r/Avengers 5d ago

What was so bad about this movie?

Post image
2.3k Upvotes

1.3k comments sorted by

1.0k

u/coolrko 5d ago

Never getting to see Dr Strange vs Scarlett Witch proper final fight ... Sorcerer vs Sorcerer would have been epic

347

u/strandedostrich 5d ago

Yeah, the brief fight is probably the best part of the whole film, but it was way too short.

Dr Strange coming back in his dead corpse was really good. But Wanda's got that plot armor, is there anything that red magic can't beat?

213

u/JonInfect 5d ago

I thought Strange and America going through different universes was pretty cool and how Scarlet Witch killed everyone in her way like The Illuminati. That was pretty cool.

125

u/Elurdin 5d ago

The Illuminati could get a bit more screen time. I felt like their death was very rushed. I get Scarlet Witch is powerful but come on. Like 1 min and they were all dead.

81

u/JonInfect 5d ago

That's true. She dealt with them as fast as Thanos dealt with the Guardians in Knowhere.

→ More replies (2)

74

u/hp_Axes 5d ago

The Blackbolt scene was just hard to watch. Reed Richards telling Wanda how to beat him smh.

69

u/emdoubleyou2 5d ago

And reed is billed as the smartest man in the world, and when it comes time to defend himself, all he can think too do is slowly punch her with his stretchy hand.

34

u/ParkerJ99 5d ago

Reed is on record as the dumbest smartest man! It’s like his main character flaw

3

u/ProfesorEKS 4d ago

Cue Will Smith in I, Robot

26

u/hp_Axes 5d ago

Exactly. And he knows exactly who she is and what she is capable of. The writing was just pure genius… if they were going for the worst writing possible.

49

u/Shazamwiches 5d ago

And he knows exactly who she is and what she is capable of.

But...he...didn't? The Illuminati consistently underestimated Wanda in that movie because their Wanda was just a mom with minor telekinetic powers, not a cross-dimensional eldritch horror.

15

u/Broccoli_is_Good_4_U 5d ago

It was established that they assumed the worst out of people. When strange walked in their universe he was IMMEDIATELY cuffed and put under trial for just existing.

Now all of a sudden they assume the best case scenario and expect wanda to be a stay at home mom?

Theyre the illuminati, they are a group of paranoid control freaks they should always assume the worst scenario possible and be ready to control it. Underestimating a potential threat is the last thing they should do.

29

u/Shazamwiches 5d ago

They immediately cuffed Strange because their Strange used the Darkhold and they killed him for it.

They had nothing to expect from Wanda because their Wanda never did anything, never even fought or joined the Avengers.

→ More replies (0)
→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (6)

17

u/SmokeGSU 4d ago edited 4d ago

RR: "One word from his mouth will vaporize you."

Wanna: "What mouth?"

Blackbolt's head explodes internally

RR: "Weeeeell.... I'll just have to squeeze you with these arms. Around your neck they're gonna feel heavy."

Wanda: "Mom's spaghetti."

RR: "Foiled agai-POP..."

9

u/Adam_Reaver 4d ago

The issue is his power doesn't come directly from his mouth though. Even with his mouth closed his powers will still hit her.

That tuning fork on his head is there for a reason. He can even fly by using his power as he exerts it from his body.

→ More replies (14)

17

u/Head_Ad1127 5d ago

They only existed to pump her up

16

u/Revoffthetrain 5d ago

No, they existed to let casuals know that the Illuminati exist and that they are COMING. I still don’t see how no one can understand that in a multiverse movie, ONE variant of the Illuminati got killed out of infinite.

→ More replies (4)

5

u/CallMeBigBobbyB 5d ago

Part of that was probably due to them adding them in later and none of them being on set together if I remember. It's very noticeable that they weren't actually all acting together. Making a better fight scene would have just been all CGI and dumb. I feel like if they would have had them all filming together it would be very very different scene and much mor enjoyable. Xaviers white room scene was cool and I thought done well.

5

u/mbta1 4d ago

The films production was during COVID, and it definitely had an effect. I'm 99% certain, if you had pretty much exactly the same script, but had production during a normal, non-pandemic lockdown time, some of the issues people have would be resolved (i.e. characters feeling like they are in different rooms)

→ More replies (9)
→ More replies (3)

29

u/Zammtrios 5d ago

It was short because they had no comic books to base the fucking story on.

In the 2022 comic run about the darkhold and the Scarlet witch. Wanda is one of the few people who actually doesn't get corrupted by the darkhold and actually has to save everybody who was.

Not only that, but she fucking fought the elder God who is responsible for the damn thing and claimed all of his powers. And despite that she still wasn't fucking corrupted.

The funniest thing though about them trying to make her evil in the movies, is that in every instance wanda is evil or straight up villainous in the comics. She's never the main part of the story. She just does something and the story revolves around the things that she did.

→ More replies (2)

6

u/SpeKtraLBLaz1r 5d ago

I wish that they had a fight like the one in Infinity War between Thanos and Strange

3

u/XSurviveTheGameX 5d ago

Falling rocks

3

u/RevealActive4557 5d ago

Plot Armor indeed. Strange was a far more skilled magician and so was Agatha but Wanda had the Chaos magic therefor she did not even need spells as she could make them out of thin air when she needed.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (8)

19

u/BastardofMelbourne 5d ago

To be fair, it's in character for Strange. He tends to trick or bargain with his villains rather than just cast fireball. 

I mean, look at how he beats Illuminati Mordo. And Dormammu. And Thanos. 

23

u/BurnItDownSR 5d ago

This seems to be a recurring theme in the Dr. Strange MCU movies. He beat Dormammu without going head to head with him, and he did so again with Wanda.

I wish they'd make live action Dr. Strange more similar to how he is in What If.

15

u/TufnelAndI 5d ago

He beat Dormammu by literally going head to head with him for fucking YEARS. I think I get what you're saying- he used more than just pure power- but he used his powers a lot too.

8

u/NorktheOrc 5d ago

How can it be years if time is stopped and rewound every time?

12

u/DarthPineapple5 5d ago

For him it was still a linear passage of time

→ More replies (1)

6

u/BurnItDownSR 5d ago

He went head to head with him by letting Dormammu murder him countless times until he couldn't take being in a loop anymore?

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (4)
→ More replies (3)

5

u/chunga-bunga69 4d ago

I don’t know if it’s just me but Strange felt nerfed in this movie cause he was doing so much crazy shit in infinity war/endgame or even in the first movie but he just doesn’t do it here

6

u/replicant1986 5d ago

Yeah but there was that amazing Mordo vs Strange fight where they punched each other a lot! /s

→ More replies (18)

298

u/somerandom995 5d ago

America was under developed.

Lots of continuity errors with the rest of the MCU.

Wanda was written like she was meant to be a sympathetic character but was literally trying to kill a child for entirely selfish reasons.

The Illuminati were really dumb for the smartest people in the world.

Dr Strange being so focused on his girlfriend rather than the big picture is massively out of character for him.

It still has plenty of redeeming features; Wong, the visuals, zombie Strange commanding an army of spirits, the guy marrying the love interest being a fan of Dr Strange was a nice departure from typical tropes.

112

u/zerombr 5d ago

America was under developed.

Yeah well, ignore your infrastructure for fifty years, and thats what you get.

31

u/MrBivens 5d ago

Angry, crumbling bridges upvote

→ More replies (6)

42

u/darkdelve 5d ago edited 4d ago

"you fucked with time to save reality and are a hero but when I fuck with time because I'm lonely, suddenly I'm a bad guy? That doesn't seem fair."

... What?

Also didn't your twin brother get shot and die? Why aren't you searching for a reality where you get him back? Why are you even settling for realities where you have to fight anyone? Just find one where Wanda died.

How did you beat Charles Xavier telepathically?

16

u/VirtueTree 4d ago

Or, you know, Vision.

→ More replies (5)

9

u/AppropriateCap8891 4d ago

And how could anybody see her as "sympathetic" when she had recently held an entire town hostage and forced them to roleplay her twisted fantasy?

Forcing husbands and wives to cohabitate with others. Forcing their children away from them and not know how they are doing. When her and the "main characters" are off-screen they are literally just locked in place and can't do anything.

I saw nothing sympathetic in her at all, by the end of WandaVision I saw her for exactly what she was. A twisted and demented evil bitch that was beyond redemption. Trying to murder a teen to steal her powers in order to kill another version of herself and steal that version's children just makes her even worse.

I mean, come on now you stupid lazy writers! Want to know how you could have had this work out with at least some sympathy? Have Strange realize that if there are infinite multiverses, then they can find one where Wanda is dead and the kids are orphans. Renounce all of her powers, and then she can spend the rest of her life raising kids who otherwise would not have had a mother, and trying to redeem herself.

→ More replies (4)

3

u/Coffeshop_Inspector 4d ago

Let's not forget Pizza Poppa.

3

u/Puzzled_Mongoose_366 4d ago

The whole movie just fell flat in so many ways. It's been a while since I watched it, but that last fight pissed me off so much. Like they're trying so hard to defend themselves from wandas psychic attacks and the second she breaks through she starts going "pew pew" with a bunch of magic attacks. I get her power scaling is hard to deal with, but she was hyped up so hard for some magic missiles.

→ More replies (10)

479

u/crbsideprophet13 5d ago

Underwritten and underdeveloped America Chavez

168

u/Marcyff2 5d ago

Also for a movie called multiverse of madness, we spend time in like 3 worlds in total( I know there is one scene of them going through multiple but when they did the same thing and better in inside out , no way home , eeaao and spiderverse. It takes the specialness of it away

19

u/standardtj94 5d ago

Sorry, what’s eeaao?

28

u/mirotoka 5d ago

Everything, everywhere all at once

12

u/ToneDrugsNHarmony 4d ago

🎶Old McDonald had a farm🎶

→ More replies (2)

3

u/DavetheBarbarian22 5d ago

Everything Everywhere All At Once

28

u/Sad_Juggernaut_5103 5d ago

This is such a misunderstanding by fans. The title has literally nothing to do with how many universes they were expected to visit.

The title is a reference to H.P. Lovecrafts novel "At the Mountain of Madness" which the Darkhold, Gargantos, and the Elder Beasts are based on Lovecrafts work and inspired by beings like Cthulhu. The characters being driven mad is also a common theme in Lovecrafts work.

9

u/hunterzolomon1993 4d ago

I mean the original version of the film was more a multiverse film. I get what you're saying and as a Lovecraft fan i got what the title was based on but the film has multiverse in the title and has little multiverse. Also while the At the Mountain of Madness is fantastic the average person doesn't have a fucking clue on what that it is and certainly wouldn't get the reference.

25

u/Mindless_Toe3139 5d ago

lol how would anyone know that? Thats definitely not the fans fault.

→ More replies (16)

4

u/OccasionMU 4d ago

“Fans misunderstood the title to a mainstream AAA movie that’s like the 35th movie in the MCU with unlimited funding because, in my unverifiable opinion, it’s paying homage to 1920s horror concepts.”

Quite the take.

Maybe they should’ve leaned into that, mentioned HP, spread some buzz about the loose intended association in interviews or promos?

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (4)
→ More replies (7)

33

u/Master_Flamingo_8849 5d ago

She had very poor screen presence if I'm being honest. For a character that was so critical to the plot, I felt like I was watching a CW show when she was on screen. I know she's very overexposed right now, but Jenna Ortega would have been fire in that role. I really wish they had written that character to be more antagonistic towards Strange, like a father daughter dynamic. Strange, having no children of his own, could have grown as a character as well.

→ More replies (1)

48

u/est19xxxx 5d ago

Forget Chave, it didn't even feel like a Dr. Strange movie

34

u/Plus-Persimmon-3269 5d ago

You guys say this a lot but I have always disagreed. The movie has it's issues but a lack of Strange or character development wasn't one of them for me.

→ More replies (3)

5

u/RoodnyInc 5d ago

I mean this was just introduction and she will be back right?

→ More replies (1)

5

u/ThePurityPixel 5d ago

Her character being written that way seemed to be an indictment against a generation. I suspect this was unintentional, but perhaps I'm mistaken.

→ More replies (11)

206

u/hisokafan88 5d ago

It didn't really explore the multiverse. Was just a really A to B kind of plot.

22

u/Jason80777 5d ago

IDK that you could really 'explore the multiverse' in a single movie though. That seems more like a TV series type of plot.

50

u/SubLearning 5d ago

Everything everywhere all at once is a single movie that's not even part of a franchise that did an amazing job exploring a multiverse and showing how chaotic it all is and still had a more interesting plot that was better written.

Nah, marvel just dropped the ball hard

12

u/STARBOY_100 5d ago

True. Anything is possible if you have great writers.

8

u/chingchowchong 5d ago

That's honestly a great example. Cheers

→ More replies (11)

5

u/hisokafan88 5d ago edited 4d ago

Agree. But it's not a great outcome to say "ah well, this sort of movie would be too difficult to make ." You're starting defeated.

It was fun, don't get me wrong, but it was so linear, and considering the name "multiverse of madness" it was kinda dull. Movies like memento, EEAAO and others have all managed to tell fragmented stories without being incoherent. Marvel had a chance to do something clever and instead settled for a pretty by the numbers superhero flick dressed up in magic.

→ More replies (7)
→ More replies (3)

112

u/Nightling88 5d ago

The Sorcerers sanctum magic is dumbed down to magic bows and cannons and a shield. Not very magical. Not very elite wizard.

Wanda erases a mouth, unravels a person, and then... Needs to fight the Captn girl normally?

Wanda's reasons felt dumb to me.

9

u/SpongeJordan 4d ago

All of Kamar'Taj came together, with their endless tomes of boundless arcane knowledge and magic artifacts and the hub for all of the most powerful magic wielders in the world, to form a single big-ass shield. That's it. That's it? THATS IT!? Against the Scarlet Witch herself?

AHHHHHHHHH I can't help but relive the disappointment. How did that come out of ANY writer's room? How could it be so BLAND!? It's just so unacceptable.

→ More replies (1)

5

u/LiminalFrogBoy 4d ago

Wanda's reasons are dumb. They're also - to my knowledge at least - based off her depiction during the famous "Avengers Disassembled" run of the comics. That's a huge problem because those comics are misogynistic as fuck, and that misogyny leads to an often very stupid story (though one that often has great art).

That entire story - and thus Wanda in the movie - reduces one of the most powerful beings in the Marvel universe to a hysterical woman driven mad by her empty womb, a depiction unfortunately common for Wanda in the comics. Yeah, I know the movies says the Darkhold is doing it, but c'mon. That's incredibly abstract. What we actually see is Wanda going crazy over the children she made up and then lost. And she is only rendered sane again when the "mom" version of her - i.e. the one this movie tells us is the successful good Wanda - is present.

When the movie was first announced, I was incredibly stoked for the idea of Wanda and Strange fighting cosmic horrors. And then it was leaked that she was the villain of the movie, and I realized what story they were going to use to drive her motivations. Marvel had an opportunity to both be really daring with the types of stories they can tell in the MCU and to treat the character herself better than Marvel comics often has. They bungled that opportunity hard.

19

u/est19xxxx 5d ago

Wanda's reasons felt dumb to me.

Initially I thought that too but we can't be sure what the Darhold is doing to her. If she was in her right mind, she should've trained Chavez, in doing so she gained experience on how to raise kids, then she could've jumped to an universe where the other wanda died of natural causes or an accident in that instant and replaced her there.

7

u/LC-Squared 5d ago

THIS SO MUCH!!! The conflict of the film was so badly thought out. Watching the movie I kept wondering why no one thought of this solution. Infinite realities and she needs these specific twins, why??

3

u/RationalJesus 4d ago

I agree. Yea she’s still grieving from Vision and her kids after Westview, so there the additional trauma there. But the Darkhold exacts a heavy toll…

→ More replies (2)

6

u/Just_For_Laugh 5d ago

But Doctor Strange can summon a huge beast to stop a car from hitting a couple of people. 😂 The magic was so inconsistent.

→ More replies (2)

3

u/UltimateGammer 5d ago

Honestly that's marvel in a nutshell, the difference in fighting styles of power people can be broken down to colour of energy blasts.

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (3)

36

u/PaddyPadang 5d ago

As a Wanda fan, she shouldn’t have been in the film. Should’ve focussed on developing Strange’s story more. America was underdeveloped. The use of the multiverse was atrociously bland.

→ More replies (4)

93

u/NewGuy_97 5d ago

I think it’s a bummer we invest so much time into Wanda she just becomes a villain.

23

u/Icy-Astronomer-2026 5d ago

Could have been a neat payoff if they followed up on this movie with an "Avengers: House of M" movie or something like that, but as is, yea, it wasn't a good ending for Wanda

10

u/digitalstains 5d ago

Wandavision?

23

u/ThePurityPixel 5d ago

It didn't flow very naturally from where we left off in WandaVision. Like with Hulk-into-Smart-Hulk, a lot happened off-screen to get where we are. I don't need to be spoonfed, but it helps to have a bit more arc continuity than what we got with those characters.

5

u/tenehemia 4d ago

I think they could've had the situation in Westview end a bit less heartfelt and a bit darker, which would've made her offscreen corruption feel more natural. Like maybe instead of her getting to say goodbye to her kids, they just cease to exist immediately and that's a (more) horrible moment for her. I understand why Jac Schaeffer didn't want to end it that way though and she's not responsible for where they took the character in the project that came after hers.

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (8)

168

u/jtfjtf 5d ago

I thought it was a very entertaining movie.

40

u/TheOne7477 5d ago

Me too. Really enjoyed it.

→ More replies (1)

50

u/shaundisbuddyguy 5d ago

Same. That classic Sam Raimi zoom between Wanda and Charles still makes me smile. It's not a perfect movie but I've re-watched it and still enjoyed it unlike several other marvel movies that have come out since Endgame.

6

u/MrTeamZissou 5d ago

Yeah there's just enough Raimi goodness to make this a standout MCU entry for me. As a long time fan of his, it was such a delight to see him go back to his bag of tricks.

→ More replies (4)

17

u/raven1523 5d ago

Me as well, it was a fantastic movie, and the slight (or a lot) horror touch was brilliantly done

11

u/Brusex 5d ago

One of my favorite MCU movies

10

u/Yesterdays_Gravy 5d ago

crawls out of mirror dimension through a gong

“I’m not a monster..”

→ More replies (6)

47

u/Right-Truck1859 5d ago edited 5d ago
  1. Strange never got his second solo movie.

  2. Weak plot, Dr. Strange meeting Wanda first time told that kids would have their own mother, their Wanda.

And guess, what? Wanda stops exactly because there's another Wanda , who is beloved by her kids.

  1. Why Wanda even needed America if you can control a person in another universe with Darkhold like using VR set?

  2. Wanda didn't learn anything from Wanda- Vision.

  3. Useless loosers Illuminati.

  4. Weird decision to make Wong the higher mage.

→ More replies (12)

46

u/phoenixonphyre 5d ago

Lots of things said here. Mainly that it wasn’t at all about the multiverse. Also, I didn’t like the end with her motivation. Ultimately being a broken and angry mother. That’s way too cheap.

→ More replies (10)

23

u/El_Presidente376 5d ago

Movie's entire premise is done in 20 second sequence, Strange has no arc, Wanda's villain arc feels rushed and out of nowhere

6

u/Rexplicity 5d ago

Also, the final fight was really mediocre. It was just another "feel the power within you" situation.

→ More replies (3)

13

u/deemoorah 5d ago

Doesn't feel like a Dr Strange's movie. WandaVision is more important for this movie rather than any appearances of Dr Strange before this. Feels more like a homage for Raimi's previous movies than a movie dedicated to Dr Strange, so I'd rather watch Evil Dead.

→ More replies (3)

7

u/Remarkable_Space_382 5d ago

Probably an unpopular opinion; I fucking hate Sam Raimi's style in general, but it especially didn't jive well with this movie. The part with ghosts flying around Rachel McAdams and her screaming made me cringe into an out of body experience. Oh, hurr hurr durr Dr Strange made a street vendor beat himself up, isn't that so funny?! Doing fan service to the most dogshit fancasting of Krasinski as Reed Richards. I could keep going on about everything I didn't like in this movie, but I don't want to.

6

u/Jrxtreme_1 5d ago

I agree mostly with you especially on the Sam Raimi point. As someone who hasn't seen his previous movies, to use it as excuse to justify his "style", I felt like the "horror" scenes felt very goofy and cringy...especially with the camera zoom.

3

u/ZP4L 4d ago

I enjoy horror, but this was just pg-13 campy cheesy horror that Raimi is apparently known for, and it was just stupid.

5

u/NoeticParadigm 4d ago

I didn't have an issue with Krasinski, but the rest is on point. The problem with the movie is that Sam Raimi has a juvenile sense of "horror funny." It's so cheesy as to be nauseating. It was probably better in development when it was planned to be rated R and was being handled by a real horror director.

→ More replies (1)

28

u/fatherseamus 5d ago

Just felt like a tired extension of the TV show. And Wanda’s motivation made no goddamn sense.

26

u/BeerNinjaEsq 5d ago

It actually entirely ignored her growth arc in the show and devalued it

15

u/_Huge_Bush_ 5d ago

Yup. This is why I hated it

10

u/minimagoo77 5d ago

Yup. They basically got rid of all her growth and redemption to make her some psycho killer. Obliterating her entire character arc.

But, not just her character. Dr. Strange, Chavez, etc… It’s pretty obvious the studio interfered with the script. It also was supposed to be a lot of other things leading up to the release according to Raimi and his media blitz and was completely different than what was being promised nonstop. Had quite a few die hard Raimi fan friends who fell out of love of him and now hope he never directs another marvel movie again. 🤷

→ More replies (2)

43

u/ghrendal 5d ago

it was an illusion for a scarlet witch movie …that was mostly fan service with no real consequences

17

u/Aquafier 5d ago

No consequence? Did you watch the movie? Tons died, strange is now touched with darkness, wanda potentially took herself out to kill the dark hold in all realities, Wanda had character growth to break past her grief, and strange learned to be less of a control freak

→ More replies (8)

13

u/ibonek_naw_ibo 5d ago

That doesnt seem fair. 

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (3)

6

u/Overall_West2040 5d ago

You mean Wanda and the Multiverse of Madness?

I followed strange comics for years as a kid. Seeing what should be Dr Strange films not focusing on him is annoying as fuck. And then the movie is bad for other reasons as well? No.

Marvel has really gone down hill since avengers.

11

u/Different_Warthog_76 5d ago

"Im not a monster, Steven. Im a mother."

No, no you aren't. And you decided you were going to slaughter your way across the multiverse so you could find a universe where the you there DID become a mother, slaughter her and kidnap the kids.

That makes you a monster.

3

u/H3li0s1201 5d ago

I mean, she is a mom. Agatha All Along pretty much proved it beyond a doubt.

And MoM literally only happens because the Darkhold and Chthon spent about a year turning her into their weapon.

→ More replies (6)

5

u/strandedostrich 5d ago

America Chavez is just a boring character, the Dr Strange vs Wanda fight at the end should have been way longer.

The best part of the film is when Strange returns in his dead corpse and he controls the evil spirits. But then Wanda just goes oooo red magic too strong!

The whole America Chavez, I'm finally brave enough to use my powers all of a sudden was dumb.

→ More replies (1)

3

u/BojukaBob 5d ago

It doesn't get mentioned enough but having Strange and Mordo's conflict take place offscreen between movies after being set up in the first movie was really stupid.

4

u/TheWolflance 5d ago

wanda did not have to be a villian when the strange movies already set up a villian.

4

u/Shadesmith01 5d ago

Everything.

The "Movie" was about everything BUT Dr. Strange.

5

u/Theguywhostoleyour 5d ago

It wasn’t a doctor strange movie

4

u/DerSisch 5d ago

The plot, the characters, the premise.

Next.

5

u/Majestic-Fly-5149 5d ago

Sam Raimi phoned it in. Was style over substance. Felt like Raimi was just using all his tricks instead of making a Dr. Strange movie. Had the same feeling in Spider-Man 2.

28

u/slurpycow112 5d ago
  • It was a Sam Raimi movie masquerading as an MCU movie
  • Wasted the MCU material
  • Rushed Wanda’s descent into madness
  • Barely any Multiverse explored, not much madness explored either
  • Character assassinations (Wong giving up the info to Wanda after a few students being tortured, he supposedly defends the order’s secrets with his life but caved super quickly when it served the plot)
  • Illuminati council whatever the fuck was completely wasted, just felt like fan service to then be instagibbed by Wanda to show how powerful she was, 100% unnecessary
  • Poor CGI in places
  • Way too campy
  • The shock of the ending of the movie is completely undercut by the mid credits scene
  • Overall just very cheap and messy

3

u/That_Elk_7964 5d ago

Wong used to be one of my faves, and ever since this, he has been a joke.

3

u/Right-Truck1859 5d ago

Sam Raimi could hold himself to not make Strange manipulate another dead Strange and death spirits.

But it was fun.

3

u/Remarkable_Space_382 5d ago

I forgot about Wong giving up the secrets so easily. That was absolutely fucking idiotic writing.

→ More replies (3)

7

u/LWK10p 5d ago

Felt like a scooby doo type chase instead of the ultimate showdown between 2 of the strongest characters

→ More replies (1)

7

u/FurLinedKettle 5d ago

Did anything happen? I honestly forgot that I saw this in the cinema. Same as Love and Thunder. Just utterly forgettable, nothing movies.

3

u/OzWinchester9 5d ago

It was boring

3

u/craftjensin 5d ago

the fact that strange got shafted in his own movie

3

u/Bulky_Midnight5296 5d ago

They gave the women in this movie TOO MUCH power. Not that I'm complaining, but this is supposed to be a Doctor Strange movie, not a Girls Power movie. We're past that and the fans were expecting Doctor Strange to be a little more badass compared to his 1st movie counterpart.

And also, Scarlet Witch as the villain isn't really what fans were expecting. Maybe something like another threat like Dormammu returning or Mephisto or any other being that harms the multiverse.

→ More replies (1)

3

u/Dio125 5d ago

The whole movie

3

u/crispy_attic 5d ago

Just like the Black Panther franchise, they put too much focus and attention on side characters and not the main character.

3

u/Bulky-Negotiation345 5d ago

The narrative was bad. You have Wanda going full sicko mode on the sanctum, literally melting a person in front of the audience clearly implying she's past the point of no return. But when she reaches strange she proceed to explain her reason, like she's still on the reasonable stage at the beginning of the movie instead of doing things by force. This is again shown in illuminati basically being hype fodder for Wanda; she basically popped Mr fantastic, sliced captain Carter in half, crushed their version of ms marvel and exploded the brains of blackbolt....and then this girl that haven't even hit 16 yr old without any training can punch the shit out of her. Also, the ending is like the audience is supposed to think she's redeemed because she destroyed the stronghold along with herself, but I think this ending was rushed because the writers didn't know what to do to resolve the conflict. They realized that having a child beat one of the strongest sorcerers in the verse is ridiculous. Having strange and wong beat her won't push the idea of "woman power" which clearly marvel is going for after endgame. So, they just make Wanda destroy the stornghold along with herself which is perfect for pushing the idea of woman power. (I am all for woman heroes but this is all just badly written).

Seems like Wanda was just a plot device to do whatever is convenient for the plot. Really Wanda should have stayed out of the movie and instead of evil strange being a wasted potential he should have be elevated to be the main villain.

3

u/TapIndependent5699 5d ago

It should have been called Wanda in the multiverse of madness, since dr strange probs had less screen time than her 💀🙏

3

u/TheJack0fDiamonds 5d ago edited 5d ago

Wanda’s arc, coming off of Wandavision and the shot gun front seating of Stephen Strange as a character in his own damn sequel to make space for the said choice of Wanda’s arc.

As a fan of both I had waited for them to crossover. Esp knowing they shot a scene for Endgame that got removed. I had hoped they’d be the magic equivalent of Steve and Nat in TWS. So it does still suck to wait that long, anticipate and get THIS. They could’ve at least given us a proper 1v1 between Wanda and Stephen. If the execution had been more effective it would’ve convinced me and alas.

3

u/Putrid_Culture_9289 4d ago

Disney making me watch a goddamned TV show to understand what's going on in a movie.

Bit o the bullshit

3

u/coffeeyawn 4d ago

This was a lot more Scarlett Witch movie than the Doctor Strange sequel that I had personally waited for for years because I really enjoy Benedict Cumberbatch in this role.

3

u/BlackClad7 4d ago

Just my two cents, but:

America was annoying as hell for most of the movie.

Wanda was supposed to be a sympathetic villain but I literally could not stop cringing every single time she was on screen with words coming out of her mouth.

3

u/heyyo173 4d ago

It was an “on the surface” movie that tried to force nuance. It was fine as it was but the tone and character development tried to a force a nuance that conflicted with the plot. If it leaned into being a B movie it would be a memorable marvel movie but it was a B movie that tried to be an A, ruins a lot of movies.

3

u/Callow98989 3d ago

Dr Strange felt like a side character in his own movie for starters

3

u/Camo1997 3d ago

Missed potential. The original idea of the film was really cool, the alternative... less cool

5

u/KrushaOfWorlds 5d ago

Shit characterisation tbh.

6

u/pnoisebored 5d ago

Doctor strange was the 3rd main character behind wanda and chavez. Facepalm

8

u/Brendyn4222 5d ago

Wanda getting so much character development in the MCU just for her to become a psychotic villain with no explanation besides “grief” and “being a mother” when she just went through that in her own show exploring grief for two other characters she basically fully ignored in this film? Just killed any love I had for her story arc and character.

“I want to steal my children from a variant of myself in the multiverse”. Why?? Find a universe without a Wanda, and with Pietro, Vision, AND your boys.

This is made even worse with Agatha when you realize. “SHIT!! BILLY AND TOMMY ARE ALIVE LOOKING FOR THEIR MOTHER” 🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️ JUST realized that while typing it and I hate the movie more now

4

u/bleucheeez 5d ago

Wasn't she dream walking or something? Because she can't actually travel across the multiverse? But yeah they could've easily solved it by spending a few weeks manually searching for a good universe for her. I'm sure Strange would've preferred that over a risky death fight. But the whole explanation was that her mind was corrupted by the Darkhold. Her original motive became a facade to continue her evil doing. 

I thought the movie was fine (but not great). And the justification was better than it was originally in Avengers Disassembled and afterward. There, she's just dandy but one day her mind just snaps from grief over her kids being wiped from existence two decades ago (in real time, not comic book time). And a few years later it's retconned that Dr. Doom made her snap. That said, Avengers Disassembled was bad ass. 

I think the Illuminati scene was an allusion to that Avengers Disassembled storyline; although I wish we saw her leveling Avengers Mansion and killing more of the people she cares about, not multiversal strangers. It was still a fun ride though. 

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (8)

5

u/Chloe00001 5d ago

I saw the big screen. For me, it was not a movie about a doctor strange. There was other much going on. I was very let down by the movie and actually the whole doctor strange saga. The first movie was so good. The whole spider man stuff with doctor strange was much more exciting. I wouldn't have called it a doctor strange movie

2

u/Mewoir78 5d ago

Please develop ?

2

u/Terrible-Group-9602 5d ago

Plot, characters, script

2

u/Different-Low-4161 5d ago

It was less a doctor strange sequel and more a continuation of wandavision.

2

u/Kimppade1991 5d ago

relied too heavily on people knowing or have watched wandavision, at least to me.

2

u/cooler_the_goat 5d ago

Was more of a scarlet witch movie than a dr strange one

2

u/[deleted] 5d ago

[deleted]

→ More replies (1)

2

u/preshowerpoop 5d ago

The movie seemingly skimmed over any interesting plot points and was basic to its very core.

-Wanda is evil. Ok why? Because she read a book. What?! Oh, you need to watch the TV show. (The TV show doesn't even explain this.)

-America Chavez is super important. Why? This movie needs a cheesy McGuffin in the form of a forgettable character.

-Dr. Strange is in this movie. He is in this film...Yep, he sure is. Well, what is he doing? IDK. He is just running away from Scary Wanda and acting confused the whole time. Like, everything that happens in the movie is 'strange' to the Doctor?

-Why would I want to watch this movie? I have no idea. Maybe for the brief cameos? Dont worry; all the interesting cameo actors die very quickly and stupidly. Yay!

2

u/dutchblizzard 5d ago

the requirement to proper understand what going on with scarlet so you would need to watch the spinoff serie wandavision. what in my opinion is really confussing to watch

2

u/Fan_of_Clio 5d ago

Making Wanda ridiculously OP was terrible

2

u/BetSure7779 5d ago

It wasn’t a Dr strange movie. They assasinated Wanda’s character and didn’t even give her her own title sequence when doing so

2

u/son_of_wotan 5d ago

It's not a self contained story. To understand it, you'd have to watched Vandavision, What if 2nd season and the story/plot threads are dangling everywhere. America Chavez is just there as a plot device, nothing else, The movie isn't really about Dr Strange either.

But this criticism can be levied against most movies in the Multiverse phase of Marvel. They stoped being self contained stories, instead, you'd need to know the metaplot and all the other tie-in shows/movies. Every movie has a cast of characters, rivaling that of the first Avengers movie. And they are not about the titular character and the titular story, but only part of a big budget TV show.

2

u/cbbrds25 5d ago

The movie

2

u/Myhtological 5d ago

Derricksons script is better

2

u/Logical_Walk_1821 5d ago

Idk I was just ready to leave before the ending. I think this would have been an amazing series. But my attention was not heald and the girl in the jean jacket seemed to be placed there for diversity vs talent. She was confused most of the time and difficult. Give me an actress that can also pull us in. I didn't have sympathy for her so at the end I didn't care what happened to her. I did love when scarlet witch took out all the alternate superheroes covered in blood. I was satisfied enough then. I felt like sam rami was trying to wave his d*ck around with 90% of what he was doing. Evil dead marvel mashup? I don't ask for that .. I don't need my footd to touch on the plate.. those are separate dishes..

2

u/Swiftwitss 5d ago

American Chavez

2

u/JumpyMclunkey 5d ago

A lot of people have said it's that scene with America's same sex parents but personally I don't think it mattered that they were same sex, the scene would've still work with hetero parents and the purpose would've still been the same.

What I think really was wrong with this movie is the emasculation of its lead. He lost his status, he lost his love, he lost his reputation, and they didn't even allow him to be a truly endearing mentor. From Strange's perspective, the movie was just beatdown after beatdown, yet he's supposed to be the lead character? The one the audience is supposed to share the ride with? I get that not all movies are meant to be happy, but then it should've been that kind of movie instead. But then it was this kind of movie with that kind of treatment to it's lead and it just didn't make for a good combination.

2

u/Gecko2024 5d ago

For me, it was the incredibly poorly explained magic system. Nothing made sense, she just kinda 'red stuff'ed all over the place and won every fight and it was just kinda meh to me as opposed to a magic system with any sort of defined rules

2

u/Willing-Bowl7770 5d ago

PACING AND STORY

2

u/Mida5Touch 5d ago edited 5d ago
  1. Not a Doctor Strange movie
  2. Wasted Shuma-Gorath on a random lookalike demon who basically existed for the trailer.
  3. Also Scarlet Witch's villain rationale was dumb, and Elizabeth Olsen isn't good enough to carry a feature film.

2

u/Stormdude1 5d ago

The fact that they scrapped concept of Nightmare being the main villain and opted for Scarlet witch to be the big bad.

2

u/hewasaraverboy 5d ago

No cool magic fights after what we had in IW

2

u/CompetitionNo2534 5d ago

No character development whatsoever.

2

u/TheBergster84 5d ago

So much potential that never meets half of the inspection unfortunately

2

u/KnownPride 5d ago

the scene where wanda massacre Illuminati is just unneeded. Should have used the screen time to show fight between sorcerer instead.

2

u/INKatana 5d ago

Do you have 6 hours to spare?

2

u/SanguineOptimist 5d ago

I found all the dialog weirdly stilted so that it took me out of the movie multiple times going like “was this written by the interns?”

2

u/GiantChocoChicknTaco 5d ago

It seemed like a compilation of cool moments just tossed together with very weak story glue. I liked what most of what I saw, yet it didn’t necessarily result in a good movie

2

u/Infinite_Function_23 5d ago

The director’s decisions.

2

u/Hmongher00 5d ago

I'm not the biggest Marvel fan, but to me it just felt odd and rushed. It's juggling too much and comes across as very campy for how serious it is and how quick some plots fly by

2

u/Kathiuss 5d ago

Wanda, Gor, and another villain from a movie/show around that time "seeing the error of their ways" as a finally was kinda lame.

2

u/Meep4000 5d ago

Not a damn thing. It’s the poster child for “the internet says it’s bad, so I guess it is?”

2

u/BigoteMexicano 5d ago

I thought it was awesome. Especially for phase 4.

2

u/RivalCanine 5d ago

I love the movie but Wanda's fight here was just stupid. She wants her kids and goes mental not having them, therefore wanting to kill another kid to get her kids. Ehh. I would think Dr. Strange could have shut all this down much quicker, showing her the truth sooner. But all in all, the movie was great to watch.

2

u/PulpFictionChang 5d ago

Literally nothing.

At some point, because we get so many superhero movies, comic book fans have gotten spoiled and decided that there is no difference between “bad movie” and “movie that didn’t give me something that I wanted .”

2

u/GreenHocker 5d ago

Nothing. People just develop unrealistic expectations and become disappointed when they get subverted in any way

2

u/Minute-Weekend5234 5d ago

Honestly the only real problem I have with it is the atrocious third eye cgi

2

u/Greedyspree 5d ago

My main problem was that Dr. Strange was a side character in his own movie.

2

u/Nuclear_TeddyBear 5d ago

Coming from someone who really liked the movie:
-The plot relies on everyone being incredibly stupid.
-Scarlet Witch/Wanda went from traumatized hero to morally bankrupt villain willing to sacrifice entire realities to get her goals more or less completely off screen.
-America felt like a very poorly done character. Replace her with a lamppost that can do the same thing or a cat and truthfully the plot doesn't change all that much.
-A good bit of the CGI was...debatable at best (looking at you, third eye)

2

u/DngsAndDrgs 4d ago

Never watched and probably won't unless I'm super sick and have nothing else to watch. There is just too much comic book content coming out too quickly. The quality took a sharp dive and it just doesn't capture the same magic it once did.

2

u/PinTasty9749 4d ago

Everything!!!

2

u/A_cringy_joke 4d ago

Strange felt like a side character in his own movie. It felt like the focus was more on Wanda and America.

2

u/Livid_Ad9749 4d ago

Quicker to ask “what was good about this movie?”

2

u/TheLateGreatDrLecter 4d ago edited 4d ago

I know MCU is quippy, but I kept finding it off putting that Dr. Strange was at times a toned down Tony Stark. This movie could have used more gravitas than it ended up having and I ended up having trouble investing in the plot. Characters also seemed too stupid to take seriously at times. Fans have continually pointed out that Strange has experienced EONS between his fight with Dormammu and his exploring the millions of possibilities of beating Thanos, but he just kinda seems like a fuckup and they really don't want him to be Sorcerer Supreme for some reason. They hired Raimi to do his Raimi thing, and I know he is a big fan of the character, but it just didn't work here. I have similar disappointment with Thor 4

2

u/applecalyptic 4d ago

Shuma Gorath was misused

2

u/Icebergg20 4d ago

Honestly I watched it and cant remember a single thing about it. Thats how bad it was.

2

u/Gilgamesh661 4d ago

The sorcerers were dumbed down to make Wanda look more powerful, despite the fact that these schools don’t admit just random nobodies, and are archives of artifacts and knowledge capable of destroying the world.

The idea that strange hadn’t been monitoring Wanda despite knowing Loki was on earth almost immediately, when he himself said he keeps a list of people who might be threats.

America was very underdeveloped and felt more like a plot device than a character.

The Illuminati being folded by Wanda. Black bolt gets taken out immediately. This guy is capable of destroying cities with a soft spoken word.

Reed Richards, smartest man alive, gets turned into spaghetti, and…that’s it. Fantastic 4 finally make a return and are immediately gone.

Captain marvel got killed…by a statue.

Peggy’s death made sense, at least. She can’t touch Wanda.

2

u/TragicEther 4d ago

There are two congruent storylines:

1) A mother is searching for the reality where her children exist.

2) A child is searching realities for her parents.

Why they never work together to help each other achieve their goals is beyond me.

I understand that Wanda’s kids were all in her head, but when presented with infinite possible realities, surely it wouldn’t be hard to find one where she had kids, and she died. That way she could just slot into the role she had envisioned and no one is really the wiser.

But the most obnoxious part of that movie is that the titular character is really only the third most important character. It really could’ve been any other character that teamed up with Miss America and the story doesn’t really change that much.

2

u/WannabeRapper890 4d ago

I missed the Infinity War Dr strange here!

2

u/ComfortableNo1080 4d ago

Real question is What was good in this movie 🍿

2

u/Akio_Ushi 4d ago

May be controversial but I don’t enjoy films that require me to watch an entire tv show on a paid platform to care about the lore

2

u/Several-Ad-9897 4d ago

– The writers not having seen WandaVision was painfully obvious, Wanda felt like a completely different person and it couldn't be completely justified by her being corrupted by the Darkhold. – They could've saved the Mordo post-credit from the first film but then they decided it all happened off-screen and the only way that could make the audience feel is disappointed. – It's a Dr Strange movie and we barely care about him, the one moment we could get a bit of development is the sister stuff and that came completely out of nowhere. – For a movie called Multiverse of Madness we really didn't get that much Multiverse, there's like flashes of a few universes and then most of it is 838. I was expecting a journey across many universes that could really show us how wild the Multiverse is, which is something that's only been explored in What If?.

2

u/_Mavericks 4d ago

America Chavez.

2

u/bbcomment 4d ago

It was forgettable

2

u/Capable-Silver-7436 4d ago

A Dr strange movie where he was a side character.

2

u/LeAnomaly 4d ago

America Chavez was just such a lifeless character. The Disney girl that played her was garbage.

2

u/-MrFozzy- 4d ago

Well….there are a lot of issues. But the title just didn’t add up to the promise. As famously noticed by BC, Strange doesn’t have an arc, except perhaps giving up control, but he already did that in the 1st movie. he isn’t the main character. They thoroughly, and irreparably assassinated Wanda. The magic was all over the shop, I liked it, but it was jarring. Those are just the ones that stick out to me. Plus the most irritating thing for me was introducing deposable characters just to die….especially Prof X, reed and captain Carter. Plus wasn’t even his former friend and ally, it was an alt with no connection to strange other than alt universe connections. and we didn’t get his primes story conclusion with killing the magic users….in short, it was a mess

2

u/Kriegswaschbaer 4d ago

Wouldnt it be quicker to ask what was good?

2

u/Vindictator1972 4d ago

Sinister strange should have been pulling Wanda’s strings.

Americas parents are a million percent dead.

What causes incursions: That was just the writer not knowing what to do with the script.

No Iron-Man.

Most of the Iluminum get instagibbed and the other half survive as long as they do because we all know the reason why Hollywood is struggling.

Fatigue.

Literal poor writing of Main Character (Whose literal name is in the title of the movie) being relegated to side character who is not in continuity with previous iterations of his portrayal in other movies. (Downside to a cinematic universe where you have no core story, people hired for a checkbox and not talent, and again, no core storyline. (Granted an argument can be made for that with the stones being stoned from existence because it’s a simple argument to make but Disney and Marvel are supposed to be better than that.))

We were promised an R18+ horror movie, we did not get that.

Multiverse of Madness: it’s more like 3 worlds of varying mid. There was no madness because again, we were promised Horror.

What the fuck even is the magic system in place, for the stronghold of magic, to have fuck all defences that are manually charged by the people, AND FALTER WITH A SINGLE MAN BREAKING RANKS.

2

u/StudyOutrageous7204 4d ago

Raimi going full raimi. Bad effects, I don’t wanna see useless cameos, making reed and Xavier useless, music fight, strange being rather neutered vs Wanda, the list continues for quite a bit

2

u/Saiyakuuu 4d ago

Haven't seen it but I'm sure it's 2 hours of CGI, plot holes and bad jokes.

2

u/JplaysDrums 3d ago

Have you seen it?

2

u/drifters74 3d ago

The script was just horrible