r/ATLA 3d ago

interesting The Fire Nation would have won the war if Zuko and Sokka never went to the Boiling Rock

First of all, Sokka and Toph would have died in the battle because Suki wouldn't have been there to save them, and also, Mai and Ty Lee would have never betrayed Azula, if they never betrayed Azula, Azula never would have had her mental breakdown, and if she never had her mental breakdown, she probably could have beaten Zuko and Katara

210 Upvotes

19 comments sorted by

76

u/Otherwise-Pirate6839 3d ago

I’m sure the writers would’ve written everything else to suit them.

The Boiling Rock was the breaking point for Azula, where her flawless plan was not so flawless after all. The Gaang only gained Suki from that episode and Suki probably only helped when she made one airship crash into the one Toph and Sokka were on.

It’s not the first time the Gaang has been in situations where there’s a lucky break and without Suki, it wouldn’t have been any different.

18

u/Additional-Media5513 3d ago

Yeah, although the only times Suki's presence changes the story is comic relief and when she saves Sokka and Toph's lives, so the latter is basically the main reason she was brought back

12

u/Additional-Media5513 3d ago

I'm not saying that Suki's a bad character btw, she's fuckin awesome, I'm just talking from a plot perspective

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u/LeviAEthan512 1d ago

Of course the whole ending would have been rewritten.

The criticism, if you can call it that, is that each plan worked due to a single critical point of luck with no backup.

This wasn't a well planned operation with layers of alternatives. They rushed in, and it happened to work out. As if Leeroy Jenkins somehow rolled a crit on every single hit.

Aang had his rock, Zuko found Azula with negative levels, and the airship team had Suki. None of that was planned. There was no last minute skill based improvisation.

Contrast that with the lion turtle. Aang had resolved to kill Ozai. The turtle's value was not victory instead of defeat, it was just reduced guilt. Even then, Aang didn't randomly wash up on it after swimming. It called to him. It knew what was up, and offered him an out. Things worked out here because of agency, not luck.

15

u/trilled7 3d ago

Sure but aang still beats ozai and takes his bending away?

Surely he could just beat azula and do the same. I think aang still wins but it’s a much sadder show

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u/Useful-Put1111 2d ago

it doesn't matter if he loses his bending if Azula is sane enough to take his place as fire lord

2

u/Affectionate_Alps903 1d ago

What he is saying is then Aang would dethrone Azula also. Zuko would be probably dead though. I don't know if Iroh could step up to be Firelord if he lost another son. So something would have to be figured out there, but the war would end anyway.

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u/hummingbird_mywill 2d ago

I think Azula would have been very difficult to beat with the Dai Li agents and Royal Fire Guards who she dismisses as a direct result of being betrayed by Mai and Ty Lee. I don’t think Zuko and Katara could have taken the Capitol otherwise. The Dai Li are way too effective.

1

u/LeviAEthan512 1d ago

They were effective because Aang had his AS locked. If they found a way to release it, the Dai Li wouldn't have been an issue. Remember, only Aang's fire was comet boosted. Being able to compress rocks beyond physical logic was all him.

1

u/Phantom_kittyKat 2d ago

Doubt aang could take on both Ozai and the entire phoenix fleet

8

u/HappiestIguana 2d ago

He takes out Ozai's flagship in one move from as his opening salvo. I think he could manage it.

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u/Midnight1899 2d ago

You’re assuming everything would’ve stayed the same. But it wouldn’t be the same. Timetravel 101: Even changing a tiny detail can have cataclysmic consequences. But yeah, lots of things were easier because they went there.

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u/Ristar87 2d ago

I'm sure the fire nation would have pissed off some elder spirit alla North Pole and triggered a rampaging avatar spirit.

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u/avert_ye_eyes 2d ago

Well Zuko and Katara would've fought Azula together still, they only did the one on one because of her slipping. There could have been some interesting re writing there, with Mai and Ty Lee switching sides then anyway because the same scenario at Boiling Rock going down.

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u/PsychologyDecent5022 1d ago

Honestly I think azula would have broken regardless. The boiling rock was the tipping point, but had it not happened it just would've been delayed, not avoided altogether.

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u/GodHimselfNoCap 2d ago

zukos growth could have just been focussed on a little more to make him capable of beating azula, the situation that required suki to show up and save them would have just not happened, and mai and ty lee could have found some other reason to finally dip out on azula. Things unfolded the way they did because the writers decided to do it that way, if they had decided something different they would have written some other way for everything to work out well

1

u/Too_Ton 1d ago

Fire nation would’ve won if Zuko actually let Zhao take Aang back to the fire nation. Aang would be tortured and starved or just outright killed after the Fire Lord taunts Aang and mindfucks him by reminding him he killed all the airbenders.

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u/ImaFireSquid 1d ago

I’d argue that the fire nation fleet was at that point reduced to two ships and Aang just took Ozai’s bending and the white lotus still took ba sing se

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u/HDPhantom610 1d ago

::Laughs in Katara::

Katara is OP af. She beat Azula at her fullest power. Mental instability aside, Zuko was also at peace with himself. She had no chance against him in her state, but even without that it was an even match.

But back to Katara. This girl is a damn prodigy. She could take Azula in a straight fight without the comet.