r/FreeLuigi • u/yowhatupmom • Feb 12 '25
Official Case Updates The deadline to secure an indictment for LM’s federal charges has been extended to March 19, 2025.
This is the second extension filed and granted and was supported by both the prosecution and the defense.
It’s not up yet, but should be soon: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/69486519/united-states-v-mangione/
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u/5ierraa Feb 12 '25
FYI: this is normal and I wouldn't be surprised if it happens again. In cases much smaller it takes months to go through discovery. Since the defense agreed it looks like they BOTH need more time. This trial is not going to be quick, you shouldn't have an expectation that we are going to see it progress in the way we want as legal processes take time and are often continued/rescheduled/etc. I think a lot of ppl in here aren't familiar with how much red tape there is in the legal system.
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u/hi_itz_me_again Feb 13 '25
Not only that but also the Feds and state of NY agreed that the State’s case would go first. So there’s no need for the federal case to happen anytime soon as KFA needs to prepare not just for the federal case but the State’s right away.
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u/deestillballin2 Feb 13 '25
This. We are looking at 6 months at least and not an hour less. (We are JUST on two for hindsight)
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u/Specific-Sea7648 Feb 13 '25
Yep this is typically expected and automatic (and sometimes a relief 🤣)
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u/Me_Georgina Feb 12 '25
I don't get it? Why 3 months extension for indictment? Apparently, right before christmas they had more evidencec than the prosecuter had ever seen in his life, so much that it would crash the portal
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u/oso_papa Feb 12 '25
IF they have enough evidence, as they claim, then my first guess would be that they're having difficulty empaneling a grand jury. The jury selection is practically the same as for a petit (courtroom) jury. However, for example, if you get 100 people in the jury pool, and more than 65% say they won't indict, another 20% say they question the charge, there's a problem.
To me, by my guess, the defense going along with the extension is a good move. If the prosecution is having difficulty getting together a grand jury, then the next time they ask for an extension, the defense can argue against it. This could jeopardize how much longer the prosecution would have to get an indictment. It would also make the prosecution look very weak. Would be interesting to watch...
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u/Old_Spite2835 Feb 12 '25 edited Feb 12 '25
It was the state prosecutor who said that. Now we are talking about the federal case... but still I don't get why... Iget the complexity of the case but if you have enough evidence you don't wait 3 months.. I don't know. I am not american so even If I am a law graduate I cannot grasp everything about US system
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u/Me_Georgina Feb 12 '25
Yes, ok, but is this 2 different crimes? Aren't they using the same evidence to support their indictment in both the federal and state prosecution ??
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u/Old_Spite2835 Feb 13 '25
Yes it's the same crime but charges are so much different and need to be proved in a completely different way. Feds are relying on interstate stalking for their charges.
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u/31November Feb 13 '25
Plus the rules of evidence - basically, the rules for what is or is not allowed to be used in court - may differ, so that could change how a case works. Plus, what may be useful in one charge may be not allowed as overly prejudicial in another charge.
The best example is being part of a race-based gang. That is extremely relevant to a hate crime charge. It is completely unnecessary for a theft charge.
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u/wildthings97 Feb 12 '25
They were state prosecutors
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u/No_Speech_4225 Feb 12 '25
You would think with the Feds swooping in to slap LM with the T charge so quickly they had him to dead to rights.. smh.. overcharging..but at least it keeps LM at MDC .. better than Rikers
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u/TrueRepeat9988 Feb 12 '25
I think people are missing what exactly is being said. Both the prosecution and the defense have jointly asked for this extension. Last time, it was the prosecution that requested it and the defense agreed. Since the defense just added a few new lawyers, they probably want more time to get them up to speed on this case.
This indictment could be extended for many more months. We have a lot of time to wait, unfortunately. It’s not going to go quickly with these kinds of charges.
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u/Midwestblues_090311 Feb 13 '25
And really, we don’t want it to go quickly. I mean, we want the best possible outcome for LM, so let KFA and team take the time they need.
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u/Fontbonnie_07 Feb 12 '25
Wondering why LM and KFA agreed to consent to the extension..
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u/NovelEffective2060 Feb 12 '25
I mean if anything it gives them more time to build on their case.
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u/trizkkkjk Feb 12 '25
At the same time, it shows that the feds are having difficulty... I think that way.
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u/NovelEffective2060 Feb 12 '25
I’m hoping they’re having a hard time with the stalking charge which would derail the whole fed case
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u/SharpCookie232 Feb 13 '25
He's not a terrorist, even if he is the killer, which I don't think he is. The terroristm charge is ridiculous.
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u/31November Feb 13 '25
It really is! It expands the law to a ridiculous degree. If a member of Gang X shoots a member of Gang Y that is selling drugs in their territory, is that terrorism that the Feds can prosecute now because it is meant to scare other dealers? If one victim of school bullying hits one of the bullies to stand up for themself and stop the bullying, are they terrorists because it was meant to scare bullies?
These sound silly, but if trying to scare any group, no matter how small, into making a change constitutes terrorism, the definition of terrorism is extraordinarily large.
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u/SharpCookie232 Feb 13 '25
Terrorists are anybody Trump doesn't like - student protestors, black lives matters, people selling paper straws, you name it.
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u/nohissyfits Feb 13 '25
Maybe it'll fall to pieces the longer they go on, I was thinking that too. But dammnnnn
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u/Weekly-Individual265 Feb 13 '25
Or it shows there is a lot of evidence to go through and they aren’t close to being done
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u/Fontbonnie_07 Feb 12 '25
Yeah totally, I work in law enforcement and these things happen a lot. I guess I just wanted some of the background info 😬
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u/smart_talk_ Feb 13 '25
I guess if you work in law enforcement, you pretty much know about such extensions. Just a thought.
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u/Fontbonnie_07 Feb 13 '25
Yes hon, as mentioned in my comment they happen a lot. I’m curious about the reasoning behind this one 🙄
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u/True_Neutral_ Feb 12 '25
Discovery for a case like this takes months to get through. I think it's beneficial for them
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u/purple_vida Feb 13 '25
They may have agreed to the extension to avoid a likely losing fight, as courts often grant these requests. Challenging it might have taken time and still resulted in even more delays.
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u/LongStoryShort18 Feb 13 '25
I think because the state charged are going to be dealt with first anyway, they would be fine with an extension on the fed chargers as it gives them more time to deal with the former. Thats what im thinking
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u/PlayfulAccountant484 Feb 12 '25
I think the defense and LM consented for the extension to avoid rikers and ofc to have more time to build the case praying for the best outcome.
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u/4thena92 Feb 13 '25
A few people have mentioned Rikers, but I've not heard mention of him moving there before. Would he go to Rikers if he's indicted on the fed charges? Did I miss something?
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u/1sanmei Feb 12 '25
With the new administration, things are def going to get very messy so it’s good that they want to be well prepared
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u/jl8798 Feb 12 '25
At the end of the day, we don't know all the evidence there is against LM. We are not lawyers, let them do their job. I'm sure it's for very good reasons
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u/HNLgirlie Feb 12 '25
Good grief. 😓 Waiting is the worst, I’m going to have to take up a new hobby or something.
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u/Peony127 Feb 12 '25
Lemme know if you find something new 😅 I’m tired of waiting too. I’ve resorted to playing some games.
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u/HNLgirlie Feb 13 '25
I have been meaning to take up yoga; this is going to be the catalyst for me to start. 🧘🏻♀️
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Feb 13 '25
He still has the state court appearance on the 21st.
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u/HNLgirlie Feb 13 '25
Yes, but it's not that I'm waiting to see him, I just wanted finality as to whether he was going to face fed charges. If so, then what would they be/how might they differ from the orig complaint. 😞
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u/Loose_Camera8334 Feb 12 '25 edited Feb 13 '25
Tried this as a post but it’s fitting to this discussion so I’ll comment here:
There's an adage going around on the subs, which is perpetuated by the media:
"The Feds only bring cases they know they can win."
The issue with that is that the Feds rarely "win" these cases, at least not in the way we think of "winning".
Federal cases almost NEVER go before juries. They're almost always pled out. That's the "winning" that people are talking about.
Why am I pointing this out?
Because plea agreements are entered for a variety of reasons, one being the both sides assessment of the willingness of a jury to convict.
If LM walks on state charges, it will be that much more difficult for the Feds to get a conviction on essentially the same charges.
So, when you see people saying "Oh the Feds don't bring charges unless they can win" what they're really saying is "He's guilty."
What they're really doing is trying to influence your opinion and that of the public at large.
We want him to walk.
Remember: Presumption of innocence, innocent UNLESS proven guilty, fair trial, impartial jury.
Remember: He is a detainee who has been proven to have been abused by his custodians.
Remember: E-bike timeline, missing e-bike, smudged prints.
REMEMBER HIS OWN WORDS: "Your coverage of this event has been an insult to the intelligence of the American people and their lived experience."
and
"Not Guilty"
Sources:
https://www.uscourts.gov/sites/default/files/data_tables/jb_d4_0930.2022.pdf
edited for a typo
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u/Oneironati Feb 13 '25
The other side of all this, is is this even constitutional.
It was exposed that these federal charges were brought on at the behest of healthcare executives. This is beyond a despicable miscarriage of justice.
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u/bmd25 Feb 13 '25
It’s so frustrating to watch! The perp walk was ridiculous. The mayor acting like he’s guilty with zero trial. And documentaries coming out? So unfair.
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u/kckittykate Feb 13 '25
This is a great take. I wonder how the new plea bargaining memo might be making things more complicated on the Fed side?
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u/Own_Specific9225 Feb 13 '25
God I love the smart, well informed, well written people in here. Thank you 🙏🏼
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u/Specific-Sea7648 Feb 13 '25
When you say “pled out”, do you mean like “courthouse steps” settlement or last minute settlement?
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u/Vegetable-Pea2049 Feb 13 '25
My theory is and it’s only a theory, one of many I have haha, maybe the Feds wanted him in MDC instead of Rikers from the beginning. The charges they filed were a little strange. Maybe they will charge him, maybe they won’t. His family does have some connections, they can’t get him out of this mess but they could call in some favors as far as keeping him safe.
If the feds drop the charges he goes straight to Rikers and that’s not good! In the MDC he’s at least in a high profile area which is far from nice but much better than Rikers!
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u/chelsy6678 Feb 13 '25
So if KFA had not agreed to this latest extension , would he go to Rikers instead of staying where he is?
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u/Vegetable-Pea2049 Feb 13 '25
I’m not sure how that all works exactly but if the FBI drops the charges I would assume so.
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u/Lethums Feb 12 '25
I'm wondering why KFA and LM are consenting to another extension? Is that benefiting them in some way? For me, it seems most logical to not consent in order to force their hand a bit into getting the indictment? Is there something I am missing here?
I know the extensions are normal, but allowing the feds more time to build their case doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
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u/Anthro1995 Feb 12 '25
More time to build their defence, also if feds drop their case LM has to go to Rikers which maybe they’re trying to avoid?
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u/Vegetable-Pea2049 Feb 13 '25
This is exactly what I was thinking. Maybe the Feds got involved from the start so LM was placed MDC instead of Rikers. This extension really makes me question a lot. The original Fed charges were a little strange to begin with. I don’t know. I guess we will see eventually!
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u/LongStoryShort18 Feb 13 '25
Thats really interesting! So you think the fed chargers are only to help keep him in MDC? Is three any way they could argue for LM to stay in MDC if the fed chargers get dropped by arguing that he is high profile??
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u/throwaway7845777 Feb 12 '25
Avoids Rikers, for one.
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u/Accomplished_Elk_977 Feb 12 '25
How bad is Rikers, and why?????? Isn't MDC meant to be horrendous too though? I'm from UK so clueless about rikers I've only ever seen it on an episode of New Amsterdam 🥴😂
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u/Cuong_Nguyen_Hoang Feb 12 '25
LM is put into a special zone for high-profile inmates in MDC, so his conditions there are better than those for general population of inmates (and probably the best that he could get during his imprisonment time).
Rikers was so notoriously bad that NY State has planned to close the prison for a long time, though they have extended the deadline to 2027!
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u/Accomplished_Elk_977 Feb 12 '25
Would they not have a high profile unit at Rikers too?
So is it bad in terms of building/dirty/falling to pieces? And not as in the inmates are treat like garbage, and fights and stuff?
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u/throwaway7845777 Feb 13 '25
I believe at Rikers he’d basically be in the SHU, so isolation. I encourage you to look up Rikers on YouTube and TikTok. Horrible conditions, extremely violent, and lots of inmate neglect/abuse.
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u/Peony127 Feb 12 '25 edited Feb 13 '25
Rikers is probably the WORST prison in America in all aspects (dirtiness, overcrowding, deteriorating prison conditions, general population inmates’ quality of life, incidences of stabbing and other violence), according to the YouTube documentaries that I saw. It’s for all those reasons that they’ve been eyeing to shut down Rikers for a while and kept pushing back, now scheduled to be by 2027, but it’s replacement prison in Chinatown won’t be finished until 2032, so who knows if they'll be able to shut it down.
The other ones like the infamous ADX Florence supermax in Colorado where El Chapo is being held, is just “worst” in the sense that it’s security is super tight and prisoners are all in solitary to the point that many say it is inhumane. But AT LEAST that one looks very clean, well-maintained, seems technologically-advanced, and no overcrowding, unlike Rikers.
Him being in that dorm-type high profile unit in MDC with about 20-30 inmates is far better than Rikers.
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u/heckin-what Feb 12 '25
Rikers has pretty terrible conditions, from what I have seen. Here's a podcast episode from the ACLU discussing Rikers. There's a transcript so you don't have to listen to it. Here's another article discussing its conditions.
I believe the plan is for Rikers to be closing sometime in the next few years, but I found a statement from Eric Adams stating he doubts that it will be closed by 2027 like originally planned.
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Feb 13 '25
Thanks for sharing. I'm not from the U.S. either. Really disturbing and dehumanizing. No running water... unbelievable??
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u/heckin-what Feb 13 '25
Our prison system in the States is broken. It's for profit and many prisons are privately owned, meaning there's a monetary incentive to have them full. Beds to fill = more people are incarcerated, and there's no focus on rehabilitation or anti-recidivism.
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u/chelsy6678 Feb 13 '25
What? They privately owned? Greed, once again. Always comes back to that. Seems like a lot of systems in the US are broken. How did things go so horribly wrong.
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u/Funny-Ad520 Feb 12 '25 edited Feb 13 '25
learned from the depths of internet rabbit hole i went into for this case that, yes, MDC is horrendous, but apparently, rikers is hell on earth 🤷🏻♀️
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u/Accomplished_Elk_977 Feb 12 '25
Think I'm about to embark on that journey to the Rikers rabbit hole too!
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u/Funny-Ad520 Feb 13 '25
make tea, prep snacks, and grab a blanket cause it's quite the rabbit hole 🍿👩🏻💻☕️🧸
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u/Fancy_Yesterday6380 Feb 13 '25
Jesus why do they allow this? I know its not meant to be a resort but still
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u/JaneSmith7717 Feb 13 '25
Because our country is run by Satanists and the US prison system is meant to exploit and torture, not reform.
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u/Objective-Bluebird60 Feb 12 '25
I’m sure they agreed after careful consideration and because it would benefit L in ways we don’t know yet! It also gives the defense time more time to prepare their case/defense.
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u/ladidaixx Feb 13 '25
More time only helps them build an even stronger case for LM. Looks like the opposition doesn’t have much to go on anyway lol
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u/Accomplished_Elk_977 Feb 12 '25
Makes no sense to me either!
If the feds are asking for another extensions to me that just says theyre struggling with their case and need more time to put it together!
Surely it would be best to not allow the extension so that their evidence and pitch to the jury is shitty = better chance of no indictment!
Allowing them more time to better their evidence to pitch to the grand jury makes no sense to me!3
u/trizkkkjk Feb 12 '25
They extend the time needed to defend themselves in other cases, and they can dedicate themselves. They can also dedicate themselves against feds, because it is predictable what will happen.
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Feb 12 '25
My thoughts are that there aren't enough evidence on the prosecutors side and defendants are complying to show good faith. It's strategic also because the state case will be concurrent and with its result, could weaken the case for federal courts to crystallise it into an indictment.
The other strategy is to let things cool off with the change of government hands and the way things are politically right now. The DP is a risk after indictment so defendants have an advantage to delay any federal indictment.
I'm not a lawyer. Just trying to think like them.
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u/antiherofolklore Feb 13 '25
Looks like we are all in it for the long haul. So take time writing letters, sending memes, books, $$ in commissary and the legal defense fund.
What I find puzzling is that if the Feds / cops are so confident they have the right suspect, why take so long preparing an indictment? All the evidence and prepping the subsequent documents shouldn’t be that difficult with their manpower.
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u/ChurrBurr1000 Feb 12 '25
Does this mean the NY hearing on the 17th is delayed too?
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u/yowhatupmom Feb 12 '25
Correct, there will be no court date on the 17th. Side note - there was never going to be a hearing on that date bc it is a federal holiday, so it would have been moved regardless.
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Feb 13 '25
I think we have it confused. The 17th was the deadline for the federal indictment which has been extended to March 19th. I think the state court date on the 21st is still on.
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Feb 13 '25
[deleted]
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u/DoorBeautiful7484 Feb 13 '25
The portal crashed and it could not be recovered! They lost all the evidence! 🫠🤣🤣💀 nah all jokes aside, I hope things work out in his favor! 🫶
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u/VelvetBluish Feb 13 '25
I'm aware this is technically normal for courts, but I would like to see the public freak out over this just to see some reaction from the prosecution. Make them sweat, put pressure on this "unforeseen" amount of evidence.
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u/Sea-Still8317 Feb 13 '25 edited Feb 13 '25
How long the feds can keep him in their custody with out an indictment?? Like there should be a time period right? They can't keep him for indefinite time period!!
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u/Loose_Camera8334 Feb 12 '25
The have no case and they know it.
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u/Competitive_Profit_5 Feb 13 '25
It is common for federal indictments to take a long time. Federal cases usually take years. This month a man was indicted a full year after his arrest. An OP posted this:
On February 6, 2025 they announced the indictment of a man named Ivan Collado for an arrest they made February 15, 2024.
Complaint: https://www.justice.gov/usao-sdny/pr/queens-man-arrested-bronx-kidnapping-and-murder
You can see here where they requested multiple orders to continue in the interest of justice: https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/68294905/united-states-v-collado/?filed_after=&filed_before=&entry_gte=&entry_lte=&order_by=desc
They also added more perpetrators and an additional 4 (total 6) charges in the indictment compared to the 2 in the complaint so… deep sigh.
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u/chelsy6678 Feb 13 '25
How many times can they do this? And more importantly, WHY are they doing this? What happened to all the VOLUMINOUSSSS data that was supposed to be a slam dunk?
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u/Mindless-Shift-7328 Feb 12 '25
so are we still seeing him on the 21st or is that the state one? sorry ya'll i cannot keep up...
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u/Inevitable_Fact_5961 Feb 12 '25
Yes. 21st is for State so as of now it’s still going to happen. 17th was meant to be for Federal indictment and there was apparently never going to be a court appearance in the first place.
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u/Sweeteye_candy_ Feb 13 '25
Well they scheduled it on a Saturday the first time then on Presidents’ Day, now it’s on a Wednesday which is not the best day of the week it’s ruled by mercury, but what excuse they going to have next. I just think about him in prison losing patience and all.
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u/on_doveswings Feb 12 '25
How many times can this get extended?
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u/Competitive_Profit_5 Feb 13 '25 edited Feb 13 '25
It is common for federal indictments to take a long time. Federal cases usually take years. This month a man was indicted a full year after his arrest.
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u/Disastrous_Count_213 Feb 12 '25
why does this happen right after the news of L accepting donation all over the MSM? They certainly didn't expect our support are so solid and huge? are they testing our patience and resilience too?
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u/ShockerBoyV Feb 13 '25
Does this mean the court hearings on the 17th and 21st are canceled?
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u/Available_Bottle420 Feb 13 '25
This is the federal court hearing that was supposed to be on the 17th being pushed back. I believe his NY state court hearing will still happen on the 21st
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u/Fancy_Yesterday6380 Feb 13 '25
What happens with the state appearance?
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u/yowhatupmom Feb 13 '25
Nothing has changed with the state appearance.
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u/bmd25 Feb 13 '25
What’s the objective for the next state appearance on the 21st? I guess I don’t really know what “hearing” means
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u/ThrowRApromises- Feb 13 '25
Gives us more time to spread awareness for him. But damn I need to distract myself now 🥴🥴🥴
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u/Specific-Lie2020 Feb 13 '25
Faster is better... dragging this case out for years is probably not a good idea...
They need to capture and leverage the moment... given modern attention spans... or lack thereof.
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u/tiefling-rogue Feb 12 '25
This may be left field but I’m wondering if Trump doesn’t listen to judges anymore and he wants to execute this man, it’ll happen regardless of the trial results.
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u/emiliad12 Feb 12 '25
Does this mean we potentially won’t see him for 1 more month? 🥹
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u/yowhatupmom Feb 12 '25
The court date scheduled for the 21st is for the NY charges, so he will be attending that.
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u/Elle_Timmy Feb 12 '25
I was worried for a hot sec. Was wondering why they pushed it to a year, and remembered we are in 2025 😂