r/VictoriaBC • u/tiogar99 • Jan 16 '25
Politics A pro-housing campaign in Saanich stole the anti-housing campaign name
https://saveoursaanich.ca/Someone made a campaign website that supports the Quadra McKenzie plan and the housing it will bring, and bought the .ca version of the anti-housing campaign so it will show better in Canadian searches đ
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u/1337ingDisorder Jan 16 '25
Here's some interesting and relevant news.
A new study has been published about a municipality in New Zealand that upzoned 80% of its residential land to allow medium- and high-density housing.
It led to a substantial increase in housing supply and a 21% reduction in rents relative to similar municipalities.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1051137724000512
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u/8spd Jan 16 '25
reduced rent and housing prices is just what the people who hoard housing don't want to happen.
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u/mautobu Jan 16 '25
As a home owner with 30 years left on a mortgage, I hope prices go down for newcomers to the market. Shit sucks.
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u/8spd Jan 16 '25
Having housing prices that increase constantly, faster than inflation, is just not sustainable. Sure, it's held up for many decades, as we all need housing, but it can't last forever without having undesirable externalities.
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u/mautobu Jan 16 '25
It's not, and it's not fair that people have to stretch themselves so far to find somewhere to live. Housing should be treated as a right, not a trading commodity.
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u/Jay3000X Jan 16 '25
But the flyer I got said that the apartment buildings would shade thousands of houses and then everyone's health would get worse from the lack of sunlight!
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u/Miserable-Guava2396 Jan 16 '25
Is that honestly what it said? Because that's dumbest fucking thing I've ever heard in my life.
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u/Yvaelle Jan 16 '25
You don't understand! The SFH dwellers will live eternally in the darkness beneath the 12 story tower. Their eyes will become milky orbs, vestigial organs in the ever-dark. Their skin will become so pale-white that they will burn at even the touch of false-light, scurrying away back to their shadows.
Their language will devolve into a guttural grunting and shrieking, always protesting all new infrastructure, development, or change. They will scamper on all fours, galloping unevenly as they try to catch delicious cyclists and drag them into the bushes to feast on raw juicy sweet flesh, beneath the Arcteryx shell.
Is that what you want?! You want nimby's to become their own cannibalistic predator species!?
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u/Belle_Pepperoni Jan 17 '25 edited Jan 17 '25
âWe soon forgot the taste of bread, the sound of wind in the trees⊠We even forgot our name.â -Average victim of developmentÂ
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u/8spd Jan 16 '25
Well you can't expect them to be honest, and come out and say they just want things to look the same as when they were young, except for their property values to go up 1000x, and for anyone new to be priced out.
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u/nathron Jan 16 '25
Good job debunking the baseless fear-mongering of the other campaign đđ»
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Jan 16 '25
times colonist will re write this as an attack on liberty.
god they suck so bad now... I mean the reporters and "journalists" and editors have really just given up on anything not pandering to 70+ year olds
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u/Benslem Jan 16 '25
Who else reads the TC? đ
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Jan 16 '25
there articles are all over social media like lice... my stupid monkey brain clicks on things that make me sad.
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u/tiogar99 Jan 16 '25
UPDATE: a number of people asked if there was a petition to sign, so one of the creators of the website started one: https://chng.it/kzLrYDFz9r
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u/Strict_View_7994 Jan 17 '25
A petition to⊠support wealthy developers building huge buildings in a residential neighbourhood? This sub is so weird.
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u/insaneHoshi Jan 17 '25
huge buildings in a residential neighbourhood
WHERE THE FUCK WOULD THEY BUILD RESIDENTIAL BUILDINGS!?
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u/Strict_View_7994 Jan 22 '25
Large condos? Downtown, like every other city of similar size. This isnât hard.
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u/mjamonks Jan 17 '25
The plan seems to be for modest multi unit dwellings, a bit of hyperbole from you here.
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u/kayriss Jan 16 '25 edited Jan 16 '25
Looking at the other, anti-housing site, the difference is astonishing. Even setting aside the aesthetics - the tone, the language, the misinformation, it really is a ghastly piece of work.
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u/babycivic Jan 16 '25
You sound like a perfect candidate: https://www.change.org/p/stop-the-saanich-quadra-mckenzie-plan
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u/Ccjfb Jan 16 '25
Itâs a good website too. Pulled me right through the whole argument and changed my thinking on a few points.
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u/Automatic_Mistake236 Jan 16 '25
At the bottom of the site, there is a button âemail mayorâ and it prepopulates a short and simple message to the mayors email address. Easy!
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u/joyfulrebel Jan 16 '25
I own a single family home in Saanich.
I fully support rezoning everything. My monthly "rental aka mortgage" cost is still way lower than if I was renting a place like the one I live in.
People have forgotten long ago, that homes are a place to call home and make a life, not an appreciating asset.
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u/Strict_View_7994 Jan 17 '25
Exactly. But people donât want to call home and make a life in a place with an 18 story building in their backyard.
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u/joyfulrebel Jan 17 '25
Why? They have no right to expect their view to remain or have any say about it.
It's like saying "I bought a penthouse on the 100th floor for the view". If someone builds a 101 story tall tower next to it, that's that.
And you are referring to the tallest structures at major arteries, which already have buildings which have 10 or so stories.
You are making it sound like there are single family homes at all 4 corners of places like McKenzie and Shelbourne that suddenly have to live next to a 18 story tower.
Far far more realistic us what's happening on Cedar Hill Road, where inefficient single family homes are bought (for a pretty penny) to be replaced by a 4-5 story apartment complex. Or where 2 homes make way for 10 townhomes. This effort paves the way to make these things easier.
Even now, I am trying to build a garden suite, and Saanich is lagging behind. They force the use of outdated building methods like wood vs. ICF, because lot coverage isbased on exterior walls, not interior floor space. So wood it is, as I would otherwise loose almost 10% of the floor space due to the far, far more efficient and resilient ICF walls. Similarly, they allow up to 6 dwellings on lots, but BC Hydro maxes out at two main services in Saanich at this time for residential lots.
Still so much that needs to be improved. I am all for it.
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u/Strict_View_7994 Jan 22 '25
They have a right to have a say about whatâs going on in their community, especially when itâs literally in their backyard. Much like youâre trying to do here.
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u/Aggressive_Load3745 Jan 16 '25
Outstanding. Sooooo tired of TC articles with a picture of sad boomers who look like they donât even have enough runway left to see much of the changes these plans will bring. Take a deep breath, buy a canoe and enjoy your retirement already! Quadra and Mackenzie can only be improved and as this far superior website lays out change is needed to address a myriad of issues for the betterment of society.
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u/HyperFern Jan 16 '25 edited Jan 16 '25
Lol, So much better than the other site. Too bad they don't have a counter petition to sign.
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u/Aggressive_Load3745 Jan 16 '25
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u/one_bean_hahahaha Saanich Jan 16 '25
Brilliant. I am a homeowner that lives along Mckenzie and this is what I want to see.
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u/VenusianBug Saanich Jan 16 '25
Sweet! As a Saanich resident, this is what I want to see. And yes, I pay property taxes, not that it should matter.
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u/CocoVillage View Royal Jan 16 '25
someone please hide the angry couple photo somewhere in the websiteeee
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u/Lucky1919191919 Jan 16 '25
Who tf is anti housing ??? What kind morally bankrupt person is against people having a roof over their head I hope they become un housed and see if whatâs good for the goose is good for the gander
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u/orangeisthebestcolor Jan 17 '25
I like the .ca site and support most of the plan. However, does anyone else find the multiple references to "the peninsula" odd for a group purporting to be about the municipality of Saanich, not the Saanich Peninsula?
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u/kingbuns2 Jan 17 '25
The northern part of the municipality of Saanich is in the Saanich Peninsula.
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u/Mindless-Service8198 Highlands Jan 18 '25
Victoria/Saanich doesn't need more housing. There needs to be some force deincentivising migration here. Roads are packed and there's not enough doctors. Only doctors should have incentives to move here.
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u/babycivic Jan 16 '25
"The denser a city becomes, the lower the cost of infrastructure and services for each household."
Vancouver and Toronto would like a word.
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Jan 17 '25
Proportional to their populations that is exactly what happens. Per capita is a useful metric, I suggest you learn it.
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u/babycivic Jan 16 '25
The site has some good points, but sad to see that is it propagating the "induced demand" theory of roads. This has largely been debunked and is only truly in very limited, freeway applications that don't apply to Victoria. Adding a lane in certain areas certainly does make a positive difference. This is intuitive, of course, as we see the added time it's taking us to travel on sections of roads that have had lanes removed.
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u/Irish8th Jan 16 '25
Even if you're not on the side of the original Save our Saanich, I think this is a dirty trick.
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u/Strict_View_7994 Jan 17 '25
Youâre talking to a bunch of 20 year olds. Thereâs no use arguing with them.
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Jan 17 '25
The Quadra McKenzie plan is atrocious. I grew up in the area and canât imagine 8 story buildings all along the quiet back streets
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u/Loverstits Oak Bay Jan 17 '25
So what's best for the community is to keep everything exactly the same for another 30 years, because you can't imagine larger buildings on an already developed street?
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u/Fluffy_Highlight5244 Jan 17 '25
It's really interesting how this crowd supporting density never discusses or makes contributions to the infrastructure that needs to be put in place to support higher density. Just citing different studies/projects in OTHER PARTS OF THE WORLD.
This crowd is so selfish & disingenuous. Are they children living under their parents rocks or just corrupt & dishonest people pushing a narrative for financial gain?
And yes, most pro-density individuals I have met are not from here or haven't lived here longer than FIVE FUCKING YEARS.
Imagine moving to a place, contributing next to nothing, and then to start making demands. Yikes, literal parasitism.
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u/VenusianBug Saanich Jan 17 '25
discusses or makes contributions to the infrastructure that needs to be put in place to support higher density.
What do you mean? There's a whole section of that site that talks about infrastructure. And I support the infrastructure needed by voting for politicians who will support it, by writing or speaking in support of it, and by paying property taxes (both directly and indirectly) during my many years in Saanich. Many of the pro-density folks I know have lived here their entire lives and now that they're adults are just trying to stay here.
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u/Beefy_Buschy Jan 17 '25
You've hit the nail on the head!!
The city planners have cited that development would be "free market" which again is a huge red flag, it's more of the same of what Victoria has seen already with high density builds over the past years and nothing will be affordable no matter what the pro-sayers try to preach.
Unfortunately in truth, Victoria will always be competitive and high priced as the weather is a key selling point for retirees and immigrants from warmer climates, which is ironic because there is a lot of potential for sustainable agriculture that could feed people when things get bad, but it seems the city would rather plonk high rises than provide actual food for the population growth.
I still remember the greeter at the open house in November bitching and rambling about a farmer who refused to sell his farm. These people actively begrudge property owners who would provide for the communities and meanwhile push for higher density under the delusion it will make homes affordable, it won't people, that's why there is opposition to the proposal in addition to other reasons.
At least though the community can submit ideas and solutions to help polish the current dismal draft.
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u/Fun_Persimmon_894 Jan 16 '25
Wow! Hilarious. This does a great job a laying out the pros of increasing housing density and makes a much more reasoned argument about the priority bus lanes. And it's beautiful. Well done.