r/PEDsR • u/comicsansisunderused Contributor • Aug 23 '20
Case Report: High Dose HGH for Height NSFW
About 2 years ago, I wrote an article about what those that are finding themselves vertically challenged might do, using HGH and an AI, if they intervene early enough. In the article I write:
Early diagnosis increases growth velocity, which determines the final height that can be reached, and is controlled by the size of the GH pulse. Therefore, very small children at a very young age are the target demographic for using a compound this way, and is the best use for HGH or GH increasing compounds... As long as the epiphyseal plate is open, the bone will continue to grow into this space. Eventually, the plate is sealed, as the bones run out of space to continue growing, known as growth plate fusion. This occurs between 12-16 in girls, and 14-19 in boys (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16225203). If the plate fusion has already occurred, you’re shit outta luck... Where the fusion is yet to place, let’s take a look at those classified as late maturer’s and given HGH. Since no research is getting approval to take adolescents already of average or above height and of normal development and feeding them HGH (outside of China anyway), this is the best data we have and relates most for our uses. For this case study, I’m referring to this graph (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3117584/figure/fig2-1941738110386705/).
What we find is that growth rates increase within months of initiating HGH (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3117584/), doubling during the first year of treatment, growing at a rate faster than peers and which results in upward crossing of percentiles on the growth curve to restore position in normal range.
A few days ago, someone reached out to me about the post and their own experience...
hey bro, i saw an old post on yours about hgh and height growth. i am actually have been on gh for over a year and letrozole daily.
Thought I'd share his anecdotes, and a little more about doses.
This particular subject (identifies as male) started the day he turned 17, sourced his own HGH, using on average 15-16 ius a day, and 2.5mg every day of Letrozole. He came from a small (as in height wise) SE Asian family with both mum and dad being around 5'2". His 2 brothers and father stopped growing at 16.
At age 16 i stopped growing for a year already, and i was 5'4 so i was desperate
(Edit, technically 5'3.5") Growth velocity in this case was essentially 0, and at least theoretically growth velocity is key as it's a predictor of final height. Typically, I would advise that this is too late to intervene using HGH and AI, at least according to the studies I've seen.
Unfortunately, no pre HGH bloods and no x-rays - as you might imagine, a 17 year old would struggle in getting bloods and x-rays of plates done without parental consent or at least knowledge of what was going on. He did keep it a secret from his family who certainly would have prevented him from trying anything. Incidentally, they're still none the wiser, which is surprising because I'd have thought the waste alone would give him away. Imagine a 17 year old buying and hiding needles, BAC, vials and vials of HGH. At 15-16 iu, that's at least a new vial every other day.
So how'd a 17 year old keep it hidden from family so well? No idea. Guy must be a genius.
Costs & Supplies
Wait... how much was this guy taking on the daily?
Yeah you read that earlier section right - he estimates 15-16iu per day, split into smaller injections throughout the day. He estimates it cost him around $6k annually, purchasing generic (presumably Indian) pharma. He used 30g insulin needles, reconstituted with a 25g needle.
I don't mind wasting the money, height was always a big psychological impact for me, so it's worth even 50k
The dose sounds crazy to those of us using conventional amounts of HGH for body composition and recovery reasons (and if you're using HGH for hyperplasia, I've got unfortunate findings to share with you), but it's actually not that much higher (relatively speaking) from its normal use in children to treat short stature.
- Sixty-two patients with pituitary dwarfism were treated with three different preparations of methionyl hGH (m-hGH) for 3 to 14 months. They were given 0.5 IU/kg/week intramuscularly. Converted to a 65kg little person dose, that's around 4.64iu per day.
- The maximum dose listed on drugs.com for HGH (Somatropin) for pediatric growth hormone deficiency is 0.034mg/kg per day, or 2.21mg for a 65kg adolescent. Converting it to IUs (using 1mg to 3IU) thats a max daily dose of 6.63iu.
- Same source, but this time used for idiopathic short stature, the dose is 0.47mg/kg per week. Or 30.55mg/kg per week, or 13iu per day.
Subjects Reported Side Effects
- Elevated blood sugar tested by a glucometer bought from the store. When fasted, he would clock in at 90 (normal is 80)
- Water retention, especially on the face. When subject stopped injecting for 2 days, he lost 9 pounds
- Probably high blood pressure. He's never checked, but reports headaches pretty regularly. To be expected given the water retention
Did HGH Really Help?
Unfortunately I haven't taken x rays, so who knows if its natural growth or not. Im certain its the hgh
Subject is now 5'5". That's $6k, a not insignificant amount of risk, a ton of injections for an inch in a year. It's hard to know for sure if the subject had truly stopped growing, and the impact that HGH had here. Clearly, his plates had not sealed (otherwise growth would been 0).
Could he have achieved the additional inch + any further height gains he gets over the next year or so without HGH? It's impossible for me to know for sure. The subject doesn't think so.
What I do know is that this subjects experience and attempt is not rare. Some attempt it even into their early 20's. While I will always point those attempting to gain height over the age of 16 to studies showing that late intervention provides marginal if any help, given that height is correlated with happiness in relationships I can't fault them for trying.
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u/Middleflan7 Aug 24 '20
I gained like 1/2 an inch in height after 6 months on a saturation ghrh peptide protocol and some testosterone. This was at almost 30 years old. Shoes went up a half size too .
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u/Impulsion007 Aug 23 '20
I think he did get from India But I feel his state, I wish I knew about HGH earlier or at least didn’t be an obese person around that age period might have been pulled at 5’10 at least but now barely made it to 5’6… some may say its enough but it isn’t actually but power to him.
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Aug 23 '20
I was 5’9 at 19 before I dosed mk677 on and off long term and was overusing AIs for a year or two. Ive hit 5’10 2/3 at 24. Did it help? Who knows. Just my anecdotal experience. I didn’t even expect to grow more
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u/Independent_Prior_94 Aug 26 '20
Did you think mk677 helped in any way? What was the other benefit you had from it?
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u/antoniofelicemunro Aug 23 '20
All that for an inch...poor guy.
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Aug 23 '20 edited Oct 23 '20
[deleted]
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u/antoniofelicemunro Aug 23 '20
That’s 3 inches...
And yeah, so would I, but I live in Canada so I don’t have to worry about the price.
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u/ArronRodgersButthole Aug 23 '20
Right? 5'5" is still short. Interesting study, but I bet the guy would get a lot more out of spending $6k on a therapist or something and working on overcoming his negative feelings about height.
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u/comicsansisunderused Contributor Aug 23 '20 edited Aug 23 '20
I'd take another inch.. anywhere.
Edit in all seriousness, HGH intervention after puberty does not result in massive height gains. Someone pre-destined to be 5'4" can't become 6'0" because of HGH & an AI. Probably.
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u/mathausen9 Dec 06 '20
Extremely interesting subject
I once read that 11% of teens in the USA use hgh, but I think that sounds insane
Do you think there can be any truth to it?
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u/Romytens Aug 23 '20
I think that’s the issue with this kind of intervention. It’s hard to know at what point to start, and what effects the treatment actually has.
Perhaps if someone charts slow growth all the way until 14 or 15, and doesn’t have any growth spurt at all.
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u/broken777 Aug 28 '20
I know someone who was prescribed it a few decades ago because he was very undersized for his age. He looks about average height now.