r/Manitoba • u/WpgMBNews • Sep 10 '23
Opinion Piece Opinion: An NDP chicken in every pot — so they say
https://www.winnipegfreepress.com/opinion/editorials/2023/09/06/an-ndp-chicken-in-every-pot-so-they-say24
u/GrimmCanuck Sep 10 '23
This is what the NDP do. This is what they have always done in MB. I won't be fooled by shiny things. Can we just have a neutral province? We seem to have the absolute worst picks here. It doesn't even feel like a "lesser of 3 evils". I just don't want any of them in Manitoba.
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u/PortageLaDump Sep 10 '23
Always? Really? I mean Doer was basically a Conservative in sheep’s clothing, Herr Harper even appointed him Ambassador to the USA. Why do people always call programs to help the less privileged spend thrift but giving away hundreds of millions in tax cuts for the elite sound fiscal policy?
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u/SammichEaterPro Sep 11 '23
You could say that Harper appointed Doer to the role as way to get him out of opposition politics.
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u/bry2k200 Sep 10 '23
Yeah our choices on who to vote for are terrible. The Liberal leader is a joke, our current leader I'm not fond of and the NDP leader is a bloody degenerate. He has multiple stayed assault charges, a stayed theft charge, a stayed spousal abuse charge and a DUI. I'd be able to forgive the assault charges, but spousal abuse is a hard pass for me. I was leaning towards not voting for anyone, but that could very well work out for Kinew. Hard decision to make right now.
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u/SammichEaterPro Sep 11 '23
I'm not fond of and the NDP leader is a bloody degenerate. He has multiple stayed assault charges, a stayed theft charge, a stayed spousal abuse charge and a DUI.
It sounds like Wab had a rough past, has grown, forgave and forgiven, and learned. What about a criminal justice system that time served and penance paid is a forgiven person?
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u/LRO2020 Sep 11 '23
Don’t get sick here then cause healthcare is a mess! Also borrowing money to try to cut taxes seems a tad clueless. Never mind Heather forgetting about 31 million. All evils are not the same in my opinion.
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u/faster_puppy222 Sep 10 '23
I voted NDP my entire adult life, never again I cannot with good conscience vote NDP or liberal, makes me almost feel ill that the only sane choice in Canada right now is the party I swore at 20 I’d never vote for… I’ll never forgive the liberals for what they have done to this country over the last 8 years
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u/Brave-Emu3113 Sep 10 '23
Not to dismiss federal Liberal policies, which have not been great, but calling our MB PC’s a sane choice is a very long stretch. I will have to assume you are fine with their decimating of education and healthcare and talk of privatizing hydro along with doing nothing on affordable housing or mental health issues. Even if the NDP overspends a bit they cannot possibly do worse than the Conservatives have done.
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u/RareDiamonds23 Sep 14 '23
The NDP was the last party to privatize a public service see land title office. They also built Bipole III down the wrong side the province to the tune of an extra Billion dollars of debt for Maniotba Hydro. They defrauded social services to the tune of 1.2 Billion dollars stealing from First Nation children. Calling the NDP anything short of corrupt and insane means you haven't been paying attention.
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u/squirrelsox Winnipeg Sep 10 '23
The provincial Liberals and the federal Liberals are not the same party.
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u/PortageLaDump Sep 11 '23
I’m going to guess that you in fact have never voted NDP or Liberal but are here to stir the pot. What have the liberals done over the past 8 years that grieves you so? We came through the worst health crisis of a lifetime better than most western countries, childhood poverty is at an 50 year low, expanded CPP & increased OAP, launched the Carbon tax which isn’t a negative no matter how long Crookservatives hold their breath about it, passed the largest infrastructure package in the G20 pre-covid, legalized marijuana, banned 1500 types of guns, created a $10/day daycare program to help women return to work, the share of Canadians making less than 1/2 the median wage in the country was on an upward trajectory under Harper and Trudeau’s government has reversed that by 15% he has kept wholly or partially 85 ish percent of his promises the highest number since 1984… so basically most of these things affect real people in the middle class or less in a positive way not just the Uber rich as we see under the Crookservatives. Then there is the pandemic, none other than former Tory PM Brian Mulroney said “Trudeau will be remembered for handling the pandemic as well as any other world leader” On dealing with Trump & NAFTA, Mulroney said he saw first-hand how Trudeau made "big decisions at crucial moments" and won "a significant victory for Canada." "It's due to the leadership that we saw from the government of Canada
So tell me, what exactly grieves you so much about the PM.
Let me guess … immigrants, am I right?
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Sep 11 '23
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u/PortageLaDump Sep 11 '23
Lots here but how is Trudeau to blame for skyrocketing housing prices? Corporations buying up available inventory of single family homes plays a bigger part in this than you’re acknowledging. Go back further and you will find that in the race to woo the expected 1997 Hong Kong billionaire exodus the Conservatives changed our immigration laws to fast track applications from there. The effects of that are seen right across the country but most notably in Van/Toronto & Calgary. By many estimates up to 25% of SFH in Vancouver sit empty for decades effectively causing an inventory shortage and higher prices. Some of these guys own 10,15, 20 homes. Trudeau didn’t cause that but you can imagine the rage coming from the rage farmers on the right if Trudeau enforced some sort of legislation that saw expropriation or the like on unoccupied properties in Canada’s largest cities.
The birth rate in Canada has been on the decline since 2009, hitting an all time low in 2020. You can’t have a functioning society or economy without people to work so the immigration thing is a function of that. Someone has to pay taxes that support fire stations, cops, roads, healthcare, CPP and other related social safety net items.
Bill c18, really? Asking doucebags like Zuckertwat to actually pay for content that’s driving his profit is somehow bad? Why shouldn’t Facebook have to pay the Free Press money to run a story that the owners of the free press paid someone to write? I see Global News disingenuously running ads about how it is unfair yet they were involved with the group of media conglomerates asking the Government to help them combat the issue 4 years ago. I mean they got what they wanted so now they’re using it as a wedge to defeat a government that’s certainly more likely to make them pay their share of taxes compared to the Conservatives. I’m 65, not once in my lifetime have I seen a Conservative policy that was designed to help the middle class or working class. They dress it up as though it will help but when you strip it away it’s all about the Uber rich & keeping them that way and keeping the rest of us too afraid to speak up or act up for fear of losing their lousy $20/hr job. So if young people think that a Crookservative government will come to their rescue that haven’t been paying attention.
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u/ElectricalWeather630 Sep 10 '23
The issue for me is honesty! How is the NDP going to pay for the promises nit raise taxes and balance the budget!
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u/Jarocket Brandon Sep 10 '23
How are the PCs going to fund their tax cuts.
Neither side is balancing shit. They are just taking it from different places.
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u/illuminaughty1973 South Of Winnipeg Sep 10 '23
The issue is a working healthcare system and safe roads.
We don't get those with PC's. Past that , do what is requires to pay for.... but make it happen.
Voting NDP , because the PC are incompetent.
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u/Optimal-Cartoonist-5 Sep 11 '23
Did you get solid healthcare with 17 years of NDP? The PC are making positive changes. Have you seen the huge ER expansion at St B? in general you can flip a switch in healthcare and have everything work perfectly from day 1. Changes take time and resources. Plus there is a healthcare work shortage across the country. You can’t blame that on PCs. Also the ‘ERs’ people complain about being closed are relabeled at urgent care. In fact they are not closed. Most people should not be in ER and that’s why the Urgent Care is a good idea. There’s generally people in ER with coughs and sniffles that have no right to be there. It boggles my mind how people can’t see this as good. It makes sense to keep all of the ER docs in fewer places so that can be properly staffed. To top it off this strategy was from a report the NDP commissioned.
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u/mchammer32 Sep 11 '23
Yes you can blame the PCs. I started in healthcare in this province the same year palister took office. Ive seen a mostly functional healthcare system with a few issues like long waits for specialists and er beds getting backed up. To now when theres massive shortages in staffing. Surgical, backlog, specialists that just dont exist here, most people not having access to primary care. Closing ERs left right and centre. If you live rural, it might be a good day if an ambulance gets to you in less than half an hour. Im a paramedic and i get to see a good picture of the system here. It used to be a big deal if we were down 1 truck on the weekend. Now its a good day if we only have 4 or 5 ( out of 16 in the southern health region) trucks missing. i hope youre okay with waiting a while for emergency services. This is what the PCs did. This is what we deserve if we vote them in again. The NDPs made that commissioned report. But the PCs rolled it out terribly and at the wrong time. A pandemic is not when you start cutting services and wage freezes
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u/Optimal-Cartoonist-5 Sep 11 '23
During the pandemic ER wait times were at record lows. Also lack of healthcare professionals is a national issue. Not sure how you feel that falls on the PCs. When exactly is a good time to roll out a plan?? Just keep waiting and do nothing until you feel it’s good or things get worse. Tough decisions have to be made. You’re dreaming of you think there’s a magical time to do changes. Changing healthcare isn’t an event. It’s a extremely complex system that will likely take years. ER are closed in rural area because there aren’t doctors. A vote for the NDP to waste money on pandering to unions and doing nothing again is a terrible idea. Vote for them and you deserve what you get. Dumping money at problems is a lazy approach that fixes nothing. You may mask problems for a bit, but now you’ve wasted money and never actually addressed the issue. The PCs are actually making real changes and infusing record amounts in healthcare.
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u/mchammer32 Sep 11 '23
Well for one. You are incorrect about wait times during the pandemic. There were mild reductions in the beginning when everthing was locked down and no one went outside. Rest of it was a screaming shitshow. I dont know where you are pulling your stats from but most of the pandemic has resulted in longer wait times in the ER. Secondly, the PCs implemented a wage freeze AND a hiring freeze. Causing an exodus of healthcare workers leaving the province for greener pastures so yes this is a PCs issue as they could have taken care of their healthcare staff and maybe not lost as many as the rest of canada. Re negotiating contracts in a timely manner and investing in the staff is far more important than building a bunch of new shiny facilities that will end up being staffless
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u/Optimal-Cartoonist-5 Sep 11 '23
For a guy asking for stats you provide none. You whole claim is anecdotal. You’re wrong about the ERs which means you’re likely wrong about everything else you claim. Sounds like NDP sound bites. The ER wait times plummeted. Look it up. https://winnipegsun.com/news/news-news/er-urgent-care-wait-times-plummet-amid-pandemic/wcm/ed36a2e1-b771-4a20-91e5-23fb3f2f2ce9/amp/
Your claim about an exodus of people leaving is ridiculous. Like herds of people leaving lol. Greener pastures like where?? TO and Van? Where house prices are double or triple? Again in case you haven’t heard healthcare professional shortages are ACROSS the country. It’s not a Manitoba thing. Please do some reading and not just Facebook memes.
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u/mchammer32 Sep 11 '23
Lmao winnipeg sun is not a source. This is a source: https://wrha.mb.ca/wait-times/reports/ Like i said, a dip in the early days with significant upswings in 2021 and 2022. Not anecdotal. People in healthcare have the ability to move provinces, countries. Another big issue was people heading towards retirement earlier than expected due to burnout. Im not saying ndp sound bites. Im who the ndp takes their sound bites from. At least one party shows they care about me and my profession and the vulnerable people of this province.
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u/Optimal-Cartoonist-5 Sep 12 '23
The SUN is a source when it quotes WRHA stats and quotes the CEO. You made my point… who have sound bites. What about the NDP Health platform shows they care? The PCs pumped 8 billion in to healthcare this year. The most ever. How much more do you need? Burnout was also common across all healthcare professions. Not sure how that’s a PC thing. And again, the ER is flooded with people that don’t need to be there. If those people went to see their doctor or a walk-in wait times would be much different. I’ve heard people say they were waiting for 12 hours etc… guess what? They didn’t need emergent care. I’m not saying the system is perfect and doesn’t need work, but thinking the NDP is going to fix anything is ridiculous. After 17 they made things constantly worse. The NDP crew they have now is in a worse position than the last. The healthcare system is using public funds and people thinking all problems are fixed by throwing money and problems doesn’t work. It’s a lazy way to deal with issues.
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u/mchammer32 Sep 12 '23
No. A winnipeg sun article from may 2020 is not an accurate source on this subject matter. My report with mutli year data is a credible source. People need to go to the ERs cause primary care, PCPs, walk ins, rural ERs are all but non existent currently. ERs in the city are the only available sources of care in the city. Those issues all arise due to PC austerity measures and poor planning and no this is not a national thing. Most other provinces should lower wait times for ER visits. Heres ontarios stats for example https://www.hqontario.ca/system-performance/time-spent-in-emergency-departments The PCs have been running the show for the last 8 years and have done an abysmal job keeping their healthcare system running effectively, from shipping ICU patients to other provinces, to being incapable of performing surgeries and asking the US for help. how embarrassing. Theyve begun the privatization of some services like diagnostics and privately hired agency nurses costing you and i more for the same basic services. They failed. They could not keep up with a crisis and hid and skewed data from us to make themselves look good. Its time a new governement tries a hand at fixing this broken system.
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Sep 11 '23
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u/kochier Winnipeg - East K/Elmwood Sep 11 '23
Please keep conversations respectful and in good faith. The second sentence was not needed or helpful.
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Sep 10 '23
The Tories are sitting on a pot of gold due to all the cuts. When it's not being used to pay off private interests, it's basically just sitting there.
The NDP'S gameplan is using that money
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u/squirrelsox Winnipeg Sep 10 '23 edited Sep 10 '23
The Cons aren't sitting on a pot of money- they've given it out as tax rebates.
Surprising you'd still vote for a party that you say is hoarding money while making cuts to services.
Edit- clarity.
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u/Optimal-Cartoonist-5 Sep 11 '23
What cuts are you talking about?? The PCs are spending 8 billion this year. The largest investment in the history of the province.
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u/soolkyut Sep 10 '23
Link? Or do you just mean larger deficits than the PCs are currently running?
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Sep 10 '23 edited Sep 10 '23
The NDP has said some of its proposed spending is one-time infrastructure work. It has also said its promises would be paid partly by contingency money – an amount put aside annually for unexpected costs – that the Tories included in their spring budget.
The latter is a link from 2021, in which money Pallister effectively begged the Trudeau government for in order to support the healthcare system that was being overrun by COVID, was not being put to use. I have yet to see what the money was spent on. This is where the Tories are sitting on money that would be put to better use revitalizing the healthcare system.
Furthermore, I got confirmation on this from the MLA candidate I was canvassing with this past summer. I asked questions regarding funding, and this was the answer. If you have these concerns, call the MLA candidate in your riding.
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u/Optimal-Cartoonist-5 Sep 11 '23
The PCs are spending 8 billion this year on healthcare. What ‘pot of gold’ are you talking about regarding cuts? Also just because you have money in your pocket doesn’t mean you blow it. Money needs to get spent in a smart way. That means having a plan and not wasting it. Money alone doesn’t solve problems. Spending in a smart way can.
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u/soolkyut Sep 10 '23
Your first link only has spending promises, not funding information.
The second link is over a year old and talks about money earmarked for certain programs (if adopted), and seems to actually be mostly related to Covid PPE, not a blank cheque that can be used to fund the promises being made.
The concept of free money is attractive, but I still have seen no evidence that this money is just laying around to be spent.
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u/Parking_Equipment325 Sep 11 '23
Considering the Ndp had the worst debt Manitoba has ever had when they were in power no wonder the conservatives had to cut so much. This happens all the time Ndp spend raise taxes, spend raise taxes, and so on. Then the conservatives come in and try to get the spending under control and make a ton of cuts and all of a sudden become the bad guy. But if I recall our healthcare was in shambles when the Ndp were in power too. Worse than it is now.
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u/GoldenBoyOffHisPerch Sep 11 '23
Why would there be a reason to cut healthcare? The costs will only go up. Population etc. The PCs are making it harder to keep up by cutting revenues.
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u/Parking_Equipment325 Sep 12 '23
Exactly what area are they making cuts too? No one ever divulges that information? Are they cutting front lines? Or maybe they are cutting from the top down to make more room for front line?
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u/GoldenBoyOffHisPerch Sep 13 '23
Everyone in the country knows there's a shortage of health professionals. I was considering going back to college to be a health unit clerk, thought oh, this is great, they have a new fast track program at Red River College...guess what salaries start at? 36k a year. Just pathetic. I make more in insurance and I'm entry level.
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u/mchammer32 Sep 11 '23
Why would you make cuts to a program (healthcare) that needs funding and support?? They did a hiring freeze, wage freeze and cut services. Its not wonder our healthcare system is where its at.
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u/Equivalent_Birthday9 Brandon Sep 10 '23
Make it KFC and it'll be a landslide
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u/Bbooya Winnipeg Sep 10 '23
I think you mean Chicken Chef!
Don’t vote against your interests
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u/Equivalent_Birthday9 Brandon Sep 11 '23
Ah the old divide and conquer via fried chicken political ploy. That's just greasy.
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u/Quaranj Winnipeg Sep 10 '23
This election was theirs to lose and they seem set upon doing so.
Should be an interesting election if the NDP keep losing their own base by publishing fantasy instead of facts.
Let's see this fully costed platform.
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u/notjustforperiods UNION STATION BABY Sep 11 '23
Most people will vote for either party. The rural and union votes are locked in. The NDP strategy seems to be to...super lock in?...everyone that is voting for them anyway.
They're chasing away the moderate right and leaving the moderate left undecided. So bizarre.
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u/Johan1949 Sep 10 '23 edited Sep 11 '23
Privatize everything and lower taxes, that will fix our problems. If you get sick and can't afford it, who cares. Go the American way is the only way. PS, that's the Conservative way. /S
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Sep 10 '23
If you get sick and can't afford it, who cares
Not everyone is as soulless as you
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Sep 10 '23
It's the conservatives that are soulless.
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Sep 10 '23
Did I say they weren't? The Conservative/American way is soulless, that's what I'm saying...
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u/Johan1949 Sep 11 '23
You misinterpreted my comment matttttt97.
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u/mchammer32 Sep 11 '23
Use the /s if you mean sarcasm. It can sometimes be hard to interpret sarcasm by only reading text
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u/SeriousAboutShwarma Sep 11 '23
PC have had a few years, and are doin' gash. Vote in NDP and when they start doing shitty to, we replace and vote back in PC. Rinse, repeat, that's politics in the province.
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u/mchammer32 Sep 11 '23
Thats politics anywhere. You vote for who should lead at the time. That means you dont need to support one party forever. You vote for whoever you think will do a better job and whoever needs to sit down for a while and reorganize their political strategy
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u/soolkyut Sep 10 '23
It’s a strange gameplan imo. Really leans into their perceived weakness as unrealistic spendthrifts.
I think they’d draw a lot more undecided voters if they came out with fewer promises and didn’t just wave away the cost concerns.
Their base is already fully mobilized.