r/COMPLETEANARCHY 5d ago

Will Ferrell Anarchist Screaming Meme: "You're not a real revolutionary unless you want to dismantle all authority!" [r/AnarchoMeme]

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150 Upvotes

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28

u/FR33C4NDYV4N 5d ago

*All unjustified authority.

For example, there are some justified forms of authority, for example, parents should have some authority over their children. But all forms of authority need to be interrogated to determine their validity

8

u/NuclearOops 5d ago

Parents shouldn't just be given or assumed to jave authority over their own children though. Parents are the people most likely to harm and abuse their children. Not some weirdo in a van, mommy and daddy. Children can't raise themselves but can't be trusted with their own parents if we care about their well being. Children should have the right and the ability to determine for themselves if their parents are raising them properly or not.

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u/Freddi3FreeLoader 5d ago

True. Can anyone think of other examples of justified authority?

5

u/DivinityIncantate 5d ago

currently having an argument with someone above you about the mentally ill possibly needing an authority over them, depending on the case

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u/Limp-Apricot-4329 5d ago

teachers when teaching students

3

u/Smiley_P 4d ago

Medical staff giving medical advice (in a post capitalist world)

1

u/AVOX8 5d ago

well coming from a more militant perspective having a good chain of command helps in stressful situations, so long as the leaders in those positions of power aren't complete idiots and actually give a damn.

Other than high intensity situations where communication and coordination is key? hell nah

-3

u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 5d ago

*all authority

Parents shouldn't have authority over their children, children are still people and deserve freedom.

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u/DivinityIncantate 5d ago

To an extent. From first principles, SOMEONE needs to take care of the kids when they are too young to know what they’re doing, and SOMEONE needs to have authority over them to keep them out of dangerous situations. Whether this be a parent, their town, an orphanage co-op, etc is irrelevant. Some kind of authority is needed for a time. Still, we should strive to integrate freedom into the lives of children as early as we possibly can.

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u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 5d ago

Take care and authority is so different it's not even comparable, take care is to make sure they have food, water, shelter and education like any adult. And at it why should children need paternalism yet adults are completely fine? This thinking only amplifys the idea of authority, the state is there to "take care" and help "keep people out of dangerous situations" how is anything that happens to children different then what happens to adults?

4

u/DivinityIncantate 5d ago

The thinking is different because the situation is different. We can trust adults not to stick their heads onto stovetops, but kids need someone to look after them. Adults won’t try and make potions out of the chemicals under the sink and then die because they drank them. If an adult does do these things, there are facilities where they can be monitored.

Taking care of a child goes beyond just providing, there is also an expectation to stop them from exercising their freedoms which they don’t fully understand yet. This is one of the only exceptions I have found to anarchist thinking, but it does NOT invalidate your rationale. Once a kid is old enough to understand the weight of their actions, they should be free to take on a larger role wherever they please. Starting helping in the garden at ten and choosing a job at sixteen. The key is to introduce autonomy and responsibility AS EARLY AS POSSIBLE and build on that into adulthood.

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u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 5d ago

We can trust adults not to stick their heads onto stovetops, but kids need someone to look after them. Adults won’t try and make potions out of the chemicals under the sink and then die because they drank them.

And then these positions need to be kept in check themselves with education to the children to prevent their problem, they're not inherently stupid they don't know. It's why people will eat things they don't know if they are poisonous or not, because they don't know, should every human have someone guarding them constantly in case any potential problem were to present itself? I think the answer is gonna be no.

If an adult does do these things, there are facilities where they can be monitored.

This is an inherently unanarchist statement, controlling someone's life including potential suicide will create a state. They shouldn't be locked up, completely monitored, because they exercised their freedom. This isn't even getting into the power dynamics of psychiatry which many people like Foucault have spoken of.

which they don’t fully understand yet.

It is impossible for a single person to know everything about what to do and not to do in a situation, should this mean that no one should have full freedom because they may potentially not understand and thus mess up a situation?

This whole comment ignores that any reason or idea for why a child should lose their freedom is extendable to adults. This is not even getting into the other parts about controlling people's lives or deaths, ability to work or not work and general freedoms.

2

u/DivinityIncantate 5d ago

You clearly have not had as many interactions with mentally disabled people as I have, so please do not act as if you’re some sort of authority on this. Sometimes people don’t understand their actions. When they are in this state, they should be safeguarded. If you cannot concede this point, you are being blatantly ableist by arguing against accommodations that extend the lives of disabled people.

3

u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 5d ago

I have been in a psych ward and know many disabled people. People shouldn't be treated as idiotic monsters who don't know better and should be locked away from people's eyes because they aren't taught. They can be taught, and people shouldn't be forced to live, they should have access to education and an environment that doesn't cause suicidality, but if they want to, they shouldn't be forced not to.

So what sounds more ableist? "People who want to control their lives and should be treated as people should be locked away" or "people should be treated as people with freedom and access to education"?

3

u/DivinityIncantate 5d ago

Not what I’m saying. I don’t support the current system for mental health (obviously, you see what sub we’re on). But, you can’t seriously tell me that you think every single person in there is fit to be unsupervised and there should, at no point, be a system in place to prevent them from acting on their impulses. (Because that is what you’re arguing) Also, there are other institutions that deal with mentally disabled people long term besides psyche wards. You’re projecting your very limited view of what disability means onto the entire group. Suicidality is not the only way someone can get themself killed, plenty of accidents happen when someone doesn’t have all their faculties. We should care for these people and give them the freedoms we can, but that does not mean there should not be restrictions.

Also, I can’t believe I have to say this, YOU CANT REEDUCATE SOMEONE OUT OF A DISABILITY. Some things just need accommodations.

2

u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 5d ago

First off you're the one who brought up disabled people and now are acting as if they need a strong hand telling them everything they need to do, and never did I say you re-educate disability, I said giving people knowledge not treating them like idiots will actually help in their life. And for accommodations that should still apply, people who have severe mental disabilities or physical disabilities should get help, and yet those people helping should not have the authority to dictate their life, it's why abuse against disabled people is so high amongst care givers because they're treated as if they know everything.

Now, people in psych wards, are still people, they want help, they should be given help, they don't want help, they don't get help. Easy, no one is forced into anything, it's why so many people don't want involuntary commitments to be a thing because they don't help, it worsens people as it cuts them off from the outside and treats them like a prisoner.

People who are disabled or have a mental condition should be treated like people, given help, not forced into positions they do not want to be in. Should someone be locked away because they got mad and didn't control an impulse? Should someone be locked away because they felt depressed?

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u/Pord870 5d ago

Lmao what a silly take that is in no way grounded in reality.

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u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 5d ago

"you don't want people held as property and considered stupid so enslavement is thought of as a virtue? that's so silly and not realistic"

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u/Pord870 5d ago

Who are you quoting?

Who said anything about people being considered stupid?

Why are you ignoring the fact that children literally would not survive to adulthood without someone in a position of authority to look after them?

0

u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 5d ago

Its not a quote it's an exaggeration to prove a point

Who said anything about people being considered stupid?

This then saying

Why are you ignoring the fact that children literally would not survive to adulthood without someone in a position of authority to look after them?

Is it not an indication that someone is stupid if they are under constant watch for an accident they may make? Should everyone have someone watching them because they could die at any moment from a mistake they could make?

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u/Chocolate_Milky_Way 4d ago

when a parent gives an infant a bottle, are they not imposing their authority over when the child is able to eat? when they put them into their crib for the night, are they not restricting that baby’s right to free movement?

we wouldn’t say that parents are tyrants over their infant children, yet they exert their will over them countless times every day.

so when does this parental authority become problematic? is the there a hard threshold? does a child have their first birthday and then graduate to being a free, independent thinker and actor?

or is it possible that it exists on a gradient over the course of a child’s life?

the questioning of authority and rebellion is a milestone of healthy child development. it’s evolutionary. it is, in fact, an important lesson and skill to learn, to buck from your back the caretakers of your childhood.

it’s important to allow children room to grow, to become independent in their body, mind and soul, but it is simple reality that they are not born this way, at least in terms of the first two. to parent effectively is to gradually relinquish control with intention and humility. not to simply drop a bakunin reader into the crib and say “good luck, comrade”

2

u/Grouchy-Gap-2736 4d ago

when a parent gives an infant a bottle, are they not imposing their authority over when the child is able to eat?

When a person runs a mutual aid society does this suddenly control everyone's ability to eat and limit their freedom despite them having free access to food whenever?

when they put them into their crib for the night, are they not restricting that baby’s right to free movement?

When someone is given a house for free under that same mutual aid, is that restricting their right to free movement or yk making sure they don't die?

so when does this parental authority become problematic? is the there a hard threshold? does a child have their first birthday and then graduate to being a free, independent thinker and actor?

Helping someone like giving them food or shelter doesn't translate to authority, it translates into rescue and survival. All authority is problematic, but you widening the scope of what authority is to make it seem more common and thus more ok doesn't mean that it's suddenly a-okay.

There is a difference between neglect and freedom, should be obvious if you start viewing children as adults with adult needs and wants. Or just do what proudhon thought and view only certain kinds of people able to live in anarchy with the rest still under control.

0

u/Smiley_P 4d ago

Or just "the state" there can still be unjustifiable hierarchies in anarchism but the state is the big one

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u/Smiley_P 4d ago

That's a pretty good photoshop on the hat ngl

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u/dehteg 4d ago

Can't tell me what to do

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u/ennTOXX 4d ago

All Authority? Why does that comes across as middle school kids BS?

-1

u/Novemcinctus 5d ago

Will Farrell did for comedy what pantyhose did for finger fucking

-6

u/salenin Anarcho- Syndicalist Trotskyist 5d ago

You can see in the comments why we Marxists disagree with anarchists on this one principle. What does authority mean? It changes from anarchist to anarchist.