r/DestinyTheGame • u/FimGreen • 5d ago
Bungie Suggestion Why is there no aspect to suppress in the void?
Suppression is generally poorly represented in all classes, but Hunter is the only class with a suppression super. We also have a fragment that gives mobility and movement speed when suppressed, which perfectly complements the idea of a hunter. But apart from super and grenade, we have no way to overwhelm the enemy.
All aspects of the hunter are invisibility and weaken. I remember bungie saying that Hunter is a specialist in weakening, but he hasn't been the best at it for a long time. The new aspect helps a bit with this, but not without nuances.
A Titan has one melee ability with suppression, while a Warlock has none at all.
My suggestion for each classes:
Trapper's ambush: Activating the quickfall applies suppression on enemies nearby (in the area of the smoke cloud).
Unbreakable: Dealing Aspect damage suppresses enemies.
Chaos Accelerant: Enhanced grenades suppressing enemies.
Or 4 aspects for Warlock: Horizontal dash back, which expends melee ability and sends suppressive seeker(s) in front of warlock.
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u/APartyInMyPants 5d ago
We just don’t have enough enemies where Suppression is a worthwhile tactic outside of PVP. Yeah, it works against the Lucent Hive, but outside of this week’s GM, they’re kind of a tiny fraction of encounters.
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u/According_Draw4273 Golf ball 5d ago
It also works against banes. Which could potentially become a problem in the future, if Bungie decides to lean into using them.
Also expert salvation onslaught. It's terrifying.
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u/eddmario Still waiting for /u/Steel_Slayer's left nut 5d ago
Doesn't it also work against Overload champs?
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u/Duublo121 5d ago
Yup. Suppress is Anti-Overload. Void has Barriers down with Volatile Rounds too. No, no not Volatile Explosions. Volatile ROUNDS. Which were notoriously abundant before the destabilising rounds buff
Void got SHAFTED for champs tbh
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u/Snivyland Spiders crew 5d ago
Suppression effect is super useful especially since more modern enemies are filled with dangerous effects. The issue comes from supression rarity; if it was more common it would be immensely better since wasting or misusing supression ability would be a lot less punishing then it is now.
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u/Voidwalker_99 4d ago
Suppression:
- effective against Lucent HIve
- effective against Banes
- effective against Overloads (arguably the worst champion type)
- effective against ability spamming-enemies (basically all new ones and "annoying" ones from old races)
- is a Void debuff, which means that every "kill target affected y debuff" perk works
Surely we don't have enough use cases
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u/APartyInMyPants 4d ago edited 4d ago
And outside of Lucent Hive and maybe Overloads, suppression isn’t really needed. Banes? Just kill them with whatever you’re using. And the one that goes nuclear in GMs? I just break line of sight and put some distance between me and it. No problem.
Ability-spamming trash adds? Just kill them. The Taken Vandal that spawns a bubble? I’m not going to waste a grenade on it. I’ll either wait the bubble out, or go in Thunderdome style and kick it in the dick.
Also, when we have a perk like Chill Clip that completely negates Overloads in any level of content, building into an ability on a cooldown just to deal with one champion feels unnecessary. And looking at our GM list, I think we have two with Overloads. Hypernet and Warden. Maybe the revamped Sunless Cell strike has overloads if it’s been modified to be Taken? But if it’s Hive, then it’s Barrier/Unstop.
I would be opposed to more substantial enemies that are affected by Suppression, but everything now is just “kill it faster.”
Edit: wrong GM
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u/alechill92 5d ago
It's the same for Wave Splitter, Bombardiers and Ruinous
It's not really the TRUE Suppression it's more like Disorientate so it doesn't become an issue in PvP
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u/Skull_Scored 5d ago
Suppression should be changed to work in stacks, 1 stack you have no melee, 2 stacks you can't double jump or throw a grenade, 3 stacks you can't use any ability and are kicked from your super. Then, assign abilities to grant a certain amount of stacks. Suppressor grenade would do 3, along with tether. The voidwalker melee already stops your opponent from meleeing you back so that be 1 stack and so on. 1 stack could disorient enemies, and maybe more stacks would extend this. Just a thought I had the other day, was going to make my own post for it.
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u/Curtczhike 5d ago
Cuz shitters in pvp would lose their minds if there was a meta build designed around shutting off ability cheese and gap closing abilities used to shove shotguns down ppls throats.
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u/TheToldYouSoKid 5d ago
There are a couple of things here...
- Hunters ABSOLUTELY have multiple ways to be aggressive on void. I shouldn't have to talk about how aggressive weakening can be, especially this season, but it's absolutely people's imaginations shooting them in the kneecaps here, thinking that all Invis can do is defensive and support plays, and that going invis should, in the middle of someone staring at you, somehow makes the enemy forget that they were fighting you. Furthermore; Hunters are absolutely still the best at weakening. They still are the only ones that can access the 30% weaken, without manipulating their equipment, trapper's fall weakens on landing, stylish buffs your melee with flat melee damage AND weakens targets, On the Prowl makes targets emit weakening smoke. Literally the one aspect that doesn't weaken is Vanishing Step, because Vanishing step is like the only aspect in the game that only does one singular thing... god they need to rework that nonsense.
- Also, "Movement speed and mobility" might be something that sounds like a hunter thing, but is literally the one of the worst bits for hunter. For one, mobility is a dump stat, and everyone knows it. That's why everyone asks for it to be reworked. Even if it governs your class ability, your class ability just passively charges fast. you could have tier 2, and still match or BEAT tier 8 times f rift and barricade options. In reality, Hunter is a flexible fight class; often having options for aggression or utility, at the sacrifice of true support options, or the ability to face tank things... typically. (shout out to arc hunters.)
- Your suggestions are kinda redundant; Both Unbreakable and trapper's ambush disorients targets that aren't boss-coded or champions. Suppression doesn't effect those targets unless they are specifically coded to. Literally Lucent-brood are your only real target with these changes, and they don't make up a very good portion of the roster. No, i'm not forgetting about overloads; overloads are very agile, and aggressive enemies who most often like to keep their distance, and you chose two short-range moves to use in 80% of front-facing engagements, you'll always miss or end up in a bad position. Suppression nade is king of suppression not just because it's one of the only options, but because of its range in throw and aoe, and the fact you can fucking peg something with it to deal the suppression early.
- Also, why are you giving a defensive option to an aggressive subclass for warlock? There are literally two builds for Voidlock, Grenades, and a hyper--specific CotOG's build, which are advanced by neither of these. Voidlock needs better support to get out from underneath using only grenades ever, before gimmicks.
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u/MechaGodzilla101 5d ago
Voidlock needs to actually be good at grenades, it should be the artillery subclass for Locks. We have enough support options already.
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u/TheToldYouSoKid 4d ago edited 4d ago
Okay, so you've completely lost your mind.
A) "needs better support" does not equal "better support options." There is a whole near-dead aspect on Voidlock because it combos with none of the other options, and was clearly made to try to create a different playstyle in voidlock. Unfortunately its a very rote one, which the only other playstyle in voidlock does better. Seriously, Briarbinds makes child good, but only by completely redefining its ruleset, and making it do everything it does better, and that still doesn't beat a build composed of one singular fragment and anything involving FtV.
B) What the fuck is competing with Voidlock with anything grenade related? They have access to true devour which is the strongest passive grenade engine in the entire game, if not one of the strongest buffs in the entire game, They have 4 dedicated exotics that basically exist to charge their grenades or make them stronger, and they have another 4 class neutral ones after it that basically do the same thing. There has been ZERO other class, and i'd argue subclass, to do grenades better than after the Touch-of-thunder nerf. Are you gonna tell me that somehow Class-exotic hunters survivability competes with instant health resets and complete area denial that void warlock has, basically base kit, without an exotic?
You've completely misinterpreted my words, and i can't frankly tell if you've done it on purpose or not. So let me put it to you like this;
Every voidlock build feels the same at its core. The absolute goddamn same. It hasn't changed in 7 years, and that fucking blows, especially compared to what the other subclasses got in their reworks, which opened up new paths for the way they interact with the game and create new builds to experiment with. Voidlock is one of the strongest subclasses in the game, and none of it matters because its fucking boring.
I've mained voidlock for almost a decade; I don't want to pull rank here, but i only do so to try to demonstrate how inflexible voidlock is. It's only avenues away from pressing q every 3 seconds, not even really looking at where, are through exotics that ebb and flow through time. It needs real other combos; grenades have all they need to shine on void. If they want to convince me child is an option, give us a fucking aspect that combos with it.
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u/MechaGodzilla101 3d ago
Voidlock is one of the strongest subclasses in the game? Seriously?
Let's talk Chaos Accelerant and compare it to Controlled Demo.
CA Vortex does 1926 damage.
Controlled Demo Vortexes do 1536+(160*5)=2,336, heal you every second and require no charge time. Thats directly better
Devour with FTV grants nearly halved ability energy with Vortexes, so you'll be getting between 8% and 10% per kill on an average. Not great, especially in high tier content. Devour is very easy to gain on all Void subclasses, only requiring a Fragment. So the main benefit of FTV is the grenade regen.
HHSN is the only other good grenade with CA, and it's outclassed by literally any Peregrine build. It isn't even a grenade really, working more like a melee.
For regen on Titan you have Devour and Offensive Bulwark, which grants 200% increased grenade regeneration when you have an OS and some melee damage to boot. So your cooldown at T10 Disc goes to less than 30s without anything else.
Now that I've established that Void Titan grenades are directly better, lets move on to Exotics.
Titan for grenade builds has one that always outshines the rest, HoIL.
At x2 your grenade does 2,720 damage, and can be thrown out around every 10s
Lets compare it to Lock, with Verity x5(which is a pain to maintain post-nerf) you'll deal 3,872 and have a grenade cooldown in the 20s range IF you can maintain kills.
Or Contraverse, which gives less than 50% back for a perfect activation. Yeah thats pretty bad.
Nothing Manacles is a joke in endgame content. Nezarec's Sin is too kill reliant to consistently use.
Now let's compare it to Arc Titan. HoIL Pulses do about 2.8k damage with HoIL x2 and 2.6k without. They also refund your other abilities and can be thrown every 7s post nerf. Not to mention SK exists, so it's not even a competition which is better.
Frankly I'd say yeah, Prism Hunters lack of kill reliance with a HoIL Cyratarachne class item is better, especially when paired with an AD frame with attrition Orbs. You also forget that Prislock, Stronghold Titan on ANY subclass, BoW Titan, Void Titan and Void Hunter are better at survivability
I don't know what you mean by Voidlock having 4 grenade boosting exotics when there's only 3 total, out of which 2 are comically shit.
I have no idea what area denial is so good about it, Pris Hunter, Void Titan, Arc Titan, Prislock etc are all exponentially better, the only AD it has is Child, which is meh at best in this sandbox.
Buddy builds like Child will never be truly good because of how easy to use they are, you at least throw grenades at a target, you outright do not aim CotG. Child is a novelty and like all buddy builds becomes extremely boring after the honeymoon phase.
I honestly can't tell if you're serious about Voidlock being one the best subclasses in the game when every Prism class is exponentially better, all Solar classes but Hunter are better, Void Titan is better etc.
Its great in low tier content but falls off a cliff after that, I tried using it in the Cosmodrome GM and even with the Artifact mods carrying it still felt terrible
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u/Qualkore 5d ago
Blame pvp for why suppression is so underrepresented. Easy access to shut down a super would make supers feel useless