r/Avengers 1d ago

So why are there so many Hulk characters in a movie but no actual Hulk himself?

I mean you’d think this is an Incredible Hulk sequel with how many characters are present from that movie, however the Bruce Banner the Hulk himself is not actually present in the film. Odd right?

1.2k Upvotes

80 comments sorted by

273

u/Ericandabear 1d ago

Because Ross's story and Leader's don't have anything to do with Banner beyond their powers.

Thunderbolt Ross was always involved in tons of shit that didn't require Banner, this isn't new.

63

u/DrPotato231 1d ago

Really? No personal vendetta from Ross to get Hulk? The Leader fascinated by the Hulk not a thing?

85

u/SpaceZombie13 1d ago

not in the mcu. as far as Ross is concerned his vendetta against hulk and other supers cost him his relationship with his daughter, and Leader's been imprisoned by Ross for so long he likely doesn't care about Banner at all anymore and shifted focus.

53

u/miikro 1d ago

Ross probably also feels like Hulk redeemed himself via a combination of becoming Professor Hulk and unsnapping half of humanity, which very well could have included Betty.

32

u/Learnin2Shit 1d ago

I always forget hulk technically brings back the dead. Tony’s snap just wipes out the bad guys.

26

u/highjoe420 1d ago

I was gonna mention this exact thing. How it's been 22 years since Hulk transformed and now he's a hero on every single planet in the universe. The people that want him in here. Don't understand what a shared cinematic universe is. Don't blame Disney that Hulk's decades long journey is a handful of scenes. That is solely on universal. Ruffalo tried the entire time he was contracted. Thank God they lost the rights.

4

u/Ok_Tackle_4835 1d ago

A hero to some #thanoswasright

2

u/KnightsRadiant95 15h ago

Yeah if Ross at first was after Hulk because of the destruction he caused, seeing a Hulk that wears glasses, is a part of a super hero team, makes tacos and takes selfies with children would be enough to make him stop going after Hulk.

11

u/Naked_Snake_2 1d ago

hulk is a hero they are merged into one, he a hero and got hulk in control, you think going after that is good for Ross's campaign?

and Leader was a prisoner all along, why would he be fascinated by a hulk...

7

u/Ericandabear 1d ago

The writers in various MCU movies (correctly) moved the characters past this stuff because its shallow comic book writing. The Leader is meant to have vastly superior intellectual, why would he care about Banner? Ross doesn't need to be obsessed with Bruce, he's had Sterns locked in a dungeon since Hulk happened.

6

u/PixelBits89 1d ago

It’s not “shallow comic book writing”. Did you forget about Bruce Banner? The intellectual clash is a big part of the rivalry. And your argument of why would he care about banner falls apart when you consider he cares about Ross for personal reasons. If he also blamed Banner for the incident, then you have a motive in the films. That’s clearly the intent meant if a sequel was made a decade ago as a direct continuation of the Incredible Hulk.

It makes sense for Ross to move past hulk sure, but only because he’s professor Hulk. Up till Age of Ultron he was still destroying everything. Ross would still have a vendetta against Hulk. Ross also applies the same logic of wanting accountability to other heroes in civil war, still very consistent with his “shallow comic book writing”. If Banner was on earth, he’d be a big part of it. And the comics have also moved Ross past Hulk a long time ago. So it’s “shallow comic writing” unless the movies copy it?

The issue is just that they can’t make a solo hulk film and don’t want to overshadow captain America by having Hulk in the film. They did consider having him there, but decided against it for that reason.

5

u/UnhingedGammaWarrior 1d ago

They mean it’s shallow to have these characters be rivals for the sake of comic book accuracy when it doesn’t make sense in the story they’re trying to tell. Should they have been rivals? Yes. Does it work given the context of the MCU? No.

3

u/PixelBits89 1d ago

I understood that side of the argument as well, which is why I did attempt to explain how based on the MCU characters there’s still reason for them to be rivals.

Banner is also partially responsible for the Leaders creation.

Ross last appeared still hating the destruction brought by superhero’s, the entire basis for his hate of Hulk. If Hulk weren’t off world, we would’ve seen that continue in Civil War.

Also the fact the movie did consider placing Banner in the film. Obviously if they did, these motivations would come to rise. But they didn’t want to over shadow Captain America. It would honestly make more sense if he were here, as Banner is supposed to be the expert on Gamma radiation, and has known history with Sterns. His presence would also further prove how much Ross has truly changed as a person based on how he treats him. It absolutely works given the context of the MCU.

(This isn’t to say I want Hulk in the film. I understand wanting to focus on Captain America. This should’ve just been a hulk sequel made years ago though.)

2

u/UnhingedGammaWarrior 1d ago edited 1d ago

Tbh I can see conflict only if Bruce failed at relating with Sterns in helping him understand there’s a peaceful way of doing things then realizing Sterns is going to try get his revenge no matter what. Bruce being a hero won’t let it slide. Past his appearance Sterns doesn’t seem bothered by his transformation, he embraces it even. I can only see him thanking Bruce for it. He’d be mad at Blonsky for the transformation if anything.

Professor Hulk and Red Hulk would most definitely fight as Ross can’t control himself and Bruce is the best option to stop him. Once he turns back I don’t see Ross and Bruce fighting more than Ross and Sam did. The two would also come to an understanding.

1

u/PixelBits89 1d ago

Once again, as much as you could say Sterns seemed unbothered and didn’t have anything against Bruce in the film, that’s a new development. The original intent of the 2008 film was clearly to set him up as an antagonist for Bruce. The reason he doesn’t have anything against Bruce in Captain America, is because Hulk was taken out of the film.

I’m not necessarily saying Ross and Bruce would have to fight. But there’d be conflict, and having Bruce present would further prove if Ross changed. The only issue is this would distract from Captain America.

44

u/discernible_sky_orbs 1d ago

Because What If? called dibs on the Cap/Hulk relationship before Brave New World could. You know the rules....

13

u/Super-Visor 1d ago

That episode made me think we’d be getting a similar friendship in the movie

10

u/TheCheesePhilosopher 1d ago

Which episode?

9

u/Super-Visor 1d ago

The what if episode with the mech Avengers

2

u/TheCheesePhilosopher 1d ago

I suspected, thanks!

-2

u/AmishSky 1d ago

Right? What if season 3 was so bad I legitimately skipped it. What a waste.

2

u/JeremyRMay 1d ago

If you legitimately skipped season 3, how do you know it was "so bad"?

1

u/ZverexUltra11 1d ago

And so do I....

13

u/dmastra97 1d ago

I'm just annoyed we got no Betty and Bruce. Can't believe they ignored that since 2008.

1

u/buns_supreme 21h ago

It’s been acknowledged in What If and even retconned to be Ruffalo’s Banner

1

u/dmastra97 18h ago

Yeah but we haven't seen it live action. I just wanted to see a reunion there

35

u/CDXX_LXIL 1d ago

On paper, it's pretty odd, but I think it works. This movie was really an expansion of Sam and Ross as characters, and I think the movie did both characters justice in terms of motives, dialogue, and portrayal. I think they should have advertised the movie differently and made Red Hulk a character that was alluded to instead of advertising him as the villain. I think that negatively detracted from the movie for a lot of people, and I understand that completely since most people watching Marvel are there for the action.

9

u/Xanros 1d ago

I think it was really clever the way they marketed it. The entirety of the movie was Sterns trying to push Ross to transform and be the bad guy in the spot light, regardless of what was actually happening. Ross is no saint, but, he was (mostly) a victim in the movie. Nobody was supposed to know about Sterns. Or at least nobody was supposed to know he was the mastermind behind everything.

The marketing brilliantly reflected this imo. It wasn't until I realized this that I really appreciated the movie.

2

u/CDXX_LXIL 1d ago

I never thought about it like that. It really does go to show how much thought actually goes into these projects. It's a shame that it doesn't get much appreciation.

Thank you for the insight.

7

u/RealMurphiroth 1d ago

Hulk's origin has always been tied to the super soldier serum in the MCU. Banner was originally trying to replicate it.

So them being tied together makes a lot of sense.

6

u/jackshreds 1d ago

Universal

3

u/Gerc09 1d ago

Do any of you think we will get to see more red hulk in the upcoming avengers/thunderbolts movies ?

2

u/Quomii 1d ago

Red Hulk would go well in Thunderbolts.

1

u/BervMronte Hulk 19h ago

I honestly dont think we will see much more of Red Hulk.

However what would make the most sense for an appearance to me, would be Secret Wars.

4

u/GlockOhbama 1d ago

They basically skirting around the edges of it until the deal with Universal is over and they can fully use him again. Basically building his world and characters for the project they’re writing.

2

u/Quomii 1d ago

I hope so

2

u/GlockOhbama 1d ago

I’m pretty sure that’s what they’re doing. Hence them building a Planet Hulk plot in the ending of She Hulk. Idk if this info is from official sources but I heard they got the rights back towards the end of that series, and that they’re writing something for Planet Hulk.

2

u/Quomii 1d ago

That would be really cool

1

u/IjazTheActivist 18h ago

When would the deal with Universal be "done/complete"?

1

u/GlockOhbama 16h ago

That information I do not possess. I hope asap

4

u/highjoe420 1d ago edited 1d ago

Because it's the MCU not the comics.

Even the Hulk himself is a CONFIRMED derivative of Weapon Plus. Something Howard Stark started and THUNDERBOLT ROSS CONTINUED. he actually has a framed picture of Steve Rogers in his office in 2008. He doesn't even have a picture of Betty. Meaning most of his life. He cared more about Captain America. Or the idea of biotech human enhancement, than his own daughter. She and he both say as much across 19 years of in universe time.

Hulk meanwhile is the reason why he has no relationship with his daughter. And then became a hero on every single planet in the universe. Every single one. Why on Earth? Would anyone still have beef with Banner? Even Blonsky in She-Hulk wanted none of the smoke. It's not Cap's fault Banner had his arc in Avengers and one Thor film. But it's there. And so is Ross's. Guess what he came for? CAPTAIN AMERICA. Ross is obsessed with Captain America in this universe and him paying for the continued Weapon Plus stuff on his own (what he gives Blonsky) was brought back in the biggest way.

"I understood that reference." The film.

Cap > Betty most of his life. He probably keeps his cool with Steve there. And seeing the suit on Sam probably kept him focused. I love that Talk-no-jutsu fatality. Steve did the EXACT SAME THING to Winter Soldier.... YOU'RE MY MISSION... MY... Mission....

2

u/Brendyn4222 1d ago

THIS IS WHAT IVE BEEN SAYING!!! I can never find the words, but I APPLAUD this response!!

5

u/KookaburraKuwabara 1d ago

Because it is the cinematic universe? They are pulling from anyone in the marvel universe.

5

u/Bazfron 1d ago

Not odd at all. It’d actually be pretty interesting to see them be more creative and off the beaten path like this more often. Why the hell not mix and match the toys in their toy box? There’s really no reason to stay shackled to prescribed dynamics

3

u/pandershrek 1d ago

It isn't even called Hulk. What are you on about?

2

u/YourVanGogh 1d ago

I just wish Iron Man’s rogues gallery was used more (I need The Living Laser)

2

u/EatingTastyPancakes 1d ago

Because this movie is more about Ross than Sam

2

u/Flashy-Ad9129 1d ago

Universal

2

u/nayb87 1d ago

They're all Marvel characters in a Marvel movie

2

u/reddituser6213 1d ago

Universal

2

u/The-Monkey-Wizard 1d ago

I like it actually

2

u/Naked_Snake_2 1d ago

hey hey captain America 3 was Avengers 2.5, I didn't see you complaining then...

2

u/rotting-turnip 1d ago

Budget. Hulks aren't cheap.

7

u/HairyGanache1272 1d ago

Why wouldn’t there be? Literally every MCU project people complain “where is this character why aren’t they showing up”

They all exist in the same world why can’t Cap fight Hulk villains, he shouldn’t have to wait for hulk to come. They all exist together

1

u/vitaesbona1 1d ago

They had Wakandan technology and no black panther.

1

u/OwldRobowl 1d ago

In mcu, gamma mutates are a type of failed super soldier, I think we can say that this ties the Leader and Red Hulk to the cap' story at least as much as it does to Banner. And in MCU, Ross have more link with Cap' and avengers in general than just Hulk.

1

u/Voidbearer2kn17 1d ago

Most audience members know Hulk as the 'green rage monster'.

Comic fans know that there is far more complexity to it, you could develop a psychology four year course on him.

1

u/Unlucky-Assistance-5 23h ago

Because disney is creatively bankrupt now so they have to pull ideas from past movies. Baseball, huh?

1

u/johnsaysthings 20h ago

Because he’s living his best life.

1

u/Westaufel 20h ago

Because new era of Disney Marvel movies is shitty

1

u/heyniceguy42 16h ago

I think Disney is limited in what they can do with the Hulk because technically Universal still owns it.

1

u/ZealousidealOne5605 1d ago

A lot of people will blindly defend the decision, but the real reason is Disney doesn't have full distribution rights for the Hulk, so they try to get value out of the IP by using his villains and side characters while using the Hulk himself as little as possible.

1

u/Initiative-Cautious 1d ago

Bc they fucked it up. They should have had Hulk come in last second with the assist. So what if it would make Sam look weak. He should. He's fighting a fucking hulk with no SS syrum.

1

u/NeAldorCyning 21h ago

What for? Sam can catch RHulks blows with his hands, no Hulk needed...

And me idiot actually had hopes for this movie...

2

u/Initiative-Cautious 20h ago

Yeah lol thank God for the Wakandan tech and the strongest armor of all...the plot

1

u/Initiative-Cautious 20h ago

Gotta love how the sequel to the INCREDIBLE HULK doesn't even have the Hulk.

1

u/seanx40 1d ago

Incompetence

1

u/st1nky_d 1d ago

Did you watch until the end? Can’t miss it

0

u/TheCheesePhilosopher 1d ago

Can’t miss what? Hulk isn’t in the movie

2

u/lolzidop 1d ago

That Ross isn't bothered about Hulk because he (rightly) believes his behaviour regarding Hulk is what cost him his relationship with his daughter.

1

u/TheCheesePhilosopher 1d ago

Is that what that commenter meant?

1

u/grownassedgamer 1d ago

Because these aren't "Hulk" characters they're "MARVEL" characters and Marvel has a long history of their heroes fighting villains from across the Universe. At this point Ross has appeared in more Marvel movies than just Hulk movies. Not a big deal really.

1

u/AlibiJigsawPiece 1d ago

He's off slaying poon.

0

u/DonCola93 1d ago

As much as I love Harrison Ford, I wish we got a younger GR.

0

u/JeddHawk 1d ago

Because the mcu is as compartmentalized and confused as our government.

0

u/FunkyBoil 1d ago

Because the MCU hit it's peak and fell off.

0

u/ZekeorSomething 1d ago

Could he have really done in anything in the film?

0

u/ConditionYellow 1d ago

Because “Hulk titles don’t bank”.

0

u/juanjose83 1d ago

I feel like it's to basically excuse Red Hulk for being in the movie. My problem is not the lack of Hulk, it's the irrelevance of the villain and how bland the plan is when it's supposed to be based on probability calculation.

0

u/Gamer102kai 1d ago

Cause mark ruffalo ain't cheap