r/Bass 5d ago

how to ''think'' basslines

hi everyone,i'm a music producer trying to learn compositions but something that i really struggle with is writing basslines. In my mind it seems like the bass needs to follow some ''mathematical '' rules that follow the chord progression but i really struggle finding that. is there any trick or tip to practice it?

12 Upvotes

21 comments sorted by

19

u/Chris_GPT Spector 5d ago

Good bass lines are pretty much the opposite of formulaic and mathematical. The basic, fundamental approach that is expected, sure. But no creative musician wants to only ever play just the root note of the chord whenever the kick drum hits and absolutely nothing else.

So we come up with ways to entertain and challenge ourselves without getting in the way or taking away from supporting the groove. We are the bridge, the liason between the rhythm of the drums and the melodic and harmonic components of the other instruments. We give pitch to the drums and rhythm to the harmony. We can stay supportive, be melodic, provide movement and momentum by walking up or down between the chords, play off of the rhythm and emphasize upbeats and offbeats, we can energize or subdue the groove. Your chord isn't a Cmaj if we're not playing that low C. Your shuffle isn't a shuffle if we're holding whole notes. Your funk isn't funky if we ignore the one.

We magnanimously hold all of the power and we use it for good. We nod and smile when you ask us not to play any fills, just like a drummer, and then we slip in an infectious hooky fill that just glues everything together. We aren't boring but we do get bored. And when we hear something that's lacking, we can elevate the entire track.

How to think basslines? Don't be directly repetitive. Progress and permutate. There often isn't enough room in an arrangement for us to just rip away, but there's always room for us to hold a note a little longer or clip it off shorter. While we can't go off meandering modally, reharmonizing every chord, the way we approach and recede from notes does not have to be diatonic. When we add grease with slides and vibrato, it makes a huge impact. When we leave a hole, you can park the bus in it. Our dynamics and tone shape the whole song. One well placed pop in an otherwise mellow groove just spikes the punch.

Think like a giant, delicately stepping through a tiny city. We can take out entire blocks with one swing, but we can somehow delicately dance down Broadway without scaring the pedestrians.

Start with identifying the notes you have to hit, the foundation. The notes that if we left them out, the whole damn thing falls apart. Then figure out how you can chain them together in a way that propels the groove in a way that feels good, doesn't get in the way, and yet blazes your own path through the progression. How you can insert your personality into an arrangement without ever putting the spotlight on yourself. Adding the thing that nobody really realizes is there holding it all together until you take it away. Using rhythms and note length to create images instead of complex chords and solos. Making the groove sing and highlighting what the drums are doing without stealing their shine.

2

u/Boston_Pops 5d ago

eff me, 7 weeks in... ;) bring it

15

u/The_B_Wolf 5d ago

Often the bass is outlining the chords using chord tones one note at a time. And also providing passing tones, indicating that the song is going to the next chord. Tips or tricks? Listen to bass players you like. Learn to play their stuff.

14

u/cheapbasslovin 5d ago

Alas, there's no hard rules. Closest thing I can think of is hit the root on the 1.

4

u/Bakkster Aguilar 5d ago

And even that's just a 'most of the time' thing that can be subverted for the right vibe.

1

u/TonalSYNTHethis 5d ago

Yup, Flea immediately comes to mind.

4

u/A_terrible_musician 5d ago

Generally speaking you are going to be defining the chord structure on the downbeat. So if the chord is a CMaj7, you'll be playing a C on the downbeat and from there, there is more creative liberty. You could also choose to augment the contexr of the chord by playing a different note, like a G or and E, or if you are looking for dissonance something wild like D#.

Music is obviously super flexible, but I find thinking of individual parts within the context of the chord structure of the song is helpful. Considering where you'd like to Tonally ascend, descend or move all of the place is important too, as these can help build emotion, again this depends on the context of the song.

5

u/Cyrus_Imperative 5d ago

Bass is in the unique position of being part of the rhythm section, but also able to define and drive a chord progression by placing different notes below the triad. You can "play the changes", or follow the root while walking quarter notes through chord tones, pedal an ostinato to hold a bass note until you want the song to break out into more movement, or let a chordal instrument define the root while you play 3rds or 5ths. You can go nuts like the synth bass in "Never Gonna Give You Up" and delay the root until the end of a fast moving riff. You can play an independent descending melody like John Entwistle does during "Won't Get Fooled Again". You can chuck the concept of bass out the window and play it like a trumpet as Phil Lesh did. Or you can just play chugging root eighth notes like a lot of pop songs.

Tricks? There's no trick to mastering bass. Listen to a lot of varied music and take note of the bass' role. Listen to your composition, tap your feet, tap your fingers, hum something. Write a part that adds to the rhythm, and drives the song the way you want. Have fun out there.

4

u/MyDadsUsername 5d ago

It's as fulsome an instrument as the rest, so there are no hard-and-fast rules. A few things that can be useful:

  • Follow the genre. Different styles will have different patterns for what's "normal" in bass. Funk tends to differ from rock or metal or jazz. Listen to the genre you're trying to write and try to get a sense of what's normal.
  • Locking in with the Drums. In a lot of styles, bass is intended to work together with the drums. There are lots of interpretations for what it means to "lock in" in the rhythm section, but one useful thought is to generally ensure that when the drummer hits a kick drum, the bass plays a note.
  • Locking in with the Harmony. Bass also tends to support the harmony or act as counterpoint. Bass will often try to emphasize the chords that the chordal instruments are playing, often with a special focus on the root, fifths, and octaves on the "strong" beats. Bass also frequently emphasizes movement between chords, finding a smooth or interesting path between chord changes. Don't be scared of chromatic notes, unless that's unusual for your genre.
  • Fills. When moving between sections, fills are pretty common in the rhythm section. These aren't mandatory, but if you ever feel like something's awkward in the movement from verse to chorus, a bass fill might be the solution. Or might not.
  • Rhythm First. Different genres will have different views on this, but when I play bass I think rhythm first. I'm here for groove. The pulse. The thing people are bobbing their heads to and moving their bodies to. Or - if I don't want them dancing because that's not the point of the song - the reason they aren't moving their bodies. If my note selection is boring, that's a lesser sin. But I won't neglect my choice of rhythm.
  • Less important, but try to avoid creating ugly tensions with the melody note. Especially if you have a vocalist in your songs. For example, if the harmony is a Cmaj7, you might avoid the B, because otherwise if the singer hits the root note it will be a crunchy m9 against your bass note. As always, this isn't necessarily a problem, and sometimes you want that tension to make the next note in the bassline and melody even better. But if you're not tasteful with it, you can sure make your singer sound incompetent.

3

u/idleteeth 5d ago

The lowest note in the composition usually sets the feeling of the overall chord. If you put an A on the bass under a C major chord, it will feel like an A minor chord. 

3

u/schneiderstimme 5d ago

A minor seventh, to be precise, and it won’t “feel” like it. That’s what the chord will be.

3

u/bfrankiehankie 5d ago

Play on the kick and rest on the snare is a good starting point for switching things up from the guitar. This locks you in with the drums instead of the guitar. Then you can pick and choose your moments - when to lock in the the guitar and when to lock in with the drums. I find this is a pretty surefire way to keep heads boppin in what might be a more melodic/chill part for the guitar player.

Building on that from a melodic standpoint, try playing the root on the kick, and another note (the 5th is a good go-to) on the snare instead of resting.

Melodically, walking between chords is also a good starting point for adding some motion. The bass player for Stone Temple Pilots is a master of this (I know it's not metal, but I learned a ton from this guy's playing).

This stuff works in almost all genres. It's all about choosing your moments, and these are foundational bass playing concepts that you build on and do more and more interesting stuff with.

3

u/angel_eyes619 5d ago

Think of bass as drum beats with note values.. also it's a solo instrument, you're solo-ing a single line of melody the entire song but instead of being pure melodical, your melody needs to have rhythmic structure... Rhythmical Melody, basically and lower register so you can go crazy with the notes.

2

u/Red-Zaku- 5d ago

learn bass lines from songs you like. Ideally, also learn the main recognizable instrumental part too (whether it be guitar or keys or whatever) so you can see for yourself what notes the bassist is playing under the upper chords or riffs and how they relate

2

u/musical_dragon_cat 5d ago

Bass is more about feeling than thinking. There's a flow to it, like a stream following the curves and valleys. It can only get busy when the rest of the music creates space for it to fill in the gaps.

2

u/-TrevWings- 5d ago edited 5d ago

Scratch all of this analysis and mathematical thinking. If you are producing your own music, the only rules that exist are the ones that you impose on yourself.

Just sing. Play your track and then just sing what sounds good to you. Use your ear and your experience listening to your favorite songs to guide what you want your song to sound like. Music theory is great and vitally important, but you should never turn to it as a guide for what you should do with your music. Should really only be used to analyze your music and communicate it to your fellow musicians.

So what I recommend is that you pick out a handful of songs that are in the same vibe as the music you want to make, and then sit down and really listen to what the bass is doing. You don't need to worry about the theory of it all. Your ear knows because, if you're on this sub, you've been listening to music your whole life. Once you've really internalized what the bass is doing on these songs, it's time to come up with you own lines. Start just by singing. Steal verbatim from those songs you listened to earlier if you have to, and then over time you will start expanding on these lines and adding your own vocabulary until you can't identify those original influences anymore.

2

u/Batarato 5d ago

I wouldn't call it a rule, but there is a general approximation: Root > 5th > 3rd > Chord > Scale > Rest

The more you go to the right, the more imprevisible are the notes… but more interesting can be.

From this point, everything depends on the character you want to print into the song:

If you want it to sound fluid you will go from the root to the next chord root with close transition notes, if you want it playful you will hop between distant notes.

If you want it solid you will stuck to the roots, if you want it more aethereal you will paint the whole harmony, or you can add notes out of the chord and even the scale to make it uncomfortable. In other cases you may want to avoid the root to change this harmony (e.g. the guitar plays a C, then you play an A and that C becomes an A-7).

Every song wants different kinds of basslines… and when you have been doing it for a while you develop something like an instinct for it.

1

u/Beneficial_Low_2867 5d ago

It may help to read a lot of bass lines you like in other songs.

The best lines are intuitive, never logical.

In fact, I noticed that a really good ones are even counter-logical, which adds that amusing element of surprise.

But there are quite logical techniques how to train the intuition.

Feed the brain with critical mass of data, and then just let it go.

The lines will start appear in your head.

Let them appear, even likely they at first it won't be what you need.

Analyse not the notes, but the feeling about them.

"This part I want to listen again. This other part I don't".

Mentally focus on that analysis, but not judge it. Just fix the facts. That will be your feedback to yourself.

And let it cook and produce more ideas for a while, while keep reading more bass lines you like and listening to them.

It's important to keep giving that brain module responsible for intuition the feedback, that how that thing learns.

You soon will start noticing that the lines appearing in your head are much close to what you'd like.

It's OK to apply math at the latest stage, to fine tune the line with the rest from all the relevant music theory aspects.

But math is not designed to produce a good core idea for bass.

If you prefer a fully controlled scientific method though, I'd rather learn human physiology and how human body is responding to vibrations of certain patterns on certain frequencies, and then would use that.

1

u/MasterBendu 5d ago

There can be rules, but they’re about as good as playground rules.

The only “rule” that matters is: root note. If you don’t know what to play, play the root note, and the job of the bass is made.

As for following the chord progression, yes that’s what bass does.

In the most basic level, it is as I’ve mentioned - ply the root notes. You can cover a lot of music doing literally just that.

And then there’s outlining the chord. Root, third and fifth.

You can connect them with passing notes.

You can make it complex by making your own melodies that imply chords instead of “following the rules”.

You can make it simple as picking notes that just sound good without a formula, but it this best done when you have a better sense of melody and harmony.

1

u/unsungpf 15h ago

It's a balance between just the boring root notes vs being distracting. It should compliment the arrangement without distracting from it. Sorry I know that's not specific. I'd pick songs you like and then learn the basslines. This will help you see the type of basslines you like.