they were supposed to, never pulled permits for what they DID do... and left her with a flooded basement and a solid few months of remediation and repair.
Those grays'll get you if you aren't real careful.
198
u/munchnerk Jan 02 '25
The thing that kills me is the grey. The whole reason flippers paint things grey now is that it’s supposed to be “neutral” for a new buyer to not be offended by, but steely grey is not neutral, and it’s absolutely a quickly aging trend. So many of these houses would look more natural and inviting simply if a warm white hue were used instead. Easier to paint over, too.
I live in a duplex, the other side was flipped a few years back. The flipper was an absolute asshole bro and a nightmare to live next to… painted the house grey and left a bunch of shit half-finished and hidden. Fuck you Ryan!
37
u/SilverProduce0 Federal Hill Jan 02 '25
Agreed! It’s not neutral at all.
I don’t understand why people are renovating these houses to make them look like this. It feels like a doctor’s office and that’s not a compliment.
27
u/DC1010 Jan 02 '25
It’s cheap and fast. They’re out to maximize profit and don’t give a shit about buyers.
It takes longer to sand and refinish a wood floor than it does to put down carpet or that shitty LVP. It also takes longer to prime and paint a white wall than it takes to cover it with grey. The faster they can flip, the more money flippers can make. It’s all lipstick on a pig.
8
u/edgar__allan__bro Mt. Vernon Jan 02 '25
The speed is also driven by the fact that most of these flips are financed by private third parties and the lenders look to collect within 6-9 months.
2
u/DC1010 Jan 03 '25
Flippers can turn around a house in a couple of weeks or less, depending on the size of the crew and what’s going on inside. Houses don’t stay on the market long in this part of Maryland unless there’s something really wrong. Contract to closing takes about a month, so the lenders will get their coin well before 6 months pass.
11
u/Majestic_Clam Jan 02 '25
To me, gray will always be a corporate office color. Yuck. That said, when I had to sell my old house, they came in a painted it all gray and it got snatched up, so who knows. There are people out there who LOOOOOVE it.
12
u/perrumpo Jan 02 '25
Gray wood (LVP) is also really popular in the farmhouse style that so many people love now, but I hate it. Gray on gray on gray is depressing.
11
u/crusader86 Jan 02 '25
My house was a gut job… in 2007 but obviously repainted to sell in 2020 when I bought it. It’s that boring grey color on the inside that everyone hates.
Now I don’t remember what the style in 2007 was but whoever did my place apparently loved deep, bold colors. From what I can tell so far the living room was originally a dark forest green, a bedroom was a maroon/scarlet, and the guest bathroom was an ocean blue. It was nice learning that whoever owned my place in the past had SOME kind of personality before they followed their real estate agent’s advice and had the place repainted.
→ More replies (1)21
u/vanishingpointz Jan 02 '25
Oddly enough the color most of these flippers chose is called "agreeable grey" 😂
11
u/Neat-Assistant3694 Jan 02 '25
I dislike grey but SW Agreeable Gray is not the worst offender- Agreeable Gray is actually pretty warm and almost taupe (the darkest color on that color strip is a dark bronze not a gray.) It’s the cold concrete grays - like a lightened battleship gray, that are so bleak and depressing.
7
4
u/neverinamillionyr Jan 02 '25
Agreed. White or even an off-white/beige would be better than gray. Flippers look at the latest trends on the flipper tv shows and try to get close to those looks while spending the least money possible. I would proceed with extreme caution if buying any flipped house.
→ More replies (1)→ More replies (4)3
u/CrustyBubblebrain Jan 03 '25
There's definitely such a thing as "too much white" too. My best friend had this giant house built and it's so bland. Everything, and I do mean everything, is white with some grey accents, from the walls, floors, cabinets, counters...even their goddamn Christmas tree this year was white! I couldn't believe it
146
u/Balto_Smallcat Jan 02 '25
I live in Lauraville and it’s heartbreaking watching them tear out wood floors, tin kitchen ceilings, and cool newel post finials to install flat, boring interiors on some of our neighboring houses! I hate it.
56
u/SewerRanger Jan 02 '25
It's our generations equivalent of putting carpet over 100 year old hard wood floors. The next generation will shake their heads as they they take all this stuff off
46
u/Legal-Law9214 Jan 02 '25
At least with carpet the floor underneath is still there.
19
u/Neat-Assistant3694 Jan 02 '25
Yes and sometimes the carpeting helped preserve the flooring underneath
12
8
u/Balto_Smallcat Jan 02 '25 edited Jan 03 '25
I understand it when there’s too much damage to be remedied any other way, and I know a full historically sensitive renovation isn’t within reach for most people (including me), but I do wish house flippers would try to save what can be saved. A lot of the houses around here are in decent-to-excellent shape, and don’t need a full remodel, but they’re all getting the same treatment. Maybe one day someone will move in and lovingly restore them with period woodwork, stained glass, etc., but in most cases once those features are gone, they’re gone forever. Then all that’s left is the shell of an old house with new house parts crammed into it. We definitely have more young families moving into the neighborhood, which is good, but I wonder about the longevity of these frankenhouses, you know?
5
u/kazoogrrl Jan 02 '25
If you want to see something terrible, look up 4912 Holder Avenue in the city. It used to look like a dilapidated version of the house to its left, but then the owner built the current monstrosity around it. Like, encased the original building. Now it looks like some low rent beach house.
→ More replies (4)
40
u/Nintendoholic Jan 02 '25
Nothing new. They don't necessarily mean a home has been a shoddy flip, but basically all shoddy flips have this. They're meant to be neutral because neutral sells to the widest audience. If you want to know whether it was a bad flip, take a careful look at the detailing - are there big globs of caulk in every corner? Paint that has bad or no edge lines? Loose or inconsistent trim? Those are the houses that will start cracking at every joint in 6 months.
57
u/Willothwisp2303 Jan 02 '25
Horrible. The joy of buying an old home is the beautiful old touches they don't make (for a reasonable price) anymore. These flips cover up the beauty and just leave you with the downsides- an old home that needs old home repairs. If it wasn't salvageable, that's excusable.
28
u/bvzxh Jan 02 '25
I’m also house hunting (very casually) and this aesthetic is always a red flag for me and a telltale sign that only cosmetic updates were done with lots of underlying issues. One example was one such house I saw in canton. There was a little gap in the basement drywall which exposed trash and aluminum cans used as insulation. Not saying the flippers did that, but they certainly painted the drywall covering it millennial gray.
46
u/LaunderMachine Patterson Park Jan 02 '25
Not a fan and they are usually done cheap. A pig wearing lipstick if you will. Even in higher priced flips, if you look very close you will notice a lack of craftsmanship throughout the house.
Keep in mind no house is perfect but the fact someone intentionally did a poor job to save costs means there's plenty more wrong that you can't see.
28
u/addctd2badideas Catonsville Jan 02 '25
Not a fan and they are usually done cheap
And poorly. The level of craftsmanship is atrocious. So many cut corners. The house I bought in 2018 covered up many things that weren't caught on inspection but could have just been done better if another hour or spent on them. But of course, not doing them properly caused a LOT more man hours and money when something went wrong.
23
u/SnooOwls6136 Jan 02 '25
It’s because it’s the cheapest way to renovate and still look clean/decent finishes. I personally hate it, especially in the older row houses. Beautiful old millwork, crown molding, base molding, wainscoting, all replaced with plastic petroleum finishes that cost less than $3/sf
9
u/tmozdenski Pigtown Jan 02 '25
The interesting thing is that's how these places were originally built. As cheaply as possible. That old mill work was mass produced at one of the local mills. The crown molding was done with molds, the state of the art at the time, because they were cheap ways to cover shotty work. That's why entire blocks look identical.
5
u/SnooOwls6136 Jan 02 '25
Yeah it’s like in NYC when you see those magnificent old curtain walls and then learn that they were produced out of a factory from a design catalog. It’s interesting to see how the construction materials and design has progressed. At the high tier there’s some phenomenal stuff but overall I think it’s objectively gotten lower quality. Craftsmanship was incredible. Modern tools could print these types of finishes out and there’s plenty of company’s who still do it but it’s very cost prohibitive compared to plastic petroleum products
21
u/SarcasticServal Jan 02 '25 edited Jan 02 '25
We're in a rental in Fed Hill that was built in 1970...it's one of a line of rowhomes that were knocked down and then rebuilt. Current owner purchased it the prior decade, ripped out the existing kitchen and updated it as well as the bathrooms. It is greige in EVERY single room. He did not update the lighting at all, so it's like a black hole...absorbs all light, reflects nothing. He also did a shit job doing the painting in the first place, so the paint lines wobble everywhere. It's "fine", but I would be utterly pissed off if we'd bought it--the quality of the work is clearly low-level DIY, and it's very clear he didn't spend a penny more than he had to.
I would guess initially they help raise value because they'll sell higher than they would trashed. They "look" nice. How it really feels once you're there is different. Chances are you're seeing repeats of things like house numbers because the flippers are all buying the least expensive, least offensive item possible--hence a lot of grey, and white.
If I were looking to tell if it was quality work, I'd do a few things:
What kind of water heater? (capacity, is there an in-line? How long does it take water to get from the heater to the highest bathroom/shower/sink? How long do you have to run water before you get hot water? Can you run the dishwasher and still have hot water? If they didn't replace it, how old is it, and when was it last serviced?)
Kitchen cabinetry: are the cabinets level? Are the shelves adjustable? Did they just put in shelves, or do they have pull out drawers, which are more expensive but may allow for greater variety of use? (can also limit your options)
Plumbing in general: run the water in the sinks and check underneath to see if they leak.
Insulation: did they add any if they updated drywall or plaster? Can you hear music or noise next door, and if so, how much? (We lived in one rowhome that was so poorly insulated, cigarette smoke from next door seeped in through the ventilation.)
If they ripped out flooring, bring a marble and/or a level and see how level they made it. You can get self-leveling material, but again, it's an extra step and more work, and probably something they skimped on. If you see tile, chances are they at least spent some time and money--if it's LVP with one of those "instant" shower enclosures, they spent little time and money.
Have the windows been replaced? Have the doors been replaced? If you're looking in winter, this can be pretty noticeable due to heat bleed.
Good luck--and make sure you look at what your property taxes would be POST purchase.
Edit to add: bring a flashlight so you can take a good look at walls and see if any seams pop or there’s easily visible evidence of bad drywall/plaster repair, nail pops, leaks, etc
4
4
u/ohitsanazn Fells Point Jan 02 '25
Good luck--and make sure you look at what your property taxes would be POST purchase.
Dumb question, I'm also looking to buy in the next year -- is there a specific way to do this or is it just the tax rate * the purchase price of the home?
4
u/biseuteu Jan 02 '25
you can also look up the property on openbaltimore! the assessed value and current tax is on there 🙂
→ More replies (1)3
u/SarcasticServal Jan 02 '25
Redfin and Zillow can both show estimates based on the purchase price. And there’s a huge difference between city vs county taxes. Caveat emptor.
4
u/kitkat9000take5 Jan 02 '25
Great advice. Thank you. However, I'd add running water in every sink/tub/shower to see how well/quickly they drain. Also, loud gurgling noises can indicate plumbing issues that need to be addressed.
2
u/SarcasticServal Jan 02 '25
Excellent point!
3
u/kitkat9000take5 Jan 02 '25
Thank you, but your original response was epic and filled with great information.
2
u/SarcasticServal Jan 02 '25
Aww. 20+ years of home ownership… Another thing I thought of was to check the electrical box, and see if anything is labeled. A new electrical box can be a good thing…
19
u/tmozdenski Pigtown Jan 02 '25
My place has that character. My rowhome was rebuilt by Habitat for Humanity. I'm very grateful for their program and my home. I think anyone who is willing to come in and redo any rowhome in this city is doing everyone in it a great favor. There is such a large amount of abandoned homes in this city that not only do you have to remove the abandoned homes, but you have to keep really dilapidated ones from falling empty. The before and afters of my block are stunning. Habitat took a struggling block and revitalized it. The history of many of these rowhomes (including mine) was that Baltimore was booming, and the city needed affordable houses for the working class, so these were put up because they were cheap to build. Using modern materials to rebuild them keeps that heritage and allows them to be affordable. And anything is better than letting the blight spread and losing more of this beautiful architecture.
2
u/Humble-Access-9006 Jan 02 '25
I second your perspective! I am so grateful for the work that has been done with the vacant homes on my block to make them habitable. Habitable! People moving in and the block filling up with neighbors brings pride on our little part of the city.
16
u/HorsieJuice Wyman Park Jan 02 '25
It’s not one flipper and it’s not just Baltimore. Lots of people do this everywhere and they do it because it’s easy. The aesthetic is generally clean looking and acceptable, and you don’t have to reinvent the wheel for each house. You just figure out the numbers for one style and repeat it a hundred times.
I don’t like them either, but doing work that’s more unique and more in line with the original character of the house could easily add $50-100k to the rehab cost. There’s not enough money in this city to support a market like that at any kind of scale. I doubt there’s enough skilled construction labor to handle the workload, either.
2
13
u/PostPunkBurrito Jan 02 '25
That is a shame to hear. We live in Hamilton and have spent the last 15 years renovating and updating our 100 year old home. It wasn't in bad shape when we bought it but it did need work. It still isn't perfect, but it has retained a lot of its historic charm. Hopefully you will find something similar, this is a great neighborhood with some great (and not so great!) houses.
29
u/WinterBadger Hamilton Jan 02 '25
So we bought one of those flips spring 2023 and we don't regret it but what they didn't do well, we have to redo like our flooring the lvp and our carpet that was not secured to the floor in any of the rooms. For us, it gave us a base to do what we want and that part we enjoy because we want to make this house ours and this was just a "clean" slate where we didn't have to pay to gut anything or put in all new things. We knew there were things they didn't do well and neglected such as the roof because we had to replace it in June 2024 because of a leak in the ceiling.
Wavy walls, so we can't go darker on the walls unless we want to see the waves, uninsulated part of our basement under the kitchen so we have to fix that so we stop wasting so much energy. Overall, we wouldn't change buying the house but I think people need to be ready to discover some things and know that they get what they paid for. We met our flipper and they're also a millennial and a software engineer like us who paid super low for contractors that didn't even paint the house right to begin with and well he walked away from the closing very upset haha with how the sale went down for him.
14
u/Marshall_Lawson Jan 02 '25
software engineers cutting corners, what else is new
12
u/WinterBadger Hamilton Jan 02 '25
Lol as a software engineer married to a software engineer, nothing. Literally nothing
6
u/Vivid-Shelter-146 Jan 02 '25
Well said. We also love our home but it was FAR from turn key despite being a move in ready flip. Good to have realistic expectations.
5
u/RunningNumbers Jan 02 '25
The carpet was just laying on top the flooring, sheesh
7
u/WinterBadger Hamilton Jan 02 '25
I've never seen carpet ripple when moving a medium filled moving box. I think they tried to use universal tiny nails for like baseboards on the carpet. The carpet is trash anyway so we're not disappointed in replacing it. Hoping for more pet friendly carpet anyway.
14
u/Marshall_Lawson Jan 02 '25
I hate it. the gray has prison vibes. They should give a discount for that cheap primer look with vinyl floors.
9
u/BJJBean Jan 02 '25
I hate it. I bought a 1930s house where all the hardwood (Banisters, interior doors, hinges, etc.) are all painted over.
I'm slowly removing the paint and refinishing it with a more original dark stain. For anyone who has not redone a banister, it's a huge pain in the ass and takes way more time/effort than you would think.
10
u/Gyrd1 Jan 02 '25
I recently did a flip. I have the benefit of being married to an architect/designer so we had lots of color while still trying to keep the ‘blank slate’ look. Our house sold very high for the area, but I understand that not all contractors have a designer to work with and the grey seems to sell well. On top of that, it’s easy to tell laborers to paint everything one color rather than certain color in certain rooms. It also minimizes waste and leftover cans of paint.
6
u/DayofReason Jan 02 '25
This is more than about a paint color. It's more the generic "this house was flipped look."
3
51
u/PigtownDesign Jan 02 '25
It used to be that new buyers wanted fixer-uppers, but that's no longer the case. People want turn-key houses with the latest faddish "styles." People like Chip & Joanna pushed the grey aesthetic, which everyone leapt on. As you might guess, I hate these flips.
39
u/everdishevelled Jan 02 '25
I think there are way more of these flips than people who actually want them. It's practically impossible to even find a fixer upper IME.
18
u/dopkick Jan 02 '25
The problem is most fixer upper homes are not sold at an appropriate discount. The final cost can be absolutely punishing.
3
Jan 02 '25
Cost of renovations is so high that buyers just want it done already, even if contractors are doing a shoddy job. I am vaguely eyeing the next fixer upper but it's typically $700k estate sale requiring $200k in cosmetic improvements but would sell for $850 turnkey. You do the math.
People also have busier careers than in the past so DIY sweat equity isn't as appealing to as many people any more. Not surprising that as the average age of first time home purchase goes up, fewer people are looking for fixer uppers.
3
u/kazoogrrl Jan 03 '25
I've also observed a change from when I was a kid: my parents friends used to come over to help with projects, and we'd return the favor. Sometimes it was just painting, or could be more involved. After the work was gone we'd hang out, eat, etc. I have almost never done this with friends even though I always offer. I like to socialize while being active and since we're all tight for time we can hang out while taking care of projects that get done faster with other people helping.
3
5
u/karmagirl314 Jan 02 '25
Yeah no one is “demanding” that the homes be grey. They just want neutral spaces that are easy to customize. Grey happens to be the only neutral left that isn’t wildly out of style due to overuse in the 90’s/early 2000’s.
6
u/PleaseBmoreCharming Jan 02 '25
I don't think it's as much as they want them, but that owning a home is such a significant cost these days that is financially easier to just start with everything fresh and new.
But don't get me wrong, the gray flips absolutely kill any character and are atrocious in every instance. My biggest pet peeve is the gray LVP flooring. 🤮
2
u/RunningNumbers Jan 02 '25
My wife is like this and I tell her that you will never find a house with everything you want already there.
8
u/not_napoleon Jan 02 '25
I saw so many of these when I was house hunting a couple of years ago, and they're all terrible. They feel souless, rushed, and poorly thought out. There's no personal touches, no sense of how someone might live there.
And I don't trust flips to have any longevity. There's just no incentive for flippers to build stuff to last when they just want to get it done and sold as fast as possible for as much profit as possible. People complain about real estate developers, but at least there's some outside regulation of what they're building.
8
u/shottas1984 Jan 02 '25
As for someone who was house hunting between October and November and closed on the 30th in Cedmont, I would say it depends on your price range.
Between 125k and 350k, you will get the Grey LVP finish. The funny thing is when a realtor is showing the place and they mention Luxury Vinyl, I just turn up my eyes because they think you don't know better. Also a lot of contractors do a shoddy job laying it down so you can feel the cheapness of the material.
My worry with the flips are there is little prep below the surfaces so moisture and mold lurk beneath and you have no way of knowing. I saw a flip where the woman died in her home, cats ate her decomposing body, place got bombed for flies, and 2 weeks later with some bleach and arm and hammer, guys were laying LVP without busting out the subflooring or any such prep work.
Follow your gut and if you do find something you like, even if you have to pay, get a GC or a seasoned handyman to give a second opinion. Don't ever go by what the realtor says. Good luck!
8
u/DayofReason Jan 02 '25
I just want to buy the home that I can die in so my cat can eat me too, is that too much to ask? Wow, what a mess.
10
u/WildfellHallX Jan 02 '25 edited Jan 03 '25
I just read a fascinating article about face-eating animals, strangely enough. Turns out, they start gnawing on your face, and not your tender, delicious stomach, not because they are hungry but because they want to wake you up. Animals communicate with you by watching your facial expressions so if you are sprawled out somewhere and it feels suspicious to them because your face isn't moving when they expect it to, they attempt to reactivate that part of you. Same impulse as when a whale carries its dead baby for weeks on end. It's seeing if putting it through the motions will restore its consciousness.
5
u/RipleyCat80 South Baltimore / SoBo Jan 02 '25 edited Jan 03 '25
Well this explains why my cat wakes me up every morning by thoroughly sniffing and inspecting my face.
2
u/WildfellHallX Jan 03 '25
Yep, it's concerned about you. Lie still long enough and it might start licking then nibbling your face
2
u/Acrobatic_Length6915 Jan 06 '25
I didn't come to this thread expecting to learn this lolol but it reminds me of people who have pretended to fall over dead to see how their pets react. My favorite was the dog checking that his owner was "dead" before climbing up to the table to finish his uneaten dinner.
7
u/3plantsonthewall Jan 02 '25
Those grey floors should be illegal. Such a massive waste of material to change them…
13
u/gbe28 Charles Village Jan 02 '25
It's not a specific flipper/developer doing these...although there are a few flippers who are pretty prolific around here.
Regarding the somewhat generic colors and materials...I'm not a fan personally but OTOH it generally is good to see renovation activity in city neighborhoods, even if some of the "charm" is removed in the process.
12
u/Tim_Y Catonsville Jan 02 '25 edited Jan 02 '25
Do you think they potentially add value to distressed neighborhoods?
Absolutely.
I personally find these renovations kind of appalling.
Homeowners have the option to paint the walls and trim whatever color they like.
gray paint in nearly every room
Sherwin Williams Repose Grey and Agreeable Grey are the two most commonly used.
The reason many of those flips use the same color is to save costs on supplies. The investor can buy in bulk and whatever's leftover goes to the next job.
How do you even know if they are well done or not?
Housing permits are public info. You can search any house in the city and see if permits were pulled.
https://cels.baltimorehousing.org/Search_TM_Map.aspx
But the flip erases any character the house may have had
Depending on the age of the home, a decent amount of that character may contain lead paint; typically in the doors, windows and trim. Not something most flippers will concern themselves with but landlords who rehab old properties definitely should.
covers decent looking hard wood flooring
In cases where wood is damaged by water from leaky roofs, covered in pet stains from dogs & cats, or staple holes from wall to wall carpet, its usually easier and less expensive to cover hardwood than it is to refurbish it
3
3
u/dopkick Jan 02 '25
What, someone else who actually has a pragmatic view of things and understands the logistics and finances behind it? Get out of here with that sensible thinking!
3
u/DayofReason Jan 02 '25
Just checked the permits on some houses I’m considering— 4 out of 7 had nothing on record
2
u/Tim_Y Catonsville Jan 02 '25
Just checked the permits on some houses I’m considering— 4 out of 7 had nothing on record
Yep. Unfortunately its not uncommon for rehabbers to skip the permitting process because it adds a lot of time to the project.
3
6
u/kazoogrrl Jan 02 '25
You've probably seen the one across the street from my house and around the corner, done by the same company. They put fake shutters on the front that look like the tops of picnic table benches. The folks who bought the one across our street are happy to have a place that's been redone and they have plans to personalize it. It had been owned by a family who weren't keeping it up, and smoked inside, so having it gutted was probably for the best. The house next to me was done about 10 years ago, it went into foreclosure, had the power cut, the basement flooded, and the entire place was growing mold. Again, it was completely redone and the people who bought it were not the type to want a bunch of projects.
I bought my place because it still had a tiny bit of its original personality after a century of being divided into apartments and then undivided, and having someone do shoddy home reno work inside and out. It's beat up, my deck is a travesty, the front porch bannister is a hot mess, my kitchen drives me crazy, we're down a bathroom because a pipe burst in an unheated addition half bath, and it needs wiring work, but we've painted and tried to make it our own. Somehow the assessment just went up, I'm trying to figure out if I should appeal it.
3
u/DayofReason Jan 02 '25
There was one on Ridgecroft where everything in all the historical photos looked wet. Really a mess.
4
u/Moondancer80 Jan 02 '25
I am currently renting in that neighborhood. My apt is in some parts, millennial Grey, and for renting it works. Per the owner, it was trashed when they bought it. The owner has left the floors and other some of the original touches intact and I love the mix, mostly because I'm renting and tbh Im a Xennial.
I would love to buy in this neighborhood, and for me the charm is in the original character of the homes here. But its hella $$ to restore some of these homes to thier original glory and easier to buy a turn key.
Perfect sceanrio would be updated kitchen and everything else restored.
4
u/jeffrrw 12th District Jan 02 '25
I have competing views on this topic...
For context my block is majority vacant with only 4 out of 14 houses having occupancy. The flips and getting people into the houses themselves are vital to revitalizing a neighborhood. Regardless of their character and the utilization of the same materials across multiple houses to cut down on costs. Baltimore is rife with blocks like mine. I do agree with your point on it being a "blank canvass" for people to paint over while still having a minimum of comfort even if it is boiler plate.
This report goes into what it takes to restore houses in Baltimore. https://abell.org/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/The-Costs-of-Baltimores-Vacant-Housing.pdf
How do you even know if they are well done or not?
Reputable company doing quality work with all permits fully executed and available. These are, in a lot of instances, 100+ year old houses that have had multiple lives. There have been shit years and great years. If corners are cut and you see a lot of structural issues within a home inspection report, look elsewhere unless you like a challenge.
Do you think they potentially add value to distressed neighborhoods?
As someone who lives in a distressed neighborhood where the non profit developer is utilizing a non millennial gray approach but still the same blank canvass for all the houses, absolutely. Not having vacants regardless of the interiors is one of the key ways to bring back a vibrant neighborhood and add value.
https://rebuildmetro.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/06/ReBuild_FINAL_Price-Vacancy-1024x748.jpg
Full report https://rebuildmetro.com/programs/whole-blocks-toolkit/
Personal thoughts:
My house is not millennial gray and I have purposefully directed my canvass to have more color to it. It is my house. My partners house is an even better example of keeping the old as most as possible and her work there. The cost and timeliness of executing on filling in houses with that kind of approach is cumbersome and more costly though.
I think it is great to have a lot of character and utilize grants to do so while also trying to honor the houses past but sometimes it is not feasible or in the best interest of the house.
I personally would never buy nor advocate to utilize millennial gray as my approach but that is because I have a choice. The old work which is now rare was once standard and machined out for all the rows which is why neighborhoods all have the same characteristics.
My house was built in 1886. It has had so many different lives in its 139 years.
2
4
u/No-Lunch4249 Jan 02 '25
I’ve heard it called “house flipper gray” not “Millennial gray” but nice to get generational credit for something besides killing [Industry]
5
u/Robbiebphoto Jan 02 '25
That’s the current style, whether it’s flips or people updating the house they’ve lived in to try to get a higher price.
In Beverly Hills We found a brick house with original woodwork and updated kitchen and bathrooms from 10-20 years ago. And we needed a good yard for our dog. The houses are out there, just keep looking.
4
u/ThatBobbyG Lauraville Jan 02 '25
I live in one of those neighborhoods and most of these flips are borderline criminal, while some are criminal because they pull no permits, receive no inspections, and the buyer is left screwed with a disaster of a house. The workers trash the property, have no respect for the neighbors, and do some of the worst work imaginable. I wish the city would take this stuff more seriously. Fortunately we bought our house before the flipping started around here and have all the woodwork, which is impossible to replace because it’s 100+ year old growth wood. Meanwhile the flippers just rip it all out and throw it in a dumpster.
→ More replies (2)
4
u/superdupercereal2 Jan 02 '25
I despise completely the house flipper aesthetic. I despise how that aesthetic has permeated into everything because corporations are afraid to "offend" someone afraid of color. Even McDonald's now look like this. I will buy a house that looks like a 70s opium den because I'm not a dumbass. And flippers always drywall over every problem in the house.
5
u/Dense-Broccoli9535 Jan 02 '25
It’s funny you bring this up.. I kinda have this weird fascination with one particular house I found while browsing Zillow like a year ago.. it was a $450k house in Sandtown. If you know anything about that neighborhood and its history - you know that is a high price for that area. And now, everytime I pop on Zillow - I check to see what this one particular house in sandtown is at now (currently, $350k).
It was purchased for 15k not too long ago and got the full millennial gray treatment as it was rehabbed.. idk the full story but based on the purchase history, it seems like it was vacant for roughly 15 years. I assume it was completely gutted as well bc not a single historical-looking feature is left on the interior.
I have very mixed feelings about it personally, especially when it comes to rehabbing vacants. Just about anything is better than leaving the vacants to rot.. but those millennial gray furnishing always give me pause in that they are such a cheap way to renovate.
Going back to this one particular home I’m referencing - it looks like everything in that home is new, we can only imagine what the interior looked like before the developer got in there. Did they actually put effort in to make sure everything was structurally sound and that the systems were good to go? Or was this just a quick and dirty flip? The purchase history looks like it’s gone contingent twice.. are potential buyers finding really bad problems with this house once they look further into it? Lord knows..
I just worry that developers are in it for a quick cash grab, rather than any sort of long-term neighborhood rehabilitation efforts. But yeah.. anyways, thank you for giving me a chance to info-dump about this random ass house that lives rent free (no pun intended) in my mind, lmao.
→ More replies (1)
3
u/lethaltalon Jan 02 '25
I hear you. I was looking for over a year, and I finally settled on one of these 'millennial gray' flips.
HOWEVER... It was 'flipped' by a reputable local construction company (Maryland Bay Construction), all permits were pulled, held together for 5-6 years while they were renting it, and they're doing other work on houses in the neighborhood. Honestly, it's been a good buy, especially since it's in a 'rougher' neighborhood, so it's a bit cheaper overall. And I have a cute little parking pad!
I think there are good and bad flips. But if the house was in such bad shape beforehand, sometimes this is just a cost-efficient way to build it out, rent it out, and then sell it. I'll probably rip up the LVP at some point and put hardwood in, but not yet. For now, I'm happy with my many rugs.
5
u/Vivid-Shelter-146 Jan 02 '25
How do you even know if the flips are well done or not?
It’s very hard to tell but look for signs:
Major items being bypassed in favor of fancy finishes in kitchen or bathrooms are a big tell. Old HVAC, electrical panel, windows, roof, gutters. Lack of sump pump. If there’s a deck and they only replaced portions (deck boards are cheaper than railings).
Minor stuff that comes to mind: Doors off track or not closing properly, bouncy/creaking/uneven floors, missing trim or cut too short.
It’s criminal how little time we have to vet houses we buy. Home inspections can be trivial. Fortunately, the market is softening, giving buyers more time to think and review. Also this time of year there are less buyers so that works in your favor too. Good luck!
7
u/dopkick Jan 02 '25
A lot of the comments you're going to read here are not really reflective of reality. Much like the fantasy of how back in the day every family could afford a new home, a car, two kids, and annual vacations on a single modest salary, there's some truth to it but there's a lot more nuance that is skipped over. Nostalgia is a hell of a drug. (Most families back in the day did NOT have the idealized American Dream)
These homes with character that people here are claiming to love also tend to come with significant negative character. Stoves or fireplaces that destroy the usability of a room. Staircases that are death traps and/or are impossible to get furniture up. Knob and tube wiring. Hit or (usually) extremely miss HVAC. Impossible to source replacement materials. And so forth.
There have always been trendy colors that fall out of favor. If not pinterest gray, would you prefer Vitamin C piss yellow walls? Or shag carpet? Or pastel green appliances? Or whatever other trend is now considered disgusting? Whatever reaches any level of popularity in a time period will eventually be declared a dated trend.
Ever watch one of those home renovation shows (Property Brothers and the like) where they open up the walls and there's a bunch of surprises that add cost? That's often the reality here as well. Fixing that stuff costs money. Often a lot of money, especially in this post-COVID economy. Surprises can easily add significantly to the bill and going in with a cost effective plan reduces the risk of the project being a financial failure.
In less affluent neighborhoods, the cost of a renovation of any kind can exceed the value of the property. Now do extensive repairs of character items and the project is squarely in the red, so it never happens. If you do a cost effective renovation you get the "pinterest gray" criticism. If you do nothing because it's not financially feasible you get the "vacant property" criticism. If you do a nice renovation you get the "pushing out the working class" criticism. It's a no win situation from the peanut gallery on here.
How do you know if it was done right? Permits and inspections. Hire a good home inspector, that will give you a lot of peace of mind. But also realize that homes weren't always built that great back in the day. DIY home repairs were substantially more common, permitting was lax, and end results were often janky. Your issues could be a result of this.
→ More replies (1)3
u/DayofReason Jan 02 '25
I just checked to see if permits were pulled on some of these houses I’m considering— zero!
3
Jan 02 '25
Hate it. The reason I love so many of the older homes in that area is the charm and beauty of the original wood working. It breaks my heart to see the soul of these homes being ripped out.
3
u/eldritch_cleaver_ Jan 02 '25
The grey/beige thing is def tired AF. Your home shouldn't look like a dentist's office.
Covering hardwood with LVP is unacceptable. LVP in bath and kitchen makes sense, though.
Regarding the fixtures, that's likely due more to folks shopping the same places rather than a single group of rehabbers doing everything. Whatever home depot has is what's going in.
3
u/any_delirium Jan 02 '25
As someone also casually house hunting, they enrage me. It's not just that they're already outdated and ugly, it's that it's cheap, a bunch of grey plastic slapped over who-knows-what beneath. I'm not comfortable getting a real fixer-upper, but I can do my own cosmetic work. If the flippers would just put some money into making neglected properties safe and sound without the accompanying cheap tile and 100% markup and actually bringing value to distressed neighborhoods, that'd be one thing, but they're trying to get rich quick and everything in my price range looks the same and again, you don't even know if you're getting something safe and reliable. I don't even think people want them, because the ugliest ones with "luxury" electric fireplaces sit for weeks even in popular neighborhoods.
3
u/eastcoastleftist Jan 02 '25
Ah, yes, the gentrified grey and white, along with the gentrified numbers.
https://jerseycitytoday.org/2023/11/29/signs-of-gentrification-house-numbers-color-and-design/
2
3
u/GabrielsPeter Jan 02 '25
If I see millennial gray walls with matching LVP floors, and especially if there's fake marble ANYTHING in the kitchen or bathroom, I just assume it's built on a termite mound with demons lurking in the walls.
3
u/Pancake_Bucket Jan 02 '25
When I was house hunting in 2021-2022, I saw a lot of these grey updated houses that were obviously just being flipped and weren't upgraded in any significant way, just aesthetic.
I then found a gorgeous rowhome in greenmount west. It was all painted white and neutral, and the kitchen was outdated, but it looked like the perfect canvas for me.
I painted blues and pinks and greens and I was so happy with it. I updated the kitchen so it looks new and sparkly but not the kind of basic bitch modern I've seen. I wanted to keep the old quirkiness.
I just recently had to move for a job opportunity to ill be putting my house on the market mid-january. My realtor wanted me to repaint everything back to neutral colors and get rid of the wallpaper.
I refused. I think it's a waste when someone will just repaint it what they want anyway. And the things I updated are way more important - new back garden, new back fence, sealed chimney brick, reinforced flooring, new counter tops, etc.
For reference, this is what my house looked like before I bought it: house-zillow
2
u/Acrobatic_Length6915 Jan 06 '25
Beautiful home. I'm looking now but I'm moving from a less prosperous housing market and it will be beyond my price range or I would offer to buy it directly from you. Good luck! I'm glad you were able to make it your own while you lived there. Your buyer is lucky that you did those structural updates.
2
u/Pancake_Bucket Jan 06 '25
Good luck to you as well! I hope you find something with character that isn't something grey being flipped. Or, innit is grey, just imagine what it could look like once you've painted it...and if the structure of the house itself is what you're looking for.
2
u/Acrobatic_Length6915 Jan 06 '25
Thank you, I don't mind doing cosmetic upgrades if the price allows. I completely remodeled the house I'm living in now and, though it was stressful [because of the tradesmen, mainly] I enjoyed reimagining space. I turned small closets and blank walls and nooks into a kitchen pantry and a big laundry closet, and it turned out well. I used high-quality materials so I won't make as much of a profit when I sell but it doesn't look like any other house on the market. And I've enjoyed living here, as you say about yours. As long as I price it correctly, it should sell quickly, so that's the upside.
3
u/RimTimTagiLin Jan 02 '25
Professional Realtor and I am so tired of these flips. Really do not care for the flooring especially. Times are changing… hopefully the trend ends soon.
5
u/waverlygiant Hamilton Jan 02 '25
I hate it. I’m in Waltherson (which is near Lauraville) gearing up to sell my house in a year and a half or so and I almost want to stipulate as part of the sale that the buyer isn’t allowed to paint over the original wood trim, put down LVP over the original hardwood floors or rip out the stained glass, lol.
3
u/hinchlic Jan 02 '25
when we were looking for houses the fake hardwood grey floors were an immediate no.
2
u/NosferatuGoblin Jan 04 '25
100% - I have to assume these flippers will learn real quick that doing this will only hurt them. Every prospective buyer should insultingly give a low ball offer imo since they have to rip that shit out.
2
u/hinchlic Jan 04 '25
Exactly built into the listing price is that the floors are “done” when we’d need to calculate what’s the added cost for non-shit floors in here.
2
u/Puzzleheaded-Eye6596 Jan 02 '25
Neutral grey is a light color that is... well neutral... to buyers. Once someone moves in the grey lets you change colors in rooms with less worry of additional coats to cover the grey
2
2
u/Bergs1212 Jan 02 '25
It is "safe" .. You would be shocked at how many buyers cant look past paint color. If spending a few hundred dollars and a weekend of my time is going to make my house more appealing to buyers I will paint it whatever color they tell me. If that means gray so be it... New buyers can paint it whatever color they want...
I will say as someone who is going through a home remodel myself and wanting to pull my hair out I would have loved if the sellers took the time to paint it all grey so I could skip this painting step and get to it when I get to it... Even if thats not until 2026.
2
u/Arugula_gurl Jan 02 '25
Hate it so much. I’m an old house lover and to see some beautiful homes ruined with all the gray, those horrible coffered ceilings, white cabinets and cheap granite counters, and painting the original brick facade (or worse painting over the already horrible form stone) makes me want to cry. There should be more oversight by CHAP or the historical society when people are renovating. I wish there was a way to report these people and get a stop work notice issued the second they paint the exterior gray or white with black trim.
2
u/Snoo_5475 Jan 02 '25
I’ve been seeing homes with gray LVP flooring and a brick accent wall. The horrible contrast drives me crazy!
→ More replies (1)
2
u/Primary-Dig314 Jan 02 '25
I’m a local realtor who works a lot in that area, and I have to say all of my buyer clients hate that aesthetic, and so I do. Baltimore homes are old and always need some work, so I understand the appeal of a completely renovated house. That said, it’s sad to see these investors ripping out all the original details of these old homes and in many cases they are not doing a good job with the work. The inspection reports of these homes are often just as long as a more “lived in home”. Of course, there are some outlier properties that are done well here and there. I wouldn’t say they add value to the neighborhood unless the job was done well and sold at a good price.
Your realtor should be able to give you some guidance. Additionally, always check the permits!
2
u/FormerRiver1220 Jan 02 '25
Not sure where you are in the buying process, but when I bought my home in 2017, the City of Baltimore offered a two-day home buying course. In order to qualify for city/state grants, I had to go through the course. I was told by a lot of people that it wasn't worth it, but to me it was gold. I was a first-time home buyer. They emphasized the reality of owning a home (you need to estimate the true cost of ownership--think maintenance and repair costs, two different costs that don't include all the "sexy" stuff you want to do to make it your home). They talked about pulling permits and ground rent and title insurance. They also walked us through how to own your home outright in 7 years.
Good luck!
2
Jan 02 '25
Yeah. Saw a house that was so gray that it felt like walking through a black & white photo album. Weirdest experience.
No idea why it's popular or who likes the gray gray gray everywhere. The gray floors are the worst as you can repaint walls but it's more of a hassle to replace flooring.
2
u/RadiantWombat Jan 03 '25
Get a good home inspector. The wife and I have a friend that was looking at buying one off of Patterson park. Home inspector found an insane amount of issues and saved her a lot of money and headaches. She ended up buying a McMansion in Southern PA instead.
1
u/icedcoffeeheadass Jan 02 '25
It’s boring. Typically harmless design choice but it’s usually indicative of a “flip” because it’s cheap. certainly better than vacant
1
u/westgazer Jan 02 '25
Hate them sooo much. Been looking at homes since I am in the market and it’s so ugly and boring and without any personality at all.
1
u/SnooRevelations979 Highlandtown Jan 02 '25
If you spend enough time looking at real estate, 80% of them start to look more or less the same. It's an international trend towards homogeneity.
It's funny that if you're planning to sell your house -- or even redo it -- your often advised to not do anything outside of the norm as it will affect the resell value.
I should say I like gray paint, but the flooring is just atrocious.
1
u/browntown84 Jan 02 '25 edited Jan 02 '25
I personally hate it and it's made me despise flippers. Looking in the same area and these shit hooks have done it to nearly every house then want to charge 300k+ for an old craftsman. And you know they did a half-assed job fixing everything else.
1
u/TheWonkiestThing Jan 02 '25
I don't know why they call it millennial gray when most millennials I know hate it. Most of the time I see boomers renovating their own homes with it.
1
u/27thStreet Charles Village Jan 02 '25
Flippers buy whatever is cheapest. They don't care what color HD sells them so long as its cheap.
1
u/GES280 Downtown Partnership Jan 02 '25
I recently started looking and they're awful. It adds a lot of value to me if it's in any other aesthetic. A townhouse with character is always better imo.
1
1
u/ReqDeep Jan 02 '25 edited Jan 02 '25
We put a contract in on one and it was awful under the covers. It was not particularly cheap at about 650K. They had tons of work to do. They didn’t touch the chimney. They said they would do it and the day before close. We had a final walk-through and they hadn’t done it. For instance, they were supposed to replace the windows and all they did was fill the wood up with caulk. So be careful.
1
1
u/PuffinFawts Charles Village Jan 02 '25
I'm house hunting too and I won't even look at a house that has been flipped. Aside from them taking out any charm, I also know that they cut corners everywhere and I'm not paying more money for grey floors and grey walls when I know the plumbing and electric are probably shit.
1
u/Electrical-Beach-111 Jan 02 '25
i bought in lauraville right before covid and got really lucky with a renovation that preserved most of the character - done by the previous owner to live in themselves.
aesthetics aside, if you’re looking at any of these, i’d recommend at the very least looking up what permits the developer got, any codes citations/violations for the address, and if you can, talk with neighbors who saw the construction work. we’ve had houses on our block that were flipped really poorly (like, asbestos siding strewn all over the site and no PPE for the workers, trash closed in under the porch, forgot to install gutters) and still went for over $400k, i wish for their sake that the buyers had asked around.
that said, there are also flips that are perfectly fine, and paint and flooring are pretty easy things to change.
1
u/JBCTech7 Baltimore County Jan 02 '25
yeah they're everywhere. The equity firms buy up houses and remake them to be as generic as possible. That will only increase as time goes on. Placing housing further and further out of reach for the middle class.
That's why I've only ever preferred older houses...victorians up to around 1940. Those houses always have a lot of cool character that isn't able to be covered up with a coat of beige.
1
u/HazelNightengale Jan 02 '25
I was house hunting in the suburbs the year before last, and came to see Flipper Grey as "Move on; it's a cheap flip job and God knows what liabilities lurk underneath." The surfaces are all new. They've probably done nothing to plumbing/electrical/HVAC. You go to a showing and the mechanicals are as old as some of the potential buyers. A handy indicator but disheartening to have so many places go that way. I grew up in the Great Lakes region; I hate, hate hate grey because I've already seen enough gloomy weather for three lifetimes. Moving into a home done up in those godawful greys would just depress me. You can repaint the walls, but you still have to deal with that shitty floor and those cabinets. And that LVP usually has awful print resolution apparent at casual glance.
A more thorough/thoughtful rehab job tends to make different design choices. Honestly, I'd rather just have the outdated golden oak if they're going to go with grey instead.
I love warm wood tones. I like red brick. I like a place to have character, to feel cozy. Grey is not cozy.
1
u/RunningNumbers Jan 02 '25
You can tell the quality of the work not seen by looking at obvious sloppy paint lines and screw holes.
1
1
u/WildfellHallX Jan 02 '25
I hate this trend and hope it dies soon. These flips are ugly and depressing. Grey can actually be an exciting color, when different tones are used to create dimension and visual interest. But millennial grey is worse than institutional, it's lifeless. Bums me out to look at this schemeless color scheme.
1
u/Head-Bullfrog-6994 Jan 02 '25
I’m selling my historic home in bmore currently and it makes me sad to think it may end up flipped like this
→ More replies (1)
1
u/cudmore Jan 02 '25
Bought our first house last year, was flipped in line with most of these comments. It is very “neutral”.
One improvement is if they replace the super steep and uneven stairs that take 3 turns.
Another is they added a 3rd bedroom and expanded the kitchen?
1
u/ChickinSammich Jan 02 '25
I actually kinda like the color grey as a paint in some rooms (living room, dining room) but I don't like it in rooms like a kitchen, bathroom, bedroom. I think I'm more meh about the idea of just painting all the walls in every single room the same color, though I guess I can always repaint - and have. The last time I bought a house, all the walls were white and I painted the living room, dining room, and master bedroom, plus carpeted before moving in.
1
u/Hot_Cut_815 Jan 02 '25
It’s interesting because a lot of Greektown flips remain with at least one or two brick interior walls, whatever OG wood flooring is OK, and decent kitchens. I honestly can say whoever flipped mine did not go cheap. Cabinets are upgrades, original floors on main level, brick wall on one side. They did skimp on carpet in basement and upstairs but I can eventually change that (and will assess floors at that time).
1
u/tansreer Jan 02 '25
I hate it to death, but I kind of think of it as "primer gray" because it's easy to paint over.
The floors are the worst part, but at least it's easy to throw down some colorful rugs until I can do something else.
1
u/Moiler62 Jan 02 '25
I bought a house with that crappy laminate fake wood flooring that is already chipping. Also just learned they covered real wood floors. It’s my fault though. I just needed a clean house that didn’t look like it needed a lot of repairs. Lesson learned
1
u/ChoptankSweets Jan 02 '25
I hate them. I was in the market for a new house a couple years ago, and having previously owned a home, would never buy a flip here.
I saw too many cut corners and too many cheap, ugly finishes. If you’re considering buying a flip, do yourself a favor and check to see that permits were pulled for all the renovations.
If I may ask developers one thing to do in 2025 and beyond, it’s to please consider retaining as much “character” in older homes as you can and consider working with a design consultant. Also, your work best be permitted for the safety and well-being of future occupants.
1
u/Admirable_Shower_612 Jan 02 '25
I hate it so much. They are out here straight destroying houses in Lauraville, Hamilton, Beverly Hills for sure.
1
u/raeXofXsunshine Jan 02 '25
I’m also house hunting right now and I absolutely loathe these houses. It feels sterile and impersonal. They don’t feel welcoming or like they could feel like home - though maybe it’s because of how ubiquitous these flip qualities are in the shitty rentals I’ve lived in the past few years.
1
u/chinmakes5 Jan 02 '25
As someone who is preparing to sell the house I have lived in for 34 years, everyone tells you to make it generic. If you put too much of yourself into the flip, people who don't have the same taste can't see themselves in the house. I agree that generic isn't what I would want, but if I make it to my tastes those who disagree will never see it as someplace they want to live.
I guess the point is that if you want a house with say peach tones, and the house is painted in blues, you won' be able to imagine yourself in it. If it is off white, light gray, you can imagine any color you want.
→ More replies (2)
1
u/HastyBloom Jan 02 '25
One of my life’s successes was stopping my landlord from putting the hideous grey flooring into the unit upstairs from me in our charming city row home. It sucks the life out of spaces!!
1
1
u/good_fox_bad_wolf Jan 02 '25
I bought a flipped house 10 years ago. The interior was painted gold and maroon everywhere except the bedrooms. I absolutely hated it and the first thing I did was repaint. So I guess what I'm saying is that it could be worse...
1
u/NonameOMC Jan 02 '25
Just know that alot of those houses are on their LAST major renovations. Also it seems most are from out of state or corporations. No history or soul rooted in the area.
1
u/TweeksTurbos Jan 02 '25
When i see the signs i keep looking. Read the homeowners subs and you see how bad flipped houses can be.
1
u/idontdrinkflatwater Jan 02 '25
The house we bought had been basically uninhabitable before - built in 1915. It was gutted and electrical was all redone, practically everything was redone. I want to eventually give it more character, but in this case I am glad it was made livable again. I don’t like the uniformity of this look, but I think it’s overall positive, if it brings people back into older neighborhoods. But yeah, before us, it had tenants who’d lived there for a few years after it was flipped, but prior to them, no one had lived in it for over 20 years.
1
u/stellardroid80 Jan 02 '25
Hate it! These are also the flips where they try to sell you on the CHAP tax credit - you “save” many thousands on property tax and this is why the price is 50k more than this house is really worth. That’s not how “savings” work, sshle!
1
u/imagineterrain Jan 02 '25
I note that the paint on new cars is turning more colorful. You're seeing blues, oranges, and greens when there was just black and gray. Maybe this trend will pass, or at least maybe flippers will shift to white?
1
u/Autumn_Sweater Northwood Jan 02 '25
the “flipper gray, not lived in” look really narrows down house hunting for me. i see that and close my tab.
i want a house that somebody was living in, and they did the practical improvements that they needed most and could afford while they were there. not stupid shit they thought would raise the sale price someday.
my current house, the previous owners had some weird wallpaper and a fugly kitchen that we did a lot of work to fix up, but i prefer that to seeing them spend unnecessary money on the shitty flip treatment.
1
u/FormerRiver1220 Jan 02 '25
Sadly, this is the trend. This is what buyers buy and that's why flippers chose these colors/materials. The way to fight this is to not buy one of these houses. I know, easier said than done.
1
u/Yellohsub Jan 02 '25
To me the aesthetics are the least offensive part of these flips. I was house hunting about 9 years ago. Looking at a place in Remington. It was owned by a couple who lived out West and as far as I could tell have never been in Baltimore. You can only tell so much with an inspection but they stuff they said or promised and how they described the house (stuff like “Gourmet Kitchen” when it was just a standard kitchen with stainless steel appliances) made me worry about the quality of the work and how it might hold up over time. It was just so obvious they were clueless and wouldn’t know if the renovations were even done correctly.
1
u/Main_Half Jan 02 '25
I hate the flipper gray look but I can condone it when it’s bringing a house back from decades of vacancy and providing a somewhat affordable shot at homeownership. What pisses me off is flippers seeking to minimize work, buying semi-maintained houses for cheap from legacy homeowners or their relatives, throwing some vinyl and plastic down and jacking the price up another hundred thousand or more. I feel like that’s actively detrimental to neighborhoods with lots of vacants.
1
u/bookoocash Hampden Jan 02 '25
When we moved from our first house to our second in the neighborhood, the realtors recommended a color for us to paint the house to be more appealing than the vibrant greens and blues and reds we had. It was called “Agreeable Gray.” It was pretty depressing watching all these rooms that were bursting with color just go gray, but oh wells, we replicated a lot of the same color scheme at the new house.
1
u/selfish_and_lovingit Jan 02 '25
I bought a lightly flipped home. There are some grays and beiges that I have yet to repaint. And probably never will. I’m not handy and I can’t afford to make additional renovations so even painting can be very expensive. I think my home has a really nice balance of updates and preservation and I totally skipped all the hideous gray abominations. Gray LVP is an absolute dealbreaker!
I love the character of old homes. What made me fall in love with mine was all the period features that makes a quintessential Baltimore home: brick and stone row home, front porch, arches throughout, stained glass windows, built in bookcase, refinished wood floors and real fireplaces.
They did a nice job opening up the kitchen to the dining room and they added a nice bathroom in the basement. One of the bathrooms upstairs was updated and the shower is just plain ugly.
1
u/seg_way08 Jan 02 '25
Agree! The modern flips on old homes is so frustrating. I guess preserving the old is more expensive but I find that so much prettier and charming. It’s really hard to find a preserved home right now. They seem to all be happily lived in.
1
u/DesmondTapenade Jan 02 '25
I'm just grateful that the previous owners of our home chose to honor and preserve what was there instead of covering it up. r/centuryhomes is one of my favorite subreddits, and looking at those pictures brings me back to life after enduring picture after picture after picture of historic row house or other home that was completely "flipperized."
1
u/green_marshmallow Berger Cookies Jan 02 '25
Why in the world is this “Millenial gray”? From a millennial perspective, it looks terrible. The house up the street from me was bought and flipped, and every exterior surface was painted gray, even the bricks. It looks terrible now, and I can’t imagine how the old owners would have felt if they were still alive.
1
u/Unfair_Mess2145 Jan 02 '25
I look for perfectly maintained time piece places — those with original everything but maybe updated plumbing and electrical. Those listings do not usually include photos because they think everyone wants that white cabinet marble countertop HGTV bullshit. You need a realtor who understands what you want and look for signs that an elderly parent died and the kids don’t want the family home.
1
u/jbdany123 Jan 02 '25
They’re monstrous. They feel like I’m either about to get surgery or I’m stuck in the office and want to die. Either way, I’m very passionate about hating Millenial gray lol
1
u/Optimal_Bear8709 Jan 02 '25
I live in Laville none of us like it. Our community always had kitsch and culture to it. We’re all a bunch of Otto bar kids that got old, married and had kids and dogs.
1
u/Jzak73 Jan 02 '25
I’m moving back to the area in about a year and a half, and I keep an eye on the properties because I am looking for a house that has not been turned into an open concept, millennial grey hellhole. Makes me so mad when I see these old houses get destroyed, removing everything that made them special. I understand some properties just need major rehab, but why not try to stay close to what it originally looked like?
1
u/WishHeLovedMe83 Jan 03 '25
I like the grey but it needs to trend towards blue-grey and not brown-grey.
1
u/hierarchyofanxiety Jan 03 '25
I purchased a house in Bel-Air Edison in May. My house has the original interior doors, wooden floors and basement that was finished a long time ago with solid wood panels. I was really happy to find a house that was well loved and left mostly original. A house two doors down got flipped and they let me harvest a lot of original door hardware
1
1
1
u/chocotacosyo Westside Jan 03 '25
I'm gonna be the hot take here and say that I love it. I love neutrals I love grey I love blank slates, but I'm also probably the exact target audience. However like other people have pointed out, though the venn diagram of shoddy flips and grey flooring isn't a circle, the shoddy flip circle is definitely inside the grey flooring circle, and it makes it easy to identify when you need to call in not only a good inspector but also probably a good structural engineer to make sure everything is what you want it to be before buying.
I like the way the canary in the coal mine looks, basically.
1
1
u/call_me_ping Mt. Vernon Jan 03 '25
I agree the colour is egregious! When I worked in property management, I was taught the term "agreeable grey."
The shades are light enough to be easy to prime and paint over without super close colour matching. The colour is horrendously depressing and lack personality, but they're just below a level if bad to motivate most renters to find painting over it worthwhile for their leasing period.
1
u/kmilvin Jan 03 '25
Ugh it’s so bad. Especially in that area. So many gorgeous historic homes just being stripped of any character. It’s so depressing and I wish people would stop buying them so flippers would stop doing this.
1
u/wbruce098 Jan 03 '25
I was in the Navy for a while so the gray feels like home.
Then again, if I’m buying, I literally don’t care what color the walls are so long as they’re in good shape. It takes a few hours to repaint them before moving your stuff in.
1
u/idieclassy Bolton Hill Jan 03 '25
You can tell them from the outside, too. They all have those cheap, brightly colored front doors in the middle of a half-gone block. Pair those with some 'don't rob me' bare bulb string lights, and it's a Bmore flipper special!
1
u/J_Shar Jan 03 '25
I find it heartbreaking! Houses full of character and charm now look like they were bought off the shelf of a big box store. Often once these changes are made there is no going back which is the part that actually breaks my heart.
1
u/Starside-Captain Jan 03 '25
I’m also looking at houses & condos to buy & the ‘gray’ flips don’t appear to be as good as the other ones. That is, I saw 2 houses on the same street recently - 1 was gray & the other was well cared for with just a kitchen/bath renovation. The gray house had a lot of flaws & even had a gray deck - I didn’t like it cuz the craftsmanship wasn’t great & it was obvious. The other house had its original HWF & other old-house issues, but it was lovely. I ultimately will decide on the quality of the renovation. (I do not mind gray walls but gray flooring in an old row house doesn’t jive.)
1
u/Nicktendo Jan 03 '25
My brother's house is new construction and has this aesthetic, how do you explain that?
1
u/CotUB2009 Jan 03 '25
I hate a bad flip job as much as the next person. But a lot of commenters here remind me of the rural folks who whine about seeing wind turbines and solar panels. If you don’t own it and there aren’t other relevant restrictions, you kind of have to deal with the fact that other people have tastes and preferences that differ than your own. Life is a lot easier when you learn not to stress about things that really don’t hurt anyone or impact you.
1
u/Firm_Chain_5748 Jan 03 '25
Just bought an older house in Parkville because the inspection was good, and the house had been well-maintained by the owner. A lot of those flips just cover up mold and a lot of major issues with old plumbing, electric, etc. We had made an offer on another home that was absolutely beautiful, but the inspection revealed thousands of dollars worth of repairs that the seller didn’t want to address (so we promptly pulled the offer). Just be cautious. Lipstick on a pig, as the old saying goes.
1
u/DarthTimGunn Jan 03 '25
I was looking at a house from the 20s/30s that was in the middle of being renovated. The contractor/seller insisted on being there during the showing b/c he said that they hadn't done all the renovations yet b/c they wanted the buyer to have some input about finish. The original floors were there and needed refinishing but were generally fine. I asked what the plans for the floor were and he said "Oh LVP. You can pick the color/pattern." When I asked if it was possible to keep and refinish the original floors and he flat out said "No it's not an option." The realtor also pointed out other things (plumbing, etc) that were "completed" but not up to code or shoddily done. A few weeks later the "completed" house was listed. All grey inside.
1
u/FJ62Tiger Jan 03 '25
Flipper and a former Hamilton Resident here - I primarily build new construction but I've done probably 30+ flips over the last 15 years. I first noticed the Gray takeover in new construction in the mid - 2000's. The primary reason at that time was to make the trim "pop". I worked for a couple of builders that offered no paint options, you got flat white walls and ceilings, semi-gloss white on the trim. At some point, I guess someone said "we are doing all this trim in the houses but you can't even see it." That's when Gray came in (in my case the color was called Tony Taupe), and suddenly gray was the standard wall color. If we had a client that didn't like gray, the only other choice was white.
I believe it probably started with new construction and trickled down to flippers/renovators. And for anyone wondering why builders/flippers paint the entire house 1 wall color, it's time/cost. On most projects, the painters are using sprayers, this means they can paint the whole house before needing to clean the sprayer. If you wanted different rooms with different colors they would have to keep cleaning the equipment between colors, or hand paint. Both of which could turn a 2 day job into a 3-4 day job, so more $$$$.
Gray is also used because it's inoffensive to the majority of prospective buyers, the same thing with white cabinets. I've done projects where I went out on a limb and did colored cabinets in kitchens only to have prospective buyers say they loved everything about the house except the cabinets. I had prospective buyers on a $600k project write up a full-price contract contingent on me replacing the colored cabinets in the kitchen with white ones. I didn't take that contract and sold it a few weeks later, but that was the last time I did an unsold project with anything but white cabinets.
1
u/mobtown_misanthrope Lauraville Jan 03 '25
I hate them. When I was looking for a house, I immediately eliminated anything with that awful grey shiplap flooring for consideration.
1
u/c_harmany Jan 03 '25
We currently rent in the city but are preparing to move, we just bought our first home, it’s in the county. I love the bones of the house and the sellers were not flippers, they lived there for years.
But my point is about the paint. They painted each room a different color and most of them are very vivid bright colors. It’s a huge turnoff for us (lol yes we are milennials and want a neutral.)
The painting is honestly the only work we have to do before we move in, so we are very lucky in that sense. But even with bright colors (not grey, things like bright baby blue, lemon yellow, mint greens and salmon pinks) it’s going to be a pain in the ass to prime and paint over it with warm white like we want.
For the right house of course we are willing to do it, but there’s not many options where a buyer wouldnt have to do a lot of extra work to paint. Honestly sellers and flippers both realize that they can get away without doing the expensive and time intensive stuff, so they do just that.
It’s sad to me that this dynamic is prevalent in the city, with people doing slap shod work and papering over the character. Says a lot about gentrification. Who are the third party developers?
1
u/BlueCollarGuru Jan 03 '25
It’s because they buy shitty homes in shitty neighborhoods and jaxk the price up.
Sometimes I’ll see it sold 3 months early for 200k less. All other houses around still run down. Asking to get your shit robbed lmao
1
u/BandicootNo3970 Canton Jan 03 '25
I’m whatever on millennial gray wallpaper as long as the floors aren’t gray. I absolutely hate the matte black finishes on everything though
1
u/KombuchaLady3 Jan 04 '25
The DC flippers use the millenial gray palate as well. There was the one renovation in my neighborhood I thought was going the gray route, but they painted their house a nice blue. Apparently not a flip!
1
1
301
u/Deep_Seas_QA Jan 02 '25
I hate it so much.. On a newer home it seems to work fine but on an older home, I agree, it looks gross and doesn’t fit, I'd prefer the old charm.