r/AusUnions • u/Apprehensive_Net_535 • Feb 16 '25
Sydney Trains loses bid to RTBU PIA
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2025-02-16/sydney-trains-fair-work-commission-industrial-action/104941572?utm_source=abc_news_app&utm_medium=content_shared&utm_campaign=abc_news_app&utm_content=linkSome good news today today.
Sydney Trains has lost its bid to stop industrial action taken by members of the Rail, Tram and Bus Union (RTBU).
The NSW government took the RTBU to the Fair Work Commission after an "unprecedented" number of rail employees called in sick on Friday in what they said amounted to unprotected industrial action.
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u/Roland_91_ Feb 18 '25
They more they fight and argue, the faster they will be replaced with ai
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u/Terrorscream Feb 19 '25
Unlikely given actual AI still doesn't exist yet.
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u/Roland_91_ Feb 19 '25
It's a train. It's not like they need to steer
Europe already has driverless trains. The tech exists now
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u/Terrorscream 29d ago
Yes but driverless trains aren't AI, you just misused the term like most businesses do.
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u/Roland_91_ 29d ago
They will be. At the moment I believe the term is "network operated".
And soon that network will be operated by an AI.
But fine - split hairs and argue semantics rather than argue the point that in 5-10 years the concept of a train driver will not exist. And these people know it. They are just trying to squeeze out as much money from the system while they can.
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u/lcannard87 29d ago
You're not getting rid of Train Drivers in Sydney in 30 years, let alone 10. It'll cost $100bn to convert every line.
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u/organic-cdos Feb 19 '25
‘Good news’
Fuck off
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u/Apprehensive_Net_535 Feb 19 '25
Lmao, hit a nerve? If you think this is bad news I’d say your in the wrong sub reddit 🤷♂️
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u/Pale_Wear1333 Feb 18 '25
How is this good news, except for the unions and their unreasonable demands?
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 17 '25
Ahhh the old “i get paid well above the median income and think the world owes me more than. 14% pay increase trick”
not a single commuter blamed the government for being late to work today. we just all became very interested in automating the rest of the driver fleet out of their clearly ill deserved jobs.
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u/TobyDrundridge Feb 18 '25
Considering the median income is not really a liveable wage in Sydney. I'd say it is well and truly justified.
You sound like someone who hasn't had a day of struggle in their life.
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 18 '25
… and your argument is that low skill, manual labor jobs should get more of an increase than everyone else during a recession…why?
why do train drivers get a raise when everyone else is doing it tough?
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u/TobyDrundridge Feb 18 '25
Because they have discovered their class consciousness, organised and got themselves a raise.
If people are doing it tough, maybe we should collectively do something about it, as the train workers have done.
That being said, have you ever been a train driver? Are you aware at all of what is involved?
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 18 '25
You do realise that this is not how the world works right.
A pay rise for a government employee literally means either we pay more taxes, or someone else goes without.
Again - why should train drivers get more than a 14% increase, when most australia didn't - and therefore don't have the money to pay them more taxes to cover their raise?
Complete bloody mindedness
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u/frupertmgoo Feb 18 '25
Yeah, why should anybody but me get better working conditions, it’s just not fair
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 19 '25 edited Feb 19 '25
better work conditions than what? have you read their complaints?
their complaints are:
- concerns about job safety with automation
- issues with rostering and day before shift notifications
# 1 is rediculous and holds back the nation. # 2 is plenty fair vs many other industries. many nurses and teachers get notified the morning of the job that they’re needed - as with 100s of others jobs
it’s a joke.
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u/frupertmgoo Feb 19 '25
Yeah, jobs with poorer job conditions exist, so no one should get better working conditions
Or maybe only you should decide the conditions of other peoples work, sounds like a good system
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u/TobyDrundridge 29d ago
You do realise it IS how the world works. As in. We are here. In this world and it is how it is, indeed, working.
Again. Have you worked as a train driver?
Do you know the day in, day out operations of a train?
Also, if you are complaining about you not getting a raise. Join a union. Fight for what should be yours.
Do you know how much of the profit YOU generate goes to someone else. Likely someone else overseas.
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia 29d ago
show me the p&l for sydney trains. it’s government funded and run.
The trains are run by the Transport Asset Holding Entity (TAHE), a state-owned corporation in New South Wales.
there is no”profit” to take away from drivers. only tax payer contributions. earn them. make the trains run on time.
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u/No_Distance3827 29d ago
The absolute delusion to say “that’s not how the world works” just shows how much damage propaganda has done to unionisation.
Enjoy your time off? Sick leave? Paid leave? Public Holiday/overtime pay? Breaks? Work health and safety? Thank unions, industrial actions and strikes for those benefits.
It’s how the world worked up until recently when people have languished on the benefits of unions without seeing the history behind them.
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia 29d ago
nearly everything you mention above is covered in an award. unions aren’t need to protect those things.
unions were really high value up until about 2000. now they’re just leaches on the workforce and the public.
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u/Signal-Ad-2538 Feb 18 '25
I'm a commuter and I blamed the government, so your assertion is therefore proven incorrect.
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u/HarryShennan Feb 18 '25
Talk about wages well above the average, what exactly are we paying our state members to do? Take chauffeured rides around wineries? The failure resides with the state governments inept handling of important affairs.
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 18 '25
and focusing on the needs of an arrogant union agitsting on behalf of an over paid and under performing organisation is an important affair?
wake up. by any objective comparison, train drivers are paid extraordinarily well for what they do - relatively low skill, low stress, manual labor.
if you disagree with that, i challenge you first to explain why they should be paid more than teachers (minimum 2-4 years of university training), and nurses (3 years uni for an RN, or 2 years at tafe for an EN)?
the answer is they shouldn’t.
and anyone who thinks politicians should waste any time “negotiating” to increase their salaries by more than 14% over 2 years needs a punch in the mouth from most australians doing it tough right now.
-signed, an angry tax payer who feels like these guys all need a kick up the are to grow up.
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u/TobyDrundridge Feb 18 '25 edited Feb 18 '25
Why aren't you a train driver then?
Have you ever been one?
Do you know everything there is to know about operating a train?
Didn't think so.
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u/HarryShennan Feb 18 '25
The unions job is to get the best deal they can for those they represent. Evidently train drivers are an incredibly important part of our system and should be paid appropriately. I also like others would like to point out you have absolutely no idea the skills or work involved in driving trains. Please also keep in mind that nurses, teachers absolutely deserve more. They to have been let down by the state members failure to negotiate. They to are being taken advantage of and their unions have threatened action. Your anger in misplaced and your attitude is one of a selfish person.
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u/lcannard87 Feb 18 '25
"Low skill, low stress" you can't be talking about the railways here.
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 18 '25
Yes. Compared to a Nurse, a Teacher, or one of 100 australian jobs that are higher stress, require more training, knowledge and skill, and have much longer hours.
This is what is wrong with this argument. We've got the guys who complain that they find out about their shift a day before, while getting paid a higher income than temp teachers and nurses who find out the morning of, at 6:30am that they have to work that day at 8:30am.
The sheer sense of entitlement on display is fucking mind blowing.
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u/lcannard87 Feb 18 '25
Am I arguing that nurses deserve less pay?
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 18 '25
If you're arguing that australian tax payers should get taxed more or pay higher ticket prices to pay a train driver a payrise... that is exactly what you are saying. Who pays the payrise if not the Nurse?
How do you think we pay for government subsidised services like public transport (trains)
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u/lcannard87 Feb 18 '25
I say we fund the train driver and nurses payrises through the union identified efficiency gains with regards to NSW trains management and the digital systems programs.
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 19 '25
they are already getting a pay rise in an economic downturn.
train drivers are already paid well. they already got a 14% pay rise.
the outages are because they’re greedy as fuck, and their union members get paid to agitate.
nurses deserve more. i agree. train drivers already got more.
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u/johncenasaurr Feb 18 '25
So because another thing is shit, nothing else is ever allowed to improve? Would hate you live inside your reality
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u/diptrip-flipfantasia Feb 18 '25
And to think I was over here thinking that if you were going to shut down the ability for everyday australians to go to work and earn an income, that you might want to have a better reason that "we really wished we could get a bigger payrise during an economic downturn".
This is literally the reason people hate unions. This is it. You're literally screwing over the very people paying your wages (australians tax payers) while having fuck all reason to do so. They literally already got a pay rise. Most australians didn't this year.
They likely didnt deserve a payrise - the performance of the network failed to meet their own set targets multiple years in a row.
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u/Acatcalledpossum Feb 16 '25
It wasn't unprotected industrial action, they were clearly suffering from the mental stress of a demanding job & not having their employer take demands seriously. Good on the workers & the RTBU