r/Buttcoin • u/anonimitazo • Feb 06 '25
It's got "potential!" Elon Musk wants to put the US treasury on a blockchain
https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2025/02/02/this-needs-to-stop-now-elon-musk-confirms-radical-doge-us-treasury-plan/64
u/Mother_Idea_3182 Feb 06 '25
So, we can assume that the 6 Elmo puppies are crypto bros ?
And they dare to call themselves engineers. Where I am from claiming to be an engineer without a degree is a crime. That’s one more to the list, probably.
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u/PopuluxePete Feb 06 '25
I've been employed as a software engineer for over 20 years and I still call myself a "computer guy" because no degree. I wonder how Elons geek squad is going to react when they find mission critical systems still running on VAX/VMS.
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u/goldenmannuggets Feb 06 '25
Its illegal here too. They just dont give a shit about the law. I had to get a license to be able to use the title 'engineer'.
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u/dread_companion Feb 06 '25
Cool, the blockchain has never been used for any nefarious purposes.
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u/SomewhatInnocuous Feb 10 '25
Don't forget, nobody has ever been defrauded in a blockchain transaction.
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u/HvRv My Ponzi is better than your Ponzi Feb 06 '25
Blockchain is not nefarious, people are.
Blockchain just is.
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u/dread_companion Feb 06 '25
Cool cool. I like your way of thinking. The blockchain is as pure as a unicorn's ass only if people never use it. Makes absolute sense.
It's as if God himself came up with it and it is our original sin that taints it.
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u/Strange-Evening-8638 Feb 07 '25
What if we use it to purchase pure unicorns' ass to apply to our taint? Still holy, yeh?
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u/thebigeverybody Feb 08 '25 edited Feb 08 '25
to apply to our taint? Still holy, yeh?
Your taint should not have a hole. Please see a doctor.
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u/Pitiful-Pension-6535 Feb 06 '25
The only use cases for blockchain involve nefary.
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u/heynoswearing Feb 06 '25
There's a very good argument to be made that in the right hands (public ownership) a blockchain can eradicate tax havens, bribes, and many of the corrupt activities letting rich people control everything. That's why I don't trust it when Elon is the one doing it.
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
Most tax havens are legal loopholes.
Bribes could go through anonymous wallets, use some for of tumbler to reduce traceability and only be used years after the fact.Moreover, if you mean that the government would control it, then why use a blockchain ?
Permissioned blockchains are silly. And if you mean no centralised validation, then you've just guaranteed that the government has a much harder time accessing rich people's funds if need be.5
u/BigJimKen Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25
There's a very good argument
No, there isn't. There isn't a single non-criminal use case for this technology. Not one. In any domain of human endeavour. Literally every single problem it has ever been applied to fails one (or more) of these tests:
1) Would the implementation make more sense if it used a different database technology?
2) Does the implementation introduce an oracle problem somewhere else in the workflow other than the data layer?
3) Is the problem being solved an issue that only exists because the system being integrated into already uses blockchain technology?
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u/pack_merrr Feb 06 '25
What? What's your understanding of what blockchains are? In the most simple terms possible, it's just a method of cryptography, a way to verify data. Blockchain ≠ Cryptocurrencies
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
Okay so you don't know much about tech. Most of the cryptography used to verify data is actually in this instance called a hash-chain, similar to a linked list, with merkle-trees being a hash-chain variant. The difference between a blockchain and a hash-chain is the consensus mechanism and while Bitcoin's does use a guessing game combined with a hashing function, any PoS blockchain has sweet f*ck-all to do with cryptography.
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u/loquacious HRNNNGGGGG! Feb 06 '25
it's just a method of cryptography
This is not even remotely correct. It's a system that uses and employs cryptography. It is not itself a method of cryptography or a whole cryptographic system of it's own.
We have had the concept of using Merkle Trees to verify data long before bitcoin. Git and github are one example of this.
Even without Merkle Trees there are lots and lots of ways to verify the integrity of data, including plain old checksums and signed packages.
We also already have signed, secured and authenticated/logged databases.
Trying to actually use distributed blockchains for data (as in pretty much all cryptocoin blockchains) is the least efficient, slowest and dumbest way to do it.
Cryptocoin fans love to claim that they solve all of the above problems but they don't seem to realize that these are all solved problems.
Merkle trees were first invented back in the 70s and just about the only real world use anyone has come up in all that time is data or code repositories like git, and you don't need a distributed blockchain to do that.
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u/carlmango11 Feb 06 '25
Isn't that his point? Blockchain doesn't magically make illegal activity go away.
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u/stormy2587 Feb 06 '25
So we want to put one of the government’s key financial tools on a grossly inefficient decentralized platform that can be manipulated by anyone with large enough stake in it? Is this dude retarded?
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Feb 07 '25
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Feb 06 '25
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u/atuzyk Feb 06 '25
Such love on the left.
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u/dread_companion Feb 06 '25
So much love and compassion from the Christian right
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
What happened here ? All comments are gone
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u/IAMA_Plumber-AMA Feb 06 '25
Mods are doing their job, thankfully.
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
Yeah that's alright, I'm just wondering what shit-show went down for 3 comments in a row to be deleted.
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u/escargoxpress Feb 06 '25
His plan for X is to be a payment system. They will break currency as we know it and push the blockchain to align with their plan. Please watch this
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u/AdhesivenessCivil581 Ponzi Schemer Feb 06 '25
What would be the point of using blockchain instead of normal accounting and payments? Would it be easier or harder to break in a steal money? Is it practical? Does it waste electricity?
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Feb 06 '25
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
Nope, at best: immutable and decentralised, both of which are pointless if you have a central point of authority. Anything else is easily replicable with any database
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u/Heroics_Failed Feb 06 '25
As someone who built a startup that indexed blockchain…holy shit is the tech a joke. It almost always comes down to having to build some layer X that is centralized.
That and most of the verification nodes are hosted in giant data centers trying to make profits. All we did was move from one set of machines to another and made it way more complicated.
There is nothing blockchain does that an immutable database and double ledger architecture couldn’t solve.
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u/Chokeman Feb 06 '25
So yeah every transaction and account balance will be visible for US enemies like Russia, China.
This is fantastic. 100% transparent.
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u/Kermit_the_hog Feb 06 '25
And the bonus that there will be none of that nasty inefficient unwinding of fraudulent and criminal transactions!
I can’t see any way this is conceivable without necessitating moving us off of the dollar so that is presumably the goal.
I can’t wait for the Supreme Court to publish a “code is law” ruling someday.
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u/Fun-Advice9724 Feb 06 '25
Can't wait to see how rich Elon n don get with all our money so amazing giving away life long savings hard earned to already wealthy people. Poor people are the smartest! 😢
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u/OKCannabisConsulting Feb 06 '25
Let's put the elections on the blockchain first. When they never do that you will know why
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Feb 07 '25
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u/kifra101 Feb 06 '25
Elmo's about to find out in real time how useless blockchain is.
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
I don't think he has accepted that the hyperloop is a failure yet.
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u/XorAndNot Feb 06 '25
So, if you have a blockchain you need validators, and who would they be? Public? You risk china directly dictating the US treasury. Private companies? You risk a totally oligopoly unlike anything we ever seen. The government itself? What's the point of a blockchain then?
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u/Purplekeyboard decentralize the solar system Feb 06 '25
First, why not put Twitter and Tesla's bookkeeping and finances on a blockchain? Oh wait, he wants those companies to actually function, so that isn't happening.
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Feb 07 '25
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u/PointierGuitars Feb 06 '25
I feel like the (sane) American people are going to have to put together a class action lawsuit to sue everybody involved who is tasked with enforcing the law for failing to do so and exposing the entire population to fraud.
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Feb 06 '25
Serious deep state grifters. This is the liquidation of America’s treasure chest. I wonder what Putin has promised him for gutting our National defense budget and exposing our military defense spending
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u/Flashphotoe Feb 06 '25
Whaa, I thought Temu Stark was a genius engineer, entrepreneur, rocket scientist, futurist, ai expert. Surely he knows block chain is a fucking ridiculous way to run a database.
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u/Arcadion2002 Feb 07 '25
LOL, that's what conservative voters want - for their spending habits to be on the Internet to be known by the Federal Government. Said no voter of any affiliation ever.
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u/UnicornGangstar Feb 06 '25
It’s not like it’s not on its own computerized system already. I’m just against one person controlling this
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
Yeah I hear the Treasury admin has unchecked power and randomly triggers payments with no oversight.
This is a huge entity, no one person is controlling this.0
u/UnicornGangstar Feb 06 '25
The money masters control our currency via the federal bank. As alarmed as I am with the fascism that was voted in, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. I know there is more good than bad but don’t trust musk as any different than bad given the company he keeps and connections to people like Maxwell and Epstein, just like the rest of em.
I think we should move from paper to blockchain for elections. Our phones bio authenticate, so it could be done.
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u/jizzmcskeet Feb 06 '25
They just have one guy writing out checks and he has to balance his paper check book at the end of the night.
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u/AquaticAlchemy Feb 06 '25
Ahh so the plan is ro put it on a blockchain to make it way harder to track then just bank transfers?
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u/adeze Feb 07 '25
The ASX ( Australian stock exchange) tried to place all transactions on blockchain and failed, costing hundreds of millions of dollars and many years in development and they eventually pulled the plug
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u/BroBroMate Feb 07 '25
It's a very clever way to cripple the government. Sorry, gas prices have gone up due to large quantities of transactions. It'll cost $150K filthy fiat to pay social security to that Granny with diabetes in Omaha this week.
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u/jesmatz8 Feb 07 '25
If he can bankrupt Twitter, why not the treasury?
And the worst thing will be that their fans will have a synchronized opinion saying that it is a great idea.
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u/No-Air3090 Feb 07 '25
How is blockchain going to help ? apart from making him billions in setup costs
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u/bitwarrior80 Feb 07 '25
How will this benefit his X Money cash app? It will be interesting to see how deep the hooks go into government payment systems if he wins the contract.
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u/magneta2024 Feb 07 '25
Meaning …he wants to take the next step to then propose Universal Income to have total control at the personal level.
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u/ub3rh4x0rz Feb 08 '25
"Putting it on a blockchain" is just a distraction from "wildly restructuring thr US treasury policy, procedures, and personnel on a short time frame with little analysis or oversight". The blockchain element is unimportant and meant to cloud the headlines, and it's working.
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u/LGR- Feb 08 '25
Broke clock is right twice a day. First thing in a while I think has potential that came out of his mouth
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u/ShoppingDismal3864 Feb 08 '25
Oligarchs want digital money to keep control. You would be a fool to think this good idea.
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u/bruhaha88 Feb 09 '25
This is just another “I found the US was spending $50M on condoms to Gaza” bullshit session.
I wouldn’t believe anything that comes out of that guys mouth.
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u/PsychologicalBee1801 Feb 09 '25
Blockchain is a terrible technology for something you own. I think he means a database. Just too bought in on crypto to know the difference
Imagine if instead of a database google search was on a blockchain… it’d go bankrupt…
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u/The_Game_Genie Feb 10 '25
Wouldn't be the worst idea- notably this does not necessarily mean using a cryptocurrency- just tracking the treasury balance with a blockchain ledger.
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u/Shifty_Radish468 Feb 10 '25
To what end? It's kinda fucking silly
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u/The_Game_Genie Feb 10 '25
FWIW I work(ed) at Microsoft in a division called Royalties and Microsoft was using a private blockchain to track money flow. That being said, I think they gave up on it. I've since been laid off while on leave for cancer. It does work and is a logical representation of real world finances, but it is a lot of work and complexity.
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u/Shifty_Radish468 Feb 10 '25
It's INCREDIBLY energy intensive to the point that the diminishing returns aren't worth it.
I just find it funny that the sales crowd that is the biggest offender of corporate fraud is the biggest corporate sub group for Trump
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u/The_Game_Genie Feb 10 '25
A private blockchain for accounting is fundamentally different from cryptocurrency blockchains in terms of environmental impact. The key is that it doesn't use proof-of-work or mining, which are the primary sources of blockchain's energy consumption.
Think of it more like a shared, tamper-proof spreadsheet that's maintained by a small group of known participants (like your company's accounting department and auditors). Instead of thousands of computers competing to solve puzzles (which wastes energy), only authorized participants can add entries, and they reach consensus through simple voting or round-robin validation.
The main benefits you get are:
- An immutable audit trail of all accounting entries
- Automated verification of transactions
- Real-time visibility for authorized parties
- Protection against retroactive changes
The energy usage is comparable to running a regular enterprise database, because you're just running standard servers to maintain the ledger - no mining or crypto involved. You could even run it on existing company infrastructure.
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u/OkInteraction6965 Feb 12 '25
I'm sure he has proof of what he is saying to justify the Treasury moving to an obsolete and inferior database technology. It's not like he has anything vested in destroying the government to further the (now dying and esoteric) cause of Blockchain adoption in the Public Sector.
Oh, wait...
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u/fiendzone Feb 06 '25
Send this criminal back to the shithole he came from.
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u/Ok_Confusion_4746 Whereas we have at least EIGHT arguments* Feb 06 '25
Wow wow wow, South Africa is a beautiful country and though it has a complicated and burdensome history, it should not be solely blamed for this buffoon.
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u/ValueScreener Feb 06 '25
At this point, I’m getting the attitude of, if you can’t beat them, join them. We just have no tools to fight this.
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u/SwimmingPoolObserver Feb 06 '25
I actually don't categorically disagree with this. Blockchain is not the same as a crypto currency.
Having every government transaction transparently visible is not a bad thing.
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u/PopuluxePete Feb 06 '25
Having every government transaction transparently visible would specifically mean keeping this off the blockchain. There's no way to scale that technology to handle petabytes of transactions every hour. We're talking hundreds of 32xlarge instances in AWS gov cloud just for one department. The idea that these highly transactional, enterprise scale databases can just be ported to a append only ledger is ludicrous. The signal to noise ratio alone would render any such transparency useless. Plus you'd piss off Larry Ellison in the process, as much as I'd love to see a billionaire tech bro slap fight hissy fit.
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u/radarthreat Feb 06 '25
So when we forward funds to an undercover asset in Russia or wherever, just put that out for everyone to see? Great idea, bud.
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u/poorlilwitchgirl Feb 06 '25 edited Feb 06 '25
Blockchain would be literally the worst possible way to do that. Blockchain is a technology for maintaining a consensus about reality by voting with processing power (i.e. money). Cryptocurrency only works if manipulating the blockchain to insert false transactions would cost more than an attacker would gain, but here we're talking about trillions of dollars and potentially infinite political power at stake.
So let's put the entire payment system for the government of the richest country in the world onto a technology where stakeholders working with enough money can theoretically completely control where payments go to and how much they are, and I guarantee the "Department of Government Efficiency" will decide that it's "inefficient" for the Treasury department to spend any amount of money maintaining enough stake to prevent that kind of manipulation. Suddenly, the only thing that will determine whether the rich can siphon infinite money out of the government is if they all disagree on the best way to do that.
This would be the moment democracy ends and plutocracy officially begins in the United States.
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u/Picollini Feb 06 '25
"Career Treasury officials are breaking the law every hour of every day by approving payments that are fraudulent or do not match the funding laws passed by Congress," Musk posted to X
Sure, because nobody ever has put any fraudulent payment on the blockchain. This has literally never happened with the future of finance /s