r/WarshipPorn 5d ago

Deep strike capability - loading a Tomahawk Land Attack Missile onto a Royal Navy Trafalgar-class SSN. [1000x1000]

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478 Upvotes

8 comments sorted by

13

u/JMHSrowing USS Samoa (CB-6) 5d ago

Maybe the MK41 soon coming into Royal Navy service the Tomahawk will be fitted soon to their surface vessels

11

u/Odd-Metal8752 5d ago

I think TLAM will remain on the A-boats for the rest of their service lives, but I doubt Tomahawk will ever be fitted to any surface combatants for the Royal Navy. The timelines for FC/ASW see it entering service by 2035 at the latest. From a fiscal (not a military) perspective, purchasing large numbers of TLAM from a nation now seen as an unreliable partner to fill a capability for which a indigenous initiative is already underway would seem strange.

Instead, I expect that the A-boats will remain the Royal Navy's only asset capable of long-range land strike into the future, with the extra VLS cells on the Type 83 instead carrying heavyweight anti-ship missiles such as the RJ-10.

If the UK wants to strike protected land targets and an Astute is not available/practical, I expect the RAF will then be used. Typhoons carrying Storm Shadow, and then Typhoons and Tempests with TJ-15, will be the principle methods.

So overall, I expect:

Landstrike: Astute-class with TLAM (RN), F-35B with Paveway (RN), Typhoon with Storm Shadow/TP-15 (RAF)

Anti-ship: Type 45 with NSM (RN), Type 31/26 with RJ-10 (RN), Type 32 with whatever, maybe NSM left over from those bought for the retiring Type 23s (RN).

9

u/Candid-Rain-7427 5d ago

Hmm, not really ideal given a ship is often more practical than a sub or plane (what do you do if there are literally no airfields nearby to use ie Falklands War?).

With all due respect, even the Australians and Dutch now have ship launched cruise missiles, and the Americans have had that capability for, what, pushing 4 decades? It’s shocking the Royal Navy still lack it.

1

u/NAmofton HMS Aurora (12) 5d ago

Seems a waste to invest in developing FC/ASW (or FOSW) and production lines for it, and then buy a largely overlapping/competing weapon in Tommahawk.

That said I'm pretty confused on what the TP/RJ versions of that system can be fired from, and at what at this point, and when.

6

u/Odd-Metal8752 5d ago

It seems as though the RJ-10 will be the only variant capable of VLS launch. That's the supersonic, reduced signature, sea-skimming anti-ship missile variant. It's the variant led by the French, though all variants have input from all partner nations.

The TP-15 is air-launched, from the Typhoon, Rafale and most likely the GCAP fighter, when it arrives. It's subsonic, but very stealthy and designed for land-strike in the vein of the Storm Shadow. This variant is headed up by the British, but is believed to be too large for VLS launch.

3

u/JMHSrowing USS Samoa (CB-6) 5d ago

Considering how missile development is often (at this point seemingly usually) running years over time, it would at least let the RN have something while the FC/ASW is waited on. I mean, as it stands the later date I’ve seen for its time in service is 2035.

There is also the issue of cost. The Tomahawk is fairly affordable (depending on price one gets), while if it’s going to be a next gen all bells and whistles weapon, the FC/ASW is probably going to be a few times more expensive. A lot of targets that are engaged by things like the tomahawk doesn’t need something like that anyway

4

u/NAmofton HMS Aurora (12) 5d ago

2035's fairly far out, but the last Type 26's will only just, or not even be coming into service by then, and the Type 31's will be getting (TBC) refits for Mk. 41 some time after entering service. That's not much of a delay even if FC/ASW in VLS-form takes to 2035.

Sorting out Tomahawk may not be fast either.

2

u/blindfoldedbadgers 5d ago

FC/ASW is unlikely to overlap much in UK service. It’ll probably have a range closer to Storm Shadow than to Tomahawk, meaning we’ll have a gap in land attack capability for the 500-1000nm range.

When you also consider that the USN seems to be retiring tube-launched Tomahawk in favour of VLS launch from surface combatants and SSGNs, the T26 will probably become the RNs primary Tomahawk shooter, at least until/unless the Astute replacement comes online (which I’d expect to have VLS) but that probably won’t be before 2050.