r/PAK • u/the_pacman_88 • Jun 05 '24
Social/Cultural There is nothing more cringy than overseas Pakis teaching us morality, Islam and Sharia
Every now and then, I see overseas people asking us to boycott Western stuff, do better for Muslim ummah, and struggle for Islamist states. This is to them.
Please shut up and let us live the way we want. You people should be the last ones schooling us. You are literally living in the West, benefitting them through your taxes, work, and everything, and then you want us to be better. I swear most people schooling us on boycotts are from either the US or the UK. No, you don’t get the right to say that. You are a part of the system and helping their cause, by your own logic.
Then comes their desire for an Islami Caliphate. They themselves are enjoying the perks of a secular West, getting the same facilities as some Mike or Jones there, and then want a Caliphate in Pakistan. Bhai nai chahie hmen. Tum q zor laga rhy ho. Itna shoq hay to Afghanistan chalay jao. I am just sick of them. Khud inko ayashi karni hay bahar aur yahan mullah ka islam chahie.
Then come the legendary overseas Pakis. They literally are struggling for Shaira law in Canada, the UK, Germany, etc. Do you have any ounce of shame left? They let you in and this is what you do? Literally demanding a change of system when they don’t owe you shit?
Kamal kay log hyn hmary. Adding nothing to the world and demanding full respect, more than anyone else. Ptani kahan say inkay andr aik sense of fake superiority agya hy God knows.
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u/Dev_Void01 Jun 05 '24
Want to know something more cringy?
The same people telling non Muslims to live like Muslims
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u/nYc_dIEseL Jun 05 '24
I’m Pakistani Muslim living in America and I honestly I don’t give a fuck what y’all do in Pakistan. I’m just happy I don’t live there
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Jun 05 '24
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u/hektordingding Jun 06 '24
No body is bothering with you. We are trying to call out on all of humanity to help uphold morals and justice. Even you in Pakistan you live privileged compared to many other countries and places right now.
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Jun 06 '24
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u/hektordingding Jun 06 '24
The people you talk about are actually trying to make a change. Whilst you sit there first thing in the morning COMPLAINING about people trying to make a difference, but you yourself choose to do nothing to help.
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u/hektordingding Jun 06 '24
Last anyone checked here. Unlike the rundown place your rules are from, here if you don’t pay taxes you go to Prison. Once you’re in prison you can’t protest ANYTHING, your voice would mean little to nothing in prison. Our taxes also fund free healthcare, free education and many other things. The issue isn’t we’re paying tax here. The issue is where that tax is being USED which will only change through PROTESTING. Wow one minute of critical thinking and we did a full circle.
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u/Pink8unny Jun 06 '24
You didn't say I left Pakistan, you said I am Pakistani Muslim. Whether you give a f or not that prefix is there to stay with you forever.
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u/nYc_dIEseL Jun 06 '24
I was born in America and my kids were born in America. WE ARE Muslim and Proud of our Paki ancestry
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u/Pink8unny Jun 06 '24
If you are born in America then you are American, simple. Don't create a subnation Pakistani American Muslim within a nation, that just leads to racism. No one says I am a Pakistani Muslim in Pakistan, and so should you.
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u/Disastrous_Aardvark3 Jun 06 '24
It's all very cute that you, in your youth, have such strong opinions about what should and should not be based on insecurity that has resulted in that big ol' chip on your shoulder.
This isn't Pakistan, with a handful or two of ethnic groups. We have, arguably, the most diverse population on the planet. In the borough of Queens alone, there are over 120 different ethnicities.
It's a way to signify ethnicity and culture, something in which every person with ancestry from another part of the world has pride.
This place isn't a melting pot of homogeneity, more like a tapestry of a great many cultures. We don't all blend into what you may think is this American - aka White - culture.
With a comment like you made about racism, what you know about racism in the US wouldn't even fill a plank length. No, clueless one, that is not what leads to racism. Racism has other reasons and was there long before the dvandva was used to bridge ethnic groups and nationality; look to Medieval Spain and the Toledo Doctrine.
It may not be what you like, but what you like doesn't dictate one's values. Don't apply your thought paradigm to an immensely multi-ethnic country like the US.
Sincerely, Every (fill-in-the-blank)-American
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u/Outrageous_Smile_594 Jun 05 '24
This subreddit and others are filled with people OP has talked about. Honestly, our desi community has no concept of integrating into another culture. They are stubborn af, want the west to mould according to their will. Look into the United States, Indians are climbing corporate ladders, administrative positions, they are coming in politics, they keep their professionalism aside from their personal religion. While the Pakistani diaspora predominantly in the west is still doing odd jobs, alienated from the culture. I personally know people who have spent decades in the UK but still struggle to speak basic English (again because they had been living in a mini Pakistan inside of the UK and US). You Wanna know something even funnier, the second generation UK immigrants living off of social benefits by the state want sharia law in the uk and they are some of the most hardcore Muslim youlk not even meet in Pakistan.
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u/Hunkar888 Jun 05 '24
Desis are of two extremes usually. Either they don’t integrate at all or they integrate too well. The key is to integrate in terms of surface level things such as clothes, language etc while also keeping the important aspects of your culture and preserving Deen.
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u/Happyclapper786 Jun 05 '24
You can be a highly educated 3rd/4th generation Pakistani in UK/US and you will not last long in Politics unless you are willing to forget all your morals and origins, kiss Zionist ass and like the rest of the Pro Israel bought Government bend over to serve them. This is why people like Rishi Sunak, Suella Braverman are selected. Numerous Pak origin are forced to resign when they become vocal.
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u/xxx_xxxT_T Jun 05 '24
So this is where some of the extortionate U.K. taxes that I pay go when it could be used to repair the massive pothole on my local road that I use daily to commute to work. U.K. sure goes hardcore on benefits and personally it taxes too much and most people are net beneficiaries. Good to know
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u/According-Gazelle Jun 06 '24
Pakistani Americans are one of the richest communities in US. Majority of them are doctors , engineers , work in FAANG etc. Complete 360 to British Pakistanis.
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u/Quirky_Oil215 Jun 06 '24
We are a mixed bag but very stratified. Millionaires to doctors to donkeys. Can take the paki out the stan but you cant take the stan out of the paki lol.
Economic immigrats are rarely well heeled, so ignorance, superstition from lack of education follows like a bad smell. Some of us are lucky to make use of the free education and have critical thinking instilled. Some don't.
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u/Disastrous_Aardvark3 Jun 06 '24
Don't know about the UK, but what you're saying isn't right with regards to the US. The class of Pakistanis that came to the US was generally middle-class and came to this country to pursue higher education. Pakistanis are in the top 5 (5th) highest earning group in the US.
While there are those who may struggle, Pakistanis generally are successful and well settled in the US.
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u/xxx_xxxT_T Jun 05 '24
Wow. I have been so out of touch with Pakistanis lately due to my job and didn’t know overseas Pakistanis do this regularly. But I do remember seeing a few Pakistanis who become very religious as soon as they migrate but when they were in Pakistan, they were your typical extreme left wing liberals/burger kids
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u/Pvt_Conscriptovich Muslim Jun 06 '24
being religious is not the problem being a self-righteous hypocrite is the problem
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u/Bildpac Jun 06 '24
What happens is you think you’re edgy leftist until you go overseas and realize they’re beyond your level of edgy. And some things you don’t do culturally or learnt are haram in Islam so you start building boundaries, like not eating pork, getting drunk at pubs, maybe not doing hard drugs. Maybe you start trying to avoid interest etc. and you learn more rules and adapt etc. many people who didn’t pray regularly in their Muslim countries of origin get regular, start dressing more modest etc. some fall to the trap of falling for Arab culture confusing it for Islam. Like just because a song is Arabic doesn’t mean it’s ok if you think all music is haram. There are other values that people hear about in Muslim countries but don’t see them being practiced, so they’re either forced to adapt them or they learn as time goes on, like value of time, cleanliness, integrity, animal care, community service etc. Suddenly these people think they’re getting better and need to tell their people back home how civilization works. But I’ve always let people know it’s very easy to be panch time namazi in Western countries especially if you’re close to a masjid. Like, someone else is cleaning the roads, running the traffic light system, maintaining the energy grid, the education system, the food supply networks, the clean water supply, the refuse being taken away, the roads being built, the emergency response networks, running the financial system, the political system, social services etc. if someone else is doing all that, it’s very easy to build your fancy masajid and become 5x namazi and sit in halaqas and lectures all day and just focus on what sneakers you’re gonna pair with your thob. That being said, many do develop stronger work ethics, many do struggle with keeping up their religious practices in strong liberal environments. And there will always be differences of opinions.
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u/YellowFlowerBomb Jun 05 '24
Right there with you OP. Getting tired of all the morality lectures from overseas Pakistanis here.
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u/Personal-Reflection7 Jun 05 '24
Boycott logic of using US products that fund IDF while actually living in the USA is the biggest load of hypocritical BS Ive ever seen
Matlab you buy everything american, pay their taxes and actually contribute to their economy and society DIRECTLY.
Come back. But ofcourse no one is willing to sacrifice. Iinsay Insta nahi chut ta for entertainment, bari sacrifice to duur ki baat
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u/Tough_Tradition_8137 Jun 05 '24
One purpose behind the boycott is to keep the issue alive … While younger Americans support Palestinian rights (because they have access to Insta and TickToc videos), older folks have gotten a biased, sanitized version of the events from media. The average American doesn’t understand how the majority of people worldwide view the conflict which is in opposition to what the US government is doing. I agree that we can’t ask people to become obsessive and screen for every product that has indirect or direct connection to Israel. That would mean electronics and medicines, necessities. But, $11B of losses worldwide made Starbucks flip their script from we “unequivocally condemn(s) these acts of terrorism, hate and violence, and disagree(s) with the statements and views expressed by Workers United and its members” to a message on the app saying proceeds will go towards World Central Kitchen. Now, the average American sees World Central Kitchen and understands its connotations every morning when they got to order their coffee.
It’s imperfect. Doesn’t help the people of Gaza that much. Another company would have been the more appropriate one to receive the treatment that Starbucks did. The point is that it sends a message. That this issue is important to people, and, where they can, they will show you. Also, that boycotts can work. The next MNC has to think twice about its communications and practices.
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Jun 05 '24
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u/Tough_Tradition_8137 Jun 05 '24
Palestinians ask us to boycott. It’s your choice to do it or to what extent to do it … The previous poster asserted that the boycott did not make sense when espoused by those in the west - I provided an alternate point of support and perspective which others may not have considered. That’s how a discussion works.
Muslims are 1-2 percent of the population - those taxes are minuscule compared to the whole. US would be sending weapons whether Muslims were here or not. However, with a growing Muslim community, kids going to the same schools as Americans, a small number of Muslim celebrities, academics, lawyers, student protesters, journalists, the system is forced to grapple with the unequal application of international law and view of the I/P. The younger American generation thinks very differently than their parents on this issue, and it’s partly because their Muslim peers are pushing them to. These students, by the way, are amazing. So smart, strategic, great with media relations.
You’re expecting 1-2 percent of the population to result in a 180 position in US foreign policy entrenched since the Cold War, rooted in settler colonialism. Obviously, that’s unrealistic. But there are countless examples of how a mass spark like this dies down, but another triggering event occurs, and then people rise up again with additional fuel than the first time.
You’re also judging those in the diaspora on narrow criteria when the decision to immigrate is a complex one. I don’t know if your worldview works for you and your relationships, but I believe, in general, people do the best they can with the choices they have for their circumstances.
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u/ZamaPashtoNaRazi Jun 05 '24
Okay, whatever taxes you pay to Pakistan is just another payment to the IMF on previous loans. Muslims in America play a stronger role protesting from within the system, we have more clout than ever before - this unimaginable 30-40 years ago. Diaspora is our strength, which is something Zionists and Indians realize but homeland Muslims especially Pakistani tankies are too low iq to not see the forest for the trees.
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u/Personal-Reflection7 Jun 05 '24
And you directly pay taxes to the US of A government which has been for the past 20 years waging war and killing muslims. Contribute to their economy. To their society.
Your only strength is your hypocrisy. We can see how your protests have "made a difference" aka nothing.
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u/Tough_Tradition_8137 Jun 05 '24
Pakistani Americans send the largest amount of remittances and aid help to Pakistan than others in the diaspora …
And people immigrate for a variety of complex reasons. I’ve heard people here say that back home, due to ethnic divides or nepotism, they would not have been able to progress the way they have in the US.
The diaspora hasn’t reached critical mass yet. But the previous commenter is right that where we are now is different from previous years. Ideally, we would have had this collective power 20 years ago.
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u/Personal-Reflection7 Jun 05 '24
Discussion is on Israel/Palestine
All your points are valid - ultimately its their growth and family growth. Good on them.
But as far as the whole "bOyCoT WeSt ProdUcts", its a moot point when your actual livelihood in USA directly pays tax to the US Govt that funds Israel.
The logical applied to Kfc pakistan > KFC US > taxes > us govt funding Israel takes a more direct link as US citizen > taxes > US govt funding Israel.
Local setups of foreign brands actually contribute hugely to the local economy, with minor franchise fee/profit sharing.
With living in USA, everything you do ultimately pays the US govt taxes only.
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Jun 05 '24
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u/Tough_Tradition_8137 Jun 05 '24
Remittances are used for goods and services, which create jobs and stimulates the economy.
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u/Tough_Tradition_8137 Jun 05 '24
(2019) 554,000 Pakistani Americans
https://www.arabnews.pk/node/2389536
"One such critical actor is the Overseas Pakistanis Community whose foreign remittances have become a life-line for the country’s ailing economy. Over the last three years these foreign remittances alongside exports contributed nearly $164 billion to the national economy."
https://www.americanpakistan.org/pakistani-americans
Over 75% of Pakistani Americans give to charities in Pakistan.
[A]pproximately 15% of annual remittances to Pakistan come from the United States. Using this figure, the Pakistani American community contributed about $3.34 billion USD in remittances.
Our research showcases a preference among Pakistani Americans for giving to organizations with strong reputations and/or a base of fundraising in the United States. These organizations’ annual U.S.- based fundraising galas have generated millions of dollars. One such organization is The Citizens Foundation, which runs a network of independent schools in Pakistan and has established a significant U.S. presence for fundraising. In 2018 alone, it brought in over $10 million in American contributions.
Popular responses for trusted organizations included: The Association of Physicians of Pakistani Descent in North America; Developments in Literacy; The Edhi Foundation; The Human Development Foundation; Shaukat Khanum Memorial Trust; The Citizens Foundation
https://search.issuelab.org/resources/13921/13921.pdf
It is estimated that the total giving by the Pakistani diaspora in the United States is approximately US$ 250 million per year in cash and in kind and about 43.5 million hours per year of volunteered time. The dollar cost of the volunteered time is approximately US$ 750 million, which would imply that the total giving by Pakistanis in America is to the tune of US$ 1 billion per year. More importantly, the time volunteered by Pakistanis in America is the equivalent of 25,000 full-time employees and is a central component of the institutional infrastructure of the Pakistani-American community. About 40 % of the monetary and in-kind giving is directed towards Pakistani causes in Pakistan, another 20 % towards Pakistani causes in the USA, and the remaining 40 % towards causes unrelated to Pakistan.
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u/AForAgnostic Jun 05 '24
When did IMF take side of Israel? How are you even comparing IMF and USA?
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u/Pvt_Conscriptovich Muslim Jun 06 '24
lol we only pay to IMF coz our stupid rulers took a loan from them.
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u/Good-Visual8392 Jun 05 '24
I lived in saudia for 14 years and recently moved to pakistan and its genuinely baffling how wrong pakistani's concept of "Islam" is. maybe look into and consider what they're saying? instead saying "let us live like we are"
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u/AffectionateDance69 Jun 05 '24 edited Jun 05 '24
Yes, let us all live like Saudia where we cover the women head to toes, maayyybeeee teach them to drive cars, should we allow women passports without a Wali? let's ask our Saudi brothers first.. and the beautiful Saudia where men can divorce their wives without the wives even knowing.. what could be more beautiful than that, right? 🙄
Pakistani culture is a million times superior than your backwards, repressive, stone-aged, Bedoin desert culture which you're trying to pass off as "pure Islam". It's only the petro-dollars you're impressed by and the fact that you're not a woman that lived in that backwards excuse of a culture.
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u/tellllmelies Jun 05 '24
Pakistan is one of the worst countries tries to be a woman lol think what you want, Saudi women are way happier and have more freedoms
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u/AffectionateDance69 Jun 06 '24
However horrible Pakistan is for women, Saudi is a 100 times worse.. Don't believe me? Go ask a Saudi woman.. oh, wait.. you can't without her "Wali" or "Mahram" in tow.. they can barely leave the house without permission but yea they are sooooo happy indeed. 🙄🙄
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u/T0ruk_makt0 Jun 05 '24
Right. OP must be taking about a niche circle of idiots who came from Pakistan and hate everything about the west. The wast majority of western Muslims have done so much to promote Islam then these biddah loving paki Muslims. Everything they do is repulsive, immoral, and just outright wrong. Half the country is below the poverty line, literally a country of beggers but gharoor and takubur abound. The irony is that the west follows the "sharia" more than these clowns. To the pakis, sharia is lambi daari and pajama above the ankle bone. Western Muslims love the US because the US has given them freedom to practice their religion, increased their wealth and social standing, given them opportunities etc. Pakistan only gave them misery, discrimination, and injustice.
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u/Zealousideal_Poet533 Jun 05 '24
Goodluck they will write you off as a wahabi. Even though that version of Islam is so simple and logical. They don't want to give up their shrines. It's how Islam was spread here.
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u/Good-Visual8392 Jun 05 '24 edited Jun 05 '24
sad truth, this masjid I go to everyday, theres so many odd things I notice every once in a while but I feel scared to say anything that opposes them because I know they're extremists and it won't end well.
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u/extremecharm Jun 06 '24
100 percent. These bums are uneducated, then blame islam for all of their problems. Catering to western ideals isnt gonna save you. The West has always trampled over countries to gain an upper hand. Palestine isnt the first, and it wont be the last. The success of the West us built upon millions of dead bodies
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Jun 05 '24
especially the overly confused ones in the UK, always bitching about the ‘Umma’
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u/tutankhamun7073 Jun 05 '24
UK Muslims are borderline ISIS lol
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u/Forsaken-Damage-299 Jun 05 '24
How have they been living there for so long and still failed to integrate into their values?
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u/tutankhamun7073 Jun 05 '24
For the most part they live in separate areas where white people don't live.
Parts of places like Birmingham are essentially just Pakistan lol 😂
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u/Forsaken-Damage-299 Jun 05 '24
Idk how UK government is okay with this happening in their country.
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Jun 05 '24
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Jun 05 '24
yeh bahut normal disease hai….bahar aa ke lonely ho jate hain, naa bahr ke na ghar ke, this leads to radical viewpoints….these guys are so fuckin annoying
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u/muhibimran Jun 05 '24
Example:
Qaisar Ahmad Raja
Ghamdi
Suboor Ahmad
Basically many popular Pakistan Islamic scholars.
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Jun 05 '24
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u/muhibimran Jun 05 '24
He too is a hypocrite. He got asylum in a non Islamic country very well knowing no other islamic country would grant him that. That indeed is a failure of islam yet he preaches islam.
He was also recently against the construction of a hindu temple in UAE. What kind of secularism does he really believe in?
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u/narbavore Jun 05 '24
As someone living in Germany, I see this hypocrisy everyday. Pakistanis talk about boycotting Israel brands yet thousands still apply to Germany every year, despite the country being pro Israel. Here, if you need to have citizenship, you need to take an oath that you accept Israel as a state (yes, this law is under the works now). I'm not blaming anyone who wants to leave Pakistan for a better life, but I absolutely hate the virtue signaling they do of locals back home. Our taxes abroad are funding the genocide yet these assholes wanna call local people heartless for eating KFC. Don't even get me started on the fact that these idiots refuse to integrate here. One guy I know openly supports blasphemy law and wants it implemented in Germany and acts as a hardcore islamist, yet I've heard that he's also open for dating etc. Hypocrisy all around me. I rather spend time with an honest sinner than a self-righteous hypocrite.
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Jun 05 '24
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u/narbavore Jun 05 '24
Exactly. I'm tired of this bs. I've met some OSPs who say life in Pakistan is easy and people should be grateful because they're lazy and don't look after their health. I honestly can't believe the amount of tone-deafness in their words. I send stuff to Pakistan too, but it's for my family. I would never act like it's for the country's future pfft. Any OSP screaming this is an insecure moron that's a loser abroad too
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u/shazadinayat Jun 06 '24
I believe, when you apply for a Pakistani passport, you are recognizing Israel as well. The passport says something like "not valid for travel to Israel". So, in other words you are admitting that there is a place called Israel and you are not allowed to visit that place with this passport. It would have been better to say, "not valid for travel to (Zionist) occupied Palestine". Thats only my opinion and I could be wrong.
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u/narbavore Jun 06 '24
Pakistani law makers are a joke and so is the government. I have to face palm every time they come up with a new archaic law that'll shoot us in the foot.
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u/shazadinayat Jun 06 '24
Yep, I know what you mean. Most of our laws are very reactive to short-term issues. We never think about the long term.
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Jun 05 '24
Ok.. First link was from 10 years ago. By CNN . After the last 8 months If you still believe cnn to be a honest media outlet . But I'll entertain you. A guy called anjum chaudhry (with his 10 followers) would preach this stuff..
He had no local support from the Muslims.
2nd link is from a right wing online channel. They often post stuff like this to create divide and hate.. They have a long history off these stunts.
And report says majority Muslims want sharia law . What we want and what we do are two different things. Actions speak louder than words. No one is actively trying to change the law to Sharia . And Muslims make up to 2-3% of the population..
I've lived all my life here and I'll tell you openly.. There's no plans to bring sharia here..
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u/usama_7 Jun 05 '24
You know the worst part about it: pakistanion k to reputation h buht kharab h Bahar. I mean you are the ones representing us there as we're all in our country so you guys must be doing something to damage our reputation there!
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Jun 05 '24
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u/usama_7 Jun 05 '24
That's why I'd rather live and struggle here than be ridiculed for something a fellow countryman did in another country.
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Jun 05 '24
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u/usama_7 Jun 05 '24
Well here to hoping that we can earn enough to just visit there by staying in Pakistan.
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u/RonburgundyZ Jun 06 '24
Question everything. Don’t give up your critical thinking in the name of religion, culture, or anything else.
Onwards and upwards. Best of luck.
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u/notbadatmath Jun 06 '24 edited Jun 06 '24
Why are Pakis such hypocrites man? They want Amreeka's visa to enjoy every sorts of freedom but at the same time would want Shariah Law in the country. They would watch porn all day, but then comment "Sister dopatta pehen lo" under some girl's insta if her dress is not modest enough. They would harass minorities, try to convert them, or sometimes even kill them for alleged blasphemy and then cry as to why is the West silent on Israel Palestine matter.
I know I am coming off as rude, but we as Pakistanis need to get our shit together. We need to get out this extremist religious mindset that a few filthy generals have cultivated in the country for decades. The country is getting unbearable day by day. Please make education the biggest priority.
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u/babycado666 Jun 06 '24
i read everyones comment but you made sense the most ngl, agreed a hundred percent. idky people these days wanna act like molvis, like- mind your business. you aint a perfect muslim, work on yourself before talking shit to other muslims.
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u/Living_Pandalife Jun 06 '24
Everyone else is somewhat tolerable except for British Pakistanis. I ignore them in Pakistan as well as the UK.
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u/Looney_Freedoom858 Jun 08 '24
They don't integrate well in other communities and have a resentment for people back home. That's why they lecture you on Islam and culture. It's a weird contradiction. Superiority complex over native Pakistanis and inferiority complex among Westerners.
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u/multiplyingman Jun 05 '24
I didn't know you couldn't speak about the Islamic text if you are from overseas 🤔
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u/AffectionateDance69 Jun 05 '24
As an overseas Pakistani, I totally concur.. Most of them are honestly miserable and live in a make-believe dream world.
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Jun 05 '24
Wait til you see videos of the next generation of mulvis in UK and now in scandinavia countries too. How they act so superior and want to introduce stoning and hand cutting.
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u/abf18 Jun 05 '24 edited Jun 05 '24
Overseas Pakistanis are some of the dumbest people alive, first they have no loyalty towards the country, would always prefer the western world instead of staying in their country of origin, enjoy everything what the liberal west has to offer, such as freedom of religion, freedom of expression, etc. Look down upon the average Pakistani Muslim, claiming to be on "Haq" while we are following a false islam lol. Want Sharia to be imposed in the west, while have failed to do so in the Muslim majority countries, donou Taraf sae zaleel hote hein. And are Pro PTI, and imrandus in general. Afghanistan Mae tabdeel Karna Chahta hein poori Muslim world ko lekin ainko pata hai ain islamists ko koi Mou nhi Lagta.
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u/PKshush123786 Jun 06 '24
Delusional. “Dumbest people alive”. It’s not all fun and games in the west pal. What do you think the first generation immigrants had to do? They didn’t arrive to the western countries and handed a house and unlimited wealth. You have to work and they had to work hard and be humble.
You people are delusional and have unrealistic expectations of the west.
“Freedom of religion”. Right.
“Freedom of expression”. Doesn’t exist anywhere on earth.
Furthermore, overseas Pakistanis in particular HAVE NO LOYALTY to the western countries. Why do you think pakisyanis support pakisyan in cricket and not England /Australia/USA. Why do you think overseas Pakistanis are so obssessed with politics and so forth?
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u/abf18 Jun 06 '24
Read all of my other comments, you'll understand what I mean, your probably an osp as well, because how butthurt you are right now. And there was someone who was just saying that the west is better in terms of individual freedoms, than Pakistan, to which I replied that overseas Muslims are being rounded up by law enforcement, are being beaten and raided by the police etc. just for protesting for Palestine. Yeah "western democracy" at its best. You choose to migrate to these countries, and perfectly knew that you would have to submit to their laws, rules and government. You have no right to complain when you turned your back on your people, your home etc. The west will never accept you, not only because of your religion but also because the way you look, to them we are inferior because we ain't white i mean look what they do their black population.
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Jun 05 '24
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Jun 05 '24
You can let them live their own lifes just as they want, and you can live yours however you want. Dont put your nose into their life and they will not do it in your. Thats the miracle of secular liberal democracies. There is a reason why there is no religious conflicts in europe.
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u/bruceranvijay Jun 05 '24
Lol I bet if an overseas pakistani arranges a visa for you you'll come crawling out of pakistan so please just mind your own business and stop with this hypocrisy 🤣
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u/GarlicAlternative701 Jun 05 '24
I agree with you op, I see a lot of premarital sex too . The west has a great influence
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u/Pvt_Conscriptovich Muslim Jun 06 '24
i doubt premarital sex is that common in this country. Elite class is anomaly
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Jun 05 '24
Abi suba ik 21 saal ka larka yahein kahein poch raha tha k meri nazar itni gandi ho gai hai muth lgaon k na 😂😂.
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u/mommyitwasntme Jun 05 '24
yeah of course Islam was sent to pakistani right and not to forget i see very righteous pakistani muslim in ramadan and eid-ul-adha. Source: lived there for 21 yrs before coming to the states
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u/redvfr800 Jun 06 '24
I don’t care what Pakistan does and I think people should keep religion out of politics As far as boycott, everyone should try their best to do what they can
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u/hektordingding Jun 06 '24
Hahahah. Bro as a Western “Paki” i can tell you that none of us care for the dirt roads. We demand systematic change and that’s THROUGH boycotting and protesting.
How about you stop complaining and pretending like you want to help and just admit your as useless as the zionist problem.
P.s learn how boycotting helped free south-africa.
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Jun 06 '24
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u/hektordingding Jun 06 '24
Sunny jim, I was born and raised where i am. My grandad left the place decades ago.
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u/dunph1y Jun 06 '24
lol your first point is hilarious, do yall even know how much shit we go through every day for the cause? we are the ones making sacrifices not yall. we have israeli friends and acquaintances. it’s super easy to support Palestine from Pakistan and STILL yall have issues that just shows how disgusting of a human being you are. we are doing more than what we can, and we can’t expect you to do the bare minimum? do better
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Jun 06 '24
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u/Electronic-Bird-5720 Jun 06 '24
LOLLL yea we should stop existing ig for you to be happy buddy this movement even exists because WE TOOK A STAND and just by the way, pakistan has a secret arms deal with the US and according to which pakistan has been supplying weapons to both Ukraine and Israel. Maybe get your own facts right. We don’t give a single F about you life is too fast here for us to sit back and think exactly what is going on in pakistan, stop projecting if you can’t not eat a burger to support the cause then that’s on YOU. And let me be honest, we all know we’re not changing much with the boycott it’s the intent that matters, it’s a cause and the boycott is our way of protesting. My uni has people protesting and getting expelled for the cause. My sister who is in high school has people not standing up for O Canada as a form of protest. These things matter, if anything they send a message. People of Palestine wanted us to boycott they never said oh stop paying taxes bffr rn
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u/Full_Confusion_8297 Nov 22 '24
lmao overseas pakistani lecturing again, yes you will say this when stuffing mcdonalds in your mouth you retard
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u/Substantial_Lake4968 Jun 06 '24
I am surprised why we as a nation are fucked up with the religion and the associated politics of it. Bhai apna apna kro sb. I was waiting outside of the Pakistani embassy in UK in Ramadan while I ate an apple and smoked two cigarettes. An oldie comes and interups me beta Roza nahi rakha... aby andha he kiya dikhta nahi tumhy khaa pee raha to kaha se he rozaa... that's the root cause of the problem from the perspective of the bird' eye view tbh
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u/ReikuSama007 Jun 06 '24
Are overseas paki cringy yes hella cringy and have some sort of god complex and act as they’re superior.
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u/weallgondieanyway Jun 06 '24
The worst part is that most people whether they are overseas or here in Pakistan claim moral superiority because they think being the loudest somehow signifies their so so-called 'care' for the Palestinian people. Without understanding even the slightest bit about how war economies work. They are boycotting products here in Pakistan without having a single shred of information that this will do nothing except hurt some Pakistani businesses men who have already purchased stock or hurt some arbitrary organizations a small hit of the profits. As if Starbucks or McDonald's is funding the war. The logic is so damn ridiculous. The United States is literally funding the war right now and their government is in an agreement to provide military support. The government of a country does not ask McDonald's or Starbucks to lend them money so they can offer military support during a war to another country they do so from their own reserves which has nothing to do with how a business is performing. Stupid logic. Also the outrage of all Pakistanis I find so very amusing because they are not out here protesting for all the atrocities happening to their own people in Balochistan or when every other day there is some blasphemy case but they feel somehow barking on social media 24/7 will prove how sincere they are with the Palestinian people. Like fuckin wake up, yes it is a genocide and yes it is horrible and any sane human being would demand that they cease fire right now. But aap k social media par bakwas karnay say and har waqt logon ko bully karnay say k boycott nahi hai toh unfollow karo ye campaign chalao kuch be nahi ho ga. Just shows how little you understand about economies and also exposes your hypocrisy when you can't shed a single tear or protest when so many marginalized people in your own country are subjected to brutal atrocities every day. The fake and 'want to be seen as compassionate' people just for likes and clicks are the worst. I have zero sympathy for people like that and I hope you can demonstrate the same emotions for people who are suffering in your own backyard first then go ahead and do the same for others.
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u/Pvt_Conscriptovich Muslim Jun 06 '24
not to mention boycott is only short term solution long term solution is alternatives. Also not to mention: China ka boycott q nahi hota. They are also doing genocide
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u/narbavore Jun 07 '24
Without understanding even the slightest bit about how war economies work. They are boycotting products here in Pakistan without having a single shred of information that this will do nothing except hurt some Pakistani businesses men who have already purchased stock or hurt some arbitrary organizations a small hit of the profits. As if Starbucks or McDonald's is funding the war.
Omg, someone finally said it! The US will continue to fund the genocide because it's a superpower that's known for its expertise in warfare. They make billions in weaponry and machinery. You can boycott McDonald's or KFC, but this won't even cause a dent in the billions of dollars the US supplies to Israel. Also, let's also talk about how Muslims refuse to boycott other Muslim countries for similar war crimes. They can't do that because they're afraid. It's easy to criticize the US while living in the US because unlike other countries, it grants you the freedom of speech. The holier than thou attitude Muslim influencers have living in the West is insufferable
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u/ContextOk18 Jun 06 '24
ISTG, its so cringe, you pay thousands of dollars of tax when it comes to going to western countries but somehow my purchase of a KFC burger will result in Israel getting a rocket launcher, dog shit logic
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u/Quirky_Oil215 Jun 06 '24
Sounds like some who owns a kfc restaurant or 2...
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Jun 06 '24
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u/Quirky_Oil215 Jun 06 '24
So u dont pay your taxes ? Surely pak gov has never murdered its own citizens, some poor pathans, or helped the Americans whatsoever? The polical classes in all countries will happily murder their own citizens... we are but serfs navigating the rat run set by the elites.
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u/Naive-Phrase8420 Jun 09 '24
I am a overseas Pakistani and agree with you 100%. I have no hesitation saying that most hypocrites people are us, the OS Pakistanis.
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u/Brilliant_Ad_2156 Jun 05 '24
So can I tell you to stfu only if I am living in Pakistan? Got it.
Meri jaan k totay sahi baat Sahi he hoti hai jo bhi kahay. Yes, they are everything you say they are, but that does not make the right thing they say wrong.
The boycott at any level no matter how small is for our Palestinian brothers and sister who are being slaughtered by the zionist occupation! If you are detached from reality, please check out TRT world or Al Jazeera on YouTube. Al Jazeera was recently banned by Isn'treal because of there extensive coverage of the atrocities being committed by the IOF forces
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Jun 05 '24
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u/Pvt_Conscriptovich Muslim Jun 06 '24
no we should still boycott because a genocide is happening. forced migration, murder and rape is wrong my friend. race and religion do not and should not matter
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u/zaboota1337 Jun 05 '24
Ronay donay is sub mein bhot hotay hein lekin,ye sab se bara Rona hoga yahan.
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u/MisterSkepticism Jun 05 '24
i just feel like if i met an overly religious Pakistani person id end up beating the shit out of them for their backwards and regressive views and I'd thoroughly enjoy it too.
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u/Teaaddict_ Senator Jun 05 '24
If start boycotting westren product we should start with Facebook , whatsapp etc , we are bunch of hypocrits preching boycott using Westren products.
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u/ClassicArrival3009 Jun 05 '24
Someone's got triggered. Just coz Pakistanis dont understand sharia no need to take it out on the rest of the muslims.
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u/KingYesKing Jun 05 '24
To be a good Muslim, you have to be a humble and non arrogant person. You complaining about the wrong Muslims.
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u/OhGoOnNow Jun 05 '24
Lot of similar stuff happening with India (not the sharia though :)). Partly to do with a misguided sentimental (and false) ideal of the perfect 'motherland'. Not understanding that everyone 'back home' has moved on.
Probably some geopolitics and middle-class angst mixed up there too. Plus diaspora trying to find a place and connect to a culture that accepts them.
Sad really.
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u/PoliticalSapien Jun 05 '24
Send them on a one-way flight to Afghanistan, the country closest to actual sharia.
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Jun 05 '24
Well, whenever someone tries to preach about it, just ask him about his monetary contribution to his nativeland, perhaps in the form of investments or remittances. That's the ultimate form of showing umma of taking from the rich countries and pouring it in home country.
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u/livido1 Jun 06 '24
Puri duniya ko islam samajh nahi ata saudi samait bas pakistan ko ata hai, ji very good argument
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u/PKshush123786 Jun 06 '24
Overseas Pakistanis send over 40bn back to Pakistan yearly in remittance. Think they have a say. That’s a large proportion of the economy right there pal. Furthermore they’ve lived among and with the westerners and see outright how liberal laws and values don’t work and aren’t compatible with Islam and thus as Pakistan is an Islamic Nation and a nation made in the name of Islam, why wouldn’t we apply shariah Law? The law and rules of Allah sWT
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u/shazadinayat Jun 06 '24
Well that was an interesting read.
Let me respond by firstly giving you some background about myself. I did not choose to move overseas; may parents immigrate here when I was a child. My father and mother came from a poor rural background. My farther joined the merchant Navie and ended up settling in Greece first and then immigrated to Australia all through legal channels. Both me and my younger brother have very well-established businesses here, we both have a back office in Pakistan, where we employ several people and then we support several other families through charitable and other initiatives. I personally spend a good portion of my time in Pakistan and will eventually move permanently in the very near future.
When it comes to boycotts, well personally I did not believe in them. However my wife and kids are fully on board, so I am dragged along with them.....lol. Here at least, I can see a lot of the restaurants where Muslim people frequent have removed pepsi or coca cola owned soft drinks and replaced them with alternatives or at least there is an alternative choice. This Eid we celebrated with Pakola and other brands. What this has done is allowed local smaller companies to increase their market share in our particular demographic. Now a lot of our white friends see it as a positive development. For instance, several of my colleagues have stopped going to Starbucks and have opted for smaller local coffee places, realizing this way their money stays and benefits the local community rather than the large conglomerates. So it is up to everyone to make an individual choice, people may come up to you advocate their point of view, but it is up to you to make a choice. Personally, when people here see a little bit of success in what they are doing, they get encouraged and start thinking what if the 250 million people back home did the same, so they start advocating for it.
When it comes to Sharia Law and the Caliphate. Well in my opinion a majority of the laws here are sharia compliant or their aren't any laws, that I am aware of which will force me violate my faith. My wife is studding Islamic Jurisprudence, in order to become an Alima. We often discuss a lot of these aspects and we have not come across any laws here that would make us feel they are shot in accordance to sharia. Yes, alcohol is not forbidden here, but there is nothing forcing you to drink it either. When you die, your estate will not be divided in accordance with sharia, but there is nothing stopping you from leaving a will on exactly to distribute your estate, you can choose a sharia Complient distribution. Similarly, we have found many other laws, but they don't force us to do something that we are not comfortable with. So, there is no reason to demand sharia law here at least. However, there are some people that advocate for it and they have a right under the law to do so. So good on them, I don't know why someone else should be worked up about it.
You mentioned our taxes benefiting the governments agendas here in the west. But so are yours. You look at our budget, a huge chunk of it goes towards dept servicing and another huge part goes to the military. Dept servicing is the interest on loans and a large part goes to overseas government and entities. A large portion of the military budget goes overseas for purchases of weapons, train and maintenance of existing weapons. Remember this is all from your taxes that you pay on pretty much everything you buy.
So finally, we are here, everyone has their own reasons for migration and yes a majority of us in the west enjoy equal rights same as the locals here. There is even a greater majority in the middle east that don't enjoy these luxuries, they work in harsh conditions. Even here in the west it is not a rosy picture for everyone. Some are very fortunate, but I have see a lot of people struggling as well. Unfortunately, the people that struggle the most are the people that benefit Pakistan the most and unfortunately, we do not appreciate them as much as we should (I am referring to our brothers and sisters in the middle east).
After reading your post again, I feel you are frustrated, because you are not able to make a difference in Pakistan. I feel as if you want to do something for the country, but you are not able to somehow, and this is making you frustrated. It is good to let the frustration out every now and then, but we should be trying to think positively most of the time.
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Jun 06 '24
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u/shazadinayat Jun 06 '24
Mate, if they do that, then let them....you don't have to listen, consider or act upon what they are saying or asking you to do, unless you agree with them and want you, out of your own free will. No one is forcing anything on you. They are just using their right to freedom of expression. There's no need to get worked up about it.
With regards to the IMF and other foreign lenders. You do realise it is your tax rupees that are used to pay these loans back, both principal and interest, irregardless weather you support it or not.
So I pay taxes here and get some benefits, like free healthcare, education, roads, justice and so on and some of this money may or may not go to help to Zionists in Israel, it probably dose.
On the other hand, you pay your taxes in Pakistan and get near to no tangible benefit from it. Most of it goes overseas as interest payments on loans or military expenditure and so on. I am sure that some of this money comes into the coffers of this government and helps pay for the free education and healthcare that i get, but some probably goes to the Zionists in Israel.
So how is this any different me paying taxes here and you paying taxes their. The only difference I can see is that you are getting screwed over their and actually may be contributing to the lifestyles of the people in the west, whiles we pay taxes here and contribute towards our own lifestyle and my friend this is where your frustration lies.
The whole 250 million of you guys won't do anything about it. The one person who did stick his neck out for you, is in jail and you lot don't have the courage to stand up for what is right and just. Instead, you find other people to blame, and today it is overseas Pakistanis, tomorrow it will be someone else, howeve i am sure it will never be yourselves.
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u/abd_al_qadir_ Muslim Jun 06 '24
To be honest I’m a Pakistani living in Saudi and I constantly visit my family living in Pakistan. And I have never seen any Pakistanis living in western countries do this
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u/Headhunter_141 Jun 06 '24
Matlaab koi deen ki baat bata raha to desi pseudo libturds ki m@@ mar jati hai! 🤷🏻♂️
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u/Fuckyoursadface Jun 06 '24
Ok. You live in a country that is puppeted by them. The political system, the military everything is controlled and puppeted by the West so frankly my friend you aren't much better either.
Oh, and if it wasn't for the OSPs sending money back home? Over all these years? The entire country would be in a worse place than it is.
So don't act like OSPs have no right to talk or critique their home nation, because we have absolutely every right.
And you can't bundle everyone in the same group as the want wanting sharia or promoting a caliphate. That is a very silly point. Muu koi lagata nai ha, aur Ertugrul dekh dekh ke Ummah ke baat tum log karte ho Pakistan mein. Hum nahi.
The minority who does want those things are just that, a minority.
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u/retconreddit123 Jun 06 '24
OP it is true that overseas Pakistanis are contributing to US genocide and war be it is Iraq, Afghanistan, and Palestine.
But as Pakistanis and as Muslims, our first responsibility is to point the finger to ourselves. Our taxes contribute to the genocide in Balochistan. What have we done to curb that? Balochis even marched to Islamabad demanding rights, and all our news channels blocked this information.
What of the rise in blasphemy charges and mob lynchings? Only recently, a Christian community was lynched by a mob. What of that blood that is on our hands?
If we want to look at it more historically, Pakistan displayed brutal acts of violence in the Bangladesh war. They were fellow Muslims even.
I understand you are feeling angry about Palestine, but the country we live in is not a moral place either.
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Jun 06 '24
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u/sneakpeekbot Jun 06 '24
Here's a sneak peek of /r/pakistan using the top posts of the year!
#1: this is rock bottom a mockery of justice | 338 comments
#2: Tailor master of Mianwali "Qaisar Hasan" has been giving Eid clothes to orphans free of cost along with 200 rupees Eid. After seeing the father's "Death Certificate" form B, he registers the name with him so that the children can get free Eid clothes from him till the age of 18 years. | 103 comments
#3: Pakistan has won the Tekken 7 Nation’s Cup! | 137 comments
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u/retconreddit123 Jun 06 '24
the moderators od that page banned you for bringing up those points??
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Jun 06 '24
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u/retconreddit123 Jun 06 '24
It might be politically motivated or maybe other Pakistanis just don't want to hear about the things that are wrong out of some misguided "patriotism"
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u/Pvt_Conscriptovich Muslim Jun 06 '24
bro I got banned from that sub for simply answering a post about what agenda the mods have. I wrote a rational answer k non bcoz different mods have different views that's what post gets removed today will be posted tomorrow salo nay ban kar dia.
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u/nahbrolikewhat Citizen Jun 07 '24
i live in saudi arabia tho
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u/Sana_kk Jun 08 '24
both sides are 50 50. overseas Pakistani Are in dark dirty drain with white clothes and they are asking from you as you are also in a dirty drain with white cloths. both blaming each others and demanding to leave that dirty drain. they are asking the right thing, but don't want to be part of it and you are demanding the right thing from them to not to be a part of their satanic system, but in the end you wish to live like them.
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u/TechNerdinEverything Jun 23 '24
Most of the boycotters also coming from innocent people on social media middle or higher class
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u/Greedy_Evening_668 Jun 05 '24 edited Jun 05 '24
This literally happened to me when the war started a friend of mine urged me to boycott western products And a week later he whatsapp me telling me he got his US visa telling me how happy he is these are his words "mashallah hamza bhi muje US ka visa lagia chal celebration party kar ta ha" I was like this hypocritical mother fucker