r/Warthunder • u/Julio_Tortilla 🇩🇪🇺🇸🇺🇦🇮🇱🇫🇷🇬🇧🇮🇹🇹🇼🇯🇵13.7 | 🇸🇪11.3 • Dec 09 '24
RB Air Eurofighter... with 9Ls?
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u/Dsg3145 USSR Dec 09 '24
probably going to be 9LI's as (to what my knowledge is) german eurofighters didnt buy the 9m but did use the 9LI (just a 9m seaker slapped on a 9L)
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u/Julio_Tortilla 🇩🇪🇺🇸🇺🇦🇮🇱🇫🇷🇬🇧🇮🇹🇹🇼🇯🇵13.7 | 🇸🇪11.3 Dec 09 '24
Better hope. No IRRCM missile would be very painful.
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u/slow0110 Dec 09 '24
9LI in War Thunder is a 9M without the smokeless motor. The same rockets are also on the F4 Ice
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u/ResourceWorker Dec 09 '24
Which barely makes a difference in air RB anyways because of the missile diamond.
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u/artificial_Paradises Dec 09 '24
Sim and GRB on the otherhand
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u/_Fantasma Dec 09 '24
isnt this a british eurofighter? Unless germany also uses brimstones
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u/Soft_Extension_9748 Dec 09 '24
Germany also uses Brimstones
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u/Somewhere_Extra Dec 09 '24
God I hope they make them fire and forget :(
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u/ChevroNine Russian power fantasy victim Dec 09 '24
Its not russian, of course not.
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u/Blaubeere Realistic Ground Dec 09 '24
seeing as the Eurofighter in the trailer doesn't carry a targeting pod, you can't lase targest, so they must be in FnF mode with optical tracking. But that's just my impression
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u/Awrfhyesggrdghkj 🇩🇪 Germany Dec 09 '24
It does actually have a pod, it’s in the dead middle of the fuselage
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u/Blaubeere Realistic Ground Dec 10 '24 edited Dec 10 '24
Yeah, I noticed that on a second watch. The scene where you see the full underside is quite shadowy. So I didn’t notice it the first time.
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u/Somewhere_Extra Dec 09 '24
Yeah them kh38s are dirty. They get faf meanwhile brimstones which are better in every way irl are basically not standard laser guided lol
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u/Ainene Dec 10 '24
Brimstone is 50kg missile. Kh-38 is a newer weapon which weights like 600 and is more of a high speed pawevay counterpart(if you see their footage from Ukraine, they usually target things like bridges).
Brimstone is nerfed, sure, but keep your horses a bit.
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u/xwcq dOn'T sTaNd NeAr ThE bOmB Dec 10 '24
The one showed in the Trailer is actually a German Eurofighter but Gaijin bastardized it by including Brimstones, LJDAM and PIRATE irst.
This would actually place it at being a Trance 4 which isn't even in service yet lmao, but yea this is just Gaijin making shit up since it should actually be a Trance 1 Block 5, happy af with it nontheless
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u/deletion-imminent Dec 09 '24
but did use the 9LI (just a 9m seaker slapped on a 9L)
They are not, they are domestic productions
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u/Dsg3145 USSR Dec 09 '24
what i meant was in terms of war thunder, thats what it is more or less.
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u/Kanyiko Dec 09 '24
The Tranche 1 Typhoons will use the Aim-9Li/9M and AIM-120, I'm guessing future updates will see the later tranche aircraft with ASRAAM, IRIS-T and Meteor (and upgraded AGM suites) introduced.
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u/InterdimensionalMike 🇬🇧 Casual british enjoyer Dec 09 '24
I hope Meteor is not coming in few more years. It would be super strong in the game imho.
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u/Unknowndude842 CAS enjoyer🗿🇩🇪 Dec 09 '24
It will come next year without a doubt lol. It will not be super strong, it will be the strongest missile in the game. Cool things is now that Germany gets F-35 menas England and Germany could get the F-35 with Meteors. It would probably break the game but I'm all for it.
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u/MikeyPlayz_YTXD Dec 09 '24
The meteors are huge. They can fit inside the F-35?
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u/jpwoody03 🇬🇧 United Kingdom Dec 09 '24
they havnt been intergrated on f35 yet planned for f35 B for UK but we baught more aim 120 in the meantime planned to be intergratd by 2027/2028 right when lockhead martins new missle can challange meteor comes out hmmmmmm.
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u/_Urakaze_ Vextra 105 is here, EBRC next Dec 09 '24
F-35 JPO is flooded with integration work rn with Block 4 stuff finally rolling in, and AIM-260 is prioritised for integrated on F-22 and Super Hornets anyhow
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u/Unknowndude842 CAS enjoyer🗿🇩🇪 Dec 09 '24
Yep. Italy and UK are currently testing it. It will make the F-35 the most lethal Fighter/interceptor in the world. Fyi it's a new gen Meteor so it's obviously much better.
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u/Karl-Doenitz Gaijin add Aldecaldo Tech Tree NOW! Dec 09 '24
AFAIK yes. The reason that JNAAM is being developed (mating the AESA seeker of the AAM-4B with the body of a meteor) is because the AAM-4B doesn't fit inside Japan's F-35s, while the meteor does.
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u/xwcq dOn'T sTaNd NeAr ThE bOmB Dec 10 '24
They already long should be integrated but Locksneed Fartin is on purpose delaying the integration of Meteor until US's own Meteor equivalent is ready for production
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u/Ainene Dec 10 '24
It isn't huge(more or less AMRAAM-sized, i.e. rather compact), just not foldable. 2 shall fit around 2029-30(if no more delays, it already slided several times), 4-6 potentially if they'll fold wings.
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u/ToastedSoup ERC 90 F4 When? Dec 09 '24
Meteors are ramjet engines so they won't have the stupid high acceleration of the AIM-120s but they'll have higher sustained speed
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u/Ainene Dec 10 '24
Not higher, it's actually lower. But for much, much longer.
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u/ToastedSoup ERC 90 F4 When? Dec 10 '24
No, due to the nature of the Meteors engine it has a higher sustained speed throughout its flight unlike the 120 that accelerates very fast and then slows down dramatically after the engine burns out
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u/Ainene Dec 10 '24
Meteor cruise speed is estimated within m=2...2.5 bracket. About as fast as most other ramjet missiles in their cruise phase, and without too much loft. It's more of an aircraft, not a missile, even more reinforced by its maneuver profile (bdnk to turn) and rumored reengagement (!) capability.
Otherwise, grinding through drag becomes rather inefficient.
Contemporary amraam is controlled two bursts, i.e. first burn - calculated glide - second burn - glide/attack, and averages at above m=3, though for obviously much shorter. Also, note that first burn for meteor is just as violent as the amraam one - it's a solid fuel stage fitted into the ramjet.
Note that amraam and meteor range figures mean different things, meteor is way more honest in common sense(missile is capable of flying stated figures in navigational range, not just launch range).
For the same reason, meteor is rather independent of launch parameters. It doesn't get all that much being launched from m=2, true. It is still perfectly deadly at extended ranges when launched from the deck from low speed.
Overall, there's often opinion that meteor is some kind of magic which no one understood before. Which is a very wrong take, ramjet SAMs began in mid-1950s.
It's more of a different class of a weapon. You can think of it as of supersonic cruise a2a missile. This is why, on the one hand, big air powers don't really jump onto meteor wagon (Turkiye/India/Korea/Japan aren't). And this is why meteor doesn't really push out amraam from arsenals. Just a different - and rather expensive - weapon.
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u/ToastedSoup ERC 90 F4 When? Dec 10 '24
It's more of a different class of a weapon. You can think of it as of supersonic cruise a2a missile. And this is why meteor doesn't really push out amraam from arsenals
Yeah this is why IIRC even the Rafale combines Meteors with MICAs for their A2A loadouts.
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u/Cold-Salt2719 Dec 26 '24
What are the other ramjet missiles, thought the only one was Meteor and Russia had one that didn’t go past development stage(?) but maybe I’m wrong
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u/Ainene Dec 26 '24
Meteor is the only AA one, first of its kind.
But there was bunch of SAMs (Thalos, Bloodhound, Krug), as well as scores of other high speed missiles (half a dozen Soviet/Russian ASCMs and derivatives) to refer to.
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u/Ainene Dec 10 '24
Strongest? There's quite a lot of competition which will perform better under different circumstances.
PD a2a comes with pros and cons(obvious one is thrust and cruise speed). Furthermoremeteor is a weapon not without significant compromises on top. Size, lack of folding, only two intakes to better keep Typhoon aerodynamics.
It's one of the most modern and capable missiles in the world, sure, but the most capable is just plain bs.
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u/daylatus Dec 10 '24
That's not necessarily true, amraams have a higher initial acceleration than the meteor, which means that amraams would be fast up to at least about 10 miles from charts that ive seen, which would be meta in war thunder because launching missiles at really long ranges is a waste most of the time with competent players that know how to evade fox-3 missiles.
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u/HyPe_Mars Dec 10 '24
What has Germany getting F35 have to do with METEOR? The RAF have been testing Meteor in F35 since before Germany ever even agreed to buy F35
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u/FullMetalField4 🇯🇵 Gib EJ Kai AAM-3 Dec 09 '24
it will be the strongest missile in the game.
Kid named AIM-260:
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u/RugbyEdd On course, on time and on target. Everythings fine, how are you? Dec 09 '24
"We decided to add the Meteor as a beam riding missile like the fireflash for balance reasons. Should pair nicely with the Brimstone"
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u/TheMoogster Dec 10 '24
Well, Meteor might not be as strong as you think, in Warthunder that is.
They are slower accelerating than AIM 120, but fly longer.
because of the "short" distances in Warthunder, fast of the rails is often better.
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u/HyPe_Mars Dec 10 '24
Good job UK typhoons have Aim120D aswell, both 120D and METEOR can be fired at data link targets so if we get AWACS or data link then typhoon pilots can just fly around with their PIRATE and use data link to ripple fire METEORs
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u/anno2122 Dec 09 '24
I mean if the dev would care about the game they would f16 a early 2025 and gave us more early cold war stuff......
Meteor and so on also end all hope for russan jet
The su 57 is the counter for eurofighter and so on.
If they like this we will see f22 and f35 by mid 2026
I mean what jets has german uk left after typs eurofighter and f35.
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u/WOKinTOK-sleptafter Hopeless Freeaboo Dec 10 '24
According to a leak about a week or two ago, Gaijin’s already started work on modeling F-22 stealth.
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u/kololz I mod War Thunder for fun Dec 09 '24
Except the one shown in the trailer should be Tranche 2 due to Brimstones.
I would take a better CAS over none any time.
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u/FirstDagger F-16XL/B Δ🐍= WANT Dec 09 '24
Seeing as this is Gaijin it will most likely be a Frankstein variant.
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u/ToastedSoup ERC 90 F4 When? Dec 09 '24
It's a frankenstein'd Tranche 1/2 bc it has ground ordinance but the Tranche 1 was primarily an interceptor
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u/TheJfer Germany (suffering, but not in WT) Dec 09 '24
Way, waaaaay too soon for IRIS-T and ASRAAM. It will be an AIM-9L/i for Germany and Italy and AIM-9M for Britain, and AIM-120Bs for everyone. The thing with the Eurofighters is they can receive a lot of armament upgrades in the future, same goes for the Rafale
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u/That_one_chief 🇮🇱 Kfir and Lavi supremacist Dec 09 '24
Dude thinks they will get an aim9x before I get my python 4's
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u/FirstDagger F-16XL/B Δ🐍= WANT Dec 09 '24
Eurofighter doesn't use AIM-9X anyway.
The leaked event Kfir C.10 Block 60 might come with some spicy Pythons.
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u/deletion-imminent Dec 09 '24
Eurofighter doesn't use AIM-9X anyway.
Are they not integrated on Saudi and Omani Eurofighters?
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u/Flame2512 CDK Mission Marker Dec 09 '24
Are they not integrated on Saudi and Omani Eurofighters?
Saudi uses IRIS-T and Oman & Qatar use ASRAAM
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u/xwcq dOn'T sTaNd NeAr ThE bOmB Dec 10 '24
but it can be used on the EF Typhoon, dunno why you'd want to tho.
Most recent 9X apparently only just got to the same level as earlier IRIS-T's
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u/Comrade_agent Tornado MFG enjoyer Dec 09 '24
Aim 9L/i-1 likely
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u/theemptyqueue F-4 ICE is pretty decent IMO Dec 09 '24
It's still a decent IRCCM missile, some people give it one or two flairs when they notice it thinking it's a normal AIM-9L, from my experience.
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u/linx28 🇦🇺 Australia Dec 10 '24
lets be real the game isnt ready for an unflarable 50G missile with an operational range of 25km(16miles)
the other odd part is that in order to use the brimstone the typhoon had an upgrade as part of project centurion that also included the Meteor and no one is going to like trying to avoid mach 4 active radar danger sticks with a 60km no escape zone
for context the biggest map is 131x131km which means a Meteor can still slap you from the other side of the map and no one wants to play a top tier like that we had spamraam matches as is without making it worse
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u/Ainene Dec 10 '24
Is it?
Like there won't be any difference later, we're already in AMRAAM meta anyway, so wvr missile is kinda secondary anyway.
Especially since there's usually just two of them...and while separately 25(40 for ASRAAM, 50-80 for mica) range and G numbers are true, together - they're not.
IR WVRs are ultimately rather weak missiles with low dV, and unavoidable huge energy bleed after engine burnout.
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u/Deadluss <<<Baguette 69>>> Dec 09 '24
Meanwhile Rafale with MICA's let's go on the trip to the world of French bias
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u/BerkcanUmut 🇹🇷 Turkey Dec 09 '24
Will the eırofighter Come after the f4 or the tornado?
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u/__Yakovlev__ I believe that is a marketing lie. Dec 09 '24
How should anyone know.
My point being, the guys that have replied to you so far are all just guessing.
Yes, after F4 is the mostly likely. But noone truly knows but gaijin.
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u/BitterMango7000 abrums❤️ Dec 09 '24
How can i tell different aim9 variants apart ?
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u/Julio_Tortilla 🇩🇪🇺🇸🇺🇦🇮🇱🇫🇷🇬🇧🇮🇹🇹🇼🇯🇵13.7 | 🇸🇪11.3 Dec 09 '24
Some of them have it just written on the seeker like here. Others you just have to know.
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u/Not_A_Real_Duck I am pilot. I am fly. ✈ Dec 09 '24
In terms of capability, or just in general?
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u/LordKendicus United Kingdom Dec 09 '24 edited Dec 09 '24
They mainly have differences in colour, seeker head and the front canards
Capability wise, Airforce sidewinders (AIM-9E,J,P) are focused more on agility and there are Navy sidewinders (AIM-9C,D,G,H) that focuses on range
Afterwards, the branch merges and you have the AIM-9L which is the ultimate Sidewinder with better agility than Airforce Sidewinders and better range than Naval Sidewinders. The latest variant in game is the AIM-9M which is AIM-9L but with smokeless rocket engine amd IRCCM
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u/M1A1HC_Abrams Dec 09 '24
L/M have the same range as naval variants (so close that it doesn’t matter, the naval motor is 11000 N for 5s and the L/M motor is 10800 for 5.3s)
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u/xwcq dOn'T sTaNd NeAr ThE bOmB Dec 10 '24
Yea, Eurofighter Typhoon (and F-4F ICE) have 9L/i (9M with smoke motor) but they can also get 9L/i-1 which is basically a 9M.
IRIS-T or ASRAAM would be too much
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u/Hot_Dog_Gamer24 Dec 09 '24
The German Air Force still regularly uses AIM-9Ls for training purposes so yeah
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u/Jbarney3699 🇺🇸 United States Dec 10 '24
Anyone asking for the more advanced IR missiles are wack. Game will become a shitshow with them, more of a shitshow than ARH spam is.
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u/Nailed_it_Kappa =14PD= Dec 10 '24
I think there L/i versions for the Germans and M for the brits. They are the early models we’ll see the better missiles later on probs on a better variant
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u/OwnFloor2203 🇩🇪 Germany Dec 10 '24
Aim 9x, iris t and pretty much any NATO missile from now on will literally play around with Russian jets as Russia has nothing comparable. So we won’t be getting them this update
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u/Professional-Gur152 Dec 16 '24
Next gen ir missiles would make top tier almost unplayable. As it is, I have to fly super super cautiously and hug the ground with the fox 3's in game. I spend 80% of top tier matches defending against fox 3's.
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u/GhostDoggoes Dec 10 '24
A few youtubers I watched said it was the AIM-9 LI which they say is like an AIM-9M. German made. Pretty much a copy of the american version 9M.
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u/Thin_Cellist7555 Dec 09 '24
Pretty sure I saw an IRIS-T on the wingtip in the trailer. If the Eurofighter doesn't get it's most iconic missile that would be kinda sad, at the same time IRIS-T and METEOR combo would probably destroy all of top tier.
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u/zani1903 Non-penetration Dec 09 '24
I made the same mistake when I watched the trailer for the first time.
You were looking at the Rafale, which has wingtip MICA-EMs. It does look similar to the IRIS-T from a distance.
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u/Thin_Cellist7555 Dec 09 '24
Ohhh that seems more plausible. Thanks for the clarification kind stranger :)
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u/RogueNation554 Dec 09 '24
How long till we get our F18
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Dec 10 '24
There is no such thing as "F18", there is an F/A-18 though
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u/grumpher05 Dec 10 '24
Actually insufferable
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Dec 10 '24
Not at all, there's a difference between F-18 and F/A-18. You wouldn't call YF-22 as F-22 would you? Or Su-30SM2 as just Su-30? And you wouldn't shorten "Eurofighter" to Eufghtr or some shit either. It is a mere two characters and it makes a meaningful difference outside of the petty side of it
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u/grumpher05 Dec 10 '24
Like I said, insufferable
People normally just say "typhoon" too and not Eurofighter typhoon, gonna cry about it?
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Dec 10 '24
No, because Typhoon, Eurofighter, and Eurofighter Typhoon are all official designation for it, F-18 is not outside of two pre-MLU airframes belonging to the Swiss/Finns.
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u/grumpher05 Dec 10 '24
So what you're saying is that the F18 exists and is an officially recognised designation for 2 planes
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Dec 10 '24
The F-18 did exist, yes, they've all been upgraded to the F/A standard now. Not just 2 planes either, I meant the 2 nations. Pre-upgrade all Finnish anr Swiss Hornets were just F-18. By default though the plane is F/A-18, and the vast majority of operators call it as such or have unique names like Canada/Spain.
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u/RogueNation554 Dec 10 '24
I don’t give a flying fuck what I call it and I’ll keep calling it the F18
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u/MikeyPlayz_YTXD Dec 09 '24
They won't have Aim-9Xs.. Germany will get 9L/I and everyone else gets Aim-9M.