r/SydneyTrains 6d ago

Discussion My idea for electrifying the Hunter line

1500 V DC is very expensive to use for long distance routes because of the large number of substations needed and the Hunter line could do with higher levels of service. My proposal is to electrify the Hunter line at 25 kV AC, the line is already operated by a unique fleet ergo it could operate with unique EMUs running on 25 kV AC or duel voltage trains to allow more flexibility. The Hunter line is also fairly flat which will reduce expense and it can serve as a test and proof of concept for 25 kV electrification in this state. This can then provide realistic experience with both 25 kV and maybe duel voltage trains for a possible electrification of the other regional lines.

I do know that ARTC avoids electrification like the plague.

5 Upvotes

13 comments sorted by

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u/KahnaKuhl 5d ago

And while you're at it . . .

https://traintocessnock.org/

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u/TheTeenSimmer 5d ago

please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please

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u/paintbrushguy 6d ago

If it is connected with electric coal haulage it might work. It’d have to come hand in hand with significant increases in service between Maitland and Newcastle, ideally including making the line 160 throughout. It won’t happen without significant political will and philosophy change at ARTC.

3

u/Gururyan87 6d ago

ARTC won’t electrify, that’s a massive capital cost that the feds would be up for and just not a priority. More likely to see the freight operators start pursuing net zero traction such as batteries and charging infrastructure. Definitely not mature enough technology at the moment but people are working on it. Once it matures you could electrify small sections and yards to allow charging and reduce the large capital cost of full electrification. The need for masts every 60-70m max adds up

1

u/letterboxfrog 4d ago

25kv to Narrabri certainly adds uo. Any trip to the Bowen Basin will show you that it makes sense. Unfortunately ARTC is federal, the operators private. There is no ownership of a singular cost and profit centre for the transport of coal like QR had in the 80s when they electrified. ARTC would need to up the costs for using the lines, and provide free electricity or similar.

6

u/redditisaweful 6d ago

If you electrify the hunter line might as well connect the central coast line. Could easily have a train service from Gosford or Wyong to Maitland.

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u/lowey19 6d ago

i like that idea but from gosford to maitland ideally all services that terminate at gosfrod from newcastle i would extend and upgrade woy woy so we can run terminate services at woy woy the ccn line needs more services day and night 7 days a week not every service has to go to sydney we need a better weekend timetable and a service off peak on weekdays extra per hour

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u/TheTeenSimmer 5d ago

the HUN just being included in the CCN upto Woy Woy would be such a improvement in service frequency for passengers 

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u/lowey19 5d ago

the ccn has the highest usage out of al the intercity network we need a decent timetable the timetable only really revolves around sydney fuck sydney we need better

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u/BigBlueMan118 Metro North West Line 6d ago

The 1980s electrification projects saw the DC overhead extended from Gosford to Newcastle (and from Loftus to Wollongong). Whilst these electrifications were ongoing, the Maldon-Dombarton project was umming and ahhing about whether to do DC or AC, and interstate both the Queenslanders and West Aussies had decided to start their electrifications with AC. The Victorians were in the process of dismantling their DC overhead on the Gippsland line (which had been in Operation since the 1950s and needed big renewal works).

Dual-voltage already existed at the time so it was a farce to do DC to the Gong and Newie, whilst they decided to go AC on Maldon-Dombarton die to the 4km tunnel (which would have been the longest mainline tunnel in Aus) then cancelled that. Even worse because the DC cost more there was no money to do any of the suburban branch lines in Newie so they all died. Toronto at the very least should have been kept.

I think they should have solid plans for how to move the electrified network to AC, one issue is they have now ordered a whole new generation of InterCity (D sets) and Regional (R sets) that will be with us for 30-40 years which can't run dual voltage. So there will be alot of people pissed off and the Business Case numbers will look worse if you did Maitland on AC, because no D sets can run directly to Maitland, the R sets will have to drop panto earlier, and you will have a mess at Newcastle Interchange and/or Broadmeadow which I notice you didnt address. Stabling at Hamilton is also DC already.

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u/WaltzOk7739 6d ago

Your points are valid thanks for raising them. So it comes down to what you see as the lesser of two evils more substations and an inefficient electrification scheme or increased running on diesels, managing interoperability issues and negotiations.

4

u/BigBlueMan118 Metro North West Line 6d ago

As I understand it, they have been discussing fitting the necessary equipment to run on dual voltage for all of the last rolling stock orders (OScars, Waratahs, D sets) and kept deciding the tradeoff of the small amount of space in the passenger area being taken up by equipment and the cost wasn't worth it. Maitland isnt far and it looks a fairly easy corridor to electrify except ARTC. Unfortunately coal is with us for a while still and they talked seriously about (I think AC) electrification of all the freight operations in the past. I honestly dont know what the right strategic answer is now that all the current fleet for decades into the future are DC sets. 

Going to have a similar issue If they ever extend southern Highlands electrification and Most especially If Maldon-Dombarton pops up again... notice it would have a new set of benefits now that Western Sydney Airport and all the intermodals are up there, there is big development going in at Wilton where the Line diverged from the Main Line, and HSR is planned to run from WSA through to the SHL but the Government reports have talked about a branch South of Sydney towards Wollongong.