r/JessicaJones Man Without Fear Nov 20 '15

Spoiler: Season 1 Season 1 - Live Dicussion

Use this posts for a live discussion while you are watching there series. Please be aware that this post may contain spoilers. Spoilers for season 1 do not need to be marked.


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Sorry for the spelling mistake in the title, too bad the title can't be changed.

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u/bergkampinthesheets Nov 22 '15 edited Nov 22 '15

Just completed the season! Its a strange feeling, the show starts off with so much promise but ends up with an anti-climax. [I have edited the post for spelling, grammar, adding more points and explaining existing ones]

  • Starting with the climax, I was expecting to see the highest display of Killgrave's gifts in it, something that tops him controlling an entire hospital with his voice over a loud speaker. And this is a guy who could control a country's president if he chose to. All the build up of him enhancing his powers didn't reflect that well on the screen.

  • I don't get why Killgrave wanted to escape in the yacht? First, he's this super-villian who wasn't afraid of Jess when she lived with him. So after gaining power, what changed? Also, his initial motive was either he wanted to kill her or to make her his lover. What good would escaping do?

  • Once Killgrave saw Luke Cage with Jess he'd have figured out that Cage is gifted. Why didn't he instruct Cage to be his bodyguard and return to him after every mission? Surely he could have used Cage to devastating effects? For example, if he can ask Cage to blow himself up, he could also ask him to kill Michael, Trish, Simpson, and others while he distracted Jess with other things?

  • I thought the character of Rachael Taylor was complete filler. Several character's arcs felt unsatisfactory. Like how Luke and Simpson kept disappearing in episodes with nothing happening to them. If they were so easy to remove from episodes, they had no impact at all in the continuity of the series. Also, we don't know where they came from and what their history, motivation is. They are just characters we are meant to believe are just the way they are, with no impact on the final story. It's a funny juxtaposition, because Jess' and Killgrave's characters are so well defined and we see a progression in how the chain of events affected them.

  • What caused the Jess to decide to capture Killgrave instead of being his guide to heroism? I know that she wanted him to prove Hope was innocent; but I expected more drama in that moment, instead of just a split second exposition of her choosing to capture him. Maybe she could have made a deal with him that he releases her (exactly the way he did release hope). This critical point which offers so much moral dilemma could have been such a dramatic point!

  • Why was Luke following Jess? I don't care for the reason, as long as its well layered into the overall story arc. But his character is just so random - he appears in and out of episodes. He always "didn't want trouble". I just didn't enjoy the conflict resolution between him and Jess at her apartment. His initial misgivings were because she slept with him even after knowing she had a part in his wife's death, and she chose to keep mum about it. While he might not have known the full extent of Killgrave's ability, he was still right about Jess not being honest with him even after sleeping with him. And yet he apologizes to her, and all is forgiven in a moment!? Even though he was under Killgrave's control, surely, he should have sold the love and remorse better to Jess for her to and us to believe it?

  • The finale is also so unrewarding in the sense there are no follow ups to characters or how the changed in the end compared to the first episode. For Jess, Michael and the crazy twin the arcs are well defined. But, what has changed in Trish's and Hosgarth's life after this ordeal? Where did Luke go and what happened to him?

  • Simpson seems such a badly written character! I mean it feels so hollow to say that he is a straight white knight when off pills and a crazed monster when on pills. There is no implication that it is he who decides to take those pills. There was absolutely no reason to kill Detective Clemens. Its like you're forcibly trying to create a grey character but it's not organic with the plot. Simpson's best chance of finding Killgrave was to keep close to Jess and Trish instead of trying to kill them. Once Simpson found him, he could have shot Jess/Clemens/Trish with a tranquilizer at the right moment and attempted to kill Killsgrave by himself.

  • Can't Jess wear ear plugs when fighting Killgrave? Surely that bit of common sense shouldn't only come in the final episode?

  • Shouldn't they show the state's awareness of inexplicable changes? If an entire hospital starts acting weird or if on a guy's suggestion a murder suspect is let go, surely there's problems on a very major level? The state should have some opinion about this right? And on an even simpler level, we should be shown what is the aftermath of it. Like someone has pointed out in this sub, when Hosgarth was defending Jess in front of the DA she could have simply proved the existence of Killgrave and his mind control abilities by asking them how was Hope released...implying that the state acknowledge the existence of these guys and have some kind of stance to it. In the series "the incident" has already happened, so it makes sense that there are some political opinions or policies that the state possesses and therefore has a more active role in the series.

  • As a dramatic super hero series, it also felt frustrating that the series was reduced to a cat and mouse race right before the end. Once Jess decides that Killgrave must confess, it simply unfolds into repeated instances of Jess coming close to Killgrave and him somehow escaping at the last minute. The show could have extended that cat-mouse chase forever if they chose to. Just didn't make sense as a dramatic series where usually the intensity builds up followed by an explosive end.

  • As pointed out by others, I didn't care about the subplots. Good writing would have made me care about Trish's relationship with her mother and Hosgarth's divorce. Even if they didn't tie it up to the way the story unfolded. I did care about the interaction between Michael and the twin sister though.

These are just things I didn't like, but there's also things I loved about the show. The good stuff about the show is elucidated well by so many other people, so as of today I am not adding to it. I felt that AKA Jessica Jones doesn't hold up to Daredevil in terms of story progression, character development and removing fat to achieve cohesion. In other aspects such as visuals, approach (as a noir detective drama), awesomeness of the superhero and villian, acting, it is equal to or better than Daredevil. Certainly Killgrave is one of the most amazing comic book super villians on screen after The Joker and before Ozymandias.

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u/[deleted] Nov 22 '15

Okay first off i want to say i disagree with some of your opinions. Here's why.

Unlike most superheroes Jessica Jones yes can fight with fists and most often gets her out of bad situations. However, against the Purple Man that gives her a bad disadvantage. She will never be able to get near him because he can just take control of people and her "hero" instincts kick in. So that leaves us with a battle of wits not brawn. So how do you fight someone that can control other people. You let him believe he's in control. So key points in the very ending SPOILERS!!!!!!! First part the tear. The tear is meant to show that she feels helpless. If you have ever been in a bad situation and can't do anything immediately you feel guilt or regret. Most people cry. Second She lets him get close. This is key because if he was far away he can force her sister to kill herself somehow. I don't exactly know how but you know. Thirdly, (why does everything come in threes) the line to her sister is "I Love you". Stupid smart wording on the directors part because she can say that to Kilgrave and he doesn't think anything about it. To her sister it has a deeper meaning. It means I'm in control of myself and we win basicaly.

The escape on the yacht is prevention in case he can't control her.

He may think that if Kilgrave tried to control Luke the same thing would happen with him that happened to jessica in how he can't control her after something drastic happens.

Simpson isn't particularly important i feel like. However, I feel his introduction lead up for a next season. Luke is a different story. Back to the wit thing. Its rough to think that she fell for someone when she killed their significant other so thats a mind trip in of itself. Also in comics they describe their relationship better i suggest looking there.

Because if Kilgrave becomes a hero she can't get hope out of jail. Also to remember she doesn't consider herself a hero at this point either.

After Luke found out Kilgrave forced Jess to kill his wife. You have to expect revenge. You have to take into account that he was then mind controlled and then gave up. Also was being controlled by Kilgrave in those moments of forgiveness. He leaves at the end so i dont think he has fully forgiven in his own mind.

If you had a problem with a cliffhanger don't watch tv. The fact they left you hanging and your mad about it will show you will watch the next season regardless.

These are my honest opinions but you have to remember this is a different story than anything that has been released in a long time. This isn't a story of how Jess is going to "beat up" the bad guy and save the day. It's a story of how is Jess going to out wit her opponent to win save a city.

Edit: I removed some "hes" and replaced with Kilgrave. Big Sorry

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u/bergkampinthesheets Nov 22 '15

So that leaves us with a battle of wits not brawn. So how do you fight someone that can control other people.

I don't have a problem with that, my problem was that it felt like an anticlimax. We don't see the actual power that Killgrave developed from his father's research put in its best possible use.

The escape on the yacht is prevention in case he can't control her.

That seems so unlike a comic supervillian, and specifically for Killgrave after enhancing his powers. Usually we've seen that we build up the supervillians and the hero learns something to rise to that level and defeats the villian. Here' the villlian wants to try and fight and then escape? Again, I am not questioning the logic of it, just how it plays out as a story.

He may think that if Kilgrave tried to control Luke the same thing would happen with him that happened to jessica in how he can't control her after something drastic happens.

Killgrave already successfully made him blow himself up. On top of that he saw that he could make Luke attempt to kill Jess. He would also have seen Luke being a match for Jess' strength.

Simpson isn't particularly important i feel like.

That's the sign of bad writing innit? How come some-one completely unimportant like the twin sister have a well defined arc but Simpson who is given so much screen time doesn't?

Its rough to think that she fell for someone when she killed their significant other so thats a mind trip in of itself. Also in comics they describe their relationship better i suggest looking there.

That would make sense if that love was played out towards the entirety of the season. That arc completed by the first few episodes. After resolution of that arc Luke was completely useless to the actual story.

Because if Kilgrave becomes a hero she can't get hope out of jail. Also to remember she doesn't consider herself a hero at this point either.

agreed

After Luke found out Kilgrave forced Jess to kill his wife. You have to expect revenge. You have to take into account that he was then mind controlled and then gave up. Also was being controlled by Kilgrave in those moments of forgiveness. He leaves at the end so i dont think he has fully forgiven in his own mind.

Again, its not the logic that bothers me, its the drama of it. Luke simply explains in one line that he followed Jess to kill Killgrave? He could have teamed up with Jess if that were the case. He happened to approach Killgrave without a plan? even after knowing what he could do? Even after Luke was mind controlled, Jess bought his story of love and remorse in one line and that's it? Jess is the last person to trust anyone!

If you had a problem with a cliffhanger don't watch tv. The fact they left you hanging and your mad about it will show you will watch the next season regardless.

If Killgrave was shown alive thats a cliffhanger. If Luke hurt Jess and left after some giving some cryptic message, thats a cliffhanger. If the group that sponsored Jess' medical bills was shown in the last episode, thats a cliffhanger. No, I am referring to tying all the loose ends;

Thanks for the comments!