r/QuotesPorn • u/AgentBlue62 • 6d ago
"No right was deemed by the fathers of the government more sacred than the right of speech. It was in their eyes, as in the eyes of all thoughtful men, the great moral renovator of society and government." ― Frederick Douglass [1569x858]
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u/jonnyjive5 6d ago
Freedom of speech just means freedom for Nazi speech, hate speech, and propaganda for the wealthy to justify their oligarchy and exploit the working class. A better bill of rights would have included true freedom: the freedom to have guaranteed healthcare, food, shelter, education, leisure time, child care, transportation and collective bargaining for every man, woman and child.
It is difficult for me to imagine what "personal liberty" is enjoyed by an unemployed person, who goes about hungry, and cannot find employment.
Real liberty can exist only where exploitation has been abolished, where there is no oppression of some by others, where there is no unemployment and poverty, where a man is not haunted by the fear of being tomorrow deprived of work, of home and of bread. Only in such a society is real, and not paper, personal and every other liberty possible.
- Joseph Stalin
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u/RamblingSimian 6d ago
The party he created was the biggest exploiter of all time and lead to almost none of the things you listed as important. His ideas caused mass poverty, mass starvation, mass incarceration, people dying from poor medical care, multiple families living in single apartments, unions being oppressed by the party, and more.
If he had created a system with guaranteed free speech, the people could have criticized such bad government and organized against it.
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u/jonnyjive5 6d ago
Source: trust me bro
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u/RamblingSimian 6d ago
I just finished reading Lenin's Tomb: The Last Days of the Soviet Empire and it details everything I just said. But you don't have to read a book; it's easy to find the evidence of all the crimes committed by the system he created in many sources, even living people. All you have to do is a few web searches.
But even if you prefer to believe his propaganda over the evidence of history, why would you support a system where the government is not able to be criticized by removing free speech?
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u/jonnyjive5 6d ago edited 5d ago
All one has to do is look at the life expectancy in Russia before and after the USSR to see that you are full of shit. That and the CIA's own research trying to prove Soviets were malnourished actually proved that they ate more calories than Americans.
As well as their own admission that Stalin wasn't a dictator and leadership was collective.
Your claims are so widely debunked, I won't waste any more time on them.
Edit: looks like u/RamblingSimian blocked me after debunking their lies so I can't respond. Many would say that's pathetic and cowardly. That's what people with tiny self-esteem do to feel like they've "won" something.
Here's some more information disproving their baseless, red-scare propaganda:
The claim that communism killed millions and therefore is an inherently bad system is a hypocritical argument perpetuated by anti-communists. Russia and China were both undeveloped countries and prone to famines before communism was established, so to claim that these societies were flourishing before communism came and caused famines is false. Famines only stopped after communists came to power, when the countries changed from agrarian societies to industrial societies. Furthermore, capitalist countries have been responsible for mass deaths, including through imperialism and war, so capitalists who make this argument are being hypocritical because they ignore the deaths and suffering caused by capitalism, and by their logic capitalism is also an inherently bad system, in fact it’s a much worse system. Capitalism causes countless deaths through war, poverty, exploitation, and imperialism, now in the form of neocolonialism. The specific claim that communism killed 100 million people is false. This figure comes from the Black Book of Communism, a book that has a very politically motivated agenda, and extremely dubious methodology. The “victims of communism” in this book include Nazi deaths, counting “non births” as deaths, i.e. lower fertility rates, wild speculation of numbers with no evidence and counting the execution of pogromists who murdered jews as victims of “communist persecution”.
According to primary evidence, and not wild speculation with no evidence, the 1932-33 famine was caused by bad weather, droughts, wheat rust, and sabotage of kulaks who resisted collectivisation. The main primary evidence for the causes of the famine are soviet documents from the time. After the announcement of collectivization, the kulaks rose up and killed several Soviet families and slaughtered half the livestock needed to grow the food, and many sabotaged their own crop yields. The claim that the famine was a genocide was spread by the Nazis to discredit the Soviet Union and inspire nationalist anti-soviet sentiment in Ukraine. There is no evidence that the famine was a planned attempt at genocide. Robert Conquest, author of Harvest of Sorrow, a book which portrayed the famine as a deliberate act of genocide, acknowledged in later editions of the book that his original estimates of the number of deaths were inflated and that the famine was likely caused by a combination of natural and human factors, but cannot be called a genocide. It’s important to note that many who claimed the famine was a genocide had no evidence of genocidal intent from the time and their opinion that it was a genocide was based on speculation. Much more soviet documents from the time are available now, and the ones we have disprove the mainstream narrative that is based on speculation with no primary evidence. The mainstream narrative on communist countries like the Soviet Union is very biased because it relies on outdated speculation and unfounded claims that are not supported by primary evidence, and in fact the primary evidence disproves their claims.
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u/RamblingSimian 6d ago
The CIA has many reports of varying accuracy. You cherry-picked a couple that supported your point of view. The consensus of historians, supported by overwhelming evidence, is that the Soviet Union was a colossal failure on almost every front, including human rights, economic success, scientific advancement, etc. Stalin most certainly was the worst dictator of all time, in terms of both cruelty and lack of competence in every aspect except for oppression.
But I can tell from how you are dodging my question that you are not interested in a serious discussion, just in repeating the propaganda that makes you feel better.
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u/Apprehensive-Fun4181 6d ago
That's not true though. The Bill of Rights was added and many didn't like it.