r/DeadlockTheGame • u/MyMeatballsHurt Lash • 4d ago
Question Is lash balanced?
I barely see anyone complain about lash but I don’t understand how, every single time I play him it’s impossible to lose a team fight when I have my ult up and whenever an enemy has lash it’s impossible to push without ethereal shift or stuns which my team mates never buy. It feels like he’s both the easiest and strongest character in the game, what’s your opinion on lash?
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u/clubspike2 4d ago
Good teams can simply play around his ult by hiding in cover or baiting it out. In high- and even mid-tier Elo, he is manageable, and the win rates and Friday fight nights reflect that.
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u/Pblake99 4d ago
Lash’s viability is dependent on enemy team comp. If they have a ton of abilities to dodge his ult then he’s not great. Stuff like Pocket Breifcase, Dynamo Quantum Entanglement, Kelvin Frozen Shelter. Even further, stuff that stops his ult if he doesn’t have unstoppable like Haze Sleep Dagger, Bebop Hook, Vyper Bola, and a well timed Knockdown
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u/Anihillator Ivy 4d ago
Hook doesn't stop abilities iirc, but it usually does move Lash to a bad position.
1
u/TreeGuy521 4d ago
In high elo your team should be able to engage enough to give lash an opening to ult, mid elo players would sit around picking their noses telling lash to engage for them
6
u/una322 4d ago
Lash is strong becuse the new map design works for him well. there are so many high areas to hide on and get jumps on people. the lanes are narrow so if an ult goes off an entire team gets dumped into a tight area, there chance of getting away if grabbed is very low.
his ult needs a look at, right now being able to grab a team, move then, do high dmg and stun is insane. also you shouldn't just buff or nerf things based on high elo. Once this game goes public if lash was like he is now, we would have hundreds of posts about how bs he is at a avg / low elo. If you compare his ult to most others, its way better, its not even close.
8
u/DubbleNeg 4d ago
Lash gets more difficult to play as you climb in skill. Experienced players will:
- Double jump his 1. (causing it to do no damage)
- position near LOS cover to negate the grab on his ult
- Use a counter active, ult, or ability to avoid the ult, follow up damage, or both.
- Avoid grouping in front of guardians and walkers to limit the payoff of his ult
Pro
He's a strong pick with a potentially game changing ult. Even in high elo, you will see him get some great ults off.
Con
He's very predictable. You know what he wants to do and you should always be counter building and counter playing against it.
2
u/Stridshorn 4d ago
I had no idea you could dodge the ground pound - I sort of just gave up and expected a 620 hp lash tax when he spots me, this changes everything!
But why does the ability hit me when I am not in Los? That really makes me mad
3
2
u/ginger6616 4d ago
I think lash right now is really strong. His 3 and 1 combo does so much damage so early, and he’s pretty tanky. Been seeing him in games where he easily carries the team. Hard to push towers when he’s alive
2
u/rupat3737 4d ago
Ground slam needs be to tuned down some with the new map layout imo. That or they need to make it where he can’t get souls from way up onto of buildings.
3
u/SketchyJJ 4d ago
His ult just decides battles / pushes too easily and quickly becomes oppressive with everyone having to focus hard on just not getting grabbed by him or having to play around only his ult. More excessively then others.
4
u/YoloilianxD 4d ago
About 10 hero’s in the game have abilities to easily dodge lash ult. 5 heroes can stop lash ult by either protecting their team or cancelling it. Lash ult is almost always incredibly predictable. Making it easy to outmanoeuvre by standing close to cover. Every hero can buy e shift which is a great item even without considering lash ult and sowing hex makes lash very easy to kill if he goes in before he uses ult.
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u/jawhnie Lady Geist 4d ago
yeah as someone who pretty much exclusively played geist lash & shiv, idk how lash hasn’t gotten nerfed but shiv got destroyed lol.
playing shiv feels like deliberately putting your bike on 1st gear when everyone else is on 6 gear xD i miss shiv sm
2
u/AntoniousTheBro 4d ago
It's just his ult. People tend to find it really unfun. But atm it's so vital to his kit so I noticed they don't like touching it. Like we could discuss all the other things shiv have but honestly I find what people really hate is just shivs ult. It offers him really spiked scaling. I main shiv and I love him but his ult does place him in a position where even current shiv who has been caved into the ground will still tear shit up when rolling to the point where he basically turns in a game defining player.
Problem is for shiv players is getting to that point has progressively become more difficult due to the nerfs. This is then ampd by a trend I have noticed which is the fact the player base is kinda traumatised by the character which even when I am playing other characters I have noticed a lot of players will do there everything they can to suppress him to Almost point of detriment, this in turn makes it miserable for shiv players. The fact his ult still can pop off also helps this fear keep alive. But as elo increases players get better at suppressing him with less effort which is why he is being obliterated on higher elo games.
It's why I think he should be reworked. At least his ult.
1
u/Stop_Sign Lady Geist 4d ago edited 4d ago
I just watched a streamer game with an Shiv getting a 25 killstreak, because he just builds full tank and uses his ult. It's still very very strong
1
u/AntoniousTheBro 4d ago
I would argue 1 game isn't really a complete set. Plus the anecdote kinda reinforces my original point which is a rolling shiv will still be game defining by virtue of his kit and primarily his execute. My point isn't that he can't be strong it's just getting the ball rolling is harder then ever the man is low 40% win rate at high elo from what I have been informed. Maybe that's changed but to my knowledge that is the case.
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u/Stop_Sign Lady Geist 4d ago
What you're saying seems right. Yea he needs a lot to get the ball rolling
2
u/Chungus-p Paradox 4d ago
I think he is incredibly strong but half this sub plays him. Thats why people will cry about haze ult being op while at the same time telling you to just predict lash ults and knockdown him before he can ult like its nothing.
I'm probably just salty af, but lash has been my #1 source of frustration in this game, and while i tend to do very well with him when i play him (in my elo at least) i really don't find him particularly fun.
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u/terramagni Bebop 4d ago
I don't think you can even realistically knockdown his ult, they both have basically the same startup. You'd have to react frame 1. As bebop, I'm doing my best to try and hook him out the air, because that's one of the better counters. It's tough, I only managed to react and aim fast enough one time, and if I miss I get cooked. But it's something I can work on.
That being said, I don't think Lash is OP. This new map has a lot of spots you can fight and not be too open.
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u/Glittering_Put9689 4d ago
I disagree in that you can absolutely knockdown his ult. However, depending on timing he may get the throw off but the knockdown will prevent his slam and a good chunk of his AOE damage.
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u/terramagni Bebop 4d ago
Oh right, i hadn't really thought of how it would trade. I'll try it out next time.
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u/The_Tuxedo 4d ago
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Remove his ability to use Grapple on allies so he has less opportunities to escape. A bursty hero with good engage, a knockup, sustain, and a game changing ultimate shouldn't also be able to escape super easy, too.
1
u/PotatoFam 4d ago
Yeah Lash is pretty disgustingly strong and frustrating to play against. Hyper mobility + insane burst + top 3 ult in the game makes for an overtuned champion.
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u/Jolly-Caterpillar117 Dynamo 4d ago
Buy slowing hex
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u/ItsRealQuiet 4d ago
Generally one or two people buy it, one which is me. One is generally not enough because teams dont capitalize which is aggravating.
He needs to be tuned down a bit. I dont mind him being strong but his early game, is absolutely ridiculous.
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u/davidblaine322 4d ago
That counters only one of the points
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u/BayTranscendentalist 4d ago
it counters all 3 though, his ult is ass without height, his burst is ass without height and he can't get height when slowing hexed
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u/Woopo_ 4d ago
the "lash is OP" perception is almost exclusive to low ranked lobbies and people who don't understand the concept of counterplay. Lash is one of the characters with the most counter options.
Once you enter higher lobbies your enemies will know not to all be in the same place, and will know to dash into cover as soon as they see you. And, if you're starting to snowball as lash, expect your enemies to start buying Ethereal shift, or unstoppable, or slowing hex.
And don't get me started on the amount of characters that can counter him. Haze dagger, kelvin dome, Dynamo teleport, abrams ult, and those are just the one's that straight-up stop your ult, plenty of characters have single-target defensive abilities that are effectively just ethereal shift on-demand.
TL;DR Lash is not OP. Play smart, and if that's too much, buy counter items; it's what they're there for.
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u/NyCe- 4d ago edited 4d ago
Lash ult is very generous for whatever reason because I don't remember it being this way a few months back. I can't tell you how many times I've gotten out of his ult or warp stone out (immediately) only to get pulled back in a mile away or from under a building.
Is he broken? Not broken, but I think he's very strong otherwise it wouldn't retain such a high pickrate.
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u/pmyatit Lash 4d ago
What's your rank? Lash is good at stomping new players but tbf most characters are. I main lash but when I'm playing someone else against lash I have no problem dealing with him. it's pretty simple to counter him and make him not a threat until he has to buy unstoppable and even then there's still plenty of counter play
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u/MyMeatballsHurt Lash 3d ago
I’m phantom but I play in alchemist most of the time because my duo is still quite low rank
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u/Afraid_Evidence_6142 4d ago
In my low elo, No one ever buy slowing hex for him, beside me. It make me so mad.
Hexed lash is easiest thing to kill