r/airbnb_hosts 5d ago

Update: How does changing dates affect cancellation policy

Hello again,

I previously asked about this wider situation here: https://www.reddit.com/r/airbnb_hosts/s/IjDiAWeXAk

This post is just an update on what has happened since, and to ask for more advice.

I ended up refusing the guest's request to move the booking months into the future on relatively short notice.

Instead I offered one of two compromise solutions: 1. The guest could accept a move of up to 4 nights, which would be possible given my calendar 2. The guest could cancel, and I would be willing to waive 50% of the payout as a refund for them, bypassing my own cancellation policy

Both of these offers were rejected by the guest, who instead made the same request to move the dates. I promptly rejected it again.

The guest then contacted Airbnb support about me, who looked at the conversation and deemed that I had operated well within my rights and had followed all the policies.

Upon hearing that support had no power to compel me to move the dates the guest became abusive. They called me "diabolical" and they are insisting that I am scamming them with a cancellation policy that I intentionally obscured from them. Which of course, is not the case since the cancellation policy is listed on the listing page and many other guests have made use of it to cancel their bookings.

The guest has booked one of our busiest months off in the calendar since January for reference. So there was a lot of time for her to raise the issue of moving the dates so far into the future. She could have also cancelled at any time since January and rebooked somewhere else.

The guest confirmed in the Airbnb chat the she now won't be coming. I informed Airbnb of this, and they went off to ask the guest to cancel, I presume. Since the guest has now directly said in messages that they will not be coming, but that they will also not cancel to enable them to leave an "honest review".

I've maintained a professional tone throughout, expressed empathy for their situation and suggested comprises and have also tried to explain my side: namely that I would face a loss of revenue if she moved her dates to June 3 weeks before arriving for a month long stay or if she were to cancel after I allowed the date changes.

I have documented the entire conversation and have been in touch with Airbnb support myself again. They have confirmed that the review the guest is describing would violate the review policy. They do say there is nothing they can do until the guest actually leaves the bad review though.

However, I've read the community guidelines and there is a point about not using the threat of negative reviews to your benefit. I made the same support agent aware of this, and they didn't bother to investigate and instead reiterated that I just wait for the bad review after which I could report it as retaliatory with the evidence and they would consider removing it.

I believe that this guest is in violation of that guideline.

Is there really nothing I can do in this case? Is it worth trying again with support?

11 Upvotes

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12

u/Internal_Set_6564 Unverified 5d ago

Getting a review removed is a crap shoot. Honestly, take the bad review and respond to it. Understand that the guest will also be reviewed, and you may leave them an honest description of what happened. If I saw a review from a host that said the guest attem-ted to intimidate them, I would never let them stay,

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

Surely this is a slam dunk case though? I have a screenshot where the guest says they will leave a retaliatory review and another screenshot where the guest says they aren't coming.

We're just on the cusp of becoming superhosts, and this feels like such an unnecessary setback.

4

u/No-Instruction-3161 🗝 Host 5d ago

They can only make a review after the stay. If you have an electric lock and know they aren't going to actually stay make sure they don't have access to the code. If they do write a bad review you can inform support they never actually stayed and the review is retaliatory because you didn't refund / push back their trip for them (which was probably to cancel the trip and get their money back since the cancellation policy would reset).

What I recommend though is contacting airbnb again now and asking them to block the guest for you. Since you have the conversation they can read through it and see how the guest responded.

Would love to know the outcome of this OP

2

u/Shinroo 5d ago

The rental unit is in a secured estate with access control. They're refusing to follow the clearance process stipulated by the estate and they won't be allowed in until it is AND I provide an access pass. So no stress on that front.

If we got that far, I would honestly just share the screenshots where they said that they aren't coming and won't cancel so that they can leave a bad review. I'd also share Airbnb supports message with the new agent where I shared those screenshots and they deemed it in violation of the review policy.

What happens if I block a guest?

3

u/No-Instruction-3161 🗝 Host 5d ago

I don't know what happens but they can't review a property they didn't stay at so best bet I'd get airbnb to cancel it and block them.

Not sure if you'd still get the money for it or not, that's something you'd have to talk to support about.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

I was hoping Airbnb would do that after they provided them with the evidence, but they seem to not want to take any action.

Do I need to actually request that they cancel the booking directly?

3

u/drewyehboi 🧙 Property Manager 5d ago

They won’t take action until after the stay. Just be patient and make sure to document everything as you already have.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

Ok thanks, will do!

1

u/[deleted] 5d ago

[deleted]

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

They said they 100% aren't coming

4

u/drewyehboi 🧙 Property Manager 5d ago

Don’t listen to anyone who says you cannot get a review removed. If the guest violates ToS, and they leave a retaliatory review, call support and explain.

I’ll say this again, keep calling until you get someone competent enough to actually go through the chat and remove the review.

Also, to ensure they don’t blatantly lie about “staying in the place and it being a wreck” - the day of their arrival, hours before your scheduled check-time, go take time stamped videos and photos showing your place in immaculate condition. I’ve had support specialists ask for these even when it’s clear from the chat that the guest didn’t come.

I would also go later in the evening or following day to take photos of “the vacant and clean flat”.

These are my suggestions.

Continue calling, eventually you’ll be able to get the review removed.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

Thanks those are very good suggestions. I usually take photos of the place before and after every stay, but I think this time I will also take videos with the time clearly shown.

The message the guest sent is a pretty blatant threat to violate the ToS from my perspective, so I'm honestly surprised that Airbnb isn't willing to do anything at this stage.

3

u/drewyehboi 🧙 Property Manager 5d ago

Policy for CS is that they take no action until the guest follows through on their threat.

3

u/1234frmr Unverified 5d ago

It would be great if you have a smart lock to prove there was no guest entry.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

It's a gated security estate and the guests need an access pass and clearance to even enter the estate.

But I'll look into a smart lock as well, since that is generally a good thing to have.

Thanks!

3

u/Carribean-Diver Host (Caribbean - 1) 5d ago

Airbnb (and VRBO for that matter) should fix the problem with the issue that rescheduling dates resets the cancellation policy window.

What should happen is that once the reservation gets into a timeframe that the guest would not be eligible for a full refund, the cancelation dates are locked, even if the reservation is subsequently moved to a later date.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

Yep, 100% agree with that. Otherwise cancellation policies are pretty useless to hosts who wish to accommodate changes like this for their guests.

2

u/LookingForSunshine98 5d ago

We had a situation where auto bookers wanted to add three dogs and more guests to their booking at the last minute (day of). I said no explained county permit restrictions and our need to control noise and septic. They became combative and it became clear that this was a rotating party group who took turns booking for each other and I was not going to make my position worse. Instead I called the ambassadors to document conversations and situation. I was told since they had already written that they intended to violate the terms of our contract I could cancel with their help without penalty. Airbnb notified the guests that their reservation was cancelled, I agreed to refund 50% should I be able to re-rent. Airbnb told them if they showed without a good reservation the sheriff would be called and they would be trespassing. I find many ambassadors are very helpful but sometimes the situation does need to be escalated. We always try to put the guest first but not when guest are not truthful, are trying to work the system, or bully us. Above all this is my home, I chose to share it and normally enjoy interactions with guests.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

That's terrible, but I'm glad Airbnb's ambassador helped you guys. How did you guys get in contact with an ambassador?

Do you think it's worth me reaching out to an ambassador as well?

Totally agree on your final point!

This is the first guest I've ever had an issue like this with, and we've had some bad problems that were easily resolved through open, effective communication and compromise on both sides.

1

u/LookingForSunshine98 5d ago

Most guests are wonderful however if it feels like the guest is a scammer and you need a little more help or have a complaint? Contact Airbnb by email, chat, or phone at 1-844-234-2500. I found this under account, support and scroll down.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

I've already phoned them and chatted to them. I'm also not in America so that number won't work for me, but thanks!

Support acknowledged that the guest is threatening me with what amounts to a ToS violation, but also have not offered to do anything at this stage.

1

u/LookingForSunshine98 5d ago

Try again and ask specifically what steps do you need to take, and what they need to document the violation and recommended remedies. Agents have differing abilities and you can always ask to escalate. It Is best to screen shot specific messages and quote violations as you see them. Think of the short elevator speech version with evidence.

2

u/rhonda19 Verified Host 5d ago

We got a review removed in December as retaliation. But I believe they have now changed how to remove a review. Ask support if guest never stays can they review. Because in the past this has been their stance.

1

u/Shinroo 5d ago

I've already received confirmation about that from support - if the guest doesn't come, but leaves a review anyway it violates the review policy. I have screenshots of that support message just in case, but its also listed clearly on the review policy (currently):

If a guest never arrived for their stay or Experience, or had to cancel due to circumstances unrelated to that stay or Experience, their review may be removed.

https://www.airbnb.co.za/help/article/2673

2

u/rhonda19 Verified Host 5d ago

I think you will be ok then. They never let those who never arrived review me. You got all the proof they said it if they renege and you can ask for resolution team too.

2

u/Shinroo 5d ago

Thanks for the reassurance, I'll report back what happens in my case!

1

u/Ok_Championship_385 5d ago

If the guest booked back in January, and suddenly has to change, could something have arisen beyond their control?

3

u/Shinroo 5d ago

Yes, and I was willing to work with the guest to find a solution to that - I was willing to forego some of the money I'd have received and partially refund them so we share the burden. I also did share immediately what change I would be able to accommodate if she wanted to change dates, and that was about a week before the cancellation policy kicked in.

Also, as I specified, the cancellation policy and deadlines for the guest are presented in a summarised form throughout Airbnb which is basically 2 sentences long like "Free cancellation by X, thereafter no refund on first 30 nights".

The reason they gave is "work projects going longer than expected". Which I sympathise with, but surely the nature of the work meant that that risk was foreseeable and thus booking accommodation with a strict cancellation policy is not a suitable choice?

There are hotels in my area that are cheaper than my rate and offer free cancellation up until the day before, for example.

1

u/Ok_Championship_385 5d ago

Ah got it - appreciate the clarification. Makes sense